Jump to content

Craigslist Peerless Sedan and Coupe


ShawnLancaster

Recommended Posts

Thank you for writing in, Shawn. I appreciate you posting a link to the ad. I've never seen these cars and parts in person, but I've seen a listing of them from the owner. There was a photo of the Sedan about 4 years ago on PreWarCar.com.

My understanding is that there are 2 or 3 truckloads of items here, including a complete Twenties Peerless V-8 Sedan...a Twenties Peerless boat tail coupe...and a lot of parts which may include a Peerless parts car.

Link to post
Share on other sites

2 Peerless autos for sale, 1 sedan complete, 1 coupe disassembled extra parts - frames, sedan body, motors & misc email ad for pics sedan -$13000.00 Coupe-$8000.00 extra parts-$3000.00 all for $20000.00<!-- START CLTAGS -->

**

Posxting the content of the ad for future cross reference. Jeff, you and I have discussed this one before. Wasn't this the seller that wasn't willing to break up the stash previously but is now considering it?

The problem with the ad is it's vagueness. No phone number, minimal content, no name. A lot of times when I respond to an ad like this by email, I never get a response because the person usually isn't active on email - if they write such a minimal ad.

No photos, no years, etc etc. The seller is making it difficult to get legitimate inquiries.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Bryan,

Yes, these are the same cars and the same owner that have been listed before. There's even an ad here on the Peerless Forum from June, 2008. I'm not certain of the model years of the vehicles, but I'm thinking there's a V-8 Sedan; a 6-60, 6-80 or 6-91 Boat Tail Coupe; and a mystery incomplete car.........possibly a straight-eight Mod. 8-125.

Like I said before, I've never seen them in person, and there aren't any photos. Apparently one can e-mail the seller for a photo of the sedan. These are probably in unrestored condition and you would get a lot more enjoyment out of three restored Peerlesses in your garage...but they might be a good deal for somebody with more room than you or I!

----Jeff

Link to post
Share on other sites

I purchased these cars today. List of cars as follows, 1927 Model 69 seven pass. limo V8 unrestored but solid, 1928 boat tail coupe v8, 1930 custom eight diassembled, year ??? straight-eight Model 8-125 diassembled. 3 truck loads of parts, including 2 6cyl motors, one inline 8 cyl, one v8 motor all with trans. 2 extra frames and wheels. I will take some pics once we sort everything. First Peerless autos I have owned, and I am very excited to join the club. Cheers Brian

Link to post
Share on other sites

Brian

That is awesome. For a Peerless collector it sounds like you have hit the jack pot. Mid 20's V8 Peerless' are very very rare and hard to get. 3 truckloads of parts? Wow.

Nice cross section of important Peerless' as well. Please do post some photos of these cars as this has been a "mystery" stash for a long time.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Congratulations Brian,

Welcome to the Peerless Forum and the Peerless Motor Car Club.

You are going into Peerless collecting in a big way! I think you now own the 2nd largest collection of Peerlesses in the world. Have you gotten to both see the cars and parts and gotten delivery? I had no idea that there were 4 cars or that a 1930 Custom 8 was in the mix.

I was always wondering what each of the autos were, exactly. Over the years the V-8 Sedan has been described as a 1924, 1925, 1926, 1927 and a 1928...also as a Model 66, 8-67 and 8-69. My personal guess was that it might be the 1925 Model 8-67 formerly in the Dexter Dotson Collection in Pound, VA 'till 1992. Very glad to hear that my suspicion of one of the cars being an 8-125 was correct. This was the first straight-eight Peerless and was more or less a 1929 model --- though there was a small 1930 continuation of the car.

I'm sure you'll have a lot of sorting-out to do. I would be happy to help you do that or try to answer any questions that come up.

----Jeff

Link to post
Share on other sites

Brian,

Another interesting thing is the Boat Tail Coupe. Aside from these being one of the most stylish body designs the company ever sold, these Boat Tails with the Peerless V-8 engine are almost unheard of. Both Model Eight-69 Roadster Coupes and Roadsters were built (unknown numbers), but almost none survive (possibly two, counting yours). I believe I have some pictures of this car when it was in a storage unit 20 or 30 years ago.

The Model 8-125 Peerless is another great car and one of the best Peerless designs of all time, in my opinion. Something like 1,200 were built but only 4 to 7 are known to exist.

And there's a 1930 Custom Eight?

Do you have a copy of The Standard Catalog? There's a factory photo of a 1927 8-69 Roadster Coupe there.

----Jeff

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 3 weeks later...

One more time I am deploring the member ShawnLancaster didn't have the initiative to issue the pictures seen in Craig List. The ads on Craig List are issued for a very limited time and who is coming here not regularly like me per example am frustrated when I can't see some interesting addition to the blog.

In addition I can speak about a Peerless, a 1928 6-80 5 Passenger Boattail Coupe which was for sale by Platinum Classic Motorcars in September, 2003. At this time I was not very experimented with computer and I was printing all the pages, now I have scanned the pictures.

The Seller was adding: "The Peerless Motor Car Company once were part of what was known as the three P's Packard, Peerless and Pierce Arow. Ahigh end restoration of this incredibly rare boattail automobile was completed in 178. This car has resided in a museum for most of its life and has been used very little. The restoration on this car remains in very good condition. Only a handful of these rare automobiles are known to exist.

This 1928 Peerless is finished in a striking Yellow and Black color combination, which was a typical color of its day for these flamboyant cars. The finish on this car remains in excellent condition with only a few minor chips.

The interior of this wonderful car has been completely redone in the original style mohair fabric and the rumbleseat of this Peerless has been redone in Black leather. This quant automobile features a beautiful dashborad that is covered in exquisite woodgrin. The car has the original wooden wheel. The car's dash cluster is original, with the exception of the amp meter, which has been replaced with a newer gauge.

The motor in this car runs well, it has been used sparingly since its restoration. this Peerless automobile has a 6 cylinder Continental engine with a bone and stroke of 3 1/4 by 4 5/8. This is the correct original motor that was deliverd new in the car. The car is ftted with Denman tires.

This unique and rare automobile would be a great addition to any collection."

post-61854-143138779522_thumb.jpg

post-61854-143138779528_thumb.jpg

post-61854-143138779533_thumb.jpg

post-61854-143138779536_thumb.jpg

post-61854-143138779541_thumb.jpg

post-61854-143138779545_thumb.jpg

post-61854-143138779548_thumb.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites

And I continue: a museum in Rio Rancho, New Mexico, was selling a few months ago a 1927 Peerless Boattail Roadster Model 6-90. Fortunately I was keeping a few (very little number published) pictures of this car long time ago.

It is in working like that we can publish pictures in forms like this one... For the fine mouth I will say that people are knowing my interest for the old american cars and that when the forum of the ACCF (American Car Club of France) had a bug they wanted to me to get pictures in de posts I wasd giving months or years ago. I had not yet the time to d that completely but I already was completing some of them even with more pictures than in the original one.

Here the 6-90 boattail roadster:

post-61854-143138779603_thumb.jpg

post-61854-143138779607_thumb.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites

No problem Shawn, but that can serve as lesson for the guys and girls who have the possibility to issue pictures to annex them to their posts. Pictures are precious for different reasons, first being the ads in craiglist, Hemmings and all other sales' websites are there for a certain time only when posted here they will remain for longer time, second reason is that the pictures will remain a source of informations for who is restoring cars and third for the pleasure of the eyes.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Philippe Hulet,

Thank you for posting the photos of the 1927 Roadster and the 1928 Roadster Coupe. The '27 in New Mexico is quite stylish as is the '28. I heard from the current owner of the '28 today. This Peerless is in Europe, just barely, and part of the very large Mehmet Arsay Automobile Museum in Turkey.

The ad was exactly like Shawn and BJM said, just one sentence and no photographs, but it was still helpful that they listed it here: otherwise 1927 S would probably not be aware of the cars and parts. My understanding is that the items purchased came from the dispersal of the largest Peerless collection ever...Dexter Dotson's...about 20 years ago, but the new owner probably had little idea of what was for sale until he drove to the other side of Ohio to see everything in person.

Brian,

I think I ought to move to Ohio. It seems like that's where everything Peerless is happening these days! I sent you a message some time ago saying that the largest Peerless collection in the world was six cars. I talked to the owner on the phone last week and he says he actually has nine. My mistake.

----Jeff

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 1 month later...

Shawn,

Hard for my eyes to tell which one is maroon. It's your choice of course, but those of us interested in Peerless get few opportunities to see these great cars and if you can, posting some photos would be great.

Jeff. Is this the "newest" or last known V8 Peerless in existence. I can not find a newer one on my version of the KP list.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Brian,

Thank you for posting the two Peerless photographs! I'm guessing the one on the right is the 1929 Six-81 with 33,000 miles from Pennsylvania and the Maroon one is the "V-Type Eight" (as Peerless liked to call them) from Ohio.

----Jeff

Link to post
Share on other sites

Bryan,

Kind of a tough question. A 1927 Peerless Eight-69 would certainly fall in the "last-of-the-line" category for the 332 cu. in. Peerless V-8s. My Known Peerless Automobiles In Existence list currently has only seven candidates for newest known V-8 Peerless in existence: 4 1928s and 3 1927s. I haven't updated the listings for all of Brian's Peerless motorcars yet, which may very well include another 1928 V-8, and Full Classic, a 1928 Eight-69 Roadster Coupe.

The 1928s are the Marks(690 493), "Joe"(690 210), Backer and Stelford cars. The 1927s are the Stelford, Adams(B690 233), and Birk cars. The '28 Stelford was listed as a 7-Passenger Sedan and the '27 Stelford Peerless was listed as a 5-Passenger Sedan. The Adams Peerless is a 7-Passenger Limousine.

Until I have serial numbers & photos, or personal visits to all 319 vehicles on KPAIE, there are a lot of cars that may be listed more than once. For instance, I think the Roscoe Stelford, Sr. 1928 Peerless may also be the Wm. Backer Peerless....but I'd have to drive all the way down to the Columbia, Missouri area to find out for sure.

----Jeff

Link to post
Share on other sites

BJM,

Technically, the Marks 1928 Peerless V-8 is the newest since I actually have a body plate serial number [690 493].

The serial numbers on the 8-69s went from 335 501 to 336 505 on the first series 8-69, and B690 001 up to B690 759 on the second series 8-69. That suggests a total of about 1,764 cars.

Engine serial #s went from 36,001-37,503, implying about 1,503 engines. I only have engine serial numbers for two 8-69s so far:

36148....1928 7-P Sedan....Marks

37433....1928 7-P Sedan....Stelford

I had a nice conversation on the phone with the previous owner, R.H. Folen of Oregon, a couple of years ago and he said that it's a great car...specifically, a great road car. All black, 132" wheelbase. He said it had the bullet headlights adopted for most Peerlesses for their 1928 models. Body by Raulang. Before Mr. Folen had it the owners were Glenn Catterson and Bill Harrah.

SORRY, BIG error on serial numbers. Corrected.

Link to post
Share on other sites

BJM,

Looking at my last post, one could make the argument that the 1928 Peerless 8-69 7-Passenger Sedan of Mr. Stelford's is the newest of the last-known Peerless V-8s, based on the engine serial numbers. Note: unsure of car's present location and owner since 1986.

I have no idea why there seem to have been 261 more bodies made than engines.

----Jeff

Link to post
Share on other sites

On my way home from the AACA Annual Meeting, I stopped in the Columbus area to visit with a "young" lady named Shirley, and her husband. They showed me two Peerless in their collection, one was a 1916 Cloverleaf V-8, and the other was a mid-'20s coupe, both in show condition. She'll be showing the Cloverleaf, hopefully it'll be finished, in AACA events this year.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On my way home from the AACA Annual Meeting, I stopped in the Columbus area to visit with a "young" lady named Shirley, and her husband. They showed me two Peerless in their collection, one was a 1916 Cloverleaf V-8, and the other was a mid-'20s coupe, both in show condition. She'll be showing the Cloverleaf, hopefully it'll be finished, in AACA events this year.

Jeff,

Know of these cars or can they be added to the Registry?

Nice catch West. I have had the privilege of viewing 2 V8 Peerless' in a local collection and they are artifacts rarely seen and it's a great honor and privilege for sure. While I am sure you see many more old cars then I, it's kind of equivalent (to me) of viewing the Mona Lisa or some rare art. One sort of looks at the details and architecture with more discernment then say a 60's musclecar.

Link to post
Share on other sites

She mentioned another Peerless in the Columbus area, too, but I can't remember what year she told me it was. I hope to get back there again when the weather warms up, so I can photograph a few of her cars to go along with Jeff's Peerless History series he's working on for us.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 weeks later...

West,

Your mention of a Peerless Cloverleaf V-8 near Columbus, Ohio reminds me of a couple of things. Peerless cars of this body style are usually described as Cloverleaf Roadsters, despite having 4 doors, but The Green Dragon tells me they're best described as Close-Coupled Touring Cars. I guess officially, a Cloverleaf Roadster has 2 doors and a pass-through between the front seats allowing access to the rear -- a style used by other carmakers like Apperson, Marmon and Pathfinder.

That being said, they were extremely stylish and advanced cars and only 3 exist on the planet, a green restored 1917, a blue restored 1920, and the HPOF candidate 1920 Bryan saw in Iowa 4 years ago [photo on "Peerless Visit Forthcoming" thread from 2008]. When John Deshay owned the blue one he described it as "America's first muscle car" because of the dual exhausts, 332 V-8 and 4-barrel carburetor.

----Jeff

P.S. Personally, I like the Cloverleaf Roadster name for these cars....despite the fact they have 4 doors and seat 4 or 5.

P.P.S.: When I say things like "only 3 exist", "I only know of one 1906 Peerless" and "319 Peerlesses survive", it's just an educated guess. I think a lot of unknown cars are still out there and would love to have people write-in and say:"You're a complete dunderhead, I've got a 1900 Peerless 1-cyl., a 1902 Peerless 2-cyl., three 1906 Peerless 4-cyl. and a 1931 Peerless 12-cyl. in my private collection that you don't know anything about!". With thousands of them made, there have to be more Peerless trucks out there than 8.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I dunno (didn't know) the proper description for Cloverleaf on this particular Peerless. I had thought that the front seats were supposed to be split, too, so I asked. He said that was what Peerless called it, and I left it at that. It was a much, much larger Peerless than I'm used to seeing.

Link to post
Share on other sites

West,

Have you seen any of the 48-Six and 60-Six Peerless cars from 1912-14? I'll try to post a photo of a 48-Six Wayne Burgess took on the 2009 AACA Western Tour. In it, the people look rather small in comparison to the car!

This 1913 Peerless won a First in Class at Pebble Beach in 2010. It's the smaller of the two models*. The larger car with the 825 cubic inch engine (a record** for production cars) is represented by the big green 1914 Peerless at the Crawford Auto-Aviation Museum in Cleveland.

---Jeff

* with a 578 c.i.d. engine

**2000 Guinness Book of World Records, c.i.d. matched, but not exceeded by 2 other firms

Photo by R.W. Burgess from Sonoma AACA Western Tour, 2009

post-49853-143138872206_thumb.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites

There were several different Models of Peerless between 1917 & 1920 that is confusing.

the cloverleaf roadster was listed as a three passenger, but they also had a four passenger roadster with two doors and isle between the front seats and in 1919 or 20 the four passenger roadster had four doors. Then that was replaced by a six passenger touring. They were making the 7 passenger touring and other sedans through this same time period. The four door roadster was sometimes referred to as a close couple touring.

RHL

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • 2 years later...

Hi Brando & Joanne,

Sometimes tracking owners of cars is hard here on the Peerless Forum. In this case, this blue Peerless 6-81 with dual rear spares Brian did own now belongs to Thomas Wallace of Ohio: since April, 2013. The car is no. 276 on KPAIE right now and you can find more contact data there. Tom uses the display name "tomwallace" here and was on a thread on the Peerless Forum called "29 Peerless FS" last posted on 5/18/13.

_ _ _ _ You might also look at the last post in "Peerless For Sale Dept."(abut 9/11/14) with mention of a '29 Peerless Six-81 that just came up for sale 2 days ago. There's a related you tube video with shots of the door hardware _ _ _ _

----Jeff

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you Jeff! You are a treasure trove of information! Can you please download your knowledge and email the disc to me asap... I need your brain :-)

I just ordered a couple of books you recommended. Is the KPAIE updated? If so, could you email it (in lieu of your brain!) Thanks! By the way, we are desperately seeking a 19" snap ring for the spare wheel (steel disc wheels). Don Bettes doesn't have, and Ralph's phone goes to fax tone, and he did not answer my fax.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Brando & Joanne,

Glad to hear something I sent you was helpful. Makes me feel like the Randy Ema of Peerless Cars. I'm not as knowledgeable, I don't make a living at it, and Duesenberg isn't as rare an automobile. I finally got to meet Randy at Bakerfield this year. David Baird and I were running the Peerless Motor Car Club booth at this HCCA Swap Meet and and he stopped by. Was the data I sent on model numbers and engines helpful in sorting out those 4 Peerlesses you have, or were you so on top of it you just needed confirmation? The difference between a '29 6-61 and a 6-81, for instance, is pretty hard to spot, unless one looks at the instrument panels, wheels, tires, engines, serial number plates, hoods and price.

Don't know where to get 19" snap rings. A Montana restorer I know has been in communication with Ralph Cartonio a lot regarding those big Continental straight eights and says he has moved. Saw on your site a picture of Dimmitt Motors. Did you ever find anything out about this Peerless Dealer down Florida way that's still in business? Also saw you have an area called Known Peerless Automobiles In Existence on your site. That part won't open (computer says "File cannot be opened.")and was curious what's there. Is there a description of KPAIE? Re: KPAIE, it's not perfect, but I update it a hundred times a year.

Thank you,

Jeff

Link to post
Share on other sites

I just went over to my favorite antique car junkyard half an hour ago and looked into finding a snap ring. Many are there, but I would need to know the application, serial number, measurements, and snap ring maker before it's worth looking. Maybe a photo, too. Good chance I'll come up with one armed with that data....I found a spare rim for my 1928 Six-80 there after removing a rim from my car, bringing it with me, and sorting through the pile for 3 hours while dragging the 40-lb. rim and tire all over creation.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...