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Hershey observations


joe_padavano

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I spent all day Friday at Hershey and I have a few observations. Once again, some amazing cars. It seems like every year, I find an example of a marque that I had not previously heard about - this year it was a Lloyd. Of course, for once the weather was phenomenal. Unfortunately, I am still mystified about the reluctance of vendors to open up or stay open. I have one day to cover the entire swap meet (yeah, it gets tougher every year). We entered the swap area at 7:15 AM and started walking the Green field. Most of the vendors didn't open until 8:00 and many were not open until 9:00. Come 1:30 in the afternoon, many vendors are starting to pack up. That leaves a pretty small window of shopping opportunity. It's discouraging since the result is a LOT of walking past closed vendors to find the remaining open ones. Personally I find it to be a very low signal-to-noise ratio. At least I got my exercise, but every year I wonder if it will be worth the trip next year. Nearly all of the vendors I was interested in had been at Carlisle the prior weekend anyway.

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Well, look at it from the vendor standpoint. You wake up at 6 am, get dressed, get breakfast, then fight the traffic to get on the field, by then it's easily 8 am, maybe later.

The issue that will never be addressed is the space after space of parked cars, people getting a space just so they can park on the field.

It really seems that fine, sell the flea market space, but have it in a designated area for parking ONLY, either one area, or one area on each field. Charge $60 per spot if it's just for parking, and $100 per spot to set up to sell things. That would help "concentrate" the actual vendors.

It's a simple logistic, compared to the overall logistics of the flea market.

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Well, look at it from the vendor standpoint. You wake up at 6 am, get dressed, get breakfast, then fight the traffic to get on the field, by then it's easily 8 am, maybe later.

Unfortunately, that doesn't explain packing up at 1:30 unless everyone is in a hurry to get the early bird special for dinner...

The issue that will never be addressed is the space after space of parked cars, people getting a space just so they can park on the field.

It really seems that fine, sell the flea market space, but have it in a designated area for parking ONLY, either one area, or one area on each field. Charge $60 per spot if it's just for parking, and $100 per spot to set up to sell things. That would help "concentrate" the actual vendors.

It's a simple logistic, compared to the overall logistics of the flea market.

Actually, that would be a great idea. As a Carlisle vendor, I recently received a questionnaire from them and one of the questions was related to the desirability of exactly that concept. It saves the buyers miles of walking past nothing but parked vehicles. It still doesn't solve the miles of walking past closed vendors, however.

Edited by joe_padavano (see edit history)
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I was overall really pleased and am just beginning to accept the fact that vendors open up after 8:00 and start closing at 3:30. I like to stay until 6:00 or so but by then you are down to just a few vendors a row and have already walked countless miles the rest of the day.

I covered the car corral twice and most of the fields atleast twice.

Vendors I bought stuff from said they would get more out later so I had to go back the next day and check again.

It was probably my best year for buying yet. The phenominal weather really made it a treat. Most of the parts are NOS and yes I would say 25 percent came from dollar piles. You just had to stop and dig in boxes which is time consuming but can really lead to some wonderful finds.

I filled my cart all 3 days I shopped. The last day it was overloaded and we had a pair of twin H aircleaners hanging off the back in a bag while I carried my Barn Fresh 35 Auburn Speedster out. (hey you have to start somewheres):D

I got some possible leads on a future Auburn Purchase from a very pleasant lady at the ACD booth. She liked my sign. I got a few replies on it but nothing that quite fit the bill. (those signs really do work if you keep them simple).

Overall I was extremely happy with the show.

Again my hats off to the members and volunteers who make the show possible. It is the best in the world.

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Joe,and trimacar,i agree,we open at 7am,close at 7pm .We are always here,no [leave the cash in the box]We always have a great time,Sold some vacuum tank kits,and,orders for several total rebuilds,so ,between or other projects,and rebuilds ,we will be busy,well,the hot rod shop next door sort of hit a nerve,when we could not get more spaces,but ,rules were made to be broken.But one thing,they did open early,and stayed late,more than most venders out there.

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Amen. We were open at 7:30 am each day; and didn't close until there were no remaining shoppers in sight. We were open on Saturday until 3pm despite a near-total lack of folks. There will always be members who get a space for a convenient parking space- let's face it, Herco charging $12 a day to park in a distant mud bog seals that deal. Perhaps the Hershey Region might consider designating the Orange field as space for non-sellers or casual sellers; and engineer a more "concentrated" swap meet in the process. But that's the Region's business- they put on a great event as usual and I thank them for all their hard work and dedication.

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Guest Torino75

I agree with the above. Miles of walking past cars for sale and parked cars only to find a few and far in between sellers. At $12 a car I can see why. Can't blame them but then what if all of us did that? Also, what is the rule on the golf carts? Way, way too many of them dodging each other and the crowds. Heck, I might consider getting one next year if its that easy to do. I can see handicapped accessability but I saw way too many using them as a convenience as apposed to walking like the rest of us tired soles LOL! Anyway, just got home from a nice weekend at Hershey and hope to come back next year. Just gotta get the tootsies back in shape now!!

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I agree with the above. Miles of walking past cars for sale and parked cars only to find a few and far in between sellers. At $12 a car I can see why. Can't blame them but then what if all of us did that? Also, what is the rule on the golf carts? Way, way too many of them dodging each other and the crowds. Heck, I might consider getting one next year if its that easy to do. I can see handicapped accessability but I saw way too many using them as a convenience as apposed to walking like the rest of us tired soles LOL! Anyway, just got home from a nice weekend at Hershey and hope to come back next year. Just gotta get the tootsies back in shape now!!

If this was the worst thing that happened to me today, I believe I had a good day.

Had a wonderful time. Glad to see you finished with you will be back next year.

Peter J.

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I am a vendor my father brought me as a kid he no longer comes but two years ago would have been his 52nd year selling My brother comes from colorado and me from tenn.we all love it we all camp on the field we open at 7:30am we close when we see no movement at around 5:30pm-6:00pm.I hate the fact we see cars pull in and put three things out for sale and then just leave there spot to shop,what this does is cause some of you guys when your walking the spaces to look down a isle and see a couple vendors open and rest cars and you walk past our stuff all because the boys won't enforce the rules I believe that no vendor shall leave or close booth until 5pm wenesday thursday friday,saturday up in air,great weather great show as always.Please encourage new folks to come.Good day

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We use to stay till Sunday morning. Keeping the space open till supper time on Saturday when all the neighbors got together for a potluck supper with whatever we had left. Slowly some of the neighbors died, stopped coming or left early but we continued our approach. Till one year not only were there very few left on the field but they decided to start pumping porta poties about 4AM (noisy and smelly) and picking them up soon after. We even had one vendor move over by us from a different part of the field because he was afraid to camp over night with no one around him.

So now with 6 plus hours to get home and no place to sleep once we pack the truck, we start packing up after lunch and pull out on Saturday afternoon so we can make it home to our beds.

Why some start packing up and leaving on Friday, no idea. Saturday is easier we were open for 4 hours or so on Saturday we had sales of one $8 item. Was actually better than a lot of years. For those that have been selling for a long time, Saturday has never been a big flea market day since the show is the big event for Saturday, some lookers but not many buyers.

The other possible reason for people pulling out early is an extra day was basically added years ago by letting us in Tuesday morning, it use to be Wednesday, so now Tuesday has become the first sale day for many, by Friday afternoon some vendors have had enough.

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This was only my second year as a vendor. I got set up early Wednesday morning. I was open Wednesday, Thursday, and Friday, from 8 am to 5 pm. I packed it all up on Friday just after 5pm. Today, I got up an hour earlier so I could be at the Judges Breakfast on time. After Judging, I had to stop by Chocolate World for some stuff to take home to the family. After that, I drove 7 hours home. I had a great time, but I am tired. I was able to see old friends, and meet a few Discussion Forum members for the first time. I also enjoyed volunteering to drive some neat cars on Thursday night at the RM Auction. I guess I have a whole year to rest up so I can do it again!

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..... the hot rod shop next door sort of hit a nerve ....

Bill and I noticed that vendor stall, as we approached your space to say hi to you and your brother, and wondered how that one got in. The sign said, "The Street Rod Shop", and street rod items were all they had for sale, so it does make one wonder. Maybe they just put down that they would be selling "automotive items/parts".

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In my old age I've mellowed and realized that the things that really bug me about Hershey are inevitable (depletion of inventory as time moves on and the internet). The golf karts, awol vendors and the parking spots are just minor nuisances that should be ignored. In general the whole affair is well run and organized and a colossal undertaking I'm sure. I'm retracting any complaining I've ever done with the realization that the flea market as we've known it will have to change as the times change and I want to enjoy it while it lasts.

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Guest Dick Whittington
In my old age I've mellowed and realized that the things that really bug me about Hershey are inevitable (depletion of inventory as time moves on and the internet). The golf karts, awol vendors and the parking spots are just minor nuisances that should be ignored. In general the whole affair is well run and organized and a colossal undertaking I'm sure. I'm retracting any complaining I've ever done with the realization that the flea market as we've known it will have to change as the times change and I want to enjoy it while it lasts.

Very astute observations. The internet, and Eflea especially, have changed the flea market forever. Why drag tons of parts, year after year, when you can buy and sell from the convience of your recliner? Don't get me wrong, I love the swap meet atmosphere as much as anyone else, but my last sentence pretty much sums up what is happening.

I was a vendor, not at Hershey as what I was selling would not have been a good fit, for quite a few years. Investment in truck, trailer, inventory, insurance, motels, etc has made it almost cost prohibitive for most medium sized vendors. I did some calculations, over 15 years ago, and figured I would have to realize almost $14k in gross sales, just to go to Carlisle, just to overcome my fixed expenses.

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In my old age I've mellowed and realized that the things that really bug me about Hershey are inevitable (depletion of inventory as time moves on and the internet). The golf karts, awol vendors and the parking spots are just minor nuisances that should be ignored. In general the whole affair is well run and organized and a colossal undertaking I'm sure. I'm retracting any complaining I've ever done with the realization that the flea market as we've known it will have to change as the times change and I want to enjoy it while it lasts.

I gotta say that pretty much sums up my perspective about Hershey as well!

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Guest Torino75

Perhaps if some official person were to oversee each field and walk through the area and question those that are selling items not appropriate for Hershey? Anyone can put down whatever on the paperwork and then possibly come out and sell Tupperware if they want, without anyone coming by to question. Or maybe they already do that. I mean walk around and see who's selling what. Just my $0.02!

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"The other possible reason for people pulling out early is an extra day was basically added years ago by letting us in Tuesday morning, it use to be Wednesday, so now Tuesday has become the first sale day for many, by Friday afternoon some vendors have had enough."

BINGO!!! Tuesday has become very much a selling day.

As to the policing of the areas...it is done by a team and last year some vendors were either removed or put on probabtion. I am not sure they can catch all violaters...most of the volunteers are working in other assignments.

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I wish I had started going to Hershey years ago; this was my 7th trip and I have loved everyminute. I walk most of the fields; my pedometer registered between 3 - 5 miles every day. I'm just glad to be there so I don't let parked cars or open or closed vendors bother me. I'm a little bummed out that so many vendors leave Friday night or Saturday morning. My son and I went back to find a vendor we talked with on Friday in Chocolate south; he was still there, but pretty much everyone else was gone, perhaps moreso than in past years. Still, can't wait until next year!

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Guest maudsley

This was my first time at Hershey. I enjoyed every minute of it, but that said, I am easily amused and entertained at car events anyway. Personally, I was looking for car parts, and maybe a car. I would estimate the number of vendors selling "non car parts" to be about 1/3. By that I mean the guys selling oil cans, gas pumps,signs, toys, antiques, non antiques, bicycles, motorcycles, and Hot rod stuff etc. Maybe a field may be just for that stuff, and other car "related" items. Something can get "too big", in a hurry. My collection of cars would get too big if my wife did not rein me back to what makes sense, not how much space we have to house them. Just a thought, as I did but an oil can!

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In 1971 or so we were required to remove a sign offering parts from a wrecked '64 Jag XKE. My general thinking re Hershey is "don't mess too much with success". I think the whole juggernaut operates amazingly well considering the wide range of interests and activities. My hat is off to Hershey Region and the AACA in general.

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Agree with Alsancle and Restorer on this - I can't imagine how you could change this without unintended negative consequences. I guess if I was limited to one day I would take one or two different approaches:

If I reallly needed certain parts I would use the program or any up-front research I could do contacting vendors to maximize my time. Otherwise, I would focus on one field only, taking my time to take it all in, maybe find some things I need or spend the time socializing and just taking it all in. But that is easier said than done, as I am sure there is the urge to cover as much ground as possible in a day - we were there 3 days and it was not enough time...

The gas and oil guys show up because the buyers are there, personally I thnk they go hand in hand. I honestly didn't see a lot of non automotiver stuff on the field like T-shirts or jewelry, or if so, it was not enough to take notice. I think they have the balance of what is appropriate pretty well down.

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Guest Packards1

Hershey was wonderful as usual. My only pet peeve is the SUNGLASSES booth 50 feet from the AACA cider tent on the Green field. I stopped an AACA cart that was cruising the Green field with two officials riding in it and asked why the sunglasses guy was allowed to operate. I was told in no uncertain terms that their cart was not for the Green field but another field and I would have to find someone else to address the issue. Not worth my time as the sunglasses guy has been there for a number of years and nothing has been done about it anyway. On a positive note, the load in for the Green field tuesday AM went great and the trash removal was outstanding. I am wondering why we had the national anthem twice on Saturday.

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I have been going to Hershey since 72 as a buyer/spectator. I acquired a couple spaces 4 years ago and began selling some of my extra parts. I consider myself a hobbyist with extra parts to sell. I am not a business or a "professional" vendor, I still go to Hershey to buy. I can't be open 6A to 6P Wed-Sat and still find time to shop. This year I decided to shop on wed. and sell all day Thurs & Friday. I surpassed my $1,000 goal per day on Thursday but my spots are near the back of the Orange field and there was so little traffic on Friday that I only sold a few little items for a grand total of $45 by 1:30 so I decided to pack up and do more hunting. I figured if I can't make money I might as well spend it. I also wanted to go to a 2:30 car club meeting. And I still didn't go through all the fields.

If I had to make the choice between vending all day, wed - sat. or shopping, I would choose shopping, even if it means going back to parking in the mud fields a mile away.

I used to wonder why some vender's don't open early or are not open at all some days until I became one myself. If you are a vendor who sleeps in a hotel, you can't drive into the fields until 8 AM. I never could figure the wisdom in that rule because spectators can come in a 6:00 and crowd the isles for two hours before the vender's can enter and open up.

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Guest Torino75

Probably because it was played at 8am to start the day and the played again at the start of the Show Car Judging. Nice touch I think!

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Maudsley, I go looking for antique toys, promos, die casts, etc., etc., but enjoy wandering all the fields looking for the different vendors. I would not want them all in one place. I've bought some things for my cars - wheel covers, a taillight, etc., just to have an extra in case. I don't restore cars and don't need parts but I still enjoy looking at everything Hershey has to offer.

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I'm lucky in that my wife has come to Hershey every year since 1971 (vending since 1972) accept 2 (when she was very pregnant and the next year when our son wasn't yet a year old). She holds down the booth while I shop as long as everything is priced. I have a great wife.

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I don't think gas pumps and old toys "violates" the Hershey experience. Look in your own garage to answer that one. Even old tools, advertising, old light fixtures, I say why not? I'd love to see a 1/2 dozen restored old shop lights over my cars some day. true enough, old dishes and glasses, housewares and such, maybe aren't perfectly acceptable. Then again, how many of our wives have put up with our affliction? At least they get a spot here n there to pick through if only for fun.

Yes alsancle, you nailed it. I think let it ride, let it eat. Why whine about the greatest antique and collector car venue on the planet? It works. Nobody wants some exacting and rigid experience there. It's not a public service. It's people like us on this board who are as much the same as we are different. Sunglasses? Seriously? How many forgot theirs this year? I recall 4 days of beautiful blazing sun and I'd bet several were as happy to see him as woulda been happy to see a rain poncho vendor in years past. You want the AACA to do something about it? I don't. Just walk on by. I didn't look for Pontiac parts either...

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I also think it is unrealistic to expect the hobbyist vendor to man their booth bell to bell each day. I know if I were to set up there it would be a 50-50 deal at best in terms of hours walking and visiting vs. selling. How many people with a car in the car corral stand next to it for 8 hours? Again, just part of the deal...

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I understand jdome's dilemma. I have for years thought of getting a vendor's space to sell off some of my spare parts--but then I would have no time to wander the fields to buy more! If a vendor wants to leave his space to shop, he ought to be required to leave a prominent cell-phone number for potential buyers to contact him while he is away.

I think I noticed far fewer "non-auto-related" sellers this year. I recall back in the 1970s when Hershey officials made Nat Adelstein remove some antique phonographs from his space, even though he mostly offered old car parts. I think it's time for that again. It's an antique car swap meet--not a yard sale!

There is no excuse for vendors packing up at 1:30 or even 3:30 in the afternoons.

There is no excuse for allowing people to buy vendor's spaces just to use for parking. I bet Hershey would be reduced to 1/3 its size if the rules would be enforced (if there are rules).

Asking prices were up this year, in my opinion. Especially in the car corral. One guy was offering an all original, in need of complete restoration, 1922 Dodge for $11,500. He finally sold it something for under $2900, still high. Sold cars were leaving the area, so maybe the prices are coming back up. (Unfortunately in my opinion.)

I hope Hershey directors find ways to correct these issues, otherwise I see Hershey yielding more and more to internet auction sites. All-in-all, it's a lot cheaper to buy a part on eBay at 50% higher price than to invest in a trip to Hershey, considering fuel, tolls, mileage, time off work, hotel, and premium-priced hotdogs from Hershey food vendors. This year all I bought were two North East rotors, cost $10 each + tolls, hotel, gas, etc. = $400 each!

Edited by JB-ed
clarification (see edit history)
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Guest Stonefish

I think more vendors camped "on site" back in the day....there was very little of this in and out traffic in the mornings/evenings.

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People tend to forget that most parts sellers are hobbyists also and want to do the same as everyone else...see what's new and interesting in the flea market, compare prices, maybe shop for a few items.

I am also a hobbyist-vendor and I completely understand the desire to shop as well as sell. I do exactly that at Carlisle. This is not my point. My point was about vendors who open late and close VERY early. Since I'm limited to a single day at Hershey, it makes it both difficult to buy items and forces MUCH walking between the few remaining open vendors. That's not the same as walking away from your swap space and leaving a cell phone number if a buyer is interested in something.

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...There is no excuse for vendors packing up at 1:30 or even 3:30 in the afternoons...

...There is no excuse for allowing people to buy vendor's spaces just to use for parking. I bet Hershey would be reduced to 1/3 its size if the rules would be enforced (if there are rules)...

..I hope Hershey directors find ways to correct these issues...

In my opinion, any such "crackdown" tactics would have the exact opposite effect as intended.

If vendors are going to have to deal with more and more rules and restrictions, do you think it's going to make them MORE or LESS eager to come to Hershey?

Again, just my opinion...

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Hershey is supposed to be an antique car and parts swap meet. Period. Not a parking lot. Not a place to display tarps over unseen parts in an abandoned vendor's space. Not a place to sell yard-sale items.

The only ones the "crackdown" will discourage are those not actively selling antique car parts.

Chickasha swapmeet has exactly these rules and is thriving. It's a pre-war (WW-2) only swap meet. I saw the directors make a guy remove his 1950s cars from his space and out into the parking lot a few years ago.

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Actually, Hershey is meant to be an antique car show. The flea market came about without any planning whatsoever in the 1950's when a few guys spread out some parts on the bleachers at the stadium. It grew from there. It is much easier to police a flea market like Chickasha which is what, maybe as large as one row at Hershey? Much more difficult with something the size of Hershey. Again, please don't mess too much with success. Years ago oil cans, gas pumps and the like would not have been considered "automotive". Would you ban those also? Peoples' interests change over time. I would venture to guess that most vendors at Hershey don't even come with hopes of making money selling parts. I would rather someone bring his small cache of rare parts and be at his stand 10 minutes a day than not bring them out at all. I'd bet most non commercial vendors actually lose money bringing parts to Hershey considering travel expenses etc. You also need to bear in mind that a non profit operation like the AACA has to be careful telling someone they can't use spaces they paid for. I know if Hershey wasn't FUN we wouldn't be there.

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Well, I agree you don't want to mess with things too much, but I'd still rather see one area devoted to those folks who KNOW that they just buy a space to park.

Guess I'm naive, would think that would be a fairly easy thing to do....but then again, I don't participate in the planning and set up of the meet, which is a huge undertaking....hat's off to those people who do so....

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Okay, I admit it :o, there is one lady that brings adorable stuffed toys every year and sells them alongside the antique vehicle parts her husband sells (and there aren't that many toys so it is more than in line with the rules) and I always get one from her. CHEAP prices for new toys. This year I got a stuffed version of the snake from the cartoon "Animal Crackers". It was then coiled around the stick part of the bike flag on my Hershey Hauler Radio Flyer Wagon. :D Some vendors do push the limits with the percentage of what is antique vehicle related.

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