JRA Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 The pictures below show a 1920's or 1930's sport car. It has 8 cyl Marmon engine, code: N7557, what I believe to be the 1929 Marmon, model 78. Am I correct? However, I could not identify this sport body type for Marmon in 1929. Did they have custom bodies at that time? I believe the front grille was added during the restoration 30 years ago. I was told this coach work could be Delage or Delahaye. Is it possible? The hood latches are very different and maybe could offer some hint...<O:p</O:pThanks for any help.<O:p</O:pJRA<O:p</O:p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 Sure has that British look to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RU22 Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 (edited) Looks like a sports car body ad from 1950's 'Speed Age'Anyone else remember the Krugar Marmon? Ray Radford added the wood lights and took out the Marmon engine replacing it with an A Dusey since it had an A chassisKruhat offered these as kits to finished cars. They were postwar and high standard Edited September 17, 2011 by RU22 (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted September 13, 2011 Share Posted September 13, 2011 Agreed. I would guess 1950s custom on Marmon Chassis. Looks to be well done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRA Posted September 14, 2011 Author Share Posted September 14, 2011 The history of such car is very interesting. This car was scraped by its owner due its very poor condition. He abandoned the car in a quiet street in a small town in Brazil country back in late 40's or early 50's. The only official information we have is an announcement in a daily newspaper in back on august 4th 1953 saying: "the municipality informs to whom may concern that the following items were found in the public streets of such town and if they are not claimed in the next 30 days they will be sold in public auction: (i) four male horses (different fur colours are described), (ii) one female horse (brown fur), (iii) one goat (black and white fur), (iv) one poor condition beige roadster with Marmon engine, (v) one green cargo cart with eight wheels and (vi) one blue fruit cart with three wheels.Based on that, I believe this car is older than 1950's...Are there coach buiilt cars for Marmon in 1929?Thanks,Julio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john2dameron Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 I suspect the car was exported to Europe and sometime in the thirties had this body fitted to it. I would guess that the same people who built custom bodies for DeLage and Delahaye built the body or perhaps Graber. Right off the top of my head I can't say whether Graber was in Sweden or Switzerland but I'm thinking Sweden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Bruce aka First Born Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 Whatever it is , it is a beautiful car. I would be proud to be seen in it. Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 (edited) Like I said before, very well done. I can say with most certainty that the body was not put on a 1929 Chassis in 1929. It is just not something you would see that early. It is possible it was done in the late 30s as the front styling is indicative of that period. While the nose is reminiscent of the Swiss builder Graber, the tail is very English.So to answer your original question, Yes it is a custom Marmon. However, the body was not put on the chassis originally but I guess it's possible it was done before WWII. There are pictures in period of almost all bodies produced by the larger builders. Finding a prewar picture of the car would help a lot. Edited September 14, 2011 by alsancle (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Peterson Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 The bumpers would lead one to believe it was built after WWII, but of course they could have been changed at anytime. A.J. is certainly right. This car was built in the late 1930s at the very earliest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Mack_CT Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 (edited) Very cool - is it aluminum or sheetmetal? Have you been able to see any of the skeleton - wooden or steel? That may give you some clue as to the approximate build time. Also, there may be a body tag in some obscure place. I agree with the consensus that the body is too streamlined/advanced to have been original and more indicative of late 30s. In any event, at least you know with certainty the body was done no later than the news account, and that would indicate some wear on the car making late 30s your most likely build time taking an educated guess. This looks usable as is - do you own it and what are your plans for it? Most interesting vehicle for sure - good luck with it. Edited September 14, 2011 by Steve_Mack_CT spelling (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Peterson Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 The newspaper account of the "poor condition beige roadster" does not imply one way or another that the car had its original roadster body from the 1920s, or the body now on the car. The person that purchased the car in the 1950s could have installed the new body at that time, or its possible the new body was installed 30 years ago when it was restored. Historical photos would be of significant help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 I would like to park that car nice and close to a 33/34 Ford. I bet the origin of some of the parts would be real obvious.It is a mixture of time periods for sure. A quality American built hot rod.Bernie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 Beings that is was in S America anything is possible, including its having been built to intentionally deceive though it seems too well designed for that scenario. I like it in any case. Would love to see more detailed pics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve_Mack_CT Posted September 14, 2011 Share Posted September 14, 2011 This is a longshot but another thing you can do is contact the Marmon club - it's possible that it is a "known car", you never know.What is the wheelbase - this does not look like a really big car as Marmons typically are. Do you know for sure it is on a Marmon chassis and not just Marmon powered? (To West's point, it's possible they are not referring to the current body. A shortened chassis could lean one's opinion that the "roadster" configuration was in place at the time of the news account, just another theory to consider.)Sorry for all the questions, I am just thinking the right questions could lead you to your answers...More pics please - I think several of us are intrigued! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRA Posted September 14, 2011 Author Share Posted September 14, 2011 Thanks for your thougths. Some responses:- this car is owned by a friend, who bought it in 1972. He is the fourth owner after the 1953 auction. - the chassis is definetively a Marmon chassis. My friend also owns a 1929 Marmon touring, so I checked against it, and they are the same.- I measured a wheelbase of aprox. 119", took from front hubcap (center) to rear hubcap (center). I am not sure this is the proper way to measured it.- the bumpers were probably added during a restorartion in the 60'sI will take soon more pictures and also scan old pictures to post.thanksJRA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidAU Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 The manufacturer of the electrical components ie. Headlights, Tail light, gauges etc may give some clue to its origin.If they are Lucas or CAV it may have been built in England or if they are Bosch it may have been Europe. If they are a US manufacturer then it was probably built in the Americas somewhereNeat car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleach Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 There is some sort of name badge on the top center of the radiator grille. What does it say on it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 Steve asks a good question. Aluminum over wood vs steel would be good to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West Peterson Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 Marmon's Model 78 of 1928-29 was 120 inches. In 1930, the Model 69 was 118 inches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Mellor NJ Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 Wheelbase is center to center of wheels but,obviously, you won't get an exact measurement if the wheels aren't perfectly straight, axles aren't parallel from previous damage,frame damage,etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRA Posted September 15, 2011 Author Share Posted September 15, 2011 The body is made of steel, but using wood frame. No aluminum was used. The taillights are not original.BestJulio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 There is some sort of name badge on the top center of the radiator grille. What does it say on it?It looks to be the oval Marmon emblem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRA Posted September 15, 2011 Author Share Posted September 15, 2011 It is a Marmon emblem, but I am not sure it was not added in some of the resaturations, so the question about if it is or not an original Marmon custom model. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 Some pictures of the wood framing would be helpful too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jscheib Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 Hw about a good close-up of the hubcaps. They might be a clue to the chassis. To me, the headlights look a bit odd and these. like the tailights, may have been adapted later to the body. An ID on them would help with the mystery.\John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted September 15, 2011 Share Posted September 15, 2011 Hw about a good close-up of the hubcaps. They might be a clue to the chassis. To me, the headlights look a bit odd and these. like the tailights, may have been adapted later to the body. An ID on them would help with the mystery.\JohnThe spare tire says Marmon on the cap, so.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRA Posted September 16, 2011 Author Share Posted September 16, 2011 More pictures and additional info. I took the wheel base measure again (center of hubcap to center of hubcap): 118.5", exactly the same wheel base of the other Marmon 78 my friend has and I use as reference. I measured the radiator honeycomb core and compare it with the other Marmon 78 too. It has the same width and frame, but it is about 5.1"shorter than the other one. We should expect that due the differen and shorter hood this car has. Al gauges are new add ons, as tail lights, that were added during last restoration.The steering wheel is original as the wire wheels as well. The downdraft carburators are not original but that strange intake manifold with optional updraft carburator opening (currently sealed) seems to be original and without any weldding signal.ThanksJRA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Headlamps are 1931 Dodge Brothers-like... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted September 17, 2011 Share Posted September 17, 2011 Exceptionally well done but it really looks like a put together special. Sometime between the late 30s and 50s. But, I could be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRA Posted September 18, 2011 Author Share Posted September 18, 2011 This friend of mine is selling his entire collection. Some of the other cars are: 1929 Marmon 78 Phaeton; 1926 big six Studebaker roadster; 1926 Chrysler roadster; 1950 Jowett Jupiter; 1959 VW beetle; this one we are talking in this post; and the one I consider the rarest one: 1936 Chevrolet Master Imperial 4 dr Cabriolet (this fine 4 dr open car is a very special coach work done by Glaser, in Dresden, Germany, focused in the european market).Talking about this other cars, the Studebaker needs a new radiator, but this 1926 model has a very different round/curved core type, does anyone know where he can buy it?ThanksJulio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bkazmer Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 sounds like the answer to the question about a CCCA-eligible Chevrolet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 Chevy sounds sweet. Post some pictures please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john2dameron Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 Chances are the 1936 Chevrolet is sporting the original 6-cylinder engine and that would disqualify it from the CCCA standards on the basis of performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 Chances are the 1936 Chevrolet is sporting the original 6-cylinder engine and that would disqualify it from the CCCA standards on the basis of performance.If it has a Glaser body installed in period it would be eligible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JRA Posted September 20, 2011 Author Share Posted September 20, 2011 I will take some pictures of this 1936 Chevrolet. The one attached is a scanned one, but you can see another good picture of it in the link below. It was taken at a car show here in Rio two years ago. Chevrolet Master Imperial 1936 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!This 1936 Chevy is entirely original. I believe only two of them were shipped to Brazil in 1936, and this one is the survivor. I have created a thread at VCCA trying to identy the production figures of such car, and I got some info about it, but no numbers.http://clubs.hemmings.com/clubsites/chevytalk/GMhistory/36convsd1.jpgIs it considered a valid Classic ?Best,JRA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsancle Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 The owner would have to apply for acceptance but I'm sure it would be accepted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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