Would like any photos of 25 touring car

[MikeC5]

I'm looking for some good photos of a 25 touring car/restoration to help put my new purchase back together. I do have the mechanic's manual coming. Are there some other good sources of this type of info?

[Guest 1930]

I would suggest purchasing the CD set of past newsletters that are avail thru the DB club, guarantee that it would be a great start for you, second suggestion is to watch e-bay religousely and you will see the cars pop up with many great photos you can save and print if you like. Also by joining the club it will put you in contact withmany other similiar members and surely out of the lot of them you can get enough pict. and info to suffice.

[MikeC5]

Hi 1930, I think the CD set is a great idea but I can't seem to find where it's offered on the site (I have joined DBC). A link would be great if you know it. I have done some digging through ebay and Google but can't seem to find much in the way of in-process restoration of a mid-20's touring car yet. I'm sure there are a lot of DIY-types in the club who have done various parts, if not the whole enchilada. I just got the mechanic's manual today. A lot of information there but unfortunately none on the bodies.

[keiser31]

Here is a 1925 DB that was at the National Meet in Keizer, Oregon.

[nearchoclatetown]

CD and other club items can be purchased from Tom and Cindy Myer's, they run the club store.

[MikeC5]

Thanks. I'll check it out. Nice color combo on that CA car. Is it a factory paint scheme?

[Guest 1930]

Most people do not take photos of a restoration as it happens because most restos are done part time when money and time is avail, I know a guy that has been working on his DA for 40 years.

Assuming your car purchased is in pieces its a matter of getting your parts together and getting an idea of where things go, studying how things went together and doing your best to preserve whatever clues you can find.

You will not find any one source of resto info for any early Dodge that I know of, its a matter of watching for pictures on e-bay, you will get tidbits from that, getting the 4 cd set from the club store again only tidbits, another suggestion is contacting the editor of the DB club and buying his CD compilation, its generally Victory six but there are tons of info, great suggestions and ideas to be found if you look hard enough, I might also suggest buying a Fisher Body service manual, they are avail repro, fisher bodys were for the most part wooden skelotens with sheet metal tacked on but the the manual covers all sorts of facets of these early bodys that youmay find uselfull.

You will almost certaintely get little body info from that service manual you purchased, as far as I know there is no Dodge manual that shows much of anything on servicing the interiors, I have a couple of Budd body manuals that get into it a little with some great pict. but again these that I have are later than what you have so the info wont pertain much.

It all takes time and sleuthing, you didnt buy a Ford or a Chevrolet, you are going to have to work for that Dodge

[keiser31]

Or maybe some nice 1925 DB owner will be so kind as to help this guy out and post some photos of their car for him.

[MikeC5]

Thanks 1930. I will try and chase down some of those leads. You make a good point that it will require more research than the typical Ford or Chevy. THat's part of the fun. Do the mid-20's cars have any under- front fender support irons or are they just bolted to the frame, running board and tie rod between the headlights? I haven't been able to discern any clues from the pictures I've found. I have helped a friend with a couple of Model T's and I recall fender irons on those. I didn't notice anything like that in the boxes 'o parts I've got.

[HBergh]

MikeC5: If you Google "1925 Dodge" you will find many images of 1925 Dodges.

[MikeC5]

Yes I've been doing that HBergh.

[Guest 1930]

I dont know much about 25 dodge, if you posted some pict (lots of them ) than maybe I can help and surely someone else can. Fenders as far as I know always had supports because of the sheer weight, as far as I know it was at the outer or widest point of the fender, at least taht is what makes sense and that is where my 29 are. Not sure what you mean by ......running board and tie rod between the headlights? ........Yes they have running boards and yes there is a support brace under the board. Yes there is a tie rod??? between the fenders to support the lamps. Like it was mentioned there seems to be alot of pict on google and you can see the tie rod for lamps here, just not so close up unfortunately and maybe that is what you are after. It all takes time and work.

[DoubleG]

I own and restored a 1924 DB Touring. I'm pretty sure that '24 and '25 are basically the same. I have a lot of photos that I took during the restoration of my car. Too many to post here. If you'd like, I can email you some that should clear up the mystery of reassembling your car. Send me a PM with your email address and let's get you and your car on the road.

[Guest DBAcadia]

Hi all, yes the front fenders do have struts. Appear to be rivetted to the fender,

thats what the two bumps are on the outside of fender, don't grind those off.

The headlamp brackets bolt on these w/6 apiece and crossbar mounts to these.

At the bottom of fender strut are 4 holes and two dedicated trapped bolt

brackets attach through car frame. All that and the four nuts attaching to

the running board apron, plus where fender attaches to running board strut

all hold fender on very secure. On earlier series fender the strut may have

been separate. You'll see these on doodlebug tractors and fenderless speedsters.

[Guest 1930]

There you go Double G and Acadia, thanks for helping this guy out!

[MikeC5]

Thank you DBAcadia, that was exactly what I was looking for. I do have these brackets- now they make sense...

[MikeC5]

I sent you a PM DoubleG.

[Guest gismo081]

If you would like I will send you some pictures I am about to pull mine out of the garage and clean it up a little for summer.

[MikeC5]

Sure. It's always interesting to see how various details are handled on other cars. Was it restored or a surviving original?

[Pete K.]

Mike, I thought your '25 was all put back together. If there is anything in particular you may be looking for, I'd be happy to crawl into the overly- packed barn of mine and photograph something for you. As you may know, I found this Dodge about a year ago, assembled, mostly original. I've spent the last year cleaning fuel system & restoring wiring and minor problems. I'm leaving the car as it is, the paint job buffed out pretty well, got it running well and just as yesterday, got my new 21" tires and the tubes delivered here. I still haven't placed the battery back in it for the spring time start-up yet this year, I've got other old car projects going on here at the same time. A picture only takes a minute to do, so let me know-- Best regards, Pete.

[MikeC5]

It's a long way from being finished Pete... I have had it on the road a few times as a fender-less jalopy in primer (with doors though). I was hoping to get more finish work done on the fenders and aprons this winter but, well you know how it sometimes goes. You can do some real touring once you get those new tires on! I will certainly let you know when I need help with some details. What other old car projects are you working on?

[Pete K.]

Mike, Here's a picture of the '31 ford pick up I pulled out of a plumbing warehouse where it had been sleeping for over 45 years un-touched and mostly original. It had some WWII modifications done like the 16" Ford wire wheels and a brush paint job. I tell people they sell my touch-up paint in every store in America. It's called black Rustoleum. The baloney skin spare tire is the original that came with the truck in '31. I drive it every chance I get. It's like driving a Go-cart since it's half the size of our Dodges. It is a tiny cab. I freshened the engine, new brakes, tires, hoses, battery, all new wiring. Just finished putting in a new radiator core last week since the old one had more leaks than I could count. It never over heated though. I plan to get the core re-done for my other project, a 1931 Ford 160-B Town Sedan, the slant windshield body. That has been on-going for many years and will be for a long time. (a frame-up resto.). The Dodge is a "breeze" compared to that. I'm very anxious to get those new tires on the '25 and drive that baby, just haven't been ready for wrestling alligators doing those tires (all five), for the Dodge. I bought the tubes with the vulcanized-on metal Schrader stems and correct, long dust covers. The Dodge has most of the original metal stems, but I can't see re-using them at this point. They are probably the clamp-in type, I don't trust them as much.I'm hoping the flaps are in those old casings, as I didn't buy new ones. They rarely go bad over time. I'll certainly find out soon enough.

[MikeC5]

That's a very nice little truck Pete. It does appear the wheel base is much shorter than the Dodge. It's pretty neat that it was a barn find and now you've got it going in dignified retirement living... It must have been a bit of culture shock when getting the DB and finding that you actually have to search out some parts rather than flip through a catalog. I like Model A's too so don't get me wrong. I'm just envious of antique car owner who's parts are just a click or two away (and $$$)

[Pete K.]

Thanks Mike, I've only had two Model A's out of the 14 antique cars owned in the past 40 years. The earliest was a 1909 Autocar two ton coal truck, two cylinder engine with acetylene lamps. I'm very used to locating "impossible to find" parts if I put my mind to it. Ford built millions of Model A's as you know, so original parts are still around. The repro parts for the A's vary in quality from poor to good. I try to find only original parts, but some body styles are unique and their parts are now difficult to locate. If you really want to go on some treasure hunts for parts, try restoring a 1941 Wurlitzer jukebox. They only built 10,000 of them in '41 and most were worn out & scrapped by the 1950's. Jukeboxes were not "built to last" like many of the fine automobiles of the day. Record disc speed & size changed and so did the machines. The old ones were cast off to the dump! This is one of about 25 still in existence and now playing my old '78's loud and clear, for a nickel-a-play.

[R.White]

Goodness Pete, that must have been a labour of love! It's hard to think now how little those Werlitzer jukeboxes were once worth; a bit like the way so many fine things of the past have been discarded only to become desirable again years later.

Just like my 'Joni Mitchell' signature.

Ray.

Edited April 22, 2013 by R.White (see edit history)

[Pete K.]

Yup, They paved paradise and put up a parking lot.

[Guest 1930]

I also like the box, I wish I were able to see it play again

[MikeC5]

That is really an exceptional Jukebox Pete. A beautiful piece... I would imagine parts a quite scarce. When did you restore it? It's hard to imagine how much more difficult it was to communicate before the internet (I mean you had to write a letter and get around to mailing the letter and then waiting days/months to hear anything back). I've dabbled in rebuilding player pianos (the player guts) and while challenging, there are a few places that fabricate many of the items that tend to wear out. And even making what you need out of wood or leather isn't super difficult (I'm excluding the piano itself here). The intricate mechanisms found in these Jukeboxes would take some serious time, effort and tooling to repair/reproduce, I'm sure.

[Pete K.]

yes, I started with the old jukes way back in 1977 when virtually no one was looking for them. The collectors went cookoo for them a short 4 yrs. later. Now, investors buy them. I've been fortunate to locate many jukeboxes from 1936 to 1955. All makes & models, probably a hundred. The rarest and most beautiful ones are the Wurlitzer's from 1939-1948. I kept 6 of them which are fully restored and in my home. The internal record changers are made of steel, iron, brass, cast aluminum and POTMETAL. The turntables rise a foot to snatch the record from a selected-out pivot ring of polished aluminum stack of the records, then meets up with the tonearm on a stanchion at right rear. Music plays, then returns record back to the "stack". One can watch all this going on through the front window. These machines are not for the faint of heart. They are quite intricate with a lot going on inside. All direct drive through gearing and a clutch for the mech & turntable. (78 RPM). There's more wiring in them than 20 1925 Dodges. They of course use a tube 110 V. amplifier mated with electro-dynamic speakers that operate at boost of 600+ volts. "Ballroom sound" for sure. I play them all the time. At least it's GOOD music. I once repaired a player piano Mike--Don't ever want to do another one, but I do love 'em. You are right on about the pre-internet days finding parts & info. It was SLOW going. It didn't stop with jukeboxes. I went on to dig up old penny arcade machines and many old mechanical slot machines from 1906 to 1949. I Had some stories and repair articles published over the years. Some of the stories are really funny. I once bought an early jukebox from a totally(from birth), deaf man. The only part it was missing was the tonearm. He didn't care. One man traded me his old jukebox for 20 Lbs. of fresh jumbo Pistachio's. At the time I was operating a string of nut machines in all the bars & shops in the county and had the bags in my trunk. Wonder how long it took him to polish those all off. Here's a couple more shots of some cool, old music machines. My apologies Mike for the severe hijacking!

Edited April 23, 2013 by Pete K. (see edit history)

[R.White]

Just for fun I thought I would post this early model to show how plain they were in those days.

Jukebox Wurlitzer 1934 P 10 10 selections 78 rpm early " VERY RARE" L@@K | eBay

Of course it is the wonderful cinema and ballroom organs that most older people will remember. The most famous one over here is in the Ballroom under Blackpool Tower but I also found this restored one which would be worth a visit. They were really something in their day and they still amaze me.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cumbria-19270424

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSw6b7PVpDw

http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/tees/hi/people_and_places/history/newsid_9115000/9115935.stm

http://www.cinema-organs.org.uk/uk%20organs/ukorgans.html

I just thought that if we are going to hi-jack someone's thread - I might as well pull all the stops out !!! Da Dah!

Ray. (sorry Mike)

Edited April 23, 2013 by R.White (see edit history)

[Pete K.]

Ray, Thanks for the photo. And yes, My apologies to Mike for the start of this major hijacking of his thread!! I would like to think Mike knows we would help him out in any way I can with his '25 Dodge project. The gent that has the Wurl. P-10 is a bit off the mark. That is not Wurlitzer's first jukebox. Wurlitzer's 1st was called the "Debutante". The blue paint in the cabinet IS original color also. I've seen both blue and black interiors. The light-up plastics were not invented as yet- that was started with the Seeburg Corp. of Chicago,Ill. in 1937. The early wood "flat top" jukes are worth far less than the later "gaudy" ones, but they're cool anyhow. I found your link to Nigel Ogden playing the Blackpool Tower Wurlitzer organ really neat! I'm glad the war bombs didn't hit that hall!

Edited April 23, 2013 by Pete K. (see edit history)

[R.White]

If the Germans had known how important Blackpool Tower was to our survival they would have destroyed it for sure.

If you are interested, here is a synopsis of Wartime at the Tower.

Blackpool Tower in the War Years 1939-1945

[Pete K.]

Many thanks Ray, I found that article very interesting and I learned many things about the Tower that I never knew.

[MikeC5]

Ah, but a great tangent it is Ray! The article on the Blackpool Tower was quite interesting; a true multi-purpose venue! I don't believe I've ever seen a Jukebox looking like regular furniture before. I wonder if anyone ever produced one that used Edison cylinder records?

[Pete K.]

By Golly they did mike--Had the pleasure of restoring one 30 years ago, made by the Columbia Phonograph Co. in 1899. An oak "table top" case with a curved glass front that held a mechanism that played cylinder records! It was originally a nickel-a-play too. The listener would have to use ear plugs on a rubber tube (like a doctor's stethoscope), to hear the one and only selection of the day, so that others around him would not hear his money's worth of music. (no amplifiers then!). other more elaborate machines were coming about thru the teens and twenties. Gable Co. was a leader of very early acoustic jukeboxes. Very rare today.

[R.White]

The Edison company continued producing cylinders alongside the more popular discs up to 1929. Today you can get copies of originals or new material on 2 or 4 minute cylinders. You can even have your own recordings made on 2 minute cylinders for £220 a time which will play on a phonograph - Thomas Edison's favourite invention. Also today new CD player Werlitzer type juke boxes can be bought for several thousand $ but I think they are only a pastiche of the original ones but no less clever in their own right. Doubtless there would be a market for a jukebox which played Edison cylinders or discs but the set up costs would be astronomical. The Parlophone gramophone player should not be confused with the polyphon music box which was popular here but they are both lovely things in my view.

Ray.

Edited April 24, 2013 by R.White (see edit history)