Guest Mochet Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Tonight, we checked the spark (OK) and put a little gas in each cylinder. Cranking a dozen or so times produced nothing. We then used a shot of starting fluid. On the fourth try, it suddenly came to life and ran well. We kept it going for a minute or so, but shut it off as there is no coolant yet. Anyway, I'm happy to report that the Metz runs.Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seldenguy Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Phil, there is one of those elusive sparkplugs on Ebay now.--Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Alexander Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Glad to learn of your success! Really glad!! Just curious, is your car ' loud '? Mine really let's you know she is alive. The noise is muffled but still she is much more loud than my friend's T. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mochet Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 It was pretty loud, but we were inside the garage standing right next to it. I think it will be quieter when we get the idle down and it's broken in.Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Alexander Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Mine remains more loud than I would have thought it would be. Does anyone know if that is a characteristic of this engine. I'd hate to invest in a new muffler just to find out that there is no real cure for Ethyl making her presence known. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mochet Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 Photo below is the car this morning. I installed the seat yesterday. As mentioned before, I retained the old upholstery that came with the car. This afternoon, I installed the steering wheel, only to discover (after an hour or so) that I had the shaft backwards. Both ends look similar; one drilled for the pin holding the gear, the other end for the steering wheel. The gear fit nicely, but the wheel didn't reach its pin hole. Once I reversed the shaft, both the wheel and the gear fit nicely. I also filled the radiator for the first time, and drained it after it dripped in a couple places. The side "inlet" gasket leaked because of slight rust pitting in the mounting surface. I used some gasket sealant there. The top "outlet" leaked also, so I sealed it with some silicone. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Looking great!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Alexander Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Really looking nice!!! Curious what color of paint did you use for teh body and wheels? Also are the fenders also painted dark blue or are they supposed to be black? Those questions are for my future reference. Right now our 1915 Model 22 Foredoor is all black with yellow wheels. Yuk.Again you have a very nice car and it is a beauty.Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mochet Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 The blue I used is the Ford Fleet color "Dark Blue" (used on commercial vehicles). Wheels are the BMW Mini color "Pepper White". Metz described their colors as "dark blue" and "cream." No color formulas back then, so you must decide. Entire body was blue in 1913 (except for "Special Roadster" which was an orange/red color). The 1915 colors were the same.Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Alexander Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Thanks. That changes my concept. I had planned on leaving the fenders black but now that will not be an option. I want it to be correct. I will remember your color and I have seen "Indigo Blue" a GM color that I really like, too. But that paint has a little metal fleck in it. I know that was not an option back in the early 1900's. But it sure is a pretty color.Again, thanks.Jerry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mochet Posted November 25, 2012 Share Posted November 25, 2012 No, I haven't quit yet! My latest challenge was a leaking lower coolant elbow. This is where the coolant "enters" the engine during the thermosiphon process (ie; no water pump). Anyway: drip, drip, drip. I tried various gaskets and sealants to no avail, but finally determined that the hole in the block had been enlarged at its base by rust. Since the block was cleaned, I didn't notice this until I saw only a very small area at the bottom of the elbow made contact with the block. I built up this area with epoxy, clamping a wood block over the opening covered with wax paper. The joint no longer leaks.I've also ordered new wood top bows from measurements taken from an original car. The firm I use, Bareville Woodcraft in PA, did a nice job on my 1921 Peugeot top bows, so I'm using them again. I've never made a top, so I hope it works!Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mochet Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 I'm working on the Metz top, which was completely missing when I got the car. As per previous posts, I got new top irons made a while back and a couple weeks ago got the new steam-bent oak bows. I measured many times before I ordered these! I took dimensions from the original Metz 22 roadster sold last fall by Bonhams at the Simeone Museum in Philadelphia. This is how I fit the bows into the sockets:Here is how the bows look as they come from the bending shop. The frame keeps them in shape until use. Note that I bought extras. I'm a pessimist. Here are some of the tools I used (L-R: jack plane, block plane, curved spokeshave, drawknife):I used a B&D Workhorse to hold the bows. First, I measured how deep they fit into the sockets (also called "top irons") and cut them to length.I then used a small hand saw to cut around the bows to form the contour to match the socket I.D. I drew an "X" on top to locate the center of the bows so my carving stayed as centered as possible.For the first rough shaping, I used a draw knife, and followed with a small block plane until I got a shape similar to the sockets.I used a rounded carving chisel to remove wood to accommodate the seam in the top irons. You could also use a router, but I found this simpler.As the socket started to fit, I carved more wood away. When it fit down a couple inches, I began using powdered graphite as a guide. I applied it inside the sockets, and lightly cut away the black marks. Each time, the bows went down a little but more. It took maybe 30 tries. Finally, a nice fit!Next, to smooth the bows and try on the car. Stay tuned.Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Alexander Posted January 17, 2013 Share Posted January 17, 2013 My goodness you went to a lot of work! But that is what it takes. I applaud you! I think the bows on my '15 are metal. I will check them when I go over to visit Ethyl at her winter's slumbering building. If her bows are metal I presume that means someone has replaced the originals or there was a metal bow option. I know the fabric is not the original. That I was told by the former owner's son the day we purchased Ethyl. Thank you for sharing your build with us. It will help for future reference. I will attempt to do the same when we re-create the motor cover. We have found a fabricator willing to take this on. We do not have a start date yet as he had to get some 20 gage material in first. Fortunately he has some on the way. This project will be a side project for him. So there could be some starting and stopping before we get done. I am in no big rush as we are still in the middle of winter here. M cousin and I will be assisting the pro at this. It will be a learning experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mochet Posted January 26, 2013 Share Posted January 26, 2013 I rounded the edges of the top bows with a 3/8" rounding bit on my router table followed by planing and sanding. I then applied three coats of thin epoxy to seal the wood, staining the corners black (I may paint the wood that shows). Here they are in the sockets and aligned for the first time.Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luv2Wrench Posted January 26, 2013 Share Posted January 26, 2013 Looks great Phil, congrats! I see another project or two peeking out in that picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Alexander Posted January 27, 2013 Share Posted January 27, 2013 Looks really nice! I love the colors of your Metz. Again, what was your mix to get the blue? That is going to be a sharp car when you get done. Congrats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Standard Eight Posted January 27, 2013 Share Posted January 27, 2013 Really nice work! - Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted January 27, 2013 Share Posted January 27, 2013 Looking great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mochet Posted January 27, 2013 Share Posted January 27, 2013 The paint color I used is Ford "Dark Blue", which is a commercial color used by Ford on trucks in recent years. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Alexander Posted January 27, 2013 Share Posted January 27, 2013 Thanks I will write that down this time. Hopefull I will not forget where I wrote it. ;-). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy13 Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 Thanks for all these postings and pictures. I have a 1913 Metz that I am preparing to restore. She's 99.9% complete and is only missing chain guard covers and the exhaust cut out pedal. Did you ever find out how the exhaust cut out pedal hooks up? I'd also be interested to get the dimensions for the castings you had made. You have inspired me!!Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mochet Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 I never did see an original exhaust cut-out connection, but I ran mine directly to the from the pedal lever to the muffler valve using music (piano) wire. It really didn't interfere with anything, so I'm guessing that's how Metz did it. They used an extension coil spring from the valve to the chassis (or running board rail; I forget) to keep the valve shut. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mochet Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Just got my new top rests for the Metz. These were made from my drawings by Bob Beck. He did a great fabricating job on these odd parts. The pair bolt to either side of the seat back and hold the top when it's down. I'll probably line them in leather and use leather belts to keep the top secure. I will paint them black, which I'm assuming Metz did.Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luv2Wrench Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Looks great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Landman Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 Just got my new top rests for the Metz. These were made from my drawings by Bob Beck. He did a great fabricating job on these odd parts. The pair bolt to either side of the seat back and hold the top when it's down. I'll probably line them in leather and use leather belts to keep the top secure. I will paint them black, which I'm assuming Metz did.Phil[ATTACH=CONFIG]178116[/ATTACH]Phil, am I correct in assuming the arms are soldered to the saddles rather than welded? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy13 Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 Andy here. The top rests on my Metz are painted black. There is a rivet on the back side of the top half that I assume held the leather strap. I will try to take a photo for you and post very soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy13 Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 Phil, Here are a few photos of the top supports on our Metz.Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy13 Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 This photo shows the bracket that spans the back of the seat frame. The top attaches to this.Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mochet Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 The rest is soldered and also invisibly pinned to the bracket in my "repro" rests.Thanks, Andy, for the photos. I made the rail that holds the top cloth, and now must attach the fasteners to it.Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mochet Posted February 18, 2013 Share Posted February 18, 2013 Andy... Is there any evidence of leather straps from the rear bow to the bar behind the seat? This was apparently a standard feature on this kind of top. You can see them in this photo from the Metz 22 sold by Bonhams last year, but I didn't check how they were attached.Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy13 Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Phil.. Our car had it's top replace by the museum that owned it in the 1950's They did not included these straps. I will re-examine our top to check for any evidence of these straps. I saw this car on Bonham's site after it had been sold. Bonham's is having an auction this Sat. Feb.23. at the Boca Raton Concourse d'Elegance. I am going to contact them to see if I can get more information on that car, etc.Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy13 Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 The straps on the top bow hold the rear portion of the top up. Here is an old newpaper article on our car showing the top strapped up. Note the square style sidelights too.Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy13 Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Let me try again.... Note the square side lights.. This is our car in a 1930's article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy13 Posted February 20, 2013 Share Posted February 20, 2013 Phil.. Where did you get the photo of the top? Do you have others of that car sold by Bonhams?Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MochetVelo Posted February 20, 2013 Author Share Posted February 20, 2013 I took a number of photos at the Bonhams sale. Go here to see them. I'd be curious who bought that car.Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy13 Posted February 26, 2013 Share Posted February 26, 2013 WOW. Thanks Phil for all those great photos. I contacted Bonhams this Sat. They are going to forward my contact info to the buyer. Hopefully, the buyer will decide to contact me.Andy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy13 Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Phil (and everyone in the group)Here are some photos of our Metz. You can see some of the original dark blue in the photos of the hood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luv2Wrench Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Very nice car Andy. It looks very correct and complete. That dark blue looks very, very much like what I found when I took apart my seat. It is very dark. At first I thought it was black. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Andy13 Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Thanks. This is part of the detective work I am doing on the car right now. I had to rub out the area on the hood for that dark blue to show. The car has had some repainting done by the museum that owned it in the 1950's. Most of the "new" paint evidence I find is on the undercarriage parts and the interior wood. The top bows were also repainted black and the wheels were painted red. The museum also replaced the top and windscreen (but with the correct material). The Rushmore headlights are incorrect, but I found the correct style on my trip to the Hershey meet last fall. Chain guards are missing. Hopefuly to be re-fabricated. The carburetor had been replaced, but I have the original Holley (brass bowl is cracked). All other fiddley-bits seem to be present with the car. The car's entire "life" is well documented in the paper work that came with the car. She runs well, but brake mechanisms are frozen. I jack up the rear end and start her every now and then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mochet Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Nice car. You may find some original pin striping under the black paint, also. I think they used the red wheel paint on the oil funnel. That was unpainted originally, I think. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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