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Any '52 Jaguar experts out there?


bhclark
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Found this.

Not sure yet if it runs, but it's on dollies, so I'm guessing not at this point.

Pictures show overspray from the paint job on the underbody and radiator.

Values are all over the board on these from 10,000-$100,000 on the web sites?

I can imagine parts are incredibly hard to find and expensive to repair?

I tried to upload a larger photo but it kept failing.

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Edited by bhclark (see edit history)
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What are you asking? Value? Should you buy it? What's it cost to restore? What goes wrong with these cars?

I don't have a lot of experience with these Jags, although I'm currently representing a very similar 1954 XK120 SE for sale. Having spent a lot of time with the car and the owner, I'm going to say that restoring one of these is not for the faint of heart, and you WILL be upside down no matter what. I have receipts for the SE, and there's nearly $40K just in the engine and chassis rebuilds, never mind the body, paint, interior, and top. And that was starting with a solid, running, driving car.

While the mechanicals are pretty stout on these cars, the bodies are notorious for being rust buckets. While inspecting this very well restored car, I can easily see all the spots where water and debris would collect and rot the body from the inside, and some of those areas are major support systems for the entire car. Fixing it correctly (if this one is indeed decaying) will involve considerable fabrication and no doubt the help of an expert.

On the other hand, if this one is solid, and only needs some modest TLC to get running, and can be had for a good price, the market is fairly strong on them and is still going up. These were $60K cars just a few years ago, but the good ones are over six figures today.

I guess it's like any other car--if you love it, maybe it's worth it just for the pleasure of the project and joy of ownership. If, however, you're trying to make some money by fixing it yourself and flipping it, you may be better off driving down the road throwing $20s out the window instead.

Hope this helps.

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First question: Will they take a trade straight up for a running TR6? :D

Second question: Am I crazy, or is that car located in someone's family room?

Third question (this one serious): Is the car local here in Butler Co. or nearby? I can help look at it if you'd like.

I know a fair amount about these cars, and there's not a lot to add beyond what Matt said. I've never owned one, but I've read about them extensively and I did have one for a day as a driver for a special event once. I can tell you without a doubt it's the most fun car on earth to drive. However when you erect the roadster top it's virtually like driving in a tunnel, with no side vision (unless you lean WAY forward) and almost no rear vision.

Ever since that day the XK120 has been #1 on my dream list.

One big problem I can see right away is that this does not appear to be a 1952 car. The turn signal housings went from chrome to body color in 1951. It's hard to tell from the photo, but the car does appear to have the long-necked rear view mirror, which I believe was from 1951 and later.

Most XKs today have been fitted with optional wire wheels (often chrome although they weren't offered until the last model year). This car has the standard wheels fitted, which is a nice touch in my eyes. Also those fender skirts are often ditched to show off the wheels. Having them in place is another plus.

XK120s have several engine versions available (using the same short-block), which are easily distinguished by the color of the head. Special, high-compression heads can be either red (C head), blue (B head). or Gold (D head, VERY rare). However these are often swapped (and painted, so have an expert check for identifying marks). A "special equipment" package, which I believe included the C version of the head, can be identified by a VIN # starting with either a 7 or an 8. You'll often see these advertised as an XK120C, and they are worth a substantial premium if authenticated. (These are mainly the $100K+ cars you'll see.)

Mechanical parts are readily available, for the most part. Some rare bits will be very expensive. (For most British cars this means overdrives and original NOS electronic bits.) Having work done is more expensive than a normal car (a tune-up is sometimes $500+), but with a Bentley Service Manual and a reasonable degree of expertise they're not too hard to work on. You will need a set of Whitworth tools, a Uni-Synch carb balancer, and a few other specialized tools, however.

A good driver should be available for around $60K, with an exeptional car around $100K. A day behind the wheel of one of these things is as close to priceless an automotive experience as I can imagine.:cool:

Edited by Dave@Moon
typo (see edit history)
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One other thing I forgot. Forget everything you know about smooth riding Jaguars. These things aren't luxury cars, they are full-on sports cars. The average pick-up truck has a softer ride and more comfortable seating. The ride is more harsh than even a Corvette (of any vintage) or any newer sports car.

It's all part of the fun to me, though. It makes the driving experience all the better for most people.:cool:

Edited by Dave@Moon
typos. Don't type in the dark! (see edit history)
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We have restored several XK Jags and I have an XK140 myself. Parts are readily available. Actually most nuts and bolts on an XK are not Whitworth but American Standard. RUST is the primary concern. If you set a team of engineers to the task of designing a vehicle that would rust at the fastest possible rate I am convinced they would come up with something closely resembling an XK Jaguar. Matching numbers is very important to early Jag folks. Jaguar Heritage can provide quite a bit of info on any early Jag, including build date, purchase date, name of purchaser, original equipment list including color and options and the dealer who originally sold the car. Did I mention RUST? If the doors sag take that as a warning. Once rust sets into these cars they quickly lose structural integrity and repairing that damage is time consuming and obviously expensive, even with the extensive list of body panels now available. Mechanically they are very strong but they drive like dump trucks until they are at speed. Once you are "on plane" though nothing beats the feel or sound of an XK in full voice.

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What a great car! I had a friend with one as a kid in Priceton NJ. Even then I was horified to see him drive it with snow chains in the winter. (but he was a Dartmouth hockey player and didn't know better)

Since 1967, my bride has wanted one. However she won't drive stick shift and the fact that I've had a horrible time with early Jag suspension and allignment, on one of our cars, restoration is out of the question.

If I could get one, I'd put a modern driveline and suspention with an Amerian V8 and automatic transmission in an otherwise restored car. Don't throw stones, I'm just dreaming. (If my wife had her dream car, I might be able to get a few more of my dreams) What's wrong with that?

Here's a picture of her present Jag. Wired to a motion sensor to turn it's lites on when we drive in the barn.

post-32318-143138381906_thumb.jpg

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The memories are coming back. In 1964 my father bought a 1951 Jag XK120 at the Utica-Rome Speedway in upstate New York where he used to race stock cars. In 1966 and 1967 it was the car I used to take my girlfriend (now my wife for the past 41 years) to the dances at Sylvan Beach. It rode low and fast. My brother totaled the car in 1970 while home on leave from Vietnam. He survived, but the Jag didn't.

Here's some Jag images to enjoy. The only picture I have left of Dad's Jag is the sketch I made in 1967. - RICK

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post-59657-143138381871_thumb.jpg

post-59657-143138381881_thumb.jpg

post-59657-143138381896_thumb.jpg

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If I could get one, I'd put a modern driveline and suspention with an Amerian V8 and automatic transmission in an otherwise restored car. Don't throw stones, I'm just dreaming. (If my wife had her dream car, I might be able to get a few more of my dreams) What's wrong with that?

Stone alert: Pure blasphemy. It's like erasing a compact disc of Mozart music and rerecording Alvin and the Chipmunks over it.

Hot rodding old cars has it's place, but....I've never understood the desire to change drivetrains in a Jag when their drivetrains are simply the best you can find! At least the best you can get without sending a huge chunk of the Gross National Product to Stuttgart or Modena. American V8s are great, but a 207 cubic inch engine that can pull 120+ mph with 1949 technology? How does that get thrown away?:confused: Simply put, when you've thrown away a Jag engine you've thrown away the best part.

Unfortunately some people do do this, especially with E-Types (that'll push 160 mph stock in good tune). It's interesting (and amusing) to see them show up at a British car show, get ignored, and leave early. Usually VERY early. I've never seen the same such car twice, and I've attended 3-5 British car shows every year, in the same area, for decades. I've often wondered what happened to them all.:confused:

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What a great car! I had a friend with one as a kid in Priceton NJ. Even then I was horified to see him drive it with snow chains in the winter. (but he was a Dartmouth hockey player and didn't know better)

Since 1967, my bride has wanted one. However she won't drive stick shift and the fact that I've had a horrible time with early Jag suspension and allignment, on one of our cars, restoration is out of the question.

If I could get one, I'd put a modern driveline and suspention with an Amerian V8 and automatic transmission in an otherwise restored car. Don't throw stones, I'm just dreaming. (If my wife had her dream car, I might be able to get a few more of my dreams) What's wrong with that?

Here's a picture of her present Jag. Wired to a motion sensor to turn it's lites on when we drive in the barn.

Someone made a replica of an XK120 with a fibreglass body on a Japanese pickup truck frame. Sounds like a good starting point for what you want.

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I proposed to my first wife in my XK-140. Wife is long gone but I still have the car. Bought mine in 1968 after demolishing my Bug Eyed Sprite (Frog Eyed to you British types). Paid $237.50 with a freshly rebuilt head in the trunk, sorry, in the boot. The mechanicals on an early Jag are truly bullet proof though the SU carbs require fiddling with on a regular basis. Weakest point on the bodies are the door hinges inside the front fenders, sorry, wings.

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I wouldn't necessarily be concerned over those dollies the car is on, they are often used when cars are stored so they can be moved around without going through a start-up. The original design featured disc wheels and spats, and to my eye that is how an XK 120 should look. Agree, rust is the big bugaboo. It, rather than mechanical problems, is no doubt the reason for the demise of most 120's that haven't survived. However, cars that are in what would have been considered just parts car condition years ago are now often restoration candidates, almost no matter how bad. Try to avoid reserrections of those, the problems have a way of coming back. With a little paint and a LOT of money, any of them can be restored. Best to buy the very best one you can afford, it probably will be the least costly in the long run.

These are very significant sports cars. The XK120 was the world's fastest production car when built.

The good old days....In the late '60's, early '70's, XK120's were dropping like flies and could be picked up for peanuts or found abandoned along the roads and in parking lots. Of the 3 "dead" ones I came into, one cost $15 and a flourescent light fixture, one $50 for a 1/2 interest and later $100 to buy the partner's half out, and the third was "If you want it, come and get it". The first and last were rust buckets which I parted, but the second one wasn't, and I have kept it as a companion for my "gooder" XK120, still owned, that cost an exorbitant $450 in '69. Roadsters all.

Edited by Dave Henderson (see edit history)
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We bought a 150S Roadster in about 1971 for $750. The lady who owned it could no longer afford the fuel. We passed on a pair of 120 Roadsters for $1500. We eventually sold the S, after months of advertising it in Hemmings for $3500 and thought we made a killing. Cars are only true sports cars if you can, theoretically at least, drag your knuckles on the macadam while driving them. The Jag qualifies. You can now buy an entire new body for a 120 as well as a complete frame.

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PAUL:

There is an XK-150 coupe' with an automatic transmission that is in fantastic original unrestored condition & has been sitting unrestored & undriven for 30 years in a heated garage . It belongs to a old school friend's uncle. It is located in New Jersey.

It was parked because of a simple automatic transmission issue ~

I believe these used a Borg~Warner automatic~~~Did they not ?

This car is a real gem~~~

The body , paint, and interior are almost perfect !

The 150 is a bit more bulky in style compared to the XK 120 & XK 140~~~ This one is also a coupe' But still a sporty car.

It is a much more refined driver compared to the XK 120 & XK 140 which are mor of a seat of your pants type of ride.

Black, red interior with wire wheels.

If your wife wants a Jaguar automatic you should buy & restore this lonely car.

It would be an easy restoration !

Edited by Silverghost (see edit history)
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Well, Dave and I checked out the Jag on Sunday.

Nice car, but seemed to be pretty rough around the edges.

According to the online bidders, it's worth a pretty penny as is.

Currently proxy bid to over $30,000.

1952 Jaguar XK-120 Roadster, 63, 986 Miles | Proxibid®

'72 Cougar overbid to $3000 plus. (rusty and moldy, last registered in '97)

1972 Mercury Cougar XR-7, 35,798 Miles | Proxibid®

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According to the online bidders, it's worth a pretty penny as is.

Currently proxy bid to over $30,000.

1952 Jaguar XK-120 Roadster, 63, 986 Miles | Proxibid®

'72 Cougar overbid to $3000 plus. (rusty and moldy, last registered in '97)

1972 Mercury Cougar XR-7, 35,798 Miles | Proxibid®

eek.gifwhaat.gifbolt.gif

I'm speechless. That's at least double book value on both cars given the condition I saw. (And my book is 3 years old!)

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A couple notes; No XK120's had automatic transmissions, nor overdrives. They came later, in the XK 140 I believe.

I don't put too much faith in price guide figures for these cars, especially in dealing with condition codes for cars falling into the lower (poorer) categories. According to the class descriptions, one would almost believe that a car would have to be rust free to even qualify as a parts car. Ok, a bit exterme, but I think you get what I mean about the issue. In addition, I suspect prices for cars in poorer condition are, at least to some extent, extrapolated rather than based on actual sales. That is because some sales in those brackets are private, not a result of documented auctions, or even based on advertized asking prices. A "dead" car failing in many of the price guide "checks" is still sometimes a restorer's dream, and can yield a considerably higher price than the guide's. It is necessary to use your own judgement along with the price guide in determining a car's value. The old saw about things being worth what someone is willing to pay still has some truth too.

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Don't be fooled by the red paint. There's still dirt under the car from where it was stored, now a lovely bright red like the top of the car! This car was originally (and recently) a cream color. They did manage to mask the tires (but not the valve stems:)), including the 3" mud line on them from (probable outdoor) wet storage.

As best I can tell from the numbers, this is a late 1950 body (thus the chrome turn signal housings) with a 1952 engine that used to have the high compression (red) head. The head in it now had no sign of the red coloration, so I suspect it's been replaced. (I don't know enough about these cars to check the numbers on the head.) The tires have no markings on the sidewalls whatsoever, except for the spare which is a Fisk brand tire. It's obviously been decades since this car has run. The attendant didn't know if the engine would turn over, however I see the auction description says it does.

This car looks like the leftovers from a restoration project done in the late 1970s, kept together for a time as someone's toy. It's probably restorable as is, but will need a lot of new and NOS parts. When finished it will be debateable as to whether it's a 1952 or 1950 car.

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We put a '51 Mark VII back together that had been disassembled by a resto shop that went out of business "suddenly". Unfortunately many of the bits and pieces were sold at the Sheriff's sale before the owner of the car realized parts were missing. The sedans are more difficult to restore, in my opinion, partly because there is not a lot of info out there about them. 60Flat there is a good source for misc parts in Virginia. Are you familiar with JagNut? He has an early Jag sedan salvage yard in the hills of Virginia and is very knowledgeable though a bit eccentric.

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Thanks for the tip, Restorer. My Virginia friend is Larry Springer, Jagware. Actually, business demands have put me in a position to offer him the Mark VII and a huge collection of accumulated parts, not terribly expensive considering a running rust free project car as the base @ $7500. I still have my '64 Riv and the '60 Electra; owned the Riv for 32 years now.

I have really gained a lot of knowledge from owning 4 Jags over the years. I am hoping to work hard for a year or so and buy a driver condition XK 140.

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