How to do a frame on restoration?

[Guest Rob McDonald]

OUCH! What a spectacular mistake - prepping and painting a fender, only to find that it fits your other car - which is turquoise and white, not red. At least the porthole count was right.

JIM, I like your creativity in suggesting that the single Venti-Port hole could have been a manufacturing convenience. Thing is, though, there are a gizzillion other holes on a fender, from which that they could have hung it.

I'm going to launch my own urban myth on this. Remember how Chrysler did some research after WWII, to determine the very best place to put a brake light? They decided right in the middle of the car, just below the back window. In heavy traffic, other drivers can see it from several cars back and it's very unlikely to be damaged in a minor collision.

It was a brilliant idea and absolutely correct but Chrysler eventually caved in and combined the brake lights with the tail lights and signal lights out at the corners, just like everyone else. Like sometimes happens with good ideas, though, it came around again and now every new car has a CHMSL (centre high-mounted stop light).

Well I heard that, for '57, Buick picked up on Chrysler's dormant investigation. They found that, if a car was provided with signal lights on the sides of the front fenders, the incidence of "blind spot" lane change accidents would be greatly reduced. Drivers in the next lane would see the signal flash and slow down to avoid a crash, as the car beside them errantly entered their lane.

Buick's engineers designed the lamp unit to complement the new, slimmer Venti-Ports ("for flat mice") and a mounting hole in the fenders was provided. The first shipment of Porta-Blinkers was already received at Flint, when Accounting nixed the plan. "Why?!" cried the good guys. "Because no one else has them," sniffed the bean-counters.

As the world turns, this still-born innovation came 'round again, from overseas this time. Practically everywhere but North America, new cars are required to have turn signal repeaters, just about exactly where Buick had decided they should be, way back when.

Fortunately, while browsing the AACA General Discussion Buy/Sell forum last year, I spotted a peculiar post for, "200 Gross of NOS Porta-Blinkers, any reasonable offer accepted." Curious, I replied and, long story short, I eventually took delivery of GM's entire dusty supply of these innovative but never sold devices, 28,800 of 'em, still in their original pale blue boxes, pigtail wiring connectors included.

SPECIAL OFFER! FITS SPECIALS, CENTURYS, SUPERS, AND ROADSMASHERS!

Buy yours now for just $29.95 a pair, while supplies last. Sorry, no CODs, no credit cards, no shipping, pickup only. Not open weekends or on days ending in "Y".

(Would have been the first commercial use of LEDs. Yes, I know the tire is almost flat.)

[Caballero2]

Rob:

That makes more sense than anything going on in the industry today.

Dan

[stealthbob]

Good theory....I was going to go with the "access hole" idea but it is rather small.

Same sort of thing with my Jeep Liberty. The antenna is on the passengers side but on the drivers side is a "Trail Rated " badge circular and exactly the same size shape and location as the hole required to mount the antenna.

The theory was that they got it wrong and stamped all the wrong fenders at the start, used to badge to cover the hole....then just kept using it. I haven't been able to prove it though but it does sound plausible.

Great job laying out your resto Jim...I can only hope newbies see it and learn that full frame off's are not required to get a Full restoration done, in your driveway no less.

[serb]

Jim, great job. I have been following your project and it is remarkable.

stevo

[1957buickjim]

Thanks Stevo!

Rob, as for the GM NOS LED Marker lights..put me down for a Gross of them! I just bought 2000 feet of GM NOS LED Wire leads that was listed on Craigslist from a defunct supplier that their first and only program was a crazy marker light for the Buick line in 1957. They were unfortunately closed due to a shortage of a critical material, unobtainium, for the build of the futuristic LEDs. They had a lot of success early on with one really good customer, Wyle E. Coyote, Esq. supplying products for the film industry. You might have heard of them. Their name was ACME. Sad ending to a pretty successful company!

Dan..Sometimes even the pro's are fooled..It is like that carpenter's old adage..measure twice, cut once. But hey, it is a REALLY nice looking fender. I would use it on Bessie, but I would have to repaint the car to match and start another thread and bore you guys to tears again, showing all the crazy people that I would have to employ at slave wages to help me out with yet another 1957 Buick story...I think I will pass on the fender until next year, when I am bored silly.

Well, some more photos of the interior restoration as it moved along from the Fred Flinstone Mobile to a driveable Buick.

[Caballero2]

I think that the fender would be a great anchor to a restoration of another Caballero. Too bad that Pete's is a '58.

Heck, I can almost see a "Senior" award in the making. Maybe like the Eastwood thing, we could stack the judging at the National.

Dan

[Guest Rob McDonald]

JIM, shouldn't that be "slurp" wages?

Never heard of ACME but the old chick who sold me the Porta-Blinkers was a Mrs. R. O. Adrunner. She did mention that she knows of Mr. Coyote but has always managed to avoid personal contact with him. Some old feud, I presume.

She has several pallets of the things shown below, for which I never did figure out a purpose. I was interested but the shipping costs (and overhead) would have been a killer.

[1957buickjim]

ROB..those must be the older version. The newer ones came in a backpack with a ripcord.

DAN: You know, I am on the lookout for a Model 49 Estate Wagon, so you never know? I do understand it is an election year, and we shouldn't get carried away with unscrupulous political chicanery, should we Perhaps we can pull a few strings and redistrict the nationals and appoint a few new judges...

Edited February 27, 2012 by 1957buickjim (see edit history)

[Caballero2]

Here is a model 49 with 69 embellishments.:eek:

Buick Buick | eBay

Dan

[1957buickjim]

Thanks for the reference Dan! Seems a little pricey to me, especially since it looks like a re-paint, re-chrome resto. Note the bolts and the firewall on the car in the engine compartment. Also, the trim seems mighty unusual to me on the interior, especially the "brushed aluminum" headliner? NADA lists pricing of one like this at tops - $25,800, which would be a completely restored original - 90+ pt vehicle. I figure this one is a solid $12 - 15K vehicle.

I would be looking for a daily driver type that can be brought up to reasonable condition.

[Guest Rob McDonald]

Fraudulent or merely ignorant? That would be for an uninformed buyer and his/her lawyer to decide.

"Century Estate Wagon", "dynoflow 3-speed automatic transmission", "california... virtually rust-free... front floor pan and rear floor pan are new", "headliner is brushed aluminum", "weighs in at 2 1/2 tons", "Transmission also shifts smoothly and quietly", "acquired a salvage title"

OMG, everyone, run do not walk away from this link or its cooties will find their way through the internet pipe and into your computer!

Edited February 27, 2012 by Rob McDonald (see edit history)

[Guest Rob McDonald]

JIM, there are two Real '57 Caballeros (Caballeri?) sitting at a storage yard just west of Edmonton. I think both of them are technically restorable. Mind you, apparently anything is, if a similar, although utterly perfect, car has attracted attention at a Vegas TV auction lately. 100 big ones? I hae me doubts, laddie.

These old dears have been in the rag-tag collection of an old acquaintance of mine for well over 30 years. Come to think of it, he's got to be in his 'hundreds by now. Well, not really but I'm sure he's older than me. If you are in the least interested in an ambitious full restoration package, I'll call this guy up and sensitively ask if he has let go of his dreams for these cars yet. That's a field in which I am an expert.

[1957buickjim]

Just a little bit more about that shameless upgrade to a Model 49 1957 Special Estate Wagon:

"Restored 1957 Buick Century Estate Wagon - (What model is that? - no such animal), rebuilt 364 V8 engine, dynoflow 3-speed automatic transmission (Dynaflow 3 Speed?????) , power steering and power brakes. Car spent its life in california and is virtually rust-free. Both the driver’s side front floor pan and rear floor pan are new. (Rust-free with the exception that it was used as the Flinstone Family car at one point) This flat-roof surfer’s dream has no chips, dips, waves or caves (except where it lived in the stoneage with the Flintstones). Mighty straight body. New paint, upholstery and carpet. Most chrome has been replated, too. The headliner is brushed aluminum.(What trim option is that????) ( She weighs in at 2 1/2 tons (does that mean it is a Duece and a Half - Military Vehicle?? - 5000lbs????) and is as solid as the rock of gibraltar. Runs and drives as it should, which is like it ran off the showroom floor in ‘57 when gm styling was at an all-time high. When all the cars were different. Fins, grilles, bumpers, dashes...All works of art. Very dependable. Starts right up and doesn’t smoke or joke. (that must be a special option for this car - the joke!!) Transmission also shifts smoothly and quietly. (At what point does a Dynaflow shift, perhaps before it implodes??) Both power steering and power brakes make this yesteryear gem easy to drive--even in today’s traffic.

Somewhere in its 56 years, she acquired a salvage title (Like Rob says - RUN AWAY, VERY FAST). Two frame/suspension experts (who- Barney Rubble and Fred Flinstone?) examined the underside and could find no evidence of it ever having been in a major crash that hurt the frame or suspension. Speculated that the car probably was stolen way back when they had very little value...And was branded salvage by insurance company. (And the DMV is no help here, hmmmm) Engine and trans fluids recently changed. It is a very solid driver. One that gets eyeballed at every car show or just driving down the street.(that statement makes sense, since it is nothing that Buick ever manufactured in this combination) How many have you seen, especially in this condition? (Me - Nothing like this, that is for sure.) For so little money. (Reserve set above $24,800? Little Money..not so much!) Its big brother, the caballero hardtop wagon in show condition, is now fetching up to $100,000 at major auctions (Maybe if it is a solid gold plated one, that is perfect, like Dan would restore). No trades, please. (They must be moving out of the country after selling a counterfit like this - especially calling this a restored vehicle..)"

WOW..I hope the buyer of this realizes how duped they have been, if they are really thinking that they are getting a restored to "factory showroom" 1957Century Estate Wagon. Oh well, 28 bids so far and the reserve is not met..Caveat Emptor!

[Guest 54fins]

if you don't have a lift, it is a miserable job. You also need a friend with a few acres. However, it can be done at home. I was lucky enough to find a rust free body that was not undercoated. Undercoat is hell to remove and almost always holds in rust, so you will find lots of surprises. You are almost better off not removing it and seeing what it hides.:eek:

What I found intersting is detailing the engine without removing it. With the front clip off, I had to rig a radiator and battery support. That way I can drive it, work on the wires etc. It was still a bear removing 50 year old grease, then masking and painting but it beats the hell out of a 5 year frame off. The body will eventually come off if and when I have the time and money. I also found that a power washer can blast the grease and bits of dum dum they plop over all the welds. But you do end up with a river of greasy water, make sure you are good friends with the neibors. Be prepared to find cancer under the tar. Sometimes what you don't know doesn't hurt you.:mad:

[buick man]

I bet that's head turner on cruise night.

[1957buickjim]

Well, now that winter has blown by as well as spring and it is summer here in the wonderful Mitten State.., Back to the original Time Life Home Auto Restoration Series - How to do a frame on restoration in your driveway. Today's story continues on the saga of the interior restoration. Now that the car is no longer a Fred Flintsone mobile and the floor is solid as Sears..the rest of the interior is on its way back to right of the production line finish. Here are a few progress pictures showing some of the steps along the way.

[buick man]

Jim: Looking good. Boy it is almost intimidating seeing the dash totally out.

I've got some questions that I hope are not too bothersome.

In photos 1 & 2, one notices that sewn in place hard rubber like border guard just above the carpet that cracks due to age, in photo 9 you have replaced this with new. Did you out source this border from somewhere or did you make it yourself and had it sewn in like the factory? If so what did you use? Looks like the black cardboard like material that this hard rubber border piece is sewn into is just like the original from the factory and appears to have been replaced as well.

Also, I noticed you have what looks like building tar based paper taped to the pan areas. Was this a temporary working surface? I would think tar paper when it got hot inside the car would definitely out gas.

Last question. When you installed the sound/heat padding, what thickness is it and will it interfere with the door jamb insert once the carpet is installed over that? I was thinking of doing this as well but feared it would raise up the carpet too high.

Questions, questions...

[1957buickjim]

David,

Yes it is a bit unnerving when you have the car this disconnected. Your only hope is that you can remember where the heck all those ganglions of wires connect to and get the car to live again when you put it back together. Good thing for digital cameras!

In answer to your questions, the firewall pad wad pretty much in a disintegration mode as you can tell in pictures 1 and 2. I actually ordered a new firewall pad assembly, which is not original, but is a SMC molded part with graining and it did have the sewn in rubber closeout as the original. It is much more robust than the original cardboard / pressboard item. I could not find one as original to replace this.

The tar paper was initially underlayment to the jute padding for the carpet as a vapor barrier, but when I read some posts on the use of a heat and sound deadening material (shown in the attached photos) I went with that, and the tar paper was then a working surface to be removed when finished with the install of the dash.

The material for the floor was about 1/4 in thick. I glued it to the floor and trimmed it at the edge of the wire channels (there is a factory rib there which is a perfect guide). I did not have a problem with the carpet installation or the sill plates installation.

[Caballero2]

Jim:

You did not ask. At this time I only have one and that is for the Super. When time permits, I plan to run some more.

Dan

Edited March 19, 2012 by Caballero2 (see edit history)

[1957buickjim]

Dan,

Are you telling me that you can make these monsters? Heck, that is awesome. I take it you have made some sort of compression mold for it. At the time I did the interior update (2010 spring / summer) I was short on knowledge compared to now.

Are the 50 /70 series going to be the same width as the 40 / 60? PM / email me and we can discuss this in further depth.

[Caballero2]

Wait until I send you a picture of the mold. You will crack up. It is proof positive that I worked in a beer factory.

Dan

P.S. The cover is the same for all series. Dan

[1957buickjim]

Can't wait...

[Guest Caribou]

David,

Yes it is a bit unnerving when you have the car this disconnected. Your only hope is that you can remember where the heck all those ganglions of wires connect to and get the car to live again when you put it back together. Good thing for digital cameras!

My wiring was a mess in the "before" state, but I took a stack of digital photos anyway. I do not regret it. Every once in a while it has helped get me closer to the "after" stage, even if the finished product is a long way off yet.

The little woman decided that she'd snoop through my camera and see what kind of exciting photos I had on there, I'm not sure what she expected but she was sure surprised to find out.

I've been figuring out every single wire individually using a multimeter and a little bit of patience. It's terrible, but I'm learning a lot. ("Why the hell is there an actuator on the gas pedal!?!? Oh, I wonder if it's a kick down switch... hmm...")

[buick man]

Thanks Jim that clears up a lot for me. Again great job and the endurance to see it thru as well.

Dan: Did you make that border? Pure inspirational genius. Let me know when you have another of this border made so I can order one from you if I can. I am in need of it. If not, at least let me know where or what you used as a source for the rubber and the cardboard material.

Perhaps you can put up a post showing how you went about making the mold or at least the finished product etc. How in the heck do you achieve that "sewn" look to the rubber & the cardboard or at least have a finished piece that makes it look that way, just like they did from the factory back in the day?

Edited March 20, 2012 by buick man (see edit history)

[1957buickjim]

Well, its been a few days, and I was thinking that it was time to get that trunk restoration going, re-restoration part of it going. Based upon what I was told on the forum by those in the know, I stripped and de rusted the trunk and painted those areas that are red-oxide primer that portion, as well as those that are body color that color. From what I have been told, floor and wheel well are red oxide, and decklid inside, trunk walls and hinges are body color. I followed that process in the resto of the trunk. Here are some pic's of the trunk on the way and finished.

[Guest Rob McDonald]

JIM, again, your purity of purpose amazes me. How ever did you resist either painting grey or covering with liner material that gash of red primer behind the spare tire? I too would be careful to photograph it from an angle that hides this "correctness".

The cardboard panels are beautiful! Did you simply paint the insulation material behind the trunklid stiffening ribs? It looks great. I wonder how this was done that at the factory. Surely the insulation was installed before the body colour was applied. Masked-off maybe? Mine already has overspray on it, so I can't tell how accurate was that cut line, originally.

[1957buickjim]

ROB, Thank you. I did wonder about painting that area with the body color, but decided to leave it primer since it is covered pretty much by the spare. As for the trunk isulation, I took a step out of Bhigdog's and OldTank's book. I purchased the correct waffle weave material, carefully cut out the ratty insulation with a razor knife, then traced the patterns onto the new material, cut them out, and trimmed and spray glued them into place after the deck lid was painted. Technically, they do get a paint spray when the inner decklid is painted at the factory, but being an asphalt based material, the paint soaks into it pretty good, and they still maintain the dark look, maybe not black, like the material, but still darker than the surrounding painted areas. As you can see from your decklid, the material is sandwiched between the outer lid and the inner support structure, the material being inserted in the final crimping process between the inner and outer. It is nearly impossible to remove and replace that insulation between the support structure, so I opted for the visual only. I kept it black because I like the contrast, and from what I have heard, it does not impact the judging either way.

There you go, you asked what time it was and I told you how the watch was made!

[buick5563]

It's a very nice watch, Cap'n.

[Guest 4 bufords]

nice job on the trunk,my 57 super trunk is in need of some help but the spare tire well has some rust issues which will have to be repaired.think for now i'll ust paint it with the splatter paint.4 bufords from ct

[g-g-g0]

Jim: Thanks for the addition of pictures of the trunk area. Looks GREAT!! Please tell me again what you used to replace the tar like strips between the ribs in the trunk floor.

[Guest speedjunkie]

Jim,

Your resto gives me hope and something to look forward to while doing my 55! I see the thread started in 2010, when did the resto process officially start? Thanks for the inspiration!

Mike

[1957buickjim]

Mike,

Started in earnest in 2010. Had the car as a driver and did some work to get it to a driver status from 1986 to 2000...Took my time, got married, kids, 2 houses, you know...life gets in the way of our restoration projects..

What really made it fun was that there was progress, big or small, and I could still drive it when I wanted to..I didn't have to wait for the shop (in most cases) to get is fixed / repaired too long before I could drive it. I wanted it that way. I hope you are the same. Drive a lot, fix / restore a little, repeat as necessary. Enjoy the car the way it was built.

And oh, BTW, I am still working on the restoration of "Old Bessie"..

[KAD36]

Wow Jim - that sure is coming along good. Makes me want to start mine over again! What material did you use for the floor insulation (did I miss that in the post?). The old jute floor padding doesn't "beat the heat", especially over the muffler area. Could be a good weekend project.

Keep up the inspirational work!

[Guest speedjunkie]

Jim,

Thanks for the info! Unfortunately, I'm no stranger to having to put projects on hold! This is the third car that a frame on resto in partials could be done. The first two had to be sold due to unexpected finances, several years ago. Stability comes with age, so that's not an issue this time!

A running, driving, work in progress is exactly what I was after! Work on it a little, and drive it alot.................perfect! It doesn't even have to be 100% original for my liking. Just a good, solid, reliable driver!

Thanks again!

Mike

[1957buickjim]

Ken,

Thanks for the kind words. It is coming along, trying to get it done for Nationals this year. For the floor (and roof as well) I used a material called ez cool.(EZ Cool Automotive Insulation heat barrier and noise reduction for cars, trucks, classic cars, street rods and much more). Was very easy to install and seems to work pretty well. I bought the 4 x 50 ft roll, and did the floor pan as well as reinsulated under the headliner (scraped off all of the tar paperish insulation) that was on the underside of the roof. The EZ Cool stuff is easy to cut with scissors and easy to form and glue down. Seams are joined using aluminum tape (like you use with furnace ducting - not duct tape, the metal kind). That will really work better than the jute padding, and it does not absorb water and is thinner than the jute. Hope this helps.

Mike,

Good to hear that you have done this before..It is always easier when you have a bit more experience on these types of projects. I wish you well on this journey. It definitely is a fun one!

Jim

[buick man]

Jim: What has been your approach when attempting to remove the rear tail light assemblies. When one looks up from under the car the one nut that holds the chrome assembly is way up there near the top of the fin. How did you remove yours?

[buick5563]

David, not sure if you have one, but for the type of removal you are describing (I haven't specifically worked on a 57) get a ratcheting box end wrench. I use the Sears Craftsperson combo version. Actually, it's the most used tool in my arsenal.

[1957buickjim]

David, the easiest way is to have an arm that is twice as long as the other and bends in between the wrist and the elbow. Other than that, I have found that removing all the trim (quarter panel extensions and the rear bumper) give your the best access to those fasteners up at the top. Also, most likely, you will remove the whole stud, rather than the fastener, since the fastener will be permanently affixed to the stud. Before you start this job, make sure that you spray the fasteners liberally with a penetrating oil, PB Blaster or the like. What you have to be careful of is breaking off the stud on those. I used a 3/8 wratchet with a 2" extension on it and a six point socket. Gives the best contact on the fastener. I layed on the ground (no lift at my house) and reached up and unscrewed the part. And BTW, working around the exhaust is a pain as well. I am glad that I only have single exhaust, which does not have resonators. That would be even more of a pain. Good luck!

[1957buickjim]

I use the Sears Craftsperson combo version.

Mike, really???? A politically correct wrench??? What's up with that? Is Toby Keith wrong in in song "Made in America" ?? I always thought that they were Craftsman wrenches. Hmmm....

[old-tank]

Mike, really???? A politically correct wrench??? What's up with that? Is Toby Keith wrong in in song "Made in America" ?? I always thought that they were Craftsman wrenches. Hmmm....

"Politically correct" is a common affliction of inhabitants of 'The People's Republic of Austin (TX)'...believe me I'm trying to wean him off the Kool-Aid.