1982 Riviera Convertible – I Might Sell…

[Guest Russ Edwards]

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1982 Riviera Convertible – I Might Sell…

Hi All –

I’ve owned my ’82 Riviera Convertible for 20 years now, and I need to make a decision whether to keep it or not. Let me tell you about the car first, and then my situation, and then hopefully some of you who have been there / done that might weigh in.

Cotillion White exterior, Claret Leather Interior, White Top, 5.0 V8

VIN: 1G4AZ67Y9CE434669

86,065 miles

I believe it has been a Florida car since new.

I purchased this car twenty years ago from Lexus of Kendall, in Miami, Florida, where its previous owner traded it in on a new Lexus. I happened to be there when it came in and snagged it before the dealer could find a place to park it! Since then it has, for the most part, been in storage. I did drive it occasionally, about 750 miles a year until 1998, when a friend in Naples, Florida, offered to store it in his garage, which seemed more secure than the its covered condominium parking at the time.

Sometime after that, although still nearly perfect at the time, a restoration project was begun with the idea of making this a true show quality car. After being freshly and expensively painted and having a new, fully lined and upholstered top installed (even though neither were necessary) the final detailing was put on hold due to a pressing and time-sucking business opportunity. The car has remained covered in the garage ever since, except for trips around the neighborhood a few times a year to let it breathe, and a trip to the tire store a couple of years ago for four new Bridgstones.

But no further detailing has been done or attention given while stored. The car hasn’t even been dusted or vacuumed, but the paint and top look absolutely new, and the car overall looks practically new, with no rust, no dents, no dings, no nicks, and doesn’t even need a bath. This car, with the exceptions noted below, is in excellent condition with everything working as it should (windows, locks, seats, top, and so on.)

Unfortunately, both the original front and rear bumper fillers, while very shiny, are brittle and have started to deteriorate – the back worse than the front. The rest of the plastic trim pieces are shiny, soft, and pliable.

Although covered and stored inside, there does seem to have developed a coating on the chrome surfaces. It comes off with little effort, but I haven’t tended to that yet. There also seems to be a similar coating in a few areas of the chrome wheels. I don’t know if it is the beginning of surface corrosion, or the remnants of some kind of coating put on by the restoration shop that painted the car.

The dash top panel is not split, as many seem to be. The interior is very nice, with almost no indications of wear and tear save for a few light scratches on the metal trim on the front seat backs. The front seats were re-leathered as part of the new paint / top job and, like the top and paint, look absolutely new. My friend orchestrated the paint and top work then, and today the paperwork for that is nowhere to be found. As with the original paint and top, the front seat leather did not need replacement as there were no tears and the leather was soft, supple, and pliable. But sometimes I guess we have more money than brains…

The hood support struts have lost their pressure, the trunk struts are not far behind, and the battery is now dead and needs replacement. But the car jump starts instantly and runs very well, and the transmission goes into gear instantly and shifts normally without any slippage (to me, but I am far from an expert on these cars.) The oil and transmission fluid were changed when the new tires were put on.

Finally, I cannot currently locate the convertible boot. I know it must be somewhere, as it was in the trunk when I bought the car, but for the life of me I can’t find it, so I must assume is missing, at least for now. If I ever find it, it goes with the car.

I do have an original 1982 Buick full line brochure, as well as the original owner’s manual and the original supplemental convertible top manual. No repair records were with the car when I bought it, and since then, other than oil and fluid changes and the tires, paint, and top, there have been no repairs needed.

Of the factory options available, this car has many, including the 5.0 V8 engine, tilt steering wheel, power passenger seat, leather sport steering wheel, chrome road wheels, factory stereo/CB radio (the mic is missing,) and fiber-optic lamp monitors, which I am told are very, very rare on these convertibles.

I have seen a number of these cars, and apart from the big-buck restorations, most seem to my untrained eye to be - I don’t know, - tired. I am sure you all know much more about these than I could ever imagine, but compared to those I’ve seen with higher mileage, or those which suffered some body damage or rust from being a northern car, mine seems to be, with the exception of the specific issues noted above, in a very healthy, well preserved state. The doors don’t sag, the rear doesn’t sag, it doesn’t smoke, and so on.

I have more pictures if that would be of interest to anyone.

As to my story, recently, the friend in Naples who has been storing this Riviera for me passed away, and his elderly widow is just not up to tending to the car for me. In anticipation that she may sell that huge house and move into something more manageable for her, I’ve got to consider what I am going to do with this car.

It’s really too nice to use as an every-day driver (although I could be tempted.) I do love this car and have extremely fond memories of some of the drives I have taken in it. But at 61 years old and very busy with my business, I am just not inclined to undertake finishing those few things that would make this car perfect, especially since I live across the state (in Miami) from where the car is in Naples. I do realize, however, that doing so would increase this car’s value, and would certainly increase its “visual” saleability to those who don’t realize how special this car is otherwise and would be put off by the bumper fillers, for example.

So the cost/benefit ratio of making this car completely right makes doing so an attractive option.

But so does leaving money on the table for the next guy, if it means no further time or effort needed on my part.

So there is the rub for me. Finish the detail work and sell it for more? Sell it clean and fast as is for less? Just keep it?

I know today is likely the bottom of the market for these cars, and I am almost shocked that no one jumped on that stunning ~$3500.00 W15 car discussed in another thread.

It boggles the mind that something as enjoyable, stylish, classy, and relatively inexpensive to maintain, as these cars are, and with virtually no chance of depreciation, can bring – for the convertibles – only one third the money of, say, a new, positively boring and pedestrian Camry which, by any metric, will have a much higher total cost of ownership. That’s nuts!

I passed on an offer of $12,500 a couple of years ago for this Buick but wouldn’t expect to see five figures today.

But faced with a slim possibility that I may lose my free storage, and factoring in that I would realize a much greater return on my money if invested in my nascent dot-com business rather than the Buick, even at today’s depressed prices an argument could be made that I should just sell it.

At the moment, however, until I evaluate all my options (or until someone makes me an offer I can’t refuse) this car is not for sale.

Still, I am inclined to test the waters, and I wanted to mention it here before going the Craigslist / eBay route. I won’t give it away, as keeping it would cause no grief, but I will give serious consideration to reasonable offers.

To that point, if those of you who have already danced this dance can offer guidance, it would be greatly appreciated, as I would hate to see this car’s potential squandered.

And it may sound silly, but if I do sell it I really need to be certain it goes to a good home. Remember, I’ve owned this car for 1/3 of my life and it is like a member of the family to me.

Thanks for letting me ramble on a bit!

Russ Edwards

1@rwe1.net

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[Dandy Dave]

If I were you I would keep it for the time being. The problem right now I see is that it is a 20 something year old car. Wait until it is a 30 something year old car, or 40 something year old car, and if the economy is better, then you may get a better price. I just bought one from Florida for $3600 or I would be after yours. Mine has more miles and needs some TLC, but it drives like a Dream on a Cloud. I have already did some some stuff to it, and have more stuff on the way to make it even better. The best part is that it is a rust free car. The mechcanics are not a problem for me, but I hate patching rust. So the 1982 Riv I just purchased has found the right home to bring it back to it's former glory. Dandy Dave!

[Guest Russ Edwards]

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Good Points…

Hi Dandy –

Thanks for your reply.

For sure these awesome cars are at an all time low in price, and for most folks who own one this is not the time to sell. Luckily I do not need to sell mine.

Of course, the other side of the story is that this is a great time to buy one, if, as you suggested, you can find one that’s damage and rust free.

That’s how the rich get richer isn’t it? Buy low and sell high?

And that is what puzzles me. Why are these stunning cars – probably the last ever of the Great American Classics –so dirt cheap?

(I mean, are Corvette ZL-1/Grand Sport/Carbons really future classics or just a marketing ploy to jump-start sluggish sales of a several year old car?)

If one takes a critical look at all the American cars (or cars from anywhere, for that matter) that the general public recognizes as “Great” they all have something in common – they stand out. Well, they jump out at you! You can’t help but notice them on the road. They have a commanding presence.

Think about those Duesenbergs, Pierce-Arrows, Auburns, Cadillac 16s, and the like. The ones you would expect the big stars of the silver screen to be driving (or driven in) around Hollywood. It wasn’t the innovative engineering, or even the exquisite craftsmanship that caught peoples’ eye. It was purely the size and style. Those cars were almost imposing.

Big, bold, and beautiful.

Tell me you can’t say that about these Riviera convertibles, too.

And you know, funny thing, but you really can’t say that about the Eldorado equivalents!

There is something about the flowing, swoopy, long, low-slung look of the Riviera convertible that the upright Eldo can’t match. Or that the boxy Rolls Corniche can’t even match!

I spend time in Naples, Florida, where my Riviera is stored. Naples is one of the richest per capita cities there is. Rolls, Bentleys, Aston-Martins, and so on are as plentiful on the streets of Naples as Camrys and Mustangs are elsewhere. But with the Riviera’s top down, I get thumbs-up at every stoplight. Even the Ferraris and Maseratis don’t get that.

Seriously, what big American car (or what big car from anywhere) built since these Riviera convertibles can turn as many heads? Remember, size matters. All the high-dollar classics are big. Huge.

Sure, some rare Ferraris, Mercedes-Benz Gullwings, and the sort bring 7 figures at auction because they have a dedicated (and competitive) following.

Apart from those, however, it is the big, breathtakingly styled cars that grab the eyes and the big bucks. Been that way throughout automotive history.

Except for now.

These Riviera convertibles fit that "Great American Classic Big Car" profile in every way except price!

So I agree that several years down the road the money will come to them. I just don’t get why they are so very cheap today.

Well, I have some theories. In the price range these cars should be – in the teens at least for nice cars – the buyers would likely be entrepreneurs, businessmen, professionals, and so on. Not to be taken to be political at all, but guys in those categories are not spending money now – they aren’t hiring employees, expanding their businesses, or buying toys - until they have a better handle on where the business climate of this country is headed. This is not news. They are waiting for the results of elections this fall, or in 2012, before they commit cash to a future that is very questionable to them right now.

Many guys who are employees may not understand this, but then for the most part they don’t buy cars like ours, at least not the expensive ones. Obviously, there are exceptions all the way around, but I am sure all the members of this forum understand what I am saying.

So my point is that today’s uncertainty about the future business economy may delay some collector car purchases for now. And I suspect that has a bigger impact on sales and prices today than the car’s age. That is, sure, not being “ripe” yet is always a factor, as you mention, but these cars bringing half what they did a few years ago is more likely due to that kind of buyer – who otherwise would pay the price – just stepping out of the market altogether for now, until there is a more certain direction from Washington.

Does this sound plausible?

Because if it does, then now is certainly the time to buy, isn’t it?

Wasn’t it Barron Rothschild who said, "Buy when there's blood in the streets, even if the blood is your own."

I mean, it is well know that the wealthiest know that bad times make for good buys, so long as there is some underlying value and the thing is not simply just cheap.

Are these Riviera convertibles just cheap cars with no underlying value?

Considering the long history of all those big, elegant, magnificent, eyeball-grabbing American cars – a history that proves ever increasing prices for them - these Rivieras, and convertibles in particular, fit right in.

And the fact that somewhere around half of these convertibles have been snapped up by uber-wealthy folks in Japan and the Middle East, also shows the compelling appeal these cars have based upon size and looks alone, not to mention they ride like a dream.

The “Wow!” of the initial retail price, the Indy 500 pace car and other special editions, and the Car of the Year award also separate these cars from the pretenders.

Toss all that into the blender and you come out with a real sleeper of a bargain that could double in price as soon as a year or two, when those aforementioned entrepreneurs and businessmen and other potential buyers start writing checks again.

So why would I consider selling mine today? Because I am extremely fortunate to have a business that will return to me way more in the next couple of years than any automotive investment ever could. I promise that if I didn’t, I would be buying every rust free undamaged Riviera convertible I could find.

(I agree, Dandy, that patching rust, and body work in general is a turn off for most of us. If it is something that bolts off and bolts on, no problem, and in the whole scheme of things, those mechanical repairs are a piece of cake on these GM cars.)

But most folks don’t have the opportunity I do, and for them cars like mine have no financial downside, incredible likely upside, and tons of satisfying ownership experience in between, as most in this forum would agree.

Again, I am surprised more folks don’t see the value here, as proven by the give-away priced these cars are bringing today.

As I said earlier, I am lucky not to have to sell mine. If I could just leave it where it is, covered and stored in a friend’s garage for a few more years, I would. But there is a real possibility that house will be sold before then, and then I will have to do something with the car. I really won’t have time for that anytime soon, so any offers (approaching maybe twice what you paid for yours) for my “car in a barn” would be seriously considered. OK, so it’s really a “car in a multi-millionaire’s garage” but you get the point!

Anyway, I love this car, and I love these Rivieras. And I am grateful to all who contribute here. The folks who “get” these cars are often as fascinating as the cars themselves!

Thanks again for letting me ramble on…

Russ . . .

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[John]

My $.02:

It took over 40 years for the 1st generation Riv's to start bringing prices in line with their unique styling, quality and performance. The later ones are all still undervalued in my opinion.

Question is, do you want to hold on to the car for another 10-15 or more years waiting for it to grow into the price you would like to get?

If I were in your situation I would fix the bumper fillers, replace the hood and trunklid struts, give it a good cleanup and then put it on ebay with a high enough reserve that if it did sell I would be satisfied. If it doesn't sell you'll enjoy it more with the fixes done.

John

[Guest Russ Edwards]

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Makes perfect sense…

Hi John –

Thanks for your common sense reply.

I do think, however, that the last 40 years of price history on special interest and collector cars may no longer be a good predictor of current and future trends, and for a number of reasons.

One, obviously, is that over the last 40 years many of us who were around back when a lot of these highly desirable cars were current models but we were too young to afford them, are now in a place where those cars are finally affordable to us. That makes this a whole different market. It isn’t teenagers or 20 or 30-somethings that are paying 6 figures for big-block Chevelles or Shelby Mustangs, for example but older guys who are finally making some money and can now afford to buy the cars they once coveted. That is, it's the boomer generation that is having a huge impact on today's market, and than hasn't been the case for most of those 40 years.

Another factor is suddenly that whole slew of collector car TV shows, especially the almost non-stop coverage of collector car auctions on cable TV. Unlike any time in the last 40 years, the drama and excitement of these cars and all that action is now being brought into folks’ living rooms, and that unprecedented exposure has (or will soon be having) a significant effect on the demand for these cars, especially the more reasonably priced ones.

Likewise, the internet. eBay, craigslist, and so on, frustrating as they may be to use, have opened up a whole new market – a global market – and when that happens, as with the cable TV exposure, the demand increases even though the supply of good collectible cars does not.

Sure, the current uncertainty about the economy throws a damper on things, but it is reasonable to expect the next few years to experience a very different (and better) price curve than the last 40. Of course, given that the cars being built today (and really for the last 20 or more years) are for the most part pretty sterile, that makes those older cars that much more special.

Anyway, I seem to be of two minds about my situation.

On one hand, I have a great deal of respect, admiration, and appreciation for these Rivieras, and the convertible in particular. And I am almost annoyed that today’s market doesn’t recognize the value of these cars.

On the other hand, Mr. Math tells me that no investment I make in my car – either in cash to replace the bumper fillers, hood and trunk lifts, and so on, or in time to let the price come to the value of the car – can equal the return on the money or time I spend on my growing business. That is, as good an investment as my Riviera is, my business is a much better deal for me.

There is a third hand you referenced, too. The enjoyment factor, and that can often be priceless. I can’t tell you how special those drives through the Florida Keys were in this Riviera with the top down. I’ve owned Ferraris, Jags, Alfas, Mercedes-Benz SLs, and Corvettes, most of them convertibles, and I’ve made that trip down the Overseas Highway in all of them. And I swear none came close to the feeling I got in this Buick. It is absolutely the right car for that kind of cruise. (OK, when I was younger, those E-Type Jags were also great, and had a lot of “pick-up” too, if you know what I mean!)

Likewise, cruising along A1A up the Florida east coast from South Beach to Palm Beach and beyond – the Buick design guys must have had that trip in mind, because there aren’t any better matches between car and route. Top down, sea breeze, palm trees, and a classy and elegant motorcar that turns heads all along the way. Clark Gable, eat your heart out!

But the Riviera has been in storage for a while, and today I really do enjoy my old, rusty Jeep Cherokee 4x4 for knocking around, and my Mustang convertible satisfies those urges for top down time in the Keys, so I can survive without the Buick for now.

And I am beginning to lean toward just selling it as is, and letting the next guy profit from the investment in the bumper fillers and detailing and the like. The paint doesn’t even need washing or wax – it’s perfect and show quality.

So now it just becomes a question of selling price, and I may let eBay decide that.

Related, as a marketing guy, I look for comparables (some of them seemingly unrelated) to get a handle on markets. It helps in identifying over and under-valued markets. Sometimes you can “steal” the results of other company’s research by observing their final product mix.

Doing so here confirms just how stupidly undervalued these Riviera Convertibles are today. It goes beyond the absurdity that these are going for less than Chrysler Sebring convertibles.

When upscale manufacturers spend a ton to do their homework and conclude there is a market for expensive convertibles, the results, as anyone can plainly see, are new (and expensive) convertibles from Volvo, Infinity, and Lexus. Mercedes-Benz now has three convertible models available, as do BMW and Audi, the latter now even offering a convertible version of its R8 Supercar. Rolls and Bentley now include convertible models as “regular production” models instead of being coach-built as in the past. Lamborghini’s two current models also now feature convertibles, Maserati has added one, and even the Bugatti Veyron now comes in a “roadster” version.

So the market for “trophy convertibles” is certainly there across the board and growing. Isn’t it reasonable to assume these stunning Riviera convertibles are sure to ride that same wave and that the price will increase accordingly? Imagine the money a really nice one would bring today if displayed in a Mercedes or Bentley showroom!

Either somebody is going to make some money right away with my car, or someone is going to wind up with one sweet, satisfying ride for a while, and then will make some money with my car.

Thanks again for your insight!

Russ . . .

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[JZRIV]

Wow thats one of the longest posts I've seen.

I would market the car the best you can and take the best offer. If its less than you expected don't fret and use the money for something you will enjoy.

There just aren't any indicators these cars will ever become sought after enough to increase significantly in price. Prices were eroding before the recession. Likely the cost for maintaining, storing, insurance, etc per year will exceed any market value increase so you will never get ahead by keeping it. Based on that, investment potential is out the window.

The only real value would be sentimental and that can be priceless but if its not there, unload it now for what you can get an move on.

Many people bought these and pampered them so there doesn't seem to be a shortage of low mileage excellent examples and that doesn't help the price either.

Good Luck.

[Guest Russ Edwards]

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Hi Jason –

I think you’ve hit a few nails on the head.

And yeah, have my posts been long! But I am a marketing guy and I typically have to detail my conclusions and prove my assertions, so being that lengthy has become a bad habit…

But for whatever reasons, yeah, these cars have become as undervalued as just about any in the collector car world. It just defies common sense and rationale.

And then there is this I found online – a 22k mile ’65 in Palm Beach for $34,500.00!

1965 Buick Riviera

Maybe I oughtta offer them my car!

Anyway, I agree it’s best for me now to just take what I can get for it (unless the offer is silly) for now and cherish the memories. Down the road, when I get the time I can always buy another one, and at this rate, for less probably less than it would have cost to keep, insure, and store this one. As you correctly point out, those costs usually eat up any increase in value, and when you add in inflation and opportunity costs, there is no way this is gonna be a great investment for me. Few cars are, really, except for the odd blip in the market here and there. Are some cars good investments? Yeah, if bought right to begin with, but seldom are they great investments unless one steals the car. And that is not truly an investment as much as it is shrewd dealing.

Good point, too, about them being pampered. Not a lot of poor people bought them when new, that’s for sure. So apart from those northern cars with rust, and those with damage or high mileage, these Riviera convertibles are absolute bargains.

Those in this forum with ‘em know exactly what I am talking about.

Thanks for your input, Jason. I sincerely appreciate it…

Russ . . .

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[RivNut]

I just contacted Hagerty's about insuring my '63, '64, and '85 coupe. They use some information from ????? on helping establish the value of your car. My '85 is fully restored and the top price they'd put on it was comical when compared to the values they'd give me for my '63 and '64, both of which are in the process of restoration. They would only insure the '85 for $5k (almost like new), but they'd insure the '63 and '64 for 7.5K and 10K respectively for cars that were still under construction. They would go as high as 43K for a show quality 63/64/65. Just goes to show you what the market is for these 6th generation Rivieras. Kind of like the one that Hemmings chose to picture in there write up of our event in Hershey - less than 100K miles, two tone paint, and rally wheels - 2,800 OBO.

Ed

[sosuzguy]

My Insurance company, insures all of my 79-85 cars at whatever value I tell them as a "Stated Value as a Classic car". The only limitations is driving them less than 1500 or 2500 miles per year (IDR) and they should be garaged. They said that if I wanted any of them valued at over 10k then they would need to have them apprased. The cost for each car is less than if it was liability only on a regular policy.

[Guest gryfan]

do riv. convertibles of this vintage have any mechanical problems that one should look for ? what about rust...do they have specific spots to look out for?

thanks in advance

gryfan

[Guest pfloro]

I can speak to the chassis & running gear as the '79 - '85 Riviera (coupe or convertible) is almost identical to my '84 Toronado. I've owned it since new (192,000 miles).

If so equipped, the Olds 307 V8 is bulletproof. It doesn't make a lot of power but is very reliable. Depending upon oil change intervals & how it was driven, the nylon tips on the camshaft timing gear wear out somewhere around 100,000 miles. A timing chain & gear set change is not a major repair job. For durability, consider a 'double roller' replacement timing gear set.

The 325-4L Hydramatic (closely related to the 200-4R) is a decent unit. They have a tendency to burn up the intermediate band (creates 2nd gear) sometime after 75,000+ miles. Once again, this depends on how hard the car was driven. Fortunately, a mild shift kit installed during the rebuild will pretty much eliminate another burnt band without snapping your neck at every 1-2 shift. An auxiliary transmission fluid oil cooler is a good investment.

If the Riviera convertible you are considering has 4 wheel disc brakes, be prepared for some trouble. I don't know if this was standard equipment or an option on the convertible. The rear disc brake calipers are problematic. Their self adjusting mechanism doesn't work well, they eventually leak and your brake pedal just gets lower & lower. The parking brake becomes useless.

These things should not be show stoppers. Having owned and driven one for over 26 years, the GM '79 - '85 'E' bodies are great cars.

Paul

[YellowLark]

gryfan,

You asked about rust in the convertibles - well, I can tell you about rust, using my '83 convertible as an example.

This eBay-bought car arrived with at least half an inch of water inside. So, I have rusted-out floor pans, including the seat cross-members, doors, windshield posts, bumpers, hood, and trunk lid. The seller, a self-described Riv collector and ROA member, advertised the car as having "zero rust".

But, I quickly bought an '83 coupe as a parts car, so I have everything I need to make the convertible whole....with a lot of time and effort.

Like Russ, I believe that these cars are special, and, while they may never compete with the '69 Camaros and similar cars on the auction circuit, they will make attractive and comfortable Sunday drivers for years to come.

[RivNut]

I've owned two '83 XX's and one '84 convertible - all equipped with 4 wheel disk brakes. I never had any problems with them leaking, sticking, or ????. Alway had a parking brake when I needed it.

Ed

[Dandy Dave]

I finally got to take my recently aquired 82 Riv Ragtop on a nice drive yesterday to a picnic outing after cleaning the Carburetor. All I can say is that It will occupy my garage for many Sundays to come. All the little problemed stuff is comming together slow but steady. It is like riding on Cloud 9 with the top down. Dandy Dave!

[Guest Russ Edwards]

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Insurance Coverage

Hi Ed, Jayson –

There aren’t many stronger doses of reality in life than what the insurance man tells you!

Still, I believe the value of our cars is stuck in some kind of closed time-space warped mobius loop.

That is, appraisers (who, for the most part, don’t “get” these cars) look to comparable sales to establish a basis for their appraisal. But the comparable sales they find are low. So their appraisal is low. So subsequent sales are low, based upon those low appraisals. Which make the comparables upon which subsequent appraisals are based low. Which… Well you get the idea. It’s like a never ending loop.

And that may be because most of these cars are traded in our own little world and seldom get exposed to the public at large who have no idea just how satisfying and relatively inexpensive these cars are to own and drive. If they knew what we know, the prices would be higher.

Certainly you can say something similar about lots of older, nicer cars in comparison to, say, a new Corolla. One can even make a solid case that used cars in general are “greener” than newly built ones. And, of course, new cars’ depreciation is way more costly than their better fuel economy could ever offset.

But when you add in stuff that makes our Rivieras so special, well, I guess the bargains that they are is our little secret. Maybe we’re all better off if the general public doesn’t catch on.

As to auction prices, again these cars are traded among knowledgeable car enthusiasts who rely more on data points from previous sales than raw, visceral appeal, practical value, or bang for the buck.

The true test of value for these cars, then, would be what someone – a non-enthusiast - would pay who sees this car for sale out in the wild and with no reference points to price other than his own sensibilities. That is, after a ride in the country in a Riviera convertible with the top down, or an otherwise boring drive to Grandma’s in a coupe (after having made the trip several times before in a Honda.)

Now, imagine seeing a nice “lipstick” Riv droptop (white/red) roped off inside a busy upscale mall, and the lady on your arm says, “Honey, wouldn’t it be great if we had one of those? How much do you think that car costs?”

What price would be more believable to that couple walking through that mall - $6,500 or $16,500? Or more!

Then imagine if there is a new twenty-some thousand plain-Jane Nissan sedan also roped off a few stores down.

Yeah, most folks would covet the Buick but buy the Nissan. But “most” means there are a few who would spring for the Riviera. They are (or should be) our market.

Unfortunately those folks are never going to see these cars on eBay, at an auction, or even a car show or rod run, which are about the only places these cars can be seen or are offered for sale.

And those few higher priced cars that are sold “out in the wild” are seldom reported to those who compile collector car sales info, and consequently never make it to being a data point to be used by the collector car appraisers.

Again, I guess cheaper prices are good for us. Unless, of course, your car is for sale. I am still puzzled as to why that W15 car in Des Moines hasn’t sold – they are only asking $3995 and I am sure there’s lots of room to dicker. Talk about a sweet ride for cheap…

As to insurance appraisals, I needed to insure my 1990 supercharged Cougar XR-7. The ‘89-90 XR-7s were the only years for the supercharger and all the goodies that came with it, and from ’91 on XR-7 became more trim than substance. There were only about 4000 ’90 XR-7s and most “books” don't differentiate the value between the rare XR-7 and the mass produced LS models. I eventually got the insurance I wanted, but only after an appraisal to verify the condition. The insurance company sent me to the body shop of a local Lincoln-Mercury dealer, where the service rep looked at it from across the parking lot and appraised it as in fine shape (which it was.)

Anyway, I am still soooo on the fence about selling my Riviera…

Later…

Russ . . .

…

[sosuzguy]

If I had a choice of insuring my cars with a company that told me what the value was as a classic car versus me being able to choose the value of my car as long as it wasn't over 10k I'd choose the latter. I feel like I have a close value insured on each of my cars as to what it would cost to replace it with another model in the same shape should that ever happen.

[Rivieraman]

Yes i agree Jayson

I have my cars insured for what i state the value is i am insured though State Farm