Jump to content

Construction of a Continental Mark II model, scale 1:12


Recommended Posts

Those crude brass parts evolved into something more near to the reality. On the first picture, the clutch pedal is on the left. In the reality, but pedal stops are adjustable; on my model, only the clutch pedal has its adjusting screw because I could not position the stopping hub in a position to skip the adjusting screw. The original hub is positioned on the shaft with splines, I just put a screw as the effort will not be that huge.

The next step: create the clutch lever which will be actuated by the clutch pedal. I'm skipping the freewheeling system to avoid too much complication.

306 Pedals ready.JPG

307 Pedals installed.JPG

  • Like 11
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The pedals look great Roger

As I understand, a lot of owners eliminated the free-wheeling feature after a white-knuckle ride coasting down a hill and wearing out their brakes. A nice feature on level ground where you can change gears by just lifting your foot off the gas pedal. Cadillac eliminated that feature in 1933

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks Alex! This is what Johan Boltendal told me when I was in Germany (he is the guy who restored the frame and engine). When I was a kid, I heard that freewheeling was the cause of accidents. And there still are people who think an automatic transmission can do all the work and go down hilly roads by activating the brakes instead of choosing another range with the gear lever!

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just finished the clutch lever with the link to the clutch pedal. The assembly is externally functional which means that there is nothing inside the transmission except a strong spring to simulate the real clutch springing. This is totally futile like the gear lever going through the gates, but its fun!
The last picture is showing what I had to do to warrant the correct position of the clutch lever and to prevent its rotation.

 

 

308 Clutch on.JPG

309 Clutch released.JPG

310 Strange construction.JPG

  • Like 11
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Roger,

Padon me for getting the wrong scale.  At 1:6 scale, these parts would be much easier to fabricate.  But at 1:12 scale..........unbelieveable!  The difficulty in detailing the transmission, boosters, rods, clevis pins, springs, etc., etc. is mindboggling.  This will be your toughest challenge yet.  We will be totally in awe when you get this all sorted out and built.  A picture of the transmission and shifter by  itself is pure art.  Painted and by iteself, one would not know that it is 1:12 scale.  Just beautiful, Roger.  We   will be reated to one of the most complicated assemblies in your build.  It is amazing how you are duplicating every aspect of this automobile, even though it will not be seen.  Certainly one of GM's most georgous vehicles ever produced by their engineers and designers.

 

At our car shows here in San Diego, we always have one or two of the  32 Cadillacs.  Up close, these magnificent cars never fail to stop the casual attendant in their tracks.  They are the MOST photographed.  Two have won "Best of Show" and always "Best in Class".  Cars after this era just did not hold up to these georgeous machines.    

 

The restoreres certainly do not have the difficulty and challenges that you are going through!   But we all know following your threads for so many years, you THRIVE on the difficulties that present themselves to you.  This is what is so amazing.  How you SOLVE the problems, plus, you explain how you do it.

 

Simply a master at your art.

 

Randy

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Randy, sure, it would be easier at 1:6. However, my small machines would be totally inadequate; the larger scale would require a larger lathe, a milling machine and so on. The result would be that I had to search for a larger flat with a room in the basement for the heavy machines. No thanks, I prefer my small flat and the complications required for 1:12!

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I might be mistaken, but this possibly looks like Roger's most astounding work yet. I believe I'm a bit younger than Roger, and I've already noticed my abilities slipping a little in a few areas. It seems to be the opposite with him, however, so I thought he deserved this pic:

5b32dc8c325d853f141056d5b906f76f.jpg

  • Like 3
  • Haha 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nowadays, a brake pedal is a pad with a lever on a shaft, period. It can push a rod or be connected one way or the other to an ABS system, but the pedal itself is easy. Not so with a car from the thirties with power brakes. There is a reaction lever attached to the pedal and an acting lever which is pulled by the vacuum system. I'm skipping further details as this is irrelevant for the model. I tried to build that system by simplifying some aspects, but in general the look is there. All is indeed simple, but the shape of the parts is not. 
On the pictures, you can see on the top the clevis which will pull a rod to activate the brakes. That clevis has an elongated hole; this is the method to avoid that the brake pedal is moved when the hand brake is activated.

311 Brake pedal.JPG

312 Brake pedal.JPG

  • Like 11
Link to comment
Share on other sites

While I was at the brake system, I did continue with the booster. Not a too difficult part do do, even if the rivets at both ends were maybe unnecessary to reproduce. The booster is attached to the frame with a support, for once not a casting but two stamped sheet metal parts spot welded together. It's what I did, with soft solder instead of spot welds. Unfortunately, that support is no good: it's too thick and should be positioned a tad towards the center of the frame. I will have to do another one, with thinner material.
Why all that complication? Because the way it is now, I could not attach the rod coming from the brake pedal to the (not yet born) lever welded to the rocker shaft. With a gain over .5mm (0.02"), the rod position will be fine! 
Some explanation about the picture: the rod connecting the booster to the brake pedal is indeed a drill bit, with it I saw that the booster is not contacting the transmission's support and the future rod will be parallel to the frame's axis. The short axle to the booster is a temporary one. 
 

314 Booster.JPG

  • Like 9
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Roger is a MAGIC man.  Not from this planet but on loan from a distant galaxy.  Just amazing work, Roger.  I loved your Continental, but I have a deep fondness for cars from the thirties.  Engineers did magic with what materials and technology that was available at that time.

They  were beefy and built for comfort.  And the styling was just georgeous. Those huge headlights, driving lights, radiators and stylish fenders/running boards.  Those were automobiles.  

 

Just remember, roadways were not designed for hi speed travel.  Going 50 MPH was tatamount to speeding!  Most hi-ways were posted 40-45 MPH.  Not until Eisenhower (into the 50's)did we have the Interstate Hiway System.  And the cars and suspensions improved.

But in the thirties, cars like this Cadillac, were built (structurally) for the poorer roads.  A Cadillac or Packard could smooth out most roadways giving the passangers excellent comfort.   

 

I wonder what body  you will choose for this chassis.....................?  We can't wait to see.

 

Randy

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh! I'm really from this planet, with all the positive and negative aspects from life!

Those cars were probably more comfortable than low price models, but I don't have any experience and not eager to have one. Compared to modern cars, their comfort was probably totally different, especially cars with live axle in the front.

During a  meet with the Swiss Cadillac club, I had the opportunity to see how much effort was needed to make a 90° curve in a city on a 1938 V-16 convertible sedan. This impressive view did confirm that those cars are not for me.

I'm convinced that those cars were well built for the time, but their frames had a poor torsional resistance. Not good for a good driving behavior. On other aspects, those cars were overbuilt with needle bearings at most unusual places!

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Still working at the brake system. I added 3 lever on the rear rocker shaft and did the clevis for the booster. There should be a rubber boot between the brake pedal lever and the booster; it will be added later.
More levers/small pieces will next be added to the system.

315 Brake system.JPG

  • Like 9
Link to comment
Share on other sites

The previous picture was showing the rear rocker shaft which is responsible for the rear brakes. Now I did the one for the front brakes. As the actuating levers are located outside the bearings, they must be removable. Fortunately, I kept the "tooling" for the actuators located at each drum, so I could do the necessary splines. Maybe the shaft is a tad too small (0.2 - 0.3mm) and on those levers, there are more than 6 splines. To reproduce that exactly would be too much work. However, I noticed a strange detail when looking at my pictures: the LH actuating lever is looking like a blade (mine is probably too thick) while the RH actuating lever is a more conventional in design. And this is not an error on that car: I have also pictures from a 1932 V-8 brake system, it's identical. The parts book is also clear; the RH lever has not the same part number as the LH one.
My theory is the following: the LH actuating lever must have some flexibility, and the RH one is rigid. Maybe when doing an heavy braking, the LH lever is flexing if the RH one can go further, like a differential actuation. I don't see a different explanation but I don't know everything!

316 Front rocker shaft.JPG

317 RH actuating lever.JPG

318 LH actuating lever.JPG

  • Like 9
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Still working on the brakes. Both rocker shafts are now complete and temporarily installed. I saw that the levers actuating the front brakes were too short and the rods going to the front wheels would interfere with the cross member #2. Probably my measurement in Germany was correct, but the rocker shaft may be located too low or the crossmember not 100% correct. To avoid the issue, I made the a tad longer with some modification.
The cotter pins you may be able to see are not the definitive ones; I had to do something simple for the testing.
As far as I can see it, the brake system will be really functioning. Certainly not perfectly, but at the speed the model will be used, there is no danger and no recall will be issued!

319 Brake system.JPG

320 Brake system.JPG

  • Like 6
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Roger,

As to your comment regarding riding in a 30's car, I am wondering if the roadways in Switzerland are narrower and thus a bit more trickey to drive than here in the States?  Our roads here in the thirties were narrower than today, but unless you lived in Colorado or other mountainous states, we did  not have the terrains that you have in Switzerland.  Especially back in the 30's.  Granted, our hiways and country roads were not wide like today, but wider than in Europe. The average hi-way speed was in the high 40's low 50's.

 

The dealer would order the car with the usual gearing for the local terrain.  In Colorado, for example, the cars came in with low gearing to tackle the mountains.  If you lived in the Mid West (Kansas, Nebraska, Iowa, Illinois, Oklahoma) where it was relatively flat, the gearing would be higher as there were no steep mountains to climb.   

 

I rode in a 34 Packard 7 passanger touring sedan in the St. Louis area.  What a road car that was!  Huge and smooth.   Ditto for the big Buick touring sedan that my friends dad had in his garage at that time. (late 60's).  In the cities of Switzerland, are the streets narrow?  It would be a job to maneuver a big chassis like the cars of that era possesed.  Add cobble stone streets and that would make an interesting ride. 

 

Switzerland today has modern roadways but I wonder how they were back in the 30's?  We see old movies showing the roadways of that  era and the streets looked narrow, twisty and very much European.  Hence the cars that were designed for them.  Certainly the driver/chaufer of a big Cadillac had to have strong arms to wheel that big car along the roadways of the thrties.  My heart would be in my throat if I had to maneuver that big car in and around those narrow streets back in the day.......

 

Randy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm thinking ahead but do you have a secret for paint at that scale? Thinning out a sprayed lacquer? Obviously the key is to cover but not gum up the moveable parts or show a "line" where the linkages presently are positioned....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

Oh! Thanks for the comments! 

@ Pat: Those two models cannot be compared. Autos from the fifties were already more or less sleek with simple parts. With many castings, the cars from the thirties are more spectacular and more difficult to reproduce. When I first saw the frame in Germany almost two years ago, I saw a forest of rods, levers tubes and so on. I had no idea about the purpose of each element; I had no time to search as I was there to take measurements. With my pictures  and the ones from Johan from the Netherland, I finally understood the whole. The shop manual did help somewhat, but not too much. 

I suppose that all cars from that time with mechanical brakes were more or less built the same. It was just new to me! A brake job could be a nightmare, I would not do it either!

 

@ Randy: Roads were most probably narrower than now. On the other side, there were trucks which had to share the roads with other trucks or cars. There were probably more US cars (at least in Switzerland) here than now because the European models were either small cars or high end products. Since 1936 GM Bienne assembled many US cars next to Opel and Vauxhall, therefore there was a demand. I'm attaching a listing of the production from Switzerland. Unfortunately, there is no breakdown in models; usually the cars assembled were 4 door sedans. Coupes and convertibles were imported as complete cars. 

Some roads are still narrow and twisty, but the main roads are wide enough now for larger cars and truck which can be up to 2.5 meters wide (98.5"). I just drove once in a 1949 Cadillac convertible; I don't remember how it drive, I was just disturbed by the archaic noise from the manual transmission. 

 

@ prewarnut: there is no secret, except that for painting, all will be removed and each part will be painted separately. I usually paint my models with spray cans; usually the paint thickness is marginal except with base/clear: when I painted the Toronado body with that process, I could no more close the trunk! I had to scrap the clearcoat to close the lid. I had no issue with that when the body had the primer coat; obviously, I was very generous with the color coat! 

With all the levers and other mechanical elements from this model, there will be some issues with the paint. Most probably I will have to scrap the paint on some articulations. However, I'm not that far!

CKD assembly.jpg

Edited by Roger Zimmermann (see edit history)
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Brakes, continuation. Indeed, I was almost closing this chapter by finishing the hand brake. And then, the trouble began: when the clevis with the rod was installed on the hand brake lever, I saw to my dismay that the décor on the transmission side was pushing the lever to the side and the pawl was no more contacting the ratchet. I bent a tad the lever to clear the transmission side. No interference anymore, but the pawl did not contact the ratchet anymore. No problem, two thick washer will correct the distance. 
But...but if I'm doing that, the starter motor will be impossible to install. 
The sole solution was to diminish the thickness of the décor, which was done after removing the engine from the frame and separating the transmission. After I was thinking there is enough material away, a quick check said that I'm right. The power train was again installer on the frame (it quickly done) and I could try the brake system. Another trouble: by pushing the brake pedal 1/3 of his travel, the rod from the hand brake was contacting the actuating lever for the RH rear brake. Even if I tried to make my parts as precise as possible, I certainly missed some details. I solved the situation by shortening the actuating lever and doing a longer link for the hand brake. 
Now, it seems that the system is functioning as I hoped it would do.
First picture: the brake system is not actuated.
Second picture: the hand brake is on; the elongated holes at the clevis from the brake pedal allowed the main rod to go forwards, without disturbing the brake pedal.
Third picture: the brake pedal is pushed, moving all actuating levers; the link I had to redo is tilting to the rear, allowing the hand brake lever to stay at his place.
Hydraulic brakes eliminated all those problems but created others!

321 No action.JPG

322 Hand brake on.JPG

323 Pushed pedal.JPG

  • Like 8
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
On 6/4/2021 at 1:11 AM, Roger Zimmermann said:

 I usually paint my models with spray cans; usually the paint thickness is marginal except with base/clear: when I painted the Toronado body with that process, I could no more close the trunk! I had to scrap the clearcoat to close the lid. I had no issue with that when the body had the primer coat; obviously, I was very generous with the color coat! 

 


Hi Roger, haven’t been here for a while but spent a pleasurable hour catching up! 
 

Was surprised by your comment that you were using spray cans as your painting method as I stopped using them many years ago due to cost and availability of colours.
 

I have been using an airbrush for many years modelling in 1:87 and later in 1:48 scale as I found the spray cans very expensive and don’t give as good a finish as an airbrush. First was an Iwata double action unit that I used for 15 years and my latest is a Passche unit. 
 

Both were fed from a small workshop compressor with adjustable pressure regulator and automatic cut off. Air pressure also runs through a water trap. If painting late at night, the air reservoir will have enough volume to keep going.

 

Most of my painting is with old school automotive lacquers with automotive primers as the base. I also use Humbrol and Floquil model paints that are solvent based, preferring to use solvent thinner than the brand thinners due to cost. 
 

With a thin coat of automotive grey primer, solvent based paints can be used on metals, plastics, paper and Timber with excellent results.

 

You can also mix your own colours, add weathering such as dust or grime or engine exhaust black. You can also clear coat with flat, satin and high gloss to achieve the level of finish you want. 
 

Made up a spray booth from an old cupboard with bathroom exhaust fan and a bucket to exhaust fumes out of the window in my workshop. An old metal box made a great, dust free drying cabinet. Also use a respirator and glasses for safety.

 

If you can use a spray can, then an airbrush is even simpler as they are smaller to manipulate. 
 

Just my two bobs worth

Rodney 😀😀😀😀😀😀😀

Edited by rodneybeauchamp
Extra information (see edit history)
  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for your comments Rodney! In fact, I have an airbrush. Don't like it too much...However, I painted the leather from the Mark II with it as I let prepare the color by a company. As this product is water based, it's easy to clean the tool. That the huge advantage from the can: you want to paint just one little part? No problem: do it and put the can away till next use! Doing that with an airbrush can get you in deep trouble. 

You are right: sometimes the choice of the color is limited; therefore I let prepare from a French company the metallic blue I used for the Mark II's body. It was available from the Duply Color brand, but with a coarse metallic. The French company used the smallest one available according to my request. 

Another valid point: the airbrush is more apt to spray paint to odd angles due to the dimension. I used the airbrush for the primer on the frame and some body's parts for the Mark II. However, the surface quality is better when I'm using a rattle can. Probably the thickness (or fluidity) of the paint is an important factor and, again, the cans are correctly mixed!

Finally about the costs: for 40 - 45 years ago, it could have been a factor but I had not the money to buy a compressor and airbrush. Now, the costs of rattle cans are negligible compared to what the restoration of a real car do cost and I restored 3 Cadillacs from the fifties! Scale modelling is a cheap hobby in comparison.

Finally, I suppose I'm better working brass than paint. Hard to be good everywhere!

  • Like 2
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, Roger Zimmermann said:

Thanks for your comments Rodney! In fact,. Probably the thickness (or fluidity) of the paint is an important factor and, again, the cans are correctly mixed!

 
hi Roger, yes paint consistency is critical to good outcomes. With my mixing jars, used a brass flat stirring stick marked with a scribed line showing the exact amount of paint and another line with the exact amount of thinners. 

 

That way every time I mixed paint it was correct. Might add a little more thinner at times but usually good to go, removing any guess work. Used a measuring cylinder, yet pipette and water to set it up.

 

And made myself stir the paint thoroughly  by counting to 100 before spraying. 

 

And with regular colours used all the time, such as black, clear or primer, I would store the left overs if enough and with masking tape to seal the screw lids, we’re ready for next time even 12months later was still fresh. 
 

 Primer was mixed about 400-500ml per time as always using it. Otherwise dispose of the left overs, cheap enough!

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

As I wrote, I'm probably not so good with paint. I'm missing a good teacher like you would probably be, but I'm afraid we are too far away from each other! The rule is good for scale 1:1; I used it when I restored my cars. For scale models, with the tiny quantity used, if the can is not perfectly square (and glass jars are not), the rule is a matter of experience which I don't have as I'm not using it enough. And I hate to clean the airbrush or spry gun when using paint with solvent!

By the way, you have a nice car with that 1963 Riviera. For years, I had a large quantity of automotive literature; I sold the lot 3 or 4 years ago, without regret. However, I found recently some sales catalogs from Chevrolet and  Buick which were well hidden. From the Buick papers, I have one '63 Riviera and two Skylark leaflets. I posted them here in the literature for sale, just in case...

1963 Riviera.JPG

1963 Buick Skylark.JPG

Edited by Roger Zimmermann (see edit history)
Link to comment
Share on other sites

They are nice brochures that I do have already.
 

My experience with painting came many years ago when I painted for a friend who was making castings of HO railway wagons for himself, his dad and to sell. So each Tuesday nite he would come over with a bunch of wagons he had made during the week.
 

I would paint them in batch mode. Undercoat for the new ones just made, then the first colour coat for those under coated from last week, then the second colour coat for the ones that had been first coated the week before.
 

Then a clear coat on those with two coats so he could decal them during the week. Then weathering the ones he had decalled previously plus then a clear coat of flat finish  to seal the decals and the weathering.
 

I got to do a lot of painting and best thing was, they were not mine! Yes, I did my own stuff too, but learnt so much in a short space of time because of the volume we put through!

 

Was great times!

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've watched your discussion of your other models and so of course know you've been at this for many years.... I had one more food-for-thought moment (given that this is an exposed chassis). If you want anything to look like steel you conceivably could go ahead and paint and mask what you don't wanted painted (potentially bolt heads or the gear shifter, pedal parts) and then nickel plate them. At this scale it'll look like steel (or nickel) or potentially any silver metal. I have been working with home bath and brush plating available from various jeweler or other suppliers and it is pretty easy. Nickel will plate right on brass and solder. Certainly if you want pinpoint things to sparkle like bolt heads it is doable. Better than silver paint but it will take a few hundred $$$ and a little practice. Nickel can be a little touchy however with either too much voltage or placing the anode too close to the item or having a large piece with uneven distance across it and the anode. I can provide advice if needed...

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks for your comments prewarnut. For various reasons, I never will do nickel plating at home. I have a good relation with a local plating company; why should I play with chemical products I don't like? Sure, doing plating myself would diminish the loss risk and waiting time. but I can manage it.

Many tubes levers and so on are chrome plated on that engine/chassis. I'll do the same via that company.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

For the moment, I cannot continue with the brake system: for that, the axles must be under the frame (or the frame above the axles); for that, I must first do the springs. I will have to buy spring steel, I don't have enough material presently.
there are enough element missing at the engine to be busy for a long time. Recently, I did the breather. This part will be aluminum color at the bottom, the part above the base will be black and the cover will be chromed.
To drill the necessary holes into the crankcase, I had to remove various elements. The engine will stay that way for a while as I will do now the fuel pump, located just before the breather.

324 Breather.JPG

  • Like 5
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Roger,

 

Looking at the data sheet(s) on the cars assembled in Bienne and the completed cars imported since the mid thirties, are there auto salvage yards and companies in and around your area that sell used parts?  300K + is a lot of automobiles.  When one is "retired", do the local recycle yards snap them up?  We use to have a LOT of wrecking yards here in the states.  Mainly, they are back East now.  Very  few (in comparison) in Southern California.  And we had the most cars ! 

 

When the "cash for klunkers" program was instituted by Obama, a lot of wrecking yards cashed in and scrapped a lot of old classics and not so old cars.  Use to be able to go to the salvage yard and get a perfectly  good used part to repair (or build) your car.  Not any longer.  Many, many salvage yards have closed.  Seeing the old classics crushed for iron and steel is so sad.  Restoring an older car has become a lot more difficult as  you are spending a lot of valuable time hunting for parts all over the country instead of in your own back yard.  

 

Is  that  the case there in your area Roger?  You work on a lot of old Dynaflo and other transmissions.  Are you able to source used parts like when a case is cracked or for some other hard  part is bad (not the clutches or soft parts needed for a rebuild)? I am sure that you are not limited to Switzerland when you are sourcing parts.  You have Germany, France, Italy and other areas to go to.  The internet has shrunk the world.

How is your uese part sources these days? We do not have a clue as to how your market(s) are in Europe.  It would be interesting to know.

 

Randy

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...