Water Pump for '63, no a/c

[Guest ZombyWoof]

I’m looking into getting the Flowkooler 1620. A Flowkooler rep replied to an enquiry I made yesterday. I had asked if this model was for cars without a/c...the answer was no. (listing at website did not specify). Remembering back to asking about water pumps here last year (tried to find the post), is the only difference between an a/c water pump and a non-a/c water pump the number of impellers, with the a/c version having more? (5 vs 3, I believe.) Would having an a/c water pump be a concern on my non a/c car?

[RivNut]

Some guys say that the five blade impeller of the a/c water pump moves the water through the radiator too fast for good cooling. Your non a/c car doesn't have a shroud behind or a condenser in front of the radiator either. Is your radiator a two or three core unit?

[Guest ZombyWoof]

It's totally basic...not "thick"...not sure, so I'd have to say two.

[Guest ZombyWoof]

Finding a non a/c version has been impossible at the local parts stores...parts shops in the US haven't replied, except Flowkooler, who list only an a/c version. The say as long as everything fits, the a/c version should not pose any problems in a non a/c car. Would anyone have any hesitations doing so?

[Jim Cannon]

No, it will work just fine. Use a 180 degree thermostat with it.

[Guest ZombyWoof]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jim_Cannon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">No, it will work just fine. Use a 180 degree thermostat with it.

</div></div>

That would be to accommodate a slightly higher operating temperature, correct?

[jimtash]

Put a 160 degree thermostat in it. There's no such thing as overcooling with these cars. And pour in a bottle of Redline WaterWetter as well.

[Jim Cannon]

The factory calls for a 180 degree thermostat. Just use what Buick engineers called for and your Riv will be happy.

The 5 blade impeller waterpump will cause no problem. It will be able to move a lot more water than your non-A/C car needs, but will cause no problem as long as you have a thermostat in there.

[jimtash]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jim_Cannon</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The factory calls for a 180 degree thermostat. Just use what Buick engineers called for and your Riv will be happy.

The 5 blade impeller waterpump will cause no problem. It will be able to move a lot more water than your non-A/C car needs, but will cause no problem as long as you have a thermostat in there.

</div></div>

I run a 160 degree thermostat in mine Jim and that's what I recommend. There's no overcooling at all and when I drive the car during the winter as the weather allows, the heater still puts out hot air.

The fact that most owners drive their cars during the warmer months, their main priority should be to get the coolant flowing through the system as quickly as possible. These engines put out a tremendous amount of heat just by their design (pushrod V-8's aren't exactly free-revving) and making sure that they stay cool is key to keeping them trouble free. And that also includes changing the coolant regularly as well. Mine even has an auxiliary electric fan that I turn on in traffic when the need arises.

Like I said, there's no such thing as overcooling in these cars but there is such a thing as overheating and they can do it quite easily.

Just my opinion.

[RivNut]

Jim Ash,

I agree with Jim Cannon, if you run too cool of a thermostat, the engine can run too cold causing inefficient combustion, moisture and sludge buildup, and other problems. Run what the engineers designed....they did it for a purpose.

By the way, another old wives tale purports that a lower temperature thermostat will make your overheating engine run cooler. It will not. If you have an overheating problem, the thermostat is wide open regardless of the opening setpoint. Putting a lower temperature one in will do nothing to solve the overheating problem. You have to increase the cooling capacity of the system to solve that problem.

My '63 with a/c uses a 180* thermostat, factory thermal clutch fan, and has a good shroud. In the 197,000 miles currently on it, I've never had a heating problem. The previous owner used to pull a rather large Airstream trailer with it (you should have seen the size of the full hitch receiver that was on it when I bought it. It had electric trailer brakes too.) The only thing he did to it to help keep things cool was to put a transmission cooler on it. It had a full set of gauges in it and the temp gauge never went beyond 180. Keep the radiator flushed and if necessary have it rodded out when you start having overheating problems. Don't resort to bandaids to fix a real problem.

[Guest ZombyWoof]

Is the a/c waterpump supposed to differ in any outside dimensions against a non a/c waterpump?

On the Flowkoler site, the fan hub working height (base to top of hub) for the 1620 is listed as 4 1/2....one of my old non a/c pumps measures as 3 5/8.

As well, the hub bolt hole spacings differ. Flowkooler lists adjacent holes (center-to-center) as 1 1/2" apart...mine measure as 1 1/4"

Link to 1620:

http://flowkoolerwaterpumps.com/catalog2/product_info.php?cPath=1_4_58&products_id=261

Link to diagram info:

http://flowkoolerwaterpumps.com/diagram.shtml

Thank you...

[Jim Cannon]

Yes, ZW, you are probably right. The A/C pump uses a thermal clutch with the fan. That will be slightly different hub than non-A/C car fan, which is fixed to the shaft. Swapping one in for the other may not work. You'd want to check that carefully.

[RivNut]

ZW,

It sounds to me like you have a water pump for the 264/322/364 engines. They had longer shafts on them than the later model ones did. I measureded the pump on my '66 engine and it's 3-5/8" If you've ever seen the pulleys for an earlier engine, they have a very long hub on them to go over the longer pump shaft. The non a/c 401/425 engines use a fan spacer in lieu of the thermal clutch fan to move the fan closer to the radiator. NAPA and Rock Auto show different part numbers for 322/364 and 401/425 water pumps.

Ed

[Guest ZombyWoof]

Not sure what's going on with Flowkooler (been waiting to hear back from them to confirm dimensions), but I've since stumbled upon TA Performance Products in Scottsdale who have a pump with the correct external dimensions.

My order has been placed.

Hotcha!

[riv1964]

My Flowcooler measures 1.25 and 3 5/8

Roger

[Guest ZombyWoof]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: riv1964</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My Flowcooler measures 1.25 and 3 5/8

Roger </div></div>

Interesting...that's different from the specification listed on-line for the 1620, which Flowkooler claims to be the correct one. They've yet to confirm that the dimensions listed on-line are correct.