36 coupe - questions about ignition coil/cables

[Guest n1gzd]

I am replacing all of the ignition parts on my 36 coupe. It appears that my ignition coil could be orignial so I want to replace it so that I can eliminate a possible weak coil from some problems that I was having earlier (just want to start out with new ignition parts). I have what appears to be the original type coil that is mounted stuck into the firewall (and it might be the orignal one - it looks old).

Bear with me, this is the first time I have encountered this type of firewall mounted ignition coil.

http://www.pangalacticconsortium.com/cars/PlymouthGallery/imgpages/image019.html

The coil ignition cable has a threaded connector on it (screws on, not plug). One coil power site is on the side of the coil in the engine area (forget if it is hot or ground). Inside the car under the panel there is what looks like conduit coming from the back of the coil and it runs to the ignition switch. I can only assume that this is the other side of the power to the coil that is switched through the ignition switch.

Why did they do this, was it a security measure (hard to hot wire the car)?

Anyway,here are some questions:

I am guessing that there is a way to separate the coil from the firewall bracket and the metal conduit on the back. It was not obvious when I looked at it how it could disconnect and I did not want to break it.

I pointed a flashlight on the back of the coil and all I saw was the conduit but in a catalog pic (andy bernbaum) I saw what looked like a connection for the other wire. <span style="font-weight: bold">Is there actually supposed to be two things on the back, ignition lock conduit and power wire?</span>

The firewall mounted coil in both catalogs that I looked at is very expensive ($129.50 vs $39.50). <span style="font-weight: bold">I wonder if it would be possible to mount the cheaper kind in the hole where the original type goes and somehow snake the other power wire behind and leave the ignition lock conduit thing disconnected.</span> If the coil is the same diameter it might fit in the coil bracket and look kind of stock. Has anyone done that?

I have noticed that the later cars have the coil mounted on the loom thing that routes the igntion cables. I really would rather keep mine in the stock location.

<span style="font-weight: bold">Here is another question: When I removed my old ignition cables I could not find a way to separate the two sides of the ignition cable loom thing so I removed the contacts and boot from the ends of the cables.</span> I have some new cables but I don't want to take them apart. Is it actually possible to separate the two halfs of the loom thing or do you really need to build the cables on the car?

Thanks,

Rebecca

[knobless]

Just a sample of how things are hooked up

Edited July 26, 2018 by knobless (see edit history)

[Guest]

Remember that many (too many) new parts are defective.  If I were replacing ignition parts I would make sure the engine was running, turn it off and replace one part (points for example) and then start the engine again.  Then I would go to the next part (condenser for example) and start the engine.  I would continue like this until I had replaced everything that I wanted to replace.  Even back in the 60's and 70's when I worked for GM and Chrysler we had a fair percentage of new parts that were defective.  Today it is much worse.  If you have replaced ten things and the car won't run what piece is defective or what mistake did you make.

Good luck in your repairs and I hope you have many miles of enjoyment out of your car.

[broker-len]

I have a 36 Plymouth----it is a bit hard to understand your question-----was the car running when you got it ?   what are you trying to do  ????    the coil comes off by unscrewing the clamp then taking off the wire in back of coil  at the firewall-------if you do not want to go with a new correct coil you can jury rig some thing but why would you as far as WHY DID THEY DO IT THAT WAY     it may have been for security,,,,,but why is that relevant ? -----if you just look at the wire loom you should figure out if it comes apart---------------don't thing so-------let me know if I can help-----Andy bernbaum can be a good source but some of his stuff is made in other countries   I always try to get US made   NOS  I notice you car has a alternator  is it 6 or twelve Volt  ?    from the factory it was 6 volt Positive ground   who changed it ?????

Edited July 29, 2018 by broker-len (see edit history)

[jpage]

I see too, that someone has added several extra wires and an electric fuel pump. If it works for you , I guess it's best not to fool with it but I would recommend putting it back to original.

[JACK M]

Point ignitions are not all that difficult to me.

But the kids these days have no clue.

I have used 6 volt alternators that are positive ground so if that is what you have it should be a dependable switch.

However if you are running 12 volts you will have to run a ballast resistor before the coil or you will be burning up points.

 

On another subject and may not really apply to this relatively small engine, but those tiny air filters don't flow much air.

I have found more than one over the years that choked out the carburetor and made the thing run to rich at speed.

[Gonedon]

Hello from North Carolina

If anyone is still here I would like to inquire about old and missing wiring on my 1936 P2 coupe.  Trying to find out how to get negative from the battery to the ignition switch and out to the coil which is still connected by an armored cable. Would welcome any insight from anyone has encountered similar ignition and instrument wiring issues like the ones "yall" have addressed here.  Looking forward to ANY assistance!!!!

Gonedon

[Bloo]

Well, starting at the beginning, not much difference from something modern. The Plymouth is 6V positive ground. The battery positive goes to ground, and all the "hot" wires are negative. That makes no difference when wiring or troubleshooting.

 

Let me back up a bit. Accessories may very well care what is positive and what is negative, but any of the stock Plymouth stuff is made for positive ground, so you don't need to really consider that much except when adding something that wasn't there originally.

 

Just consider the negative wires "hot" and treat them like you would hot wires on any other car.

 

The armored thing is just has an armored cable between the ignition switch and the coil, for the "hot" wire. If you connect power to the ignition switch in the normal way (see @knobless ' diagram), then you have power to the coil. Done.

 

A normal modern coil has 2 small terminals. This does too, but the hot terminal that gets it's power from the key switch is hidden inside the armor. It's already connected. The small terminal that you can see is the other terminal, and it gets wired to the distributor just like on any other car with points-and-condenser ignition.

 

Edited February 9 by Bloo (see edit history)

[Gonedon]

Bloo,

Thanks for the insight into the ignition wiring. 

I will check in with knobless to get the diagram.

That will, I hope, provide insight into how to get negative into the ignition switch and out into the coil!!!

Your assistance is much appreciated.

Gonedon

[Bloo]

Scroll up a few posts. The diagram is up there. He didn't outright say it was 36 Plymouth, but that's what the thread is about so it probably is. The diagram does look like one for a mid 30s Chrysler product to me.

 

[Gonedon]

Bloo

Thanks again!

Found it and it looks like what I am up against!

Will try wiring the ignition based on that diagram this weekend.

Gonedon

[jpage]

I would suggest, if you can find one, is to get a Motor's Master Maintenance book that covers your car year. These books cover virtually every mechanical and electrical item on the car. Also, if anybody publishes one, try to find a Plymouth Master Maintenance book for your car. I'd be lost without these books! You can usually find them on the internet, or I found some in antique shops.

Edited February 15 by jpage (see edit history)