1916 Dodge Brothers Roadster price question $$??

[Guest imported_brian j]

Hi. I have a 1916 Dodge Brothers roadster with a clear title. It is a 98 percent rust free body and chassis/w rear end only. In other words you get the body shell with trunk and doors/hood/radiator/radiator shell/frame/springs/frontand rear axle dash with gauges/headlights/running boards. No fenders,and only the windshield posts. I was told there are only 3 to 5 of these 1916 roadsters left on this earth. How many are actually in existance? There are people out there commonly paying between $2000.00 and $4000.00 out there for Ford model T and A bodies in this condition. Am i out of line to charge in this range for what i have, considering it's rarity? I'm going to try to sell it to a restorer before it goes on Ebay to be possibly rodded. Your help would be appreciated.

[bobs1916]

Brian

as a member of the Dodge Brothers club I would be interested in restoring the roadster. There were 8 1916 roadsters listed in the 2003 edition of the DBC . It would be a shame to let someone rod it!!! . I have just completed a 16 touring car. Front fenders are very tough to come by and they are not being reproduced unlike the model A's and T's for which everything can be bought off the shelf!. My 16 took 4 years and I am ready to take on another project.I paid in your range for a complete car including wheels and fenders and did a frame off .Do I understand that there is NO engine in this car??? I look foward to hearing from you .

bob

my email is bob487thbg@aol.com or send me a PM

[John McEwan]

I have perfect reproduction fiberglass front and rear fenders for 1923 Dodges. Are the fronts the same for the pre-1923? I spent countless hours producing the moulds. Its a pity I am in Australia.

[bobs1916]

John

fenders are different on the 16 thanks

bob

[Guest imported_brian j]

Hi. Brian here. To everyone who has expressed interest and provided info on my DB roadster, thanks much! I will post pics very soon. I have done more research and have set my price at $3000.00 firm. Given the rarity,and other considerations if it doesn't command that i will keep it untill it does. Pics will be posted soon! Regards.

[Guest imported_brian j]

Hi. Here are the pics. Anyone interested at $3000.00? I have more pics also. Just ask. I'll email them to you. I have a clear title.

[Guest imouttahere]

Brian, you have <span style="font-style: italic">got</span> to be kidding! Don't you understand that the car would only be worth about $15,000 when fully restored? Why would somebody pay you $3,000 for this pile of rust, and then have to pay somebody else at least $25,000 to restore the pile, only to have a car that is worth $15,000?

If you want to charge prices like that, you need to switch to a different make of car. Us Dodge Brothers are not used to paying such prices. And if you want <span style="font-style: italic">that</span> kind of money for it, the car should be in better condition to begin with.

[nearchoclatetown]

I'm not taking sides here, but I think it worth the $$. The closest DB club roster I have here lists 5 '16 roadsters, that's not many. Wish I needed another project. DBers are always complaining about hotrodders buying early cars that should be restored. Trust me, a hotrodder would pay more for less car then this one. Someone should save it!!

[bobs1916]

Brian

where is this car ???

bob

[Guest imouttahere]

I'm not trying to start an argument, but let's face it: largely due to auction sites like eBay, lots of people seem to feel that their piece of junk is a "classic" and worth oodles of money. I just felt that somebody should point out the idiocy involved.

[gboy]

The buyer's willingness to pay determines the price, I have sold several bodies and parts only to find the guy I sold to put it on ebay and doubled his money. I sold a solid complete 25 DB coupe body to a fellow, who wanted to restore his grandpa's coupe, this body showed up on ebay several weeks later having a 6" chop with extra parts to build a hotrod.

I just looked at a 1926 DB 4 door sedan this weekend, a rusted hulk. It was advertized for $1800.00, The owner said he just sold a 24 DB that wasn't as good for $2800.00 to a hotrodder. He was very firm on his price and said it would sell. At these prices the roadster price doesn't seem out of reason, then again, when will you see a 16 roadster body again.

[Jim Anselmo]

Well, this is what I got for $3500 5 years ago and I drove it off the trailer. Recently I've seen people asking (key word here is asking) upwards of $7000 for something that isn't even in half as good a shape.... I guess it's worth what someone is willing to pay.

[dwollam]

I have seen prices go up considerably in the last 5 years. My buddy paid $5000 for a 28 Victory 6, not running, in fair condition. He got it running but engine was tired. Had to go through brakes, engine, top, needs paint, etc. I sold a 25 4dr that ran but needed everything redone for $4500 a year or two ago. Sold a 24 roadster, running and driving but needing everthing to be "nice" for $5500 about the same time. I have a 1919 DB roadster, nearly complete, engine turns freely, needing total restoration for $2600. Does $3000 seem a bit high? Yeah but if it is truly a 16 they are pretty rare. It is not a ridiculus price to start at in my opinion, certainly not to give the fellow a hard time about. If the price is too high, it won't sell. If it's not, it will. It's all for fun anyway, right?

[Guest imported_brian j]

Hi. Brian here. Now that the pot is stirred up i will give my 50 cents worth. The car is in NE Minnesota, Bob. As to the other commentaries good bad or otherwise....... everyone has a point. Here's where i'm coming from. Over the years i've had a few old cars, some were great deals dollar wise,some i had to pay through the nose to get something i decided i wanted bad enough. A couple of years ago i had a Ford model a coupe body, that was rusted around the bottom and had a "flagpole mount" (pipe) welded to the A post. It was dented here and there. It had a few extra parts with it. It was just stored away in my pole building as a "someday" project. A guy came one day to have a look at an unrelated part, and spotted the coupe. He asked if i would sell the extra trunk lid. I let him make an offer/he gave me $300.00 for it. He came back a year later with an interested friend who offered me $2800.00 for the car. It didn't take me much time to decide. Now i have more space in my building. His friend was very happy as he commented that a reproduction steel model a coupe body is $12,000.00 or more depending who you buy it from. He could build what he wanted on a budget. He was happy/i'm happy. Would "I" have paid that much? Not on a bet! But i would be willing to pay "obscene" money for my "dream car". As to the fellah who "drove his car off the trailer". Good for you! Heckuva deal! When's the last time any of you out there spotted another one for that price? If you were to sell it today, what would you take for it? As for the insults i'm taking,and the insinuation that my car is "junk", and not worth near what i ask. The car only has 1 small rusted area on the cowl,the rest is rock solid. I have the original serial plate mounted to the wood, it matches the frame number,the title is clear, it IS a 1916,and there are by the info i've been given, as few as 8 of them that exist in the world. There are Ford model A, and T bodies out there in similar condition (and they were produced in the millions) and they average between $2000.00 to $4000.00, depending on various selling factors. Not just EBAY, but car corrals,swap meets,craigs list,and local papers. And by rodders and restorers alike. Although rodders tend to spend more on these cars, their cars tend to resale higher also. Thanks much to those of you who came to my defense. The reason i offered it first on this forum was to give an opportunity to "restorers" to get first crack at it. It has been pointed out to me this may be the wrong forum to offer it in. To those of you who say it's WAY WAY TOO HIGH,i'm sure another one will come along soon, maybe for a hunnerd bucks. Like the 1969 Plymouth Roadrunner i bought in 1979 for a hunnerd fifty (missing trans)(found a four speed on the floor for fifty) I wonder how cheap i can get another one nowadays??????? NUFF SAID!

[bobs1916]

Brian

Bit too fasr off for me I am in CT and shipping would make it out of the question. Good luck with the sale. I wish it was in this area. For my 2 cents worth. To all the folks who have made their opinions public on this car the next part is for you. Sure I too would like to pick that roadster up for say 500 bucks but those days are gone. Plus where are you going to find another one that will let you, the restorer, spend the next few years involved in a project that will give you countless hours of pleasure...and some grief no doubt too. But when you are finished WOW!! Of course if you need to farm the work out and pay someone else 25G then you should definitely buy a finished car and keep your hands clean. SOMEBODY PLEASE SAVE THAT CAR FROM THE RODDERS!!!

[Guest allan c]

I have perfect reproduction fiberglass front and rear fenders for 1923 Dodges. Are the fronts the same for the pre-1923? I spent countless hours producing the moulds. Its a pity I am in Australia.

I would like to contact you about the fenders. Can you email me please? ringmaster@hotkey.net.au

[1936 D2]

So, brian j, now that it is three years later, please tell us what ultimately happened to the 1916 Dodge Roadster. Where is it now? Does anybody know?

[dwollam]

I had forgot about this thread. Shortly after this transpired I made a deal for 5 DB's in 1 load. We paid $2000.00 for all 5 and another $1000.00 to have them delivered. They are a 1916, 17, 18, 19, 20 believe it or not. The 16 is a roadster. Also there was a 19 Roadster. It was only good for parts. The rest were tourings. All of them were in rough shape, some worse than others. The 16 is slowly becoming a car, mainly gathering better parts, etc. Some of the cars and parts we sold off. There was also an early T partial chassis in the lot. Now that I think about it, was this really only 3 years ago?!

[vergil]

As for the fenders...there were the early and later styles for the '16.

[Guest brian j]

:)Hi All you DB guys out there. It's been awhile since i've been back here. A lot of things have happened.......such is life. I thought i would let you know what happened to the 16 roadster. In the summer of 2010 a fellow not involved with any DB organization bought the car from me for the grand sum of $1700.00 It was of course less than i was shooting for, but like for most people, the art of negotiation can influence price. I liked the guy......he was polite, respectful,enthusiastic.....it was a nice day.......i was feeling easygoing......and the deal was made. It is now December 2011, and i'm no worse for wear. I'm happy....and he's happy. I'm still amazed, at the responses i received on this sale issue. I find that people's attitudes on the same vehicles range widely. From the cranky curmudgeon, to the skinflint, to the purist, to the optomist, to the indignant insulter, to the defender, to the statistician, to the jealous, to the helpful. What it says is.......these cars are owned by all types. And the experience is a pleasant one to some, and hell to others. Some people make money,and are unhappy.....some lose money and could care less. There's no doubt in my mind EVERYONE appreciates these CARS. It's the HUMANS that can be difficult to be happy with. We should all remind ourselves of how we project our demeanors on others, and how it affects the enjoyability of the hobby. And just by chance........i have another opportunity to pick up another DB..........go figure. I'll let you know later. I think i'm going to have to cough up WAAAAY more than it's worth......or maybe not. I'm sure someone will let me know. Regards.

[1936 D2]

Hey brian j,

Maybe the bottom line question for the "old guys" here on the forum - Do you know the final disposition of the '16? Will it be restored or (gulp) rodded?

[Guest brian j]

Hi. Brian here again. I suppose i should let the "old guys" know. It was bought by a small town farmer. You guys know the type. He has quite a few "projects" in his barn. Projects that have not moved in years. He likes just "having them". It will probably turn up one day as a "barn find"........one of our kids will find it. The price in the year 2042? 1 million pazoozas.(the new worldwide currency.....UGH) The DB i'm looking at right now has resided in the same spot for 30 years. It's complete, and i mean COMPLETE. There are no parts missing that i know of, but it doesn't run. Been sitting too long. I hope to change all that. I'm going to purchase it tomorrow. I have no plans for "restoring" it as it's still mostly painted. Has a nice "patina" I'm going to clean it up and get it running, and just drive it for fun on nice days. Maybe drive in a parade or 2. I'll hold up the hotrods turtling down the fairgrounds at the "back to the fifties" show in St.Paul in June. Wish me luck, as the deal isn't done yet. You know how these thing can go.............Regards

[DCE]

Good luck on the purchase Brian. What vintage and body type is your prospect?

[Guest brian j]

Hi Again. Well, i bought the car. I'm no DB expert so i have a little detective work to do. I have some provenance going back into the 50's, but the history stops there. It has been sitting in the fellow i bought it from's garage since 1984. Before that it resided at his brothers house in Winslow, Il. Was used as a parade car in the 50's. The title says its a 1919 coupe. I will have to check the VIN to see if the title has the correct year. It's a turtle back style car, but it's different than all the DB coupes i've seen. I was told it is a "doctors coupe". I don't know how to tell the difference between a "doctors" coupe, and a "business" coupe, but it does have some odd features i haven't seen before. First the rear side window is as large as the front side window. Other cars i've seen have a smaller back side window. Also the seat is odd. Instead of a single seat going from driver side to passenger side, it has a "split" seat, with the driver side seat as a short seat with a boxed in area behind it. The passenger side seating goes all the way back to the rear of the cab and provides a spacious seating area. (I was told it was so the doctors patient's could be transported "stretched out". The Steering wheel is odd in that it appears there is a set of "rails" in the spokes, and somehow it can be "slid" from the centered position. The turtle deck has a smaller trunk door than my 1916 roadster did. And lastly the tires are fairly large, 33X4 tires on wire spoked wheels. There are some other things also, but for now, can anyone help me identify the car model? I will post pics soon, i don't have any yet. Thanks much.

[JACK M]

Fat mans steering wheel.

I have see a box affair in a Victory Six two door once. The owner was not around so I only saw it thru the window. Odd looking deal but looked to be original.

[keiser31]

Here is a photo from Doug...

[Guest brian j]

Hi. Brian here. The seat appears original, and is mohair, as is the interior/headliner cloth.

[nearchoclatetown]

BrianJ is the car John posted like yours? I know this local car, first saw it for sale at Hershey about 15 years ago. As was stated fatman wheels were supposedly in all coupes, and this body style came with the wires. Not your ordinary plain jane DB.

[Guest brian j]

Hi. Brian here again. Pics will be forthcoming, but my camera batteries are dead, so it will have to be tomorrow. Other things......It has "skeleton key" door locks....i think the trunk might be skel key also. It has big "canisters" hanging from each side buggy spring shackle area. The tag says "Johnson" on the label of the canister. I believe they are shock absorbers of some type. It has a heater on the cab floor, i have a hard time reading, but looks like "perfection". The large DB hubcaps are heavy brass/bronze???The boxed in area behind the driver seat has a "lid" that opens up with a substantial storage space inside. I haven't figured out just HOW yet, but the rear side windows have a strap at the bottom going inside the body, and it appears that they may be able to be removed?/rolled down?? Does the VIN on the title match 1919? It's 365XXX. The numbers match the toeboard tag.....everything looks proper and unmolested, i'll be checking it against the frame# later, but don't anticipate any surprises. Regards.

[Guest brian j]

Hi. Yes it looks like the pic Doug posted. I can't tell from the pic, but mine has a spare mount on the back also, that uses the same heavy brass/bronze cap to retain the spare as is on the car wheels. Thanks for the help guys!!

[1936 D2]

This is sounding like a perfect car for keeping as is for an excellent "unrestored" display! Many will appreciate that in the future!

[Phil 32DL6]

Is this another?

CarsOnline.com: Dodge For Sale

[nearchoclatetown]

Yup, it's someone's chance to own the only one to exist, just like the other two.

[dwollam]

LOL Those only one to exist stories are just like fruitcakes. I am positive there is only 1 fruitcake known to mankind, it just keeps getting passed from one person to another!

[Guest brian j]

Hi. Brian here. Yup it's the same vehicle. His is a silk purse...mine's a sows ear. Mine doesn't have a visor over the windshield.But i have a pair of sunglasses. Mine can be afforded by anyone with a job. His is fun to sell, mine will be fun to drive. Mine you don't have to check if your pants and shoes are clean to sit in it. It's so rare, 3 people are under the impression they have a one of a kind, verified by the inscrutible collector car ads. Ha. Ha. I've now heard 2 names possibly associated with this car Rex, and Victoria. What gives? I though old Henry had the market cornered on Royal names. Are these made up? Can anyone in the know tell me what the authentic name/model#/type of car? etc. I have manuals but they make no mention of specifics on this. Just so you know, i'll treat this car properly, and do my best with it, but rare or not i'm going to drive it. That's what i bought it for, dumb luck not withstanding. Thanks for the help! Regards

[nearchoclatetown]

BrianJ, can you remove your door pillers? And is the top removeable. If the top is removeable I think it's considered a Rex roadster, Rex being the manuf of the top. If the door pillers are removeable it is a convertible coupe. The one I know of the door pillers are removeable, giveing it a two door hardtop look. If neither it is just a two passenger coupe. Color me jealous, I like the unusual body styles. The wires and suicide doors give it a unique look, rather then the blah woodspokes wheels.

[Phil 32DL6]

I was told it is a "doctors coupe".

So maybe it's an "Rx coupe"?

[dwollam]

I do not believe ANY manufacture ever called their coupes Doctors Coupes. Rex was a Winter Top that turned roadsters into solid roof cars with glass windows. The convertible coupe is yet another type, quite rare. Same idea with the DB sedan with the removable post elsewhere in this forum. Drives me nuts some of the descriptions and names people come up with. Like 2 door coupe, of course it has 2 doors, all coupes do. The 2 doors that is a given. Another that bugs me is people calling all hot rods "Roadsters", and calling sedans 2dr coupes. Oh, and if anyone thinks I am pointing at anyone here that is not the case. Just ranting!

[Guest brian j]

I understand Dave. The collector car hobby is rife with creative embellishments. To me it's entertaining, but yes, it can drive you nuts trying to get to the truth of things.Soooooo........if i ever sell it i could call it a 1919 Fairly Fast Four Prince Albert Holiday 2 Dr. Doctor Lawyer Indian Chief Special Seat Coupe Extroardinaire......the only one of it's kind experimental car driven by Horace Dodge's Pinkerton man in a secret undergound tunnel. LOL

[Guest brian j]

Also........just a 2 cents worth. I think the habit of calling a car a 2 dr. coupe is allowable, as i believe even though we all know a coupe has 2 doors, it is a habit started when a person is explaining the traits of a car to another person, in many cases a lay person not schooled in automotive terms. Not to mention the often confusing variations of cars. Cars with 2 doors and no back seat. Same car, just a bit longer in length with back seat. Same car with 2 doors, back seat, and the rear of car top comes off. You see where i'm going. I once worked on heavy equipment with a person who attended a well renown mechanics school. He taught me many valuable lessons about mechanical things, and he was a stickler on calling things their proper names. He often corrected me on the proper term for a "bolt" He said the correct automotive term is "cap screw". He tried his darndest to break me of the habit, with some success, but when i would have to explain things to someone else.......i would have to say "bolt" or they wouldn't know what i was referring to. Sooooooo .......i often catch myself "double explaining" about the 2 door coupe i have. By the way, this thread is getting a little long winded. It started years ago. I think i'll start a new one on this 1919 model whatchamacallit coupe. Regards.