MonsterTruck Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 Hi ive got a 89 tc with the 4cyl and automatic in it. I was going down the highway and decided to wind it up and she just cut out and died. before it was cutting out intermitenly at wide open throttle runs. I come to find looks like there is no spark. Ive replaced the coil rotor and even the sensor under the Cap still seems to be no spark. I checked the coil for voltage and there is no voltage at the supply wires. When the wires are disconnected from the coil there is about 10-11 volts. Im at a complete loss on this it cranks over just find there is fuel pressure in the rail it just wont light off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89TC-16V Posted April 14, 2008 Share Posted April 14, 2008 have you pulled the codes from the computer? i think yours is a number of key cycles and it blinks the code numbers or if you have a scanner it would be easier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LouZ Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 I'm pretty sure the 4cyl. has an electronic sensor unit under the distributor plate (inside the distributor) that has 2 wires These 2 wires are the culprit. Change that unit the name of which I just can;t think of right now. (an old age problem). Good luck, Lou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 15, 2008 Author Share Posted April 15, 2008 I replaced the sensor under the cap. What code interface does this car have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
car_chick Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 Possibly a short/break in the pickup coil wire or connectors? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 15, 2008 Author Share Posted April 15, 2008 I pulled the codes and found 11,12,16 and 55. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89TC-16V Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 well all relate to it dieing and not being able to be kicked back over. you say it has volts at the coil? how do you know the distributor is good, maybe it took a crap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest My TC Toy Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 For explination of the fault codes go to www.allpar.com/fix/80s-codes.html and get a listing of the fault codes. It would seem 11 is the culprit, but one never knous with these 'modern' cars.Best of luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 15, 2008 Author Share Posted April 15, 2008 There is voltage in the coil wired if they are disconnected from the coil but onece disconnected there is no voltage in the what so ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89TC-16V Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 you are apparently losing it someplace. you said you replaced the HEP( disc with wire under the rotor), are you sure that is good? i had one eat the base of the HEP and refused to run then broke the second one i put it also because it bent the distrubutor inside. have you tried spraying starter fluid in the trottle body thats open and have someone crank it see if it fires up and runs at all> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 15, 2008 Author Share Posted April 15, 2008 I havent tried ether yet. The sensor under the cap and rotor is good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
car_chick Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 YOu might also want to try to jump directly off the battery to the coil to see if you can get the coil to produce anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Reichert Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 Nobody has mentioned that the aftermarket heps are not reliable.the 12 code says you disconnected the battery recently? Did you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cowancom Posted April 15, 2008 Share Posted April 15, 2008 How old are the wires? When I raced Datsun Z cars we had problems with intermident coils. They would test fine, but die on the worst place on the track. Turn 8 at Road Atlanta uphill comes to mind. Coils are cheep.http://www.fwdperformance.com/Store/Product.asp?IDCatalog=5&ProductID=695http://www.fwdperformance.com/Store/Product.asp?IDCatalog=5&ProductID=160http://www.fwdperformance.com/Store/Product.asp?IDCatalog=5&ProductID=1056 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 15, 2008 Author Share Posted April 15, 2008 I tried jumpering the coil and no go. And yes the battery was disconnected and run dead acouple times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 16, 2008 Author Share Posted April 16, 2008 Still havent been able to figure it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 16, 2008 Author Share Posted April 16, 2008 Is there a crank position sensor that comes into play here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwinCamFan Posted April 16, 2008 Share Posted April 16, 2008 No, but if you have fuel pressure to the rail/injectors but no spark I am still suspicious of you Hall Effect Pick up (HEP) the sensor you replaced up the dist cap. They can be finicky. Was the small round metal plate that's plastic welded to the dist still intact? Rotor got put back right? I've done that once myself... The dist cap was in good shape? The carbon 'button' that transferes the spark energy is still in the cap? They fall out sometimes... The wires where the HEP plugs into the harness (two circular three way connectors, one grey one black)) can get loose, make sure the female side of the plugs are snug and making good contact, you may have to bend them shut a little with a pick or jewlers screwdriver. Pull the # spark plug and bring the piston to TDC, is the rotor pointing to the #1 wire (about 10:30-11:00 looking strait down on it) Did you replace the ignition coil yet?Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 16, 2008 Author Share Posted April 16, 2008 I will go out and inspect the HEP again. Yes I replaced the coil twice now. Which cylinder is #1? all the way to the left? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 16, 2008 Author Share Posted April 16, 2008 HEP seems to be all in intact. I found where the postive wire for the coil ends and I believe its at the ecm next to the battery? I put a multimeter on that and when the motor is cranking it makes about .30 volts intermitenly so its like it trying but not makeing the voltage it needs. Do you think the ecm is bad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemi Dude Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 Have you thought of getting a REAL mechanic to look at the car?From all that you are saying, it appears that you have no idea as to how to diagnose this problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 17, 2008 Author Share Posted April 17, 2008 Becuase Ive already gone through everything. I was a marine mechanic until about a year ago. Thanks for the helpful post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mtworkshop Posted April 17, 2008 Share Posted April 17, 2008 Machinist's Mate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 18, 2008 Author Share Posted April 18, 2008 Have you seen the ecm cause this before on these cars? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89TC-16V Posted April 18, 2008 Share Posted April 18, 2008 highly doubt its the ECM, they rarely go bad and cause that problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest LouZ Posted April 18, 2008 Share Posted April 18, 2008 HI, I have been reading all of this "back & forth" and I still don't know If you have taken the car to a tech that has a good ECM "reader" and is experienced to understand what he reads.????? Lou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
car_chick Posted April 18, 2008 Share Posted April 18, 2008 Never seen the ECM do it, but I've seen the distributor gear wear out and do it (it's nylon), broken pick up coil wires do it (they can rub and cause intermittent cutting out under load before breaking entirely), bad coils do it, bad coil wires do it... I would pick something else in the ignition system before the ECM. Like Lou and other said, maybe someone to scan your systems for you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 18, 2008 Author Share Posted April 18, 2008 Problem is I dont have any money to get a tech involved. I cant seem to find a break in the wire it goes into the main loom then comes out on the driver side next to the battery and ecm. Ive replaced the coil twice so I dont think thats it.Do I just need to yank the distributor to check the gear? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwinCamFan Posted April 19, 2008 Share Posted April 19, 2008 NO YOU CHECK THE POSITION OF THE ROTOR like I've already told you. I'm not gonna get all snippy with you but If you don't go the procedures I'm outlining, I'm out on helping with this. Do us a favor, as you check the things that are suggested, say so in your next posts so we can keep eliminating possible causes. It's the only way these suggestions do any good.ECM's DO fail but rarely, it's way far down on my list of things to check... You might take the 8mm bolt out of the harness connector, check the overall condition (loose wires, corrosion, spread pins etc) but keep narrowing down the suspects.Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 20, 2008 Author Share Posted April 20, 2008 Which cylinder is #1? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89TC-16V Posted April 20, 2008 Share Posted April 20, 2008 do you even own a tech manual or FSM for your car? basic things are in it, any 2.2L chrysler motor has the same outline if its an 8 valve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwinCamFan Posted April 20, 2008 Share Posted April 20, 2008 All the way to the passenger side of the car.Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 21, 2008 Author Share Posted April 21, 2008 Thanks twincam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwinCamFan Posted April 22, 2008 Share Posted April 22, 2008 Sure thing. The rotor is turning when the engine cranks right?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 22, 2008 Author Share Posted April 22, 2008 Yes, I havent gotten a chance to go out and check the distributer timeing yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwinCamFan Posted April 23, 2008 Share Posted April 23, 2008 Not just for the dist. timing, I am trying to establish that the cam is turning. Cam belt failure is WAY more common than ECU failure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted April 25, 2008 Author Share Posted April 25, 2008 I did check that the cam is turning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemi Dude Posted May 1, 2008 Share Posted May 1, 2008 Hi again 'Monster'. Your old buddy Hemi here. I've been reading all the posts here and Alan is correct, you got to answer our suggestions with a logical answer for us to help.First of all is to establish that the distributor rotor is turning when you crank the starter. If so, then the cam is turning too.Your initial indication is that it quit at wide open throttle.I'm sure you went into overboost. Code 11 indicates that there is NO DISTRIBUTOR SIGNAL, so that MUST be addressed first.You said, "I was a marine mechanic until about a year ago."Then what happened? I've been an auto mechanic for 50 years, and a US Marine. So where does that get us?Follow through on the #11 code. With no distributor signal, it 'ain't never' going to start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wild bill Posted May 2, 2008 Share Posted May 2, 2008 I don't know where the mechanic will get you, maybe able to help a lot of people and save em some money? As for the marines, or any other service to our country, I see it as you serve my country, you serve me and I owe you, so you tell me, what can I do for you?Respectfully yours,Wild Bill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterTruck Posted May 16, 2008 Author Share Posted May 16, 2008 Well its still not running. Ive done everything and I think the only thing left is the ecu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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