'50 Special - Getting harder to start

[Gary_N]

Lately YODA, my '50 Special is becoming hard to start. He never is in temps below 48 degrees (min temp of the garage) and spits out a a lot of black soot onto the floor when I finally get him going. Usually, I run him around once a week, and I never usually have to pump the gas to start. Now I have to pop the hood and play with the choke a bit as in hold down then open, etc. I had the Carb redone by Pony Carbs in OK, and playing with the idle screws has not done much to change anything. Have not opened the Carb up since it was done by Pony. The Carb looks like it's starting to leak again though. Yoda eventually starts and every time its a surprise since he never gives any indication that he's about to fire.

I installed a Pertronix ignition about 2 years ago and that seemed to make a big difference.

I used to marvel at how fast he would start in any weather...still with the soot though. Now it's becoming a bit too cumbersome. Of course, once he's running, he never lets me down.

Gary

[Jim Cannon]

I used to have a Yoda; drove it all through high school.

The black soot means the mixture is way too rich (too much fuel). The engine is kind of drowning in fuel. Something is getting worse with time.

You (or someone who works on carbs) is going to have to open 'er up and see what's going on.

[Guest imported_JPIndusi]

I am curious about the improvement from the Pertronix sytem to replace the points and condenser. What type of improvement did you notice?

I also agree that the black smoke indicates Yoda is running too rich. Try adjusting the choke setting and check to be sure the exhaust manifold heat tube is OK. The carb leaking is worrisome and may indicate that the float level is incorrect. None of these are too hard to check with a shop manual.

Good luck.

Joe, BCA 33493

[JohnD1956]

In my experience with Buicks, I have come to believe they have a soul . I can't tell you how many times the same thing has broken in various cars at the same time. Odd you say? Here's a few examples : the fuel pump went on just about every single Buick I owned ( or had here at home) in the same year . Tires, One see them on the other and suddenly you have them on all of them . radiators? same thing. Tune up. exhaust systems. All types of things .

I mention this because I think the problem with Yoda is the fact that you are trying to sell Frankie .

Or, IMHO, you could always dump that pertronix and go back to points and a condensor.

[KAD36]

My put is your plugs are probably fouled from starting overly rich over a period of time, especially if you haven't taken it out for a 20-30 minute highway run in awhile. Pull some plugs and see if they are tan/grey or have soot on them. Bet you'll find the latter. You may want to try a hotter plug if you're just starting it and not driving it too much. Also, it sounds like the choke may be adjusted too rich if its blowing out soot at startup. Mine used to do that, I reset the choke according to my uncles (was an Olds factory trained mechanic for 35 yrs)rule of thumb: when cold, set the choke dial toward rich until the choke plate closes tight, then move toward lean slowly until you just see the plate start to move, and tighten it up. Make sure the fast idle speed is set to spec when on the high step of the cam. Test it out. If the choke comes off too fast, go 1/2 tick more rich. Worked for me. Good luck.

[Guest brh]

Agree with everyones troubleshooting, just adding a comment from personal experience--check that frickin heat tube first. I went through carb hell until I took the fitting off to remove the carb--again and the heat tube fell apart. The insulation on the outside kept it together, I never knew it was rusted through in 3 places, till it let go.

[Gary_N]

OK, well thanks for the input. I've had the plugs out a few times and yep, they look more black then beige. Off the top of anyone's head, what would be a hotter AC plug number to use? OK, I'll go look it up. I'll look at the heat tube tomorrow. Didn't think of that.

I've always had the soot problem (before and after the carb rebuild). As far as the Pertronix is concerned, up until recently, the car started MUCH, MUCH faster. I mean like a quick crank and running.

I will also try the choke adjustment. I backed it off a bit in that I actually had the plate stick. Had to pull the air cleaner off a few times and push it open with my finger.

The one thing that is great about these pre 61 Buick's is the routine of popping the hood, turning the key on and using the linkage to crank her up. Gotta love that.

John. Frankie might like your home just fine. I'll make you a very good deal, unless Lamar wants him back, for a fee of course! By the way, you may be watching too much Ghost shows!

To anyone with a Straight 8: Am I the only one to be surprised whenever the engine fires. I mean Yoda gives no warning at all. Crank, crank, crank and then running. And it always amazes me that it can crank so slow and still fire.

Yoda has a great story;looks like hell....but has never let me down. Even when the tank was so full of s----, he'd grumble but keep on going. Of course that cost me a ton to get the tank re done; pump and the rest. And the best part for me (and the worst part for the ex...but she's gone so who cares) is the smell. The smell of old musty cars is just as good as the smell of new ones!!!! Kind a reminds be me of my grandfathers garage with the wood floors. The was a great place to sneak a cigarette in the early 50's.

Gary

[Gary_N]

Ken:

Thanks for the Choke trick. I get him out every week for about an hour. One of the many issues that I have (of course new wiring is the answer - I hope) is the charging system. He doesn't start to immediately charge when running. After about 4 miles or so down the road, the ammeter pegs to the right. And since I've been cranking so much to get him fired up, I drive around until the meter gets close to center to get the battery charged back up. It never really gets to center though no matter how long we drive. I guess I need to do the wiring since I want to drive him to Hershey this year.

Gary

[JohnD1956]

"John. Frankie might like your home just fine. I'll make you a very good deal, unless Lamar wants him back, for a fee of course! By the way, you may be watching too much Ghost shows!"

HAhaha.. Too many ghost stories... You may be right, but it seems to be that way for me.

Man I'd like to give Frankie a try, especially since someone else already cleaned out all the undesireable stuff I love those big bodied Buicks.

But alas, I am committed to this Electra project. The patches I put on that with the construction glue are so tight that I am now anxious to try and glue on the rear 1/4 panel extension and see how long it stays on there.

Plus I need a new house with room for a serious garage before I buy any more projects. I can't drop a hair and have it hit the floor in my current garage.

[Gary_N]

I understand. I need to clean out my garage so I can concentrate on one car and not be distracted (like that's possible) by others.

I was just drooling over some '46 - '48 Convertibles. I'm starting to get the urge to look. Might have to sell the '64. That one's almost perfect.

Gary

[Gary_N]

Well, as a follow up. The choke adjustment worked just fine. The plugs looked OK (tan) but a little dirty on the edges, so I changed them with new Autolites.

Now, with a one blip of the pedal, he fires right up (so far). Still have the soot on start up and a miss that's been there forever. The rockers need to be adjusted badly since they are talking quite loudly these days. Have to tackle that soon.

Stupid Question: Without a 6 Volt timing light, can I do a timing adjustment by ear with any accuracy at all?

Gary

[Guest rlbleeker]

What I always used to do was start the car with the distributor loose (engine warmed up), then advance/retard until you find the spot where it wants to idle the fastest. That's going to be too much advance, so pull it back a little and take it for a drive. If it starts hard when hot, runs hot, or knocks pulling a hill, retard it a bit more. What a particular engine likes usually varies a bit from what's in the book.

[Guest imported_JPIndusi]

You can use a 12 volt timing light on 6 volts in either of two ways. In the first, just connect the light up as you would with a 12 volt battery. My Sears power timing light works OK on 6 volts. If your light does not work this way, then leave the black wire connnected to the vehicle negative post on the battery. Take a short jumper wire with alligator clips on each end and connect one side to the positive post on the car battery. Connnect the other end of the jumper to the negative post on a 6 volt lantern battery. Finally, connnect the red lead on the power timing light to the positive terminal of the lantern battery. This essentially supplies 12 volts to the circuitry of the power timing light. It should now work just fine.

Good Luck.

Joe, BCA 33493

[Gary_N]

Thanks for the input. I'll give it a try!