Selling in Europe.

[R Walling]

Has anyone had any experience in selling and shipping a car or parts to Europe?

Roger

[RICK YOUNG]

At work we deal with a guy in the Netherlands who buys John Deere parts from us. He also buys 2 cylinder tractors and other farm related items. About twice a year he ships them in a 40' container to his place in the Netherlands.

Super nice guy. I sent a 401 nailhead with him once that needed to go on to Finland.

If someone could tell me how to post a picture I would show how we do it.

RICK

[Guest BJM]

Roger,

I shipped my 64 Buick Wildcat to Sweden BUT the guy came here and got it, so I guess he took care of it. I just had an ebay auction end with the buyer from England. OK, so I go into look at his feedback and he has 3 recent negatives, one neutral with one of the negatives being a Snowmobile from Minnesota.

He never ended up paying for it and I don't even know if they get measurable snow in England. Parts? No biggie there. I had a guy in England buy some Caddilac parts off me, told him to send me a money order or such.. He did. I shipped to him, he was happy and that money is just as good as anything. I think he might have used American Express.

I'm not sure I trust PayPal from overseas folks. Too much Nigerian scam opportunity, but I believe the guy from Sweden used Pay Pal for the deposit then paid balance in cash.

Just some thoughts, no answer will be perfect -

[Guest Taco]

I like to buy (later this year) a vintage car (healey) in the USA.(maybe 2)

I live in the Netherlands.

And yes, i buy a lot in Canada, USA, Germany, England and Australia and Austria.

Mostly i use PAYPAL. Its for me a good way to pay. At once you got an email that you have payed. So the seller does.

I have no experience with buying cars in the USA till now.

Maybe we can make a deal later. Because in that case i need a independent man who can take a look for me at the car(s).

<span style="font-weight: bold">Warning:</span> <span style="font-style: italic">don't use moneygram and such things, it's bad. And don't buy from 'classified adds'. It's mostly the same.</span>

Taco.

[Erik]

Hi, Here in Denmark the local forum is generally filled with articles of importing car from the US. Generally we would contact a local shipping company that will arrange everything from the local pickup to paying the ballance in cash or check.

Our main problems with dealing with you guys are:

<span style="font-weight: bold">Payment.</span>

Normal payment methods trough-out <span style="text-decoration: underline">Western</span> Europe would be by direkt bank-transfer. That means we need your account no. This is in Europe the absolut secure way to do things. MO's doesn't work, costs a fortune and are not secure. PayPal is a creditcard payment and secured by our banks.

<span style="font-weight: bold">Is the deal true.</span>

Sending money for an expensive item, with only a picture as reference can be pretty hairy. We're paying for something we won't see for 3 months.

The cost for shipping is normally about $1500 and please remember to freeze protect the car! Even in the summer! when the car arrives it will be winter and freezing!

Typically for the EU is import-customs of about 10% and salestax of the total price including shipping. Salestax differs from country to country but normally 20 - 25%.

So my best advice from the wrong side of the question:

Selling to Europe should not cause concerns but...

Request pickup in person or by a named shipping company.

Don't be scared of giving us your account no. IBAN no. and SWIFT no. Thats how we always do buisness over here. We will not abuse it! but NEVER accept money to be relayed to a third party (shipping co) - THATS A SCAM!!

Have patiance. We can't arrange shipping from day to day.

E-mail a lot of pictures and tell the whole truth about the condition of the car. If the car needs parts that you know of, it would be a great service (and very muth cheaper for us) to get them bought locally and stuffed in the trunk.

[Dave@Moon]

I've sold a number of books and old Buick parts to buyers in Europe through eBay, especially lately due to the weak dollar. Since it often takes longer to get payment by mail than is convenient given eBay's seller protections, I will only accept PayPal from over there. I've never shipped a car, but posting items to Europe is a country-by-country experience, with insurance/size & weight restrictions/delivery times varying even more widely than postage.

I used to buy quite a lot from Europe for my Triumph as well, but the exchange rate of late has made that an untenable proposition.

[RICK YOUNG]

The last I knew it was about $2,500.00 U.S. Dollar to send a 40 foot container to the Netherlands from Iowa, U.S..

[RICK YOUNG]

401 GOING TO THE NETHERLANDS

[Guest Dyna]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DRAGNRIK</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The last I knew it was about $2,500.00 U.S. Dollar to send a 40 foot container to the Netherlands from Iowa, U.S..</div></div>

Sounds about right but shop around you can get it cheaper (that is the price to port in Europe). However be aware, get the price from door to door. See what happens is that the boat comes in, and containers will be handled by just one agent!! That means they can set what ever price they want to get the container off the ship and home to you. It's pure extortion sometimes, since they know that you will pay. And if you can't in time they can charge you for storage which isn't cheap!! So watch out and have it all paid in advance or you will get robbed in the end!!

Cheers Dyna

[jscheib]

I was just thinking about the original question. I would think that you and the buyer could arrange the shipping details between the two of you. I would strongly suggest that you have the buyer make the final arrangements and payment,

My opinion, that $2500 price may have been a few years ago, when fuel cost (both truck to port and the ship) was much less. I would not be surprised to find it quite a bit more now.

John

[imported_75RivGS]

I will only pay for items through paypal (expensive for both seller and buyer) or (and prefer) direct bank transfer.

Bought my wagon by sending money from bankaccount to bankaccount A very secure and cheap way.

All other payments (M.O., pers check) are not possible or very expensive

Can somebody please explain why US sellers don't like to give their bankaccount number?

Here in Europe 80% (at least)of the items on auction sites are paid with those bank transfers. There is no way I could missuse a seller's bankaccount number

[NTX5467]

Rob, "identity theft" is a major concern over here right now. Emails from (allegedly) PayPal and eBay, plus emails from "official looking "websites, asking to verify certain account information are rampant in our email boxes. It's hard to tell the "real people" from the "imitation people" or businesses. Once they have some of that information, they can clean out bank accounts in short order. Many of these operatives are not in the USA, but then again some are.

Therefore, we generallly have a much higher sensitivity to handing out such financial information (as bank account numbers/information) to "unknown others".

Just some thoughts,

NTX5467

[Argyll]

Hi Roger,

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Roger Walling</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Has anyone had any experience in selling and shipping a car or parts to Europe?</div></div>

Most of the other posts have covered the points from the European end, but perhaps I could add one or two additions.

I'm not 100% certain, however when I receive parts from Late Great Chevy's or Danchuk there's always a US Customs certificate inside the paperwork envelope. I reckon you might have to complete one of these regardless of what you ship as Her Majesties Customs & Excise require it to ensure what is being sent has an originators details, and costs. In the UK when an item arrives HMC&E add 10% Import tax and then add Federal Tax (VAT) at 17.5% on top of item cost, packing and shipping and the 10% Import Tax which I have to pay - you are not responsible for the payment of these taxes, etc. Federal Tax (VAT) I believe varies from EU country to EU country, so be prepared for somebody from one country, lets say Sweden asking you to send it to Germany. Its not that they're trying a scam, its because the Federal tax in German is less than in Sweden and is more cost effective for the buyer to drive into Germany, pay the taxes and return than pay the taxes if it was shipped directly to their home address. However I don't think this happens very often, perhaps with large items such as a vehicle maybe where the taxes add up to no mean sum.

The other point is if you (or anybody here) do choose to send an item could you please, please, please ensure the packaging is robust. I've lost count how many items that have arrived damaged because the packaging just wasn't up to the job. For example, I ordered a set of wheels from Chevy Interational and they arrived (eventually!) in light cardboard boxes that were in tatters, all the wheels were damaged, parts were lost and it took a lot of time, pain & tears to get CI to accept they were responsible.

In the UK PayPal appears to be the favoured method of paying, because like yourselves we're very careful about who we give our bank details to, but as I've read in this thread other nations have a much more open view about this subject.

Argyll.

[TG57Roadmaster]

About 10 years ago, we sold a '58 Buick Estate Wagon to a hobbyist in Sweden. His ex-pat friend who works here for GM took care of all the details, so I can't comment on that.

We now have two cars in one 40' container on the water from Long Beach, CA to Bangkok, Thailand, which cost under $2,000 for both, one way. Total loss insurance for both cost another $1,000.

One of them is a '58 M-Benz 220S cabrio bought in Canada (previously a Florida car), which had to come thru US Customs. Go to their website and search for "Exporting a car" to Europe. There will be instructions, forms (Shipper's Export Declaration (SED), EPA certification, etc.) to follow.

Both cars were paid for with wire transfers, which basically involves only your bank routing & check number and their bank's routing code and their bank's code for transfers. You're not revealing anything secret, since every time you pay by check, your routing & check numbers are there, plain as day. It's when you get asked for other info, such as Soc. Sec. #'s, <span style="font-style: italic">that</span> would be a red flag.

We used a CFR Lines division named Rinkens for shipping from L.A., and will do the same next time when we ship out of Charleston, SC. For cross-country shipping, we were very happy with the sevice provided by FedEx PassPort auto transport.

For your sale to Europe, make the buyer aware of: <span style="font-style: italic">all</span> shipping & (optional) insurance costs; that the overseas shipper needs a consignee on the receiving end to unload & deliver the container (unloading & delivering can be separated, if too costly, as mentioned above); that duty must be paid on imports; that appropriate paperwork be filled out to the letter.

It ain't Rocket Science, but it can try your patience. For example, when the 220S was titled & registered here, the VIN was off by one digit; a "Z" instead of a "2," which I missed. Luckily it was caught at the last minute and rectified. Customs can be pretty rigid, and I wasn't about to test them.

You can get around all of it by hiring a Customs Broker to do all the paperwork for you, and include the cost in your selling price.

Feel free to send me a PM if you have any questions about the learning curve I've been thru in the last few months.

Regards,

Tom Gibson (TG)

[Guest invicta592]

Depends a lot on whether your car is driveable or not, but this is what happens, generally speaking.

Assuming that your car is driveable, then the buyer may choose to use Roll On-Roll Off shipping. Thats how I brought my Invicta home. RO-RO shiping is cheaper, but you can't carry any spare parts in the vehicle. The port authorities use the rule that there should be nothing more inside the car than what was in it when it was sold new.

If its not driveable, or if the buyer prefers, it may be containerised. With a container, you can ship as much as you can squeeze into the container - even a parts car if you can shoehorn it in

Although the procedure may vary from one state to another, it would probably be something like this.

You would either drive the car to the port, or the buyer will arrange collection. In either case, the car will end up at the dock. The biggie here is the title. I gather that usual procedure is to take the title to a notary, and sign everything over only at that point. In export cases, you will have to Fed-Ex the title (unsigned) to the shipping agent, so that it can be included with its export documentation.

When I brought my Invicta home, the vendor did the following for me : -

1) Removed the wheelcovers and put them in the trunk (just in case of light fingeredness at the docks!)

2) Sticky Taped some "How to start the car" instructions to the steering wheel (Gas Pedal starters are so confusing to the uneducated )

3) Posted the title to the Shipping agent.

Obviously, the first two are irrelevant if the car is a non-runner and/or going by container!

On my part, when I paid for the vehicle, I added $50 to the transfer to cover the costs of any postage, or costs on the vendors side. Not a vast amount, but after had posted the documents and dropped the car off, he realised that he had forgotten to put the convertible top boot in the car. He posted that to me via USPS, and the $50 even covered that cost to.

It really isnt difficult from the vendors end. Maybe a couple of forms to fill out, and post, and thats about it.

For parts only, the only thing that is maybe different to the norm is a customs form. You declare whats in the box (Antique Car Parts or something similar) and the value of the items. I usually buy things foir future use, rather than immediate, so I prefer surface mail. Its cheaper, but slower.

Hope some of that helps.

[imported_75RivGS]

I always try to make an appointment with the seller to keep the stated value as low as possible; here (The Netherlands) we have to pay $15 + 20% over value and shipping on all items above $30)

@Dave: surface shipping is no longer an option. Everything goes by air nowadays (makes shipping from US much more expensive)