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Dodge Deluxe

Help needed with a 1939 Dodge D-11 Deluxe

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Okay, here is where I'm at today...

I tried soaking, I tried blowing air to no avail, then I tried the drill thing and it worked like a charm, I did not have a speedometer cable so I used my wire coat hanger, real slow like you said. I busted it up and it's all clear! Now... have you ever heard the phrase when one closes another door opens? Well, not in my world. When door opens another door closes! I'm all clear but still no gas pumping from the tank. I have a transparent fuel filter in line under the drivers side door, no gas in it at all after cranking the engine and running the engine on gas poured into the carb. Won't draw anything. I'm thinking perhaps this rebuilt fuel pump is bad? Before installing it, when I actuated the arm it did pump air, so I do not know?

Now a whole new problem has arisen as an added bonus to my current frustration; when I was running it on gas poured into the carb I noticed oil leaking under the engine. Upon inspection I found that the braided line that runs in between the steel oil line from the oil pressue gauge and the steel oil line that comes out of the block has ruptured at the fitting from pressure. My oil prerssure gauge reads fully pegged to the right when I run the engine on gas poured into the carb.

A blockage somewhere, or just an old fitting?

Dan

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OK, just because you got the fitting open doesn't mean the tank is clear. The crud that caused the blockage is still in there, but now it's in pieces. Think about removing the tank and cleaning it correctly. It also sounds like your oil pump plunger is stuck or the plunger spring is broken, causing too much presure. Do you have another guage to test with, maybe a higher LB. guage? Don't run it too long this way, could start blowing out seals.Sounds like good progress is being made.You also have a blinking flag that needs clicked at the top of the page.

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Regarding the tank, I flushed it out with the drain plug out. I'll try hooking the electric pump up again to see if it draws any gas. How would one go about fixing the oil pump plunger? I do not have another gauge here, but I think I know where I can get my hands on one. I'm not seeing any blinking flag? Not sure what you mean?

Dan

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I'm assuming the oil pump would be inside the oilpan. The bypass would be part of the pump, that's where the plunger and spring are. Some engines have the bypass in the block seperate from the pump. You need to look at a manual to find it. VWs have it seperate and being a steel piston in an alloy case they grow together and stick if the engine sits for a long time. I just guessing that is your problem, but it sure sounds like it. I'd try another guage of higher reading first.Try for the blinking flag again

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there is no check valve in the tank , but there is a built in filter .i suggest that you remove the line from the tank again a blow back into the tank with compressed air . it sounds to me as if the filter is blocked as it is located in a depression in the tank and every thing gravitates to it.before you apply the air remove the filler cap so you dont pressurise the tank

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Hi Delux. If your fuel line is disconnected from the tank and fuel does not freely run out the outlet no pump will help as you still have a problem. (I assume there is not a goose neck or similar in the thank) I would suggest you drop the tank out, this will take just 10 minutes and give you great access. Onec out the tank can be rolled and tipped until you remove whatever is in there which could be almost like tar.

Question to others about the oil pressure issue, should Delux also be checking the oil pressure release valve or is this what you are calling the bypass?

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Got another question regarding the oil pressure situation. I noticed today that the gauge in the dash is still reading all the way over to the right, fully pegged and the engine is not even running. In fact, I took the ruptured line off today so there is no pressure at the gauge at all. I am wondering if I broke the gauge?

Dan

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Friends,

I got away from the engine problems for a little while and worked on the electrical system situation, I now have headlights, both high and low beam, tail lights, parking lights, dome (reading) light, high beam indicator, and wipers working. I still need to get the horns and dash lights working. Now back to the oil pressure problem, I have a service manual now and it shows an oil pressure relief valve down near the bottom of the block on the drivers side, just above the oil pan. I am going to unscrew that, and there is supposed to be a spring and a plunger inside. I am wondering if perhaps the plunger is stuck as one you already said. Once I remove the spring, if the plunger is indeed stuck how do I get it out and unstuck?

Dan

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I'd get there first, then figure out the plan of attack. It may be rusted in place, forget how long the car sat. It could just be gooped up, maybe some carb cleaner. I'm thinking it's really stuck or it would have pushed out. Didn't you peg theguage a few times? I know what the plunger in a VW looks like, never saw one of these. MAybe look at one from another engine like yours, maybe you can get a plan. They are usually piston shaped { hollow in the bottom}, I'm thinking like a machinist again, but you might be able find a tap that fits up in the bottom and put a few threads in it. Then screw a piece of threaded rod on and pull it useing washers and a nut. If it's not possible to thread it, maybe you could drill a hole up through it and thread it and pull, then replace it with a good one. I doubt they are hardened, but it may be? Lots of ways, hope it's easy and no big deal.

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Well I took out the hex head plug and spring, the plunger was pushed way back in. I took the oil lines off from both sides of the oil filter and made sure they were clear. Then I took them off at the block and blew air inside there as well. Then I sprayed PB Blaster into the hole where the plunger is, as well as the holes above it where the oil lines go in. I let it sit a bit then blew air in all the holes. I tapped the the block around the plunger a bit with a small ball peen hammer, then I put a small Phillips inside and tried to wiggle the plunger. I felt it moving. I blew air into the plunger hole and it blew out where the oil filter line goes in so I figure it must be clear now, as before I was not getting any oil to the filter. I guess we'll see what happens when I try to start it again?

Dan

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Sounds to me like your wife better pack a picnic lunch, you'll be on the road in no time. IS the plunger galled on the sides? MAke sure it slids easily, you're on your way.

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Good on you Dan, you are starting to improvise and just work your way around the problems. That is how it is done on these old cars, they are generally very simple (with a few exceptions) and very robust. Just keep at it you can not be very far off start up now. A few years back I was having engine problems with my 38, a very good and older mechanic said "if you give it fuel and spark at the right time it will go...the engines are that simple".

Keep up the posts !!!

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IT'S RUNNING !

I put a new flex oil line on this morning to replace the one that blew. It's running on it's own now, new fuel pump is working. Radiator is holding. Temp is good. Oil level is good. Oil pressure gauge is not working, need to get an aftermarket one to see what the true reading is.

Dan

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Okay, so it's running pretty smooth. I oiled the air cleaner and breather, new engine oil, new antifreeze with rust inhibitor and water pump lubricant. Now, next problem... I cannot put it in gear while it's running, the clutch does not disengage. Any suggestions?

Dan

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<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dodge Deluxe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Okay, so it's running pretty smooth. I oiled the air cleaner and breather, new engine oil, new antifreeze with rust inhibitor and water pump lubricant. Now, next problem... I cannot put it in gear while it's running, the clutch does not disengage. Any suggestions?

Dan

</div></div>

This is a common problem with cars that have been off the road for years. The clutch plate gets stuck to the flywheel.

One way to fix it is simply to slide a putty knife between the flywheel and clutch plate. To do this you need access to the clutch. Is there an inspection plate on the bottom of the bellhousing?

Have someone hold the clutch down, or prop a stick between the dash board and clutch pedal. Drive a knife blade between the clutch and flywheel, rotate the clutch, repeat until the plate is free.

On a Nissan 4 WD pickup with no access I once drilled a hole thru the bottom of the bellhousing with a hole saw and successfully freed up a sticky clutch. Not that I am suggesting such a thing.

Have heard that spraying Brake Kleen spray on the clutch will help free it.

Others have reported success by push starting the car and driving around with the clutch pedal depressed until it comes free.

I recommend the first method (putty knife). The other ideas I am only reporting NOT suggesting you do them.

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Tried pull starting it and driving around the back field, would not break free, still frozen. Going to have to try the putty knife I guess. Got a new problem now too, running very hot, needle was fully pegged 212 degrees. Didn't blow any hoses, but I could hear it bubbling inside the radiator. The reason why the former owner parked it back in 1990 is because he was over heating and did not know why. Apparently the problem still persists. Coolant is full, thermostat is new, radiator does not seem to be leaking anywhere, hoses are all new. What else could be causing it to run too hot?

Dan

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Borrow an infrared and check all corners of the radiator. A cold spot will indicate a blockage. They are only about $40 if you can justify one. IS the water pump any good? Did you flush all the crud out when yoou changed the hoses? When it's hot would be a good time to take off a hose and flush it. And the timing will cause overheating. Advance working?? No vacumm leaks?

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I believe the water pump is good, I believe the radiator is good. I do have the tell tale white smoke exhaust I think though of coolant being burned. So I am thinking my head gasket may be bad. I have clouds of white smoke when it is running, looks like steam, so I think I'm burning coolant. This could either be the cause of the over heating or could be the result of over heating? Hopefully the head is not warped or cracked. I am going to start with a new head gasket I guess and go from there. I do not show any signs of coolant in the crankcase.

Dan

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<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dodge Deluxe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Tried pull starting it and driving around the back field, would not break free, still frozen. Going to have to try the putty knife I guess. Got a new problem now too, running very hot, needle was fully pegged 212 degrees. Didn't blow any hoses, but I could hear it bubbling inside the radiator. The reason why the former owner parked it back in 1990 is because he was over heating and did not know why. Apparently the problem still persists. Coolant is full, thermostat is new, radiator does not seem to be leaking anywhere, hoses are all new. What else could be causing it to run too hot?

Dan

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I just went thru this on my 1951 DeSoto flathead 6.

It turned out the rad was full of shredded paper. It looked like those brown kraft paper shop towels shredded up.

My only clue was a few bits of the paper floating around in the rad top tank. I fished them out but the car kept overheating.

When I took the rad off I turned it upside down and set it on a milk crate. Then flushed it with a garden hose.

Out came enough shredded up paper to make a clump the size of a football.

I also took off the water pump and inspected inside the engine's water passages. But the clogging was all in the top tank of the rad. The water pump and engine were clean.

My theory is that someone drained the rad for the winter and left the rad cap off. Then, a family of mice built a nest.

You might check the rad for floating debris.

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<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dodge Deluxe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I believe the water pump is good, I believe the radiator is good. I do have the tell tale white smoke exhaust I think though of coolant being burned. So I am thinking my head gasket may be bad. I have clouds of white smoke when it is running, looks like steam, so I think I'm burning coolant. This could either be the cause of the over heating or could be the result of over heating? Hopefully the head is not warped or cracked. I am going to start with a new head gasket I guess and go from there. I do not show any signs of coolant in the crankcase.

Dan </div></div>

When you have the head off you can check it for straightness with a feeler gauge and a straight edge.

Put the .003 feeler gauge in the middle of the head and set the straight edge on it. If you can slide the feeler gauge around you know the head is warped at least .003.

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I wouldn't doubt that mouse nesting isn't part of the problem, as I still pulled some out of the top of the radiator just this morning, but I still think there is a deeper problem. The previous owner did indeed leave the rad cap off all those years, and mice did indeed get inside the radiator, but the whole reason he had it off to begin with was because he was overheating. I still wonder if maybe the head gasket is bad. Even if I replaced it and it was not bad, it can't hurt to have a new one.

I've heard of the sniffer that you are talking about, I'll have to see if I know anyone who has one.

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Well then you definitely need to take the rad off and flush it out.

What else needs doing I don't know. Could be the rad is also clogged with deposits of lime or sediment. Could be a bad water pump. Could even be a plugged up exhaust, that can cause overheating too.

Maybe you should take the rad to a rad shop for a thorough cleaning.

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One other thing comes to mind that is unique to Chrysler made flathead sixes.

They have a water distribution tube behind the water pump. This is a metal tube with evenly spaced holes. It takes the cooling water and distributes it to each cylinder.

If this tube corrodes away all the water can stream straight up into the top radiator hose.

This results in the front of the engine running cool and the back of the engine overheating.

If you have the rad and the water pump off you should check the water distribution tube.

There is a picture of it here on the P15D24 web site along with instructions on removing and replacing it.

http://www.merc583.addr.com/mopar/framesets/techtipframeset.html

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