6219_Rules

It would not surprise me in the least that Mercedes Benz would build such a car. In fact, the European Super cars were incredible pieces of engineering. I know a little about this, and it stretched into the mass market through Mercedes, and Citroen. The 1950s Citroen highend models were amazing for their time in design, ergonomics and efficiency. My personal favorite is the Mercedes Benz 600 series Limo... air ride (problematic and finicky as the Cadillac's), luxury, power and efficiency, and style. But... that is not American. So here is a question for you: if the overthetop cars of the 1930s gave way to the more mainstream, mass produced cars, then which of the new post-war cars at the top of the market was the quietest, best riding cars? Consider style and interior appointments too. I suspect it will be Packard with their significantly better suspension but let's see what the experts say. And how do these cars measure up at least in engineering to the Super car of the 30s? Discuss. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

PH, see my above post for the email address. I can post here if others would like to see them. I will not argue the engineering with you on the Toyota. Clearly the engineering is sophisticated and provides the comfort and performance most desire. But I would not take any modern car over the greats, or even the so-sos of the past within the modern automobile definition. My Father is convinced that driving across the desert in my 1956 Cadillac sedan would be unbearable. But I disagree... uncomfortable, most definitely (hope she doesn't boil over), however the superior air flow makes the car completely comfortable at speeds. I would not do it in a 1950 Buick Roadmaster, with all due respects to my Buick friends, because that beast was an oven. The Cadillac is a completely different experience. And, there are no computers or RTFI chips so Big Brother can pin point you at any turn. I like reading maps, taking chances on being wrong on a route, and being surprised by what comes around the corner. I drive as defensively, and accurately, as possible to provide the most safety for myself and others, thinking of other drivers first. I love to drive, and I would take a car from the 1940s to 1970 any day over the current crop of plastic computerized jelly beans. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> I know... a curmudgeon.

Did anyone happen to see this car? It was lovingly restored with all the optional stuff, but I was wondering what the red rings that were around the base of the hubcaps were for, as did the commentator? I noticed too that they mentioned the dip stick but not the toe lever inside the car for the 2 gallon reserve tank. And since when was there an AM/FM radio on a 1959 VW?? Was that an option? Was FM available then? The only thing the car was missing was the Blumenvase. Very German. Ours had one... it sported fresh flowers until the late 60s when it started leaking, so we used plastic (yuck) blooms. I miss that touch. The modern VW has it though. Its nice to see again. I miss those little touches.

I would also like to see pictures of your cars, Peter and Brad. All of your old Classics! I can only imagine what it must be like to drive or ride in such illustrious examples of the Industrial Arts from the Past. So please do post a few. That would be very nice. Thank you! <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" /> Or send them to me! (greedy) <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> randallmcgrew@yahoo.com That would be even <span style="font-style: italic">more</span> appreciated!! LOL

hi Peter! Glad to see you are still here. I am having fun with you... actually I like English and believe it actually <span style="font-style: italic">means</span> something when used appropriately. So I do not believe that double negatives are any more legitimate than dangling participles just because people have become lazy or too modern to care. Perhaps that is redundant. At any rate, I was interested because in 1936 George Trendle and Fran Stryker, the creators of the Lone Ranger, developed a later family member in Brit Reed, the Green Hornet. Since I have a fascination for pulp fiction, I wanted to know what Black Beauty was supposed to be. In 1966 it was a Chrysler Imperial LeBaron sedan, stretched a bit to open up the back though not enough to be defined as a limosene. While that car is loaded with gadgets, the 1936 car was simply large, powerful and silent. Initially I liked the 1933 Pierce-Arrow Silver Arrow sedan, but that really would not fit. Of course, it would be fine since it is not real. Still in 1936 the choices are the Cadillac, Packard, and possibly a Lincoln. I thought it would have been a V-12 or V-16. That is why I asked this question. I am doing OK. We have decided to move me in with my ex, which is very generous, to share an enormous house. I am not well. The diabetes suddenly took off. No one ever mentioned that it would be painful, but it is. Very painful throughout the body. So this move is looking like it is a good thing for all of us. I can watch the house and animals while Pat is on work trips, and have a place within shot of a good hospital. But I still love building models. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> The more my hands hurt and shake, the more I work at them, researching the object, car, plane, ship... so that I can make it as accurate as possible to scale. It is like meditation, and very Zen. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I am glad you still have the Packard. That is a gorgeous car. I have a 1956 Cadillac sedan (6219) and love it. Great car... a great drive and better ride. What's not to like? <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Excellent analysis, Pete, as usual. Uh... does that mean that the Packard was or was not quieter than this marvelous Cadillac? I kind of got lost in all of the condoscention and sarcasm oozing out between the lines. Seriously, which is it? And how do they compare to the K series Lincolns or any other of the major luxury models out at the time? Hmmmmmmmm? <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

This is a reply I received from a friend up in Canada. I thought it would make for good reading and add to the discussion, such as it is at the moment. <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Many of the luxury makes had passed Pierce Arrow in technology by 1936, Cadillac was the de-facto leader in technology by then, the others just trying to catch up. Packard was perhaps close in some areas having multi-cylinder engines. Their Twin Six was a marvel of engineering. Absolutely silent and supremely powerful, but the Cadillac V-16 overshadowed it in most every respect. It was a technological marvel, 1936 being the last year for the original OHV V-16. The Chrysler Imperial was in many ways a very advanced car. Especially in the Airflow variations, but the solid axles and L-head straight 8 could bot compare to that of the V-12's from Packard, Cadillac, Lincoln or Pierce Arrow. The Duesenburg was a very differant animal. The engine was pretty much a high strung race engine. It was very powerful, yes (now they are beginning to admit that even the mighty SJ was over rated) but tended to be pernickity and a bit noisy owing to it's DOHC and mechanical tappet design. But these cars were built in very limited numbers and really could not be considered a real competitior in the luxury class. At $8500 for the bare chassis alone, it put the car completely out of even what could be considered the mainstream luxury market. And even when the last one was built in 1936, the chassis was becoming quite dated. Cadillac had, in 1936, a wide range of engines to choose from. A new V-8 of 322 or 354 CID design that was state of the art. They had the OHV V-12 and V-16's that were still regarded as one of the most advanced engines of the time. The V-16 was perhaps the most powerful engine available in the land owing to Cadillac's tradition of under rating their outputs. They pioneered independent front suspension in 1934, the turret top the same year. The styling was the most advanced thanks to Harley Earle and his young protoge Bill Mitchell. In the mid 60's, I think they were looking for a car that could be modified and made to look unique. I suppose the Cadillac was out because it was comparitively common. The Imperial was a unique and fresh design and it was also a very high quality car. These Imperials, had they sold in greater quantities, could have been recognised as the leader in the luxury field. They just reeked of quality. They were so meticulously put together and the quality control inspections ensured that these cars were delivered void of any flaws. Chrysler really sweated over these cars. Even if you have the oppourtunity to drive one today, you will feel the quality and soundness of the cars. </div></div> Mike Jones FYI: There is an obvious bias as Mike is an expert in Cadillacs, and a life long mechanic with many, many years as a GM Cadillac mechanic.

In 1998, September 8th, a car or SUV, waiting to turn on green on Pearl Street in Boulder, decided for some daft reason beyond my comprehension or anyone elses, to abruptly turn left in front of my 3/4 ton diesel traveling 45 mph in the left lane. He totalled my truck spinning it 360 degrees, and tearing his own vehicle in half or something.. I do not recall. Neveer saw it. He was a bloody mess. I was bruised, battered and mucked up. I wore my belts and did all the right things. He got the ticket, and I got my life shortened by an estimated 20 years. I guess that is a fair trade.

What was the most silent running of the Greats? Cadillac V-12 K series Lincoln V-12 Packard V-12 Duesenberg J Series Pierce-Arrow V-12 Thank you for your input... please give reasons and any technical data you may know about these cars. I am working on a project and it involves America's best luxury models of the 1930s. Am I correct in believing that Walter Chrysler never made a V-12 Imperial?

Hey Matt! Like most things, this is a case of taste (or lack of) for most people. I saw a 1960 VW with wide whites and it was <span style="font-weight: bold">cute</span> ! And I like that Phord Pickup with the white walls! Its well restored and painted, and looks really nice. Not as a manure hauller but a town truck. I agree that the special cars like the Duesenberg and Packards look better in black walls, but I never liked Cadillacs in black walls except for the War years because that is how they were delivered. Cadillacs are supposed to have a little flash. I will say, less is better. Every car seen suited up in wide whites deminishes the impact but like most popular additions it happens. I guess seeing everyone in spats would be a shock and bore too. LOL <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> And that picture was just not right. It probably extended my therapy another 5 years, thank you very much. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" /> Uh oh,... TG, you just used the "C" word!!! Duck and cover!!! <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Simple, Mr. H. Do as I do not as I say. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Hi Steve! Dass ist ein schones Photograpiert, und Die Bloomenvase ausgezeichnet ist. Or something... our VW had rubber-like-leather looking stuff, in a very pale grey. It stood up to a lot of abuse. And there was a rough berber like carpet in dark grey. He had a Bloomenvase too, as any self respecting VW would have. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

I do not know... we bought the car in Hamburg in 1960 and imported it to America on the USS Rotterdam. You are right, the VWs made for the US market may only have come in those colors. I really do not know how that worked in Germany. Our little car had no radio, and the floor switch for an emergency gas tank when the main tank runs dry. No gas gauge. LOL I love it. It was a fantastic car. I really miss it.

Now that is a lovely Beetle!! Sadly ours was lost in 1976 due to the entire undercarriage and body. After I left for college, they sold it to a kid who wanted to make a dune buggy. It was a real loss for me. Especially after I found out how easy it is to find parts for them. Ours was black with light grey interior with white highlights. No sun roof. By the time the car was sold that black paint looked more like an oil slick ... purple, green, blue and black but in a mix... now you pay big bucks to get a paint job where the paint shimmers in different colors!

Thanks, Steve. I will check it out!

I love that Isetta! My friend wants to know how they were brought into the country legally. Now that would be a perfect little run around for the city. There are so many fun little cars like this to see. Athough I like the Mercury Turnpike Cruiser with its LOOOONNNGGGG Continental kit. Too cool. I have a big cruiser for highway fun, now might be a good time to find a tiny car for intown? <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

The 1960 VW Beetle was one of the best cars my family ever owned, and the longest lived. Over 15 years of excellent service, both in town and cross country. Between two engines and numerous fixes due to my brother's teenage adventures, that little car had well over 400,000 miles on it and many more wonderful memories. Somehow we were smart enough to work around the mechanical issues without Mr. Nader's input. Henry was just jealous.

AWWWW Yeah a Messerschmidt. That is adorable. And in New Hope, no less... I used to hang out there and at the flea market outside New Hope way back in the 1970s. Great cars... and great memories. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

I have a fascination with the little Isetta, whether the BMW version, or Italien, and I want to know what the availablility and price ranges on this car. Also just to talk about them. I have fond memories of the Isetta, Messerschmitt and VWs from living in Vienna in 1960. In fact, we brought home a little black VW in 1961. Hope to hear from someone soon!

Around 1946, my Uncle came home from the Pacific and pulled the 1936 Ford coupe w/ rumble seat, out of the garage, cleaned it up and headed out to drive it. When cleaning it, he realized the tires were too worn out and went to see if he could get white walls for it. No deal. GrandDad could have told him that... he had black walls on all his cars. WWs were too picky... you had to bleach and clean and scrup to get them to look good. Not something my Grandfather would be caught dead doing. As it turned out, WW's were not available but you could get new BWs with a white applique to make them WWs. He bought the tires and the appliques and headed home. Washed the car, polished it to a fair thee well and then, after carefully drying the tires, applied the appliques. It was a long, painful process but eventually worked. The problem arose when they got very dirty and then started to peel. He would glue them on and white wash them, whatever it took... cause that little honey and its blown out flathead V-8 was going to have WWs. 1936 Ford coupe w/ rumble seat. Rare 1936 Ford coupe w/ rumble seat and black wall tires w/ white appliques - classic. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Good point, Pete. My current 1956 Cadillac sedan cost a little more than that for a #3 driver. And it certainly is not in the same universe, let alone category, as a Deusenberg. And that was what my car was worth in the 1960s... about $150. But heck, it got you a nice Cadillac of an older style to use. I see younger people, and some older, running around town in 1984 Cadillac DeVilles that look nice and seem to serve them well. Older luxury cars make good drivers. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

Well heck, I always liked Box Car Willie!! If you have a great name, like Randy, hell... flaunt it!!! I may be biased though. <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

What about Box Car Willie? <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

I got it to work, JT, by cutting and pasting it into the search address line of a new tab/window in the browser. Interesting article. However, if you use the INSTANT UBB CODE URL you can paste or type the address there, label it, and it will appear in the text as a hyperlink rather than just text. Just an FYI for ya! Cheers!

Congratulations, Laurynas, on your new acquisition! She is definitely a beauty! I hope you have as much fun with her as I have with my bottom end '56 Cadillac sedan. It is a real joy to drive these wonderful beasts reassured that their simplicity and quality has brought you a fine, quality sedan with unique looks and legandary inheritance of engineering! Actually I have both 6219s, one that is basic, the other the top of the line with A/C, power windows and seat, and to be honest, I like the basic one best. Good luck! And yes, more pictures!! <img src="http://forums.aaca.org/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />