Ron Green

If you are going to mix and match different chrome parts just remember that the chrome on the reproduction parts is usually a slighty different shade and may look a little different then the platers which is generally the better chroming process. <P>There is a reason that the plater costs more and it depends on what you can live with and <BR>at what level you are going to show the vehicle if at all.

I will also be at the Trade Show however I maybe able to help Friday from 9 to 10 AM and after lunch from 12:15 to 2 PM. Its not much but it is all I have!

Yesterday I spoke with one of Gene Zimmerman's mechanics who did a lot of his restorations. He started his own restoration business years ago with his sons and in fact will be at the AACA Trade Show in a few weeks. He is around 80 years old and the following is his story as told by his son who is a good friend of mine:<P>The collection was auctioned off in the mid 70's, with all vehicles and building contents sold at no reserve. Many of the cars went for a fraction of there worth. Many were very rare and some (very few) were made to appear rare.<P>Gene Zimmerman had a serious health problem that was thought to be life threating. At that time he gave his son power of attorney over all assets. The son had some money problems including back taxes and also did not get along with his father all that much. The son is the one who auctioned off the collection and kept most of the money. Gene got better, lived and moved to Florida.

The museum in question was Gene Zimmerman's Automobile-A-Rama. It was about 3 miles from my house. It was located off route 11 and 15 and was also a hotel.<P>From my understanding Gene fought for years trying to get a liquor license for the place however it was and still is a dry township. The collection was sold in the late 70's or real early 80's when Gene moved to Florida.<P>The hotel rooms were torn down about a year ago however the main building (3 floors)which housed the collection was just turned into a architects office. Story has it that many of the vehicles were in fact rare however there were also some that were made or pieced together to appear rare?

Maybe the term rotting away was a little strong however these vehichles are slowly falling into a state of disrepair. Some may not have been started for 50 + years? The interiors on some are getting rough.<P> The states archieve building which houses them when not displayed does not have 100% conditioned air on all floors and these vehicles may be stored there for years at a time.<P>The LuLu I believe had 4 wheels. Is this really a cycle car?

Just came back from looking at a project at the Pennsylvania State Museum in Harrisburg. Have lived close by all my life but never went. <P>As we all know most vehicles in a museum are not taken care of all that well. On the 3rd floor I stumbled on to the following:<P>1. 1905 Autocar<BR>2. 1912 Brewster<BR>3. 1913 LuLu made by Charles Kearn from PA.<BR>4. 1909 Model 1 Surrey High Wheeler with a <BR> Zimmerman motor<P>I am not all that familar with these older cars without looking them up in my books. I am wondering if any are semi rare. They are slowly rotting away. And I swear the 1913 had LuLu marked on it!!!!

I will be there Friday including the lunch. <P>I read yesterday in Old Car's Weekly that on Friday at 10:00 AM there will be a AACA presentation by the apprasial company on the Harold LeMay auto collection. It is about how they went about appraising it after his death. Interesting stuff such as the 53 buildings it took to house the collection of over 3000 cars of which his son and wife are still adding to.<P>Where is a list available showing the type and time of the seminars? I though last year they were with the registration but not this year,unless I missed them?

Either Harry Samuels who leans towards Pontiacs or Jenkins who is a Buick guy are excellent choices if you are looking for a factory appearance or any future judging.

OUR51SUPER, I really don't care for the battery thing either. They are nice when you park your car when you are done driving it or storing it for the winter however they can be a pain if using for security reasons if you are making a lot of stops and leaving the car while out running around. You will put a lot of wear on your hood hinges opening and closing it all the time.<P>The switch in the glove box will work ok but I would think a thief would have a few tools and one of the areas of the vehicle that would interest them might be the glove box?

Cammam, go ahead and switch to synthetic oil. It does not matter that you have been using a regular oil. There is a reason that some of the vehicle manufactures are switching to synthetic oils such as the Corvette, etc. Do you think for one minute that GM would spent a extra million dollars (50,000 cars x $20 for synthetic) if they didn't think it was necessary or worth it?

As stated above my comments are only my opinion however that opinion was based on the oil seminar I attended at last years AACA Annual Meeting of which was very interesting and presented by a very knowledgeable guy.<P>He stated that non synthetic oils will leave a brown residue under your valve covers and in your oil pan due to the fact that this was the by product of the refining process that takes place with regular oil. I have also seen this first hand on old motors. Is this a good thing? He claimed that he tore a motor apart that had 160,000 miles with 10,000 mile synthetic oil changes and the motor was factory clean. The use of a synthetic verus a regular oil should be a no brainer, again only my opinion.<P>You will get many different opinions on this subject however it has always been hard for me to understand why someone will spend thousands of dollars on a vehicles restoration and short cut the use of a synthetic oil that is proven to be better all for saving $20?

Synthetic oil in my opinion is far better then regular oil in many ways. The heat and cold have no effect on it and during engine start-up there is less wear as it clings more to the metal and has more slip to it. I have heard that 90% of your engine wear is caused at start-up and warming up the engine.<P>If you ever take the valve covers off a engine that has been run on regular oil you will see brown residue that is the crap that is not refined when regular oil is made. No such thing with synthetic oils.<P>I have used synthetic oils with both old and new cars for years with excellent results even with a 46 year old engine that has never been apart yet and a daily driver that is 16 years old with 130,000 miles. The valve covers underneath look like they left the factory yesterday. Also forget the old wives tale that changing to a synthetic oil will cause your motor to leak. The current synthetic oils have a small amount of a swelling agent in it that will prevent leakage unlike when it first hit the market. And no I don't work for a oil company.

SBRMD I guess everybody now knows our secret!<BR>It is a good spot.

Sounds like a excellent and logical idea that is long over due.

Excellent reading and viewing!!!!!!!!

Deering, You are correct in the fact that the goal for a lot of cars in the POCI points judge show will be the modified class if they elect not to change the data plates. This will include your AACA Grand National Senior and National Award winners if a factory color does not match the data plate.<P>Dynaflash, There are many odd and ugly factory colors that were available from all the manufactures. Many of these may be lost in history if the owners elect to point judge there vehicles in the POCI annual national show as more of the common colors were produced and are around today. We have all been drawn to a car that had a oddball paint job. It would be boring if all the vehicles would be the blacks, reds, whites, etc.<P>Dave Moon, Pontiac Historical Services provides ($35)information, build sheets, etc on Pontiac years 61 thru 85. Prior to 61 all records are lost due to a fire I believe? As you know changing data plates on these years will really mess up the cars history forever. You mentioned the GTO's, there are probably more GTO's on the road today then were manufactured.<P>The AACA has a relaxed and fun atmosphere at there shows that is hard to beat. I am glad I became a member. The AACA can only gain from bone headed decisions made by other clubs as the members get fed up with the few making the rules.

Congrats on making the calender. I know they are hard to make it on. My car was slected after 3 years for the month of August 2002 Old Car's Weekly annual calender out of over 300 entrys.

You are right Ted, however it is my understanding that budgets are set in regards to construction projects and new products. Some projects or new buildings may wait a few years until construction can start due to the yearly budgets. At least that is what I have been told and witnessed.

Sal, this is a real ugly battle here. Me and the company I work for have had various projects on campus for many years. I believe many years ago they made the kids stop milking the cows and doing the farm work as it was to much work (up early?) they claimed and not fair to the kids? Milton would roll over if he knew the farms for the most part are closed.<P>The Alumni is against just about everything. The campus has not had any major upgrades for 25 years, so 5 years ago they started spending some of the 5 billion dollars that the Hershey Trust has on new schools, houses, librarys, etc. This really tripped there trigger.<P>Hershey Foods and HERCO are given a budget each year and there profits are put in the Hershey Trust for the school to spend. The problem being that there is more money and interest that can be spent. Milton had it set up that the money can only be spent for the kids, perioid. <P>The Alumni wants to make the enrollment larger and take in all kids regardless of behavior, intelligence, etc. This would also make old Milton roll over.<P>They are trying to control all this money with rules that no longer apply to todays world and the rules can not be changed. <P>I learned not to take sides in this ugly battle however I was in the Alumni offices one day to see that they had Hersheys largest competitors snicker bars in the candy dish in lieu of some Hershey candies. This is going a little to far! <P>My 2 cents.

hvs, I agree with you and did clarify about the AACA ruling. If a guy wants to paint his vehicle a factory white color for the model year in lieu of the blue on the data plate I believe it is not a AACA deduction, which is good. When the car is sold the new owner can change it back to the factory data plate colors.<P>One car was painted a pink and had a paint=special data plate installed. The pink color was not even a manufactures color. Granted it would stick out on a model T or A and many of the older cars however it would probably slip by for a 50's or 60's vehicle. <P>POCI uses a 400 point system that is semi close to the AACA. One of my suggestions that fell on deaf ears was to put a vote to the members to first let them know of these rule changes and second of all do they think that changing data plates, colors, etc should be done. Opinions and views by the members can only help. I am sure many would be aganist changing a data plate however with only a few making the rules change comes slow.<P>One of the main reasons for starting this thread was that I felt it was important to make the AACA aware of this information and also let our members see how other clubs do things right or wrong. In this case wrong! <P>As they say common sense is un-common

Just to clarify. I know the AACA does not deduct for a factory color available for the model year. Novaman what is to stop someone from changing the vin numbers if they know it is ok to change the data plate? It would be a cheap way to make a Tempest a GTO and double your investment.

I thought I would start a new thread rather then add this to the matching numbers thread. The purpose is to show different judging methods between clubs and here your opinions. The Pontiac Oakland Club International Club (POCI) has one national show a year and is made up of mostly volunteer judges for this event. In the past few years some major rules are now being enforced as per my conversation with the chief judge. For those of you who complain about the AACA judging, read on:<P>If your vehicles color (not shade)does not match your data plate even though it was a factory color for that model year you will be deducted 10 to 30 points depending if it is a single, two tone or tri-color. To avoid these deductions it is recommended that a new data plate be installed to match the colors of your vehicle. If non factory colors then the data plate should read paint=special. No deductions. It seems to me that a non factory data plate with false information will allow the vehicles history to be lost for future generations? <P>Pontiac along with other makes had many different color combinations that are rare (odd) and most may also be lost in history. Many of the surviving vehicles are the more common red, blues, whites, greens,etc as more of these colors were produced and are still around.<P>A 10 point deduction will also be taken from the interior as most matched the exterior color combinations. The trim codes will also need changed with a reproduction data plate.<P>They are thinking of making it the judges (volunteer)call regarding the colors on the amount of points to deduct for a wrong non matching data plate factory color if the false data plate is not used. The POCI will provide you at the end of the show a copy of your score sheet. I can see a couple of friends comparing sheets with a different amount of deductions for each having wrong factory colors via the data plate. Does this mean that a red color will get less deductions then a or equal vehicle painted a driftwood, salmon, etc? <P>I know the AACA does not deduct for non factory colors for the model year, what do other clubs do? Am I out of line here thinking a non factory data plate with false information is wrong? Are we not just the temporary keeper of these vehicles for future generations?

Typically a clicking voltage regulator is the sign the battery is weak or almost dead. Check for the proper size of all cables, good and clean connections and most of all do a cell check on your battery. All the cells should read very close to each other. If one or two are somewhat lower the battery is shot. I believe a fully charged battery should read no lower then 12 volts when standing or around 13.5 when the generator is charging it. Check your manual. Adjust the voltage regulator if necessary.<P>I don't know about anyone else but the reproduction old style batterys only seem to last 3 to 4 years.

Hand cranking isn't a problem for Hulk Hogan, the Bionic Man or the Incrediable Hulk however for a older gentlemen that dosen't weigh 300 plus pounds and may of have had some health problems it is. <P>Register if you want to spout off!

I have had excellent results using a product call Calyx (513-923-1154). You see it advertised in many car magazines. It is like a paste that you can apply with your fingers or a toothbrush after bead blasting your manifolds. The color looks factory. After you apply it you have a few months until you have to start up the engine to heat up the manfolds and cure it. It will last a couple of years with little wear and then all it takes is a few minutes to re-apply it and you are set for a few more years.