o2zoom
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Posts posted by o2zoom
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Update
Hypothesis of how rear drum lug studs are anchored. On the back view of the rear drum hub you can see where the stud that has two dogs goes in. The dogs keep the stud from possibly rotating. On the out board side you can see there is a beveled dish. I believe the studs are pre-formed with the back side mushroomed with the dogs and the front side just below the threads is a thickened area that when pressed into the drum hub forms a mashed wedge that fills the beveled dish on the front side of the drum hub. What basically happens is the lug is riveted to the drum hub. I had to drill the threaded lug stud out and then take a dremmel tool and cut away the portion of the stud that was mashed into the bevel. What I found was that the stud could be drilled but the mashed portion in the bevel was extremely hard and would not drill. Ruined a couple of bits before resorting to the dremmel tool. These studs could have quite possibly be put in hot like a rivet and then pressed into place. They can be replaced but it’s not the easiest task. Remnant of the studs shows how it is sandwiched like a rivet.
The earlier picture showing the studs welded was from an earlier owners repair. Stock lugs have the large mushroom head on the in board side.
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Recently purchased a 1932 Buick. Before I picked up the car I bought the 1932 Manual. When I got into the trunk of the car there was a manual. So if anyone needs a new unused reprint I have one. Think I paid $29 plus shipping. I can send it media mail. If I can get $22 I'd be happy.
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Looking for some advice on rear brake drum lug nut studs. I have a broken stud and one that is stripped. I see where someone had replaced the studs on the one side. Not too pretty looking but works. What I can’t figure out is how these things are anchored. I don’t think they’re pressed on in the usual manner. I found one stud that is slightly loose. When I rotate it the entire thing moves, including what looks like the big flat end inside of the drum. When I cleaned up the one broken stud the part that looks like a washer is actually part of the stud assembly and rotates on the one loose stud. I don’t want to ruin the drum if at all possible. I am more tempted to drill it out as opposed to trying to press it out. Has anyone faced this problem and come up with the solution or knows how these things are anchored in the drum? Thanks
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I did just that. Made one out of aluminum but could use stainless for a forever fix.
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Update. Steering gear was assembled and adjusted on the bench. Cornhead grease was added and then clearances again checked. Unit was re-installed in the car and I did a static test. No more binding and all seems good rotating from lock to lock. Continuing with other work so will road test when finish.
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Yes typo. Bushing at 1.128.
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Here was the problem. Never under estimate the problem of previous shoddy workmanship. I guess this person never learned the basics of how to make a proper gasket, they just cement things together with RTV.
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Revisiting this old thread for any other additional input. I have removed the 3 bolts from the generator. The bottom bolt is loose but will not clear the bottom radiator cast flange. I don't believe this should be a problem since the bolt is far enough back to have completely disengaged the generator. Removed the water pump and distributor for safety. I can with prying the generator feel a little movement and also hear and see the output shaft to the water pump move some. Other than that the generator will not separate from the front motor mount housing. I have pried pretty hard but don't want to damage anything. I tried rotating the out put shaft from the generator while prying but no luck. Can I cause damage by getting aggressive with prying? I know the out put shaft has to be rotated once the generator starts to separate from its mounting. Any suggestions??? or just get a bigger hammer.....
Thanks,
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Looks good to me. Shaft mic at 1.125 at + and - 90 degrees bushings at 1.122. So about .003 clearance. With heat expansion should be OK in my judgement.
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Steering update. With the gracious help of mentor Bob I’m ready to start the rebuilding of my gear box. All the components have been cleaned so will make the gasket for the box to flange and one for the sector shaft. Waiting on John Deer corn-head grease. Once that arrives I’ll assemble and dial in the proper settings.
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Figured out what the mystery item was. It was part of the tensioning for the throttle shaft at the end of the steering column. There is a spring and two end pieces that ride in the bore of the cast piece. When I removed it one of the end pieces fell out. Lucky to have found it on the floor. I didn't realize what it was until I was cleaning up the parts I had removed earlier. Thanks for you suggestion on what it was.
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It did have a zirk fitting in the gear box. From what I can tell the zirk was also bad. Worm gear is it awful shape. I did get the locating brass pieces out. There was only one located in the center of the tube and then there was some sort of composite bushing located at the top of the shaft tube. I looked very carefully and did not find any other locating brass. From looking at the tube I could see where the one brass locator rides and could see where the upper bushing rode. I didn't see any more wear spots on the throttle tube.
Another item under review.
When I had the car running some times I could hear the pinion on the starter dinging once in awhile on the flywheel. Pulled the starter to inspect it and found that the return spring located on the starter engaging cross shaft is broken. So the starter drive was not being fully retracted. Another parts quest to find a spring that will work.
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Bob,
Sent a PM. Trust I did it correctly.
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Bob,
I found the allen head set screws you mentioned. Got the gear box out last night and disassembled today. I think everything you had pictured from your so called junk pile is better than what I’ve got. The sector has pitting and wear but still might be able to be used. Bushings in the box looked good. Timken taper bearings have some pitting but I think they could be used. The worm gear looks pretty poor. Lots of pitting. I think this was the source of the binding and extremely hard/rough steering. Take a look at the pics. What are your plans for the gear box parts you have? I wonder if something could be put together that is better than what I’m looking at that might be usable? I’m planning on going over to my buddy who has a press and see how hard it is to get the worm gear off of the steering shaft.
After a little study came up with a way to remove the cone piece from the steering column that worked like a charm. Might not be the most acceptable way for some but made short work of the task. Happy to share the idea.
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Pete,
Yes I think that's it. Is the other side a 3 bolt pattern? Thanks for checking on the steering box.
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Bob,
The tubes look to be in perfect shape. The problem is the riser casting itself. It's cracked in a couple of places. When I get back home in a couple of days I'll post a picture. Results in basically a huge vacuum leak. Doubt it can be repaired. Maybe someone replaced the tubes and cracked the housing doing it.
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Steering update. Started the removal of the gearbox. Removal of the splash panel was fun since none of the nuts are captured and holding them is a little difficult while trying to loosen the old slotted screws. I don’t think the panel had ever been removed before. Removed the Wizard control valve and linkages, carb and riser along with exhaust piping for access. Found that the carburetor riser is badly cracked in two places. The diverter off of the exhaust manifold and heat transfer tube all in pretty poor shape. Might be time to think about a down draft mod. Will have to start a new topic on that one. Once the area was cleared of the obstructions I followed Bob’s removal formula. Carefully removed the light switch and throttle pieces. The light control tube was removed without any difficulty. The throttle tube was a bit of a problem. It would only extract about 3 inches before becoming stuck. I kept working it back and fourth applying some WD40 from up top and letting it work its way down. It became evident that a shellac like coating had built up, might even have been some rusting. In any event after a lot of coaxing it came out. The problem now is none of the little centralizers came out with the tube. So they are still in the steering shaft and probably contributed to the removal problem. I’ll have to deal with that once I get the shaft and gear box out. The pitman arm took some persuading with a large pickle fork but came off after a few blows with a trusty 3 pounder. Will tackle the steering wheel removal and final push in a couple of days. In the course of cleaning up under the car I found an interesting little piece. Not sure if it is something that had been lurking on the frame for years and just now fell off or if is part of something from the column. It’s non metallic, about 3/16” in diameter and maybe 3/8” long. Any ideas on what it is?
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Spent the better part of the day doing a few more adjustments and took some readings. Caster was right at 2 degrees. Camber was 1 ½ degrees. So those are in line with specifications in the manual. Measured the toe. Looks like someone else tried to cure the wobble by increasing the toe in. However I would say a little overboard, it was ¾ inch toed in. Reset to ¼ inch. End result was no improvement. Even after backing off lash adjustments for testing purposes seems like gear box is still binding and makes it very hard to steer.
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Answered part of my own questions. Looks like it's a Saginaw box.
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Bob,
You responses have been admirably succinct. Without the information and guidance you’ve provided I’d be up against the wall with a blindfold. I made several adjustments today without any meaningful progress; each test drive resulted with the same “death wobble” at the slightest provocation. I don’t believe there is any option but to pull the steering assembly and inspect the internals. I’ve been doing some research on various components and history of steering gear boxes. It seems that Gemmer was an early manufacturer of gear boxes primarily for Ford. They may have held the patent on this type of worm and sector design. I am assuming that GM boxes were made by Saginaw. I wonder if they were a knock off and if they paid a royalty for using the Gemmer design? The spec book says the 50 series gear boxes are a 17:1 ratio. Is there a reference to the Buick boxes being Saginaws? I also see some early ford boxes are also 17:1 ratios. Coincidence? Or was the Saginaw box a hybrid. I am resigned to start the removal of my steering assembly. I’ll review your previous instructions on the process and get ready to gut it up. I pretty sure I’ll find that there is pretty severe ware in the worm and sector. The saga continues.
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Bob,
Forgot to ask if you would measure the sector shaft diameter as well?
Thanks,
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Thanks Bob. Odd there was no part number for the sector. Could you do me another favor and measure the worm gear length and the steering shaft diameter? Would help in seeing if I can get another GM piece to adapt.
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Bob,
Unfortunately I'm on the other end of the country north of San Diego.
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Good pictures explain a lot. Do you happen to have the part numbers for the sector and the steering shaft? I see the Ford guys can get an after market replacement:
1931 Dual Point Timing- Advice?
in Buick - Pre War
Posted
Just finished reviewing all of the great information and input on the dual point distributor timing. I'm in the process of re-ringing my 32 - 50 series and replacing the cracked head courtesy of a long time member who assisted me with a replacement. Prior to starting the engine work I had gone thought the timing procedure as outlined in this thread. I always wondered if I had gotten things just right in the process. I came across a distributor from a 1933 50 series. This distributor physically is the same with the exception it is a single point unit with an 8 lobe cam. So in theory I think I was able to do away with the syncing of the second set of points. I just set the single set to the initial #1 advance mark on the flywheel and was done. I had had a 1935 40 Series and it had a single point unit and it always worked well, didn't see why the same wouldn't be true for a 32. Car seems to run as good or maybe better than when I was running the dual point unit. Not sure this would be proper etiquette for one wanting a number matching car but for a driver like mine it seems to work. Until I came across this 33 unit I often wondered if the four lobe cam could be changed to an 8 lobe and just use a single set of points in an original correct housing for a 32. This might be a little off the topic but thought I would throw it out for comment anyways.