ryan95
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Posts posted by ryan95
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Hi Norm, it's been coming along slowly. Since there was so much rot on the original woodwork, many of my measurements to make the new pieces have about an 1/8 inch margin that they are off. It makes everything take a little bit more time to get it all to work nicely together. The wood has to match up well with the metal or else there are gaps or spots that the metal just won't fit. One of the pieces I tackled is a piece that goes between the fender and the door jamb. I have one made and need to start the other. Originally it must have been stamped, but I made it out of a couple pieces welded together to get around that. The next pieces that I have been working on are the large panels that make up the sides of the tub. I am using the originals for them. After lots of careful sanding on the wood, I was able to get them to fit okay. I still need to weld more material on the edges in some areas so that the flanges for the nails will work well. The big piece that I have yet to make is the rear panel. I still need more practice on my English wheel to get it right. It will also be a two person job since it is so large. I'll be seeing a couple other Moons this week at our club's annual meet. It should energize me to get busy on the body work again. I'll get you and the others some pictures of the tub progress when I'm back home from this trip.
Ryan
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I hope the best for him. If none are known of by the club president, or the members with other Dianas, his best bet is probably to make fenders based off of a surviving set on another car rather than wait for a set to surface. It might be beneficial to look into taking a metal shaping class that way he can learn the techniques and use the machines that are required without having to buy all of the machines just for that one job. Wray Schelin comes to mind.
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Assuming one of you is in the Moon club, look up Ron Moon in the club directory. He has a lot of knowledge about Moon and Diana cars. If your friend isn't involved with the Moon club, I highly recommend looking into it. The members have been a great help for the restoration I am working on.
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I think it is usually garnet.
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Their website says DXF, DWG, EPS, or AI file. I use DXF files. I think STEP is a 3D file type, which isn't what you would want for laser or water jet.
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If you have spark, and you are confident that the timing is at least close, then I would verify things elsewhere. Did it run fine before changing ignition parts, or is this after reassembly or other engine parts at the same time? A broader picture of the engine's situation would be helpful to know.
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I use sendcutsend.com for laser cutting. You can order just one part if thats all you need. I use them here and there for hard to find or custom pieces of metal or plastic that I need made. I checked the price for a similar part I already have drawn up. It would run you about $30 in mild steel or about $70 in stainless. If you already have the tools to do it by hand, that would take about the same amount of time and be cheaper. If you have to buy a jigsaw, blades, bits, countersinks, and files, it isn't worth it to do by hand unless you plan on using the tools for other future jobs. There are also free options to get into CAD work, such as Tinkercad or FreeCAD. FreeCAD is what I use. I am a novice, but making 2D drawings only took me a couple hours to learn, and I have used it multiple times over the past couple years.
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I can hardly believe it's been a month since my last update. I have been working on the tub here and there for a couple hours at a time. When I make another big step on that, I'll update more on it. I made some progress on the primer cups. I have been piecing together a set. I know what the originals looked like from the owners manual, so I knew what to look for. I have found all of them so far on ebay. I couldn't find any correct ones at Hershey. I started out by winning a good set of 3. Then I found number 4 with a long stem, which I cut down and rethreaded. Number 5 had a good body, but wrong handle. Number 6 was another long stem one that I cut down. The hex on it is smaller, so I will keep it in the set for now, but keep watch for one that matches the others. The next success was finding another one on ebay two weeks ago. It looked like the others in the pictures, but the body was significantly larger. I enden up taking the handle from it to complete the number 5 primer cup. The handle brass instead of bronze like the others, but it works for now. At least at this point, they all look pretty similar with exception of the one with the small hex and the other with a brass handle. Eventually better matches will pop up. I have been polishing and tuning them over the past few days.
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Those look very similar to the ones Moon used. In their case, there are three soldered on tabs that both locate the lens and lock into slots on the rim of the bucket. The Moon's bezel twists counterclockwise about 2 inches at the circumference.
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This happened to me with a carburetor once. I ended up drilling both sides of the break for a roll pin and pressed the broken parts back together. Maybe that along with JB would work.
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Maybe next time opt for a pin with a hole in the end for a small cotter pin or other kind of clip. Even with an aluminum casting I would fear snapping the legs off by trying to peen the end. I'm thankful that you're showing what you learn on this as I will be doing the same project here eventually.
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I'll be going through our vacuum tank as well sometime in the next year. These mechanisms are so interesting to me. I had some thoughts for your lid with the cracked inlet. It needs to be a strong repair or your will have a difficult time fighting air leaks and future cracking. Being pot metal, soldering isn't a good solution, as you have probably also decided. JB weld in my experience is great for reinforcement and sealing, but I'd have a hard time trusting it to hold a crack together. Maybe along with the JB, a friction fit collar on the outside would be helpful. I imagine something like a short piece of brass tubing of the right size. There is probably some taper to the casting so that it could come out of the mould. That might aid in a collar tightening up as it's driven on.
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I have enjoyed seeing your work and other's on here too. It takes many talents to build a prewar car. That's probably one of my big reasons I appreciate them. Perhaps further on I will spend some more time on the bezels and polish them up. A part only comes out of a plating bath with a nice surface finish if it went in that way. I've done a little bit of plating before but decided to save it mostly for the parts like the grease cups on the axles, which probably weren't that pretty from the factory. We do have a good shop in our area, Paul's Chrome. They turned our junk gas cap into a piece of art.
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Today's little project I wanted to try was straightening out the damaged headlight bezel. It looks like at some point the car was in a small accident and someone else straightened it out just good enough to fit the bucket. They left lots of hammer marks and stretched the metal. First thing was finding what I could use as a dolly on the inside. The mushroomed end of a couple punches worked well. I did a little bit of heat shrinking and hammering to get it a little closer to how it should be. Next I made a couple cardboard profile gauges based on the undamaged side. The rest of the process was working the damaged part back close to the original profile and sanding it smooth. Maybe an expert could get it better, but it is much better than it started. Fortunately I don't think I will need to get a new one spun. I hope the plating shop will be able to smooth it out some more without taking it back out of shape. All of the trauma has made this part finicky. Even a small tweak makes the opening for the lens look out of round.
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Those are some nice cars Gary, great work. Hearing success stories helps me keep pushing. At times I feel like I am just building an imaginary car that will never be a real one, just like how when I was little our family couch was my pirate ship.
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Since last time I have been working more on the tub. The quarter panels look solid enough. Both needed stripped and de-rusted. The first paint stripper I tried didn't do anything. I bought some Citristrip next, which works, it's just slow. For the rust, I used the rest of my Rust 911 concentrate and a plastic lined plywood box. After about 12 hours for each panel the rust was gone. This morning I worked on welding up and smoothing the original nail holes in the panels and then fixing the distortion. At this point I needed to get the rear fenders out so that I can use them to get the panel placement good enough. I decided to mount the fenders with a couple bolts to see how the car looked. Seeing it like this was a good motivational boost.
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I've been playing with the English wheel for the past few days. I'm close to trying to make the actual panel. The guys on youtube who have been doing it for decades make it look easier to do than it is. This morning I also started separating the panels. That's a chore. Melting out the lead was easy, but dozens of little acetylene tack welds hold it together. I separated the sides from the back and separated the driver side piece from the wheel well. I need to make a decision on the side pieces to save them or remake them. The panel is straight and solid, but the flanges where it gets nailed or welded are beat up and I'm concerned with the flanges cracking when I re-hammer in place. I want to save them to keep some original metal on the car. Hopefully that won't be the harder option.
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The stanchions pass through the bracket underneath and are secured by a flange on the top and a nut on the bottom. I copied how the original was done the best I could. To get both brackets where I wanted them I used the windshield frame to get them both in correct relationship with each other. Then it was centered on the body, screwed directly to the arch, shimmed underneath, and bolted to the horizontal piece underneath. The wooden angle shims were found under the original construction and my assumption is that they allow the casting to fit correctly with minimal machining. Here is a picture without the metal and a picture looking up from below on a complete Moon.
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Thanks Norm, I will try to provide some good detail on it as I make progress. This week's goal is to get a Harbor Freight English wheel and start getting familiar with it. I also need materials to make a wire form for the back panel.
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This morning I transported the tub to my garage from Bob's. This piece might take some time to get done right. It is made of seven pieces. The rear panel is the worst. the bottom third is rusted out. The flat pieces that make the backside of the wheel wells are simple enough to make new ones. The bottom flanges on them are rusty, and would need too much repair work to be worth repairing. The side panels I will try to keep. There are two more pieces for the door jamb that I haven't decided what to do with yet. The first problem that I need to solve is the the rear panel. Since the bottom third is gone, the top flange is in rough shape, and the rest of it has a lot of pitting, I want to remake the panel. It could be fixed by welding in a new piece at the bottom, but that's a big, long weld seam, and I'm not confident in handling all of the heat distortion to get it back to the right shape. The next problem is that it has too much crown to simply bend a new piece of steel in place. I will need to find an english wheel to make the new one. Thanks for the support and interest from you all. Ryan
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Metal work on the cowl is now complete. Since the last update on the cowl, I trimmed and hammered over all of the edges, nailed it down the whole way around, and leaded the seam above the dash. Next step is the rear tub.
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Thank you, I'm not sure how yours goes together, or if it is even Delco. I haven't seen one like that before, so I can't help, but if it is anything like the Delco ones, the whole switch has to come apart to replace the knobs.
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I played with some nickel plating not long ago. The kits look fine, but you can do the same for much less if you have some sort of DC power supply, a nickel anode, and not too many other supplies. Most of the hard work is in the polishing and prep work. I decided to save diy plating for parts that don't need to be that pretty, like hardware or fittings.
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How much backlash is too much for a gear pump? Maybe this is a silly question, but if you have nos gears and the shaft centers are where they are supposed to be, I would think the gears are meshing as they were designed to. I would think that clearance between the gears and the housing would be more important, but I'm not an oil pump expert.
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1923 Moon Restoration Progress Part 2
in Our Cars & Restoration Projects
Posted · Edited by ryan95 (see edit history)
Hello guys, sorry for letting my posting go dead for so long. I struggled to get much work done on the car these past couple years due to some mental health issues and having some other big projects going on. I am excited to say that over the past weeks I have been getting back into the Moon project. I have been working on some small parts, the hood, and the tub. Some of my project paralysis was from needing to figure out how to English wheel a new back panel for the tub. It took me a good bit of research, practice, and failure to finally figure out how to make something that was good enough to use. I'm thankful that it is the only panel with compound curvature that needs made. One hurdle was figuring out how to wheel the panel without a helper on the opposite side. I rigged up a support arm for opposite of me that solved that problem. Most of the process was going back and forth between wheeling, test fitting on the car, bending the panel around on a table with a moving blanket, and rolling the panel over a propane tank. Once the panel had the right shape everywhere, I cut the top and bottom edges to size and hammer formed them to the car. Coming up next, the sides still need trimmed, the panel needs nailed onto the body, it needs welded to the quarter panels, and the seams need filled.