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PMac

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  1. PMac

    Model 20 Axles

    I have two axles for a Model 20. These are the later type with tapered ends, keyways and threads for a securing nut. They are for a standard track car (not Southern track). They are in very good condition with good bevel gears, keyways and threads. I would like to trade these for some parts I am seeking for my 1910 car. Some of the parts I am seeking include: Brass cap for the crankcase breather tubes Front spring-to-axle u-bolt x 1 Spare tire carrier brackets for rear chassis Primer cups for cylinder pots Owners manual for 1910 car My preference is a trade and I am open to other items. Send me a PM if this interests you. Thanks, Peter
  2. PMac

    Hupp 20

    That is a great period picture and the brass radiator is clear. I see it is captioned 1909 although it does have two step tread brackets (vs. the one bracket the 1909 had if my understanding is correct). Could it be a 1910 maybe? Your red color looks good in my opinion and the information and source is helpful. Here is a picture that appears to be a new 1910 in front of a Hupp dealer with a painted radiator. You could be right re the option of a painted or brass radiator. Perhaps also it was a transitionary change? If I zoom in there appears to be the black pinstriping on the hood but it just too hard to be sure due to the reflection off the hood. The beading on the side body rail does appear to be black. Again, zooming in, the black pinstriping on the wheels can be seen. Thanks for sharing this info.
  3. PMac

    Hupp 20

    The last thing I would profess is to have all the answers and I am sorry for you that you feel the need to make a comment like this. What I do know is that with the passage of time and access to new information, often made available by technology (e.g. the internet), our understanding of what was can evolve. I am merely sharing some amateur research that I have done so that others can benefit should they choose to do so. My experience with other similar antique car forums is that sharing information and observations is welcomed and not met with sarcastic comments. It would be great if others would share their information and period pictures of Model 20's so we can learn more on this topic. Please don't be put off by what happened here.
  4. PMac

    Hupp 20

    The last picture came from the 1910 sales brochure and is clearly an artists rendition but, the pinstriping detail the artist has captured is consistent with the other period images of actual cars including that which Bill published in his book (on page 22). If you read my earlier comment re the brass radiator, you will note that I believe that the radiators on 1910 cars were painted red (this also aligns with the advertising materials). On page 22 of Bill's book, the front and top view of the car (the same car in the first picture of my last post) shows the radiator on the 1910 and it appears to be painted with two pinstripes across the top and a single pinstripe on the front of the top and bottom tanks. This also aligns with the photos and images in the advertising. I am open minded enough to consider that they could have painted some 1910 cars with white pinstriping, I just haven 't seen any evidence of this in period photos or advertisements. Let us know if you find some period pictures showing this, it would really help with our understanding of these cool little cars.
  5. PMac

    Hupp 20

    Here are a few more pictures for reference. The first is a picture from Bill Cuthbert's book The Hupmobile Story. The second is a color plate in the sales brochure I have. Both show the black pinstriping. These may be helpful also.
  6. PMac

    Hupp 20

    Factory advertisement below. It is bit hard to see the back of the car in this one but the BLACK pinstripe detail on the hood is clear (thin back line bordered by a heavier black line). I have a few other different adverts showing exact same detail.
  7. PMac

    Hupp 20

    I have been looking into the color and pin striping matter as I am getting ready to paint my own 1910 Model 20. I believe that this restored car (see: http://classicoldcars.net/1910-hupmobile/photos.htm) is very close to what the Model 20 paint work looked like when new. The body (red), chassis (red), running gear (black) and pin striping (black) certainly all aligns with pictures and original advertising materials I have collected. The pin striping on the hood panels was very distinctive with a thin line bordered by a heavy black line on each of the four panels. I believe that the body beading was highlighted black and the black pin striping also extended to the fuel tank. Likewise the black pin striping on the wheels and chassis and red pin striping on the fenders appears correct. I would caution about going too light red or orange-red with the body/chassis paint work as the 1909 and (early) 1910's were noted as being "bright" or "bold" red when new. A mint original sales brochure I have shows the car as being what I would describe as "fire engine" red. Red is one of the most susceptible colors to degradation, so we need to be careful with referencing any residual paint on survivor cars/restoration projects. I also note that period advertisements and photo's show that the radiator on some (circa 1910?) cars were also painted red with black pin striping (painted or color matched radiators were a feature of the period and offered by many manufacturers). I guess that keeping brass shiny was just as laborious back then as it is today, possibly more so then, given the use of the cars in wet and mucky conditions. This all said, I am not sure I can bring myself to paint my nicely restored brass radiator. At some stage late in 1910 and certainly from 1911 on, Model 20s were painted differently e.g. dark blue with light grey wheels and black fenders with white pin stripes (others might have more information to share here). I note that the car in the above link has incorrect diamond style cushioning on the back of the seats (these should be plain seat backs) and a non-standard brass front apron. These items aside, I think it is a pretty good reference car and looks to be well restored. Hope this information and reference helps.
  8. The first one is Chevrolet. It is common to all the Superior models.... 1923 B, 1924 F, 1925/26 K and 1926 V. I would be interested in it if it is for sale.
  9. Henry, I have sent you an email re these parts. Regards, Peter
  10. Chevrolet 4 cylinder - 1923 Superior through 1928 National
  11. PMac

    Model 20 King Pins

    Bob, I am working on a couple of options at present and will let you know how this pans out. It is a shame that Model T pins are smaller in diameter. They are almost identical in all other respects. Cheers, Peter
  12. A question for the Model 20 Brigade..... my 1910 needs a new set of king pins and bushes as the ones on the car are the originals and are approaching the end of their serviceable life. Can anyone recommend a supplier. I am happy to have a few sets made if this would help others. Cheers, Peter
  13. Hi Simon, These look great. I have sent you a personal message . Regards Peter
  14. Thanks Trimacar, Appreciate your thoughts on this topic. The 1910 instruction handbook does seem to point to the plug switch. Maybe others have some ideas? Peter
  15. Would appreciate any feedback from 1909/early 1910 owners regarding the type of ignition switch fitted to the dash board of their car. My car (build number 1994) has a "General Plug Switch" made by the General Sales Co of Detroit (see first photo). This square shaped unit is made from bakelite, with brass internal contact blades and an etched brass cover. Its one moving part is a brass pin that slides from left to right. The center section of this pin is bare brass and the ends are insulated with bakelite. I initially thought this was incorrect for the car but on reading the Instruction Book for 1910, I am now not so sure. The instruction book advises the owner starting the car to "put the switch plug on center of the switch which later is located on the dash". This mimics the practical procedure for starting my car. In shutting down the engine the driver is instructed to "put the switch plug in the off or neutral position, which is done by shifting the plug to the extreme left". Again, this mimics the practical action required to shut my engine down. It would seem that early Model 20's used this switch plug while later cars used the Hupmobile script circular switch with key (see second photo). Thoughts from others? Cheers, Peter Preview attachment IMG_1810.JPG IMG_1810.JPG 3.1 MB
  16. Have purchased one of Jerry Deck's beautiful reproduction magneto switches for the Model 20. I don't have a reference for where this switch and/or the manufacturers plate should be located on the dash board. Hoping someone might be able to provide a reference photo. Thanks, Peter
  17. Rick, Drop me a line at kezandpete AT gmail.com and we can discuss. As luck would have it, I now have acquired two of these units (remarkable... looked for over a year and couldn't find one in restorable condition). I am happy to sell one on for the same price I paid. cheers, Peter
  18. PMac

    Model 20 Fuel Leak

    Phil, yes the central tube does protrude up into the fuel tank by about an inch or so. This is a simple fuel reserve indicator. When the petcock is set (in my case) to the downward position, fuel is only drawn through the smaller raised tube, thereby giving the driver a warning when there is circa one gallon of fuel left in the tank (I don't have an owners manual, it may make reference to the precise volume of reserve fuel?). The petcock is then set to the middle position to draw fuel through the main pipe which is largely flush with the bottom of the tank. The tapered petcock valve pin has two offset holes drilled into it, one for each setting. The small washer on the spring side of the valve pin has two indents and these slot into the indents on the main body of the device. This gives you confirmation of the positioning of the valve relative to each setting (you can hear and feel it click into place). You can see this better in Trimacar's photos of the disassembled unit. The petcock (in my case) is rotated upwards to shut the fuel flow off completely, again with a click to confirm its location. Cheers, Peter
  19. PMac

    Model 20 Fuel Leak

    Here are some pictures of my petcock unit. Note the screen is much finer. Cheers. Peter
  20. PMac

    Model 20 Fuel Leak

    This is an identical unit to that which is fitted to my car. Peter
  21. PMac

    Model 20 Fuel Leak

    Thanks Both. Phil, I will likely pull the tank off over the weekend and will post some pictures of the fuel valve/strainer. Cheers, Peter
  22. My 1910 has what I understand to be the original brass petcock (combination petcock/brass gauze fuel strainer/reserve fuel level indicator) piece fitted below the fuel tank. The petcock has three settings, one for off, reserve level and fully on. While I have managed to seal the various threads on this unit, despite my best efforts to seat the tapered petcock barrel, it continues to weep fuel. Any suggestions for a fix welcome. Cheers, Peter
  23. Hi Ben, Have sent you a PM re the carbide generator. Regards, Peter
  24. PMac

    Model 20 Parts

    Hi all, Looking for the following 1909-11 Model 20 parts: Magneto switch (there appear to have been a few types fitted between the years of production?) Front apron for 1909-1910 (sits below the radiator) - any condition welcome Brass radiator cap Steering wheel spider Bosch DU4 points Cap for the engine oil filling/breather tubes Hubcaps - brass or alloy Owners instruction book Hoping someone may have these on their spare parts shelf in the garage. Cheers, Peter
  25. Thanks George and David.
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