msdminc
-
Posts
305 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Forums
Gallery
Events
Posts posted by msdminc
-
-
First thank you all for the kind words. For those of you who didn't know i retired and moved to Punta Gorda Florida with my wife a few years ago. Unfortunately i dont have a first gen Riviera, but still love them.
Those switches are in pretty tough shape, but I've been pretty successful in getting most of the ones I received over the the years operational.
The subparts I am running the lowest on are the plunger and nice clean metal tops. And I am not to proud to ask for donations of pieces and parts. If you have any, reach out with a pm and I'll let you know how to get them to me. I don't charge much to recondition switches, $20 US per switch plus $5 return shipping in US. Actual shipping internationally.
BTW I use beryllium-copper internal slide contacts like Paul Metzler used. I use the same supplier, jig, and heat treatment process too. And I am also a native of Massachusetts, a small town called Medway.
If you need any assistance best way to contact me is to use my email or cell number shown in a picture in an earlier post. Don't send them to me until you get in touch with me. I am here in Florida most of the year working on my golf game, but full disclosure I do take some extended vacations a couple times a year.
I'll rebuild 1st generation door jamb switches as long as I have supplies, and am walking with the living.
Rock On
gord
-
4
-
1
-
-
Ed that's another problem with building the body and sheet metal in different plants, in addition to the paint mismatches. This one of the big reasons GM went to full assembly under one roof. That transition started with BOP and Fisher Chevy plants in the 40s, to GMAD in the 60s to the big Billion Dollar current assembly plants.
Rock On
gord
-
Ed is correct. There were paint shops in the Fisher Body plants and in the motor division plants. Paint match was critical. It occasionally presented problems. Fortunately not all that often.
When GM used Assembly plats with everything under one roof, they had only one paint shop, and the sheet metal and body were painted together. The paint match problem was eliminated.
Rock On
gord
-
All, I know its been a while since this thread was active, sorry for the delay. I worked in GM assembly plants for 20+ years both Frame Rear Wheel Drive Cars and Unibody Front Drive Cars. For frame cars, as you said the body was dropped onto the frame on final line. For plants that had body's delivered by Fisher from another site, Final Line was part of the Car Division or Buick plant in this case. The Fisher Body was basically the car from the A pillar to the tail lights (No bumpers (front or rear), no fenders, no core support)). The frame was dressed with the engine, trans, brakes, suspension etc. Tires and Wheels were put on, and then it was delivered to the final line, where the body was married to the frame. The delivered frame had the radiator and all that was needed for that. The fenders, and Fascia with head lights etc. were attached. The steering, pedals, all the electrical, AC, and other things that needed connection inside the body were made. After everything was buttoned up gas was put in started, driven of the final line where testing and alignment was completed. If all inspections were good to go it was shipped, if problems, they were repaired, re inspected and then shipped.
Now I read the whole thread. The suggestions of aligning the door to the rocker first is right. Then hang the fenders and align them. Inboard/outboard is to feel generally, the gaps you desire consistency around the opening. If everything was done right in the body shop, and all the fixtures and clamps were applied correctly there should be generally no extraordinary effort to fit the doors the quarter, rocker, fender and hood. Sometimes things are not perfect so they invented shims, and 10 pound sledge hammers. Hanging doors is easy, fitting doors is an art, patience is a virtue. You may get to do it more than once. The hope is the door doesn't drop off the striker when you open it (also can be an indication of worn bushings), essentially sagging, and all the gaps (to Quarter and Fender) are consistent, remember the rocker is kind of low, so you cannot see it like a door to fender or quarter).
Hope this helps
Rock On
gord
-
1
-
-
Joe unfortunately it is not still available. Sorry about that.
Rock On
gord
-
Brandon, welcome to the world of Riviera. The fun has just begun. Looks like it cleaned up pretty well.
Rock On
gord
-
1
-
-
$400 obo with free shipping
PM with offers
-
All,
I am revising my ask on this to $400. PM me if you are interested.
Rock On
gord
-
1
-
-
Drew, it sounds tempting, but I think I will go for a beach front condo for a while before getting into our house. Punta Gorda is a ways from Orlando but my kids will be visiting from around the country and will invariably go to Disney, so we'll follow along with the grandkids. Maybe I can stop by and get a Riviera Fix.
Since it appears Drew will be passing on the TriShield Flipper Emblem, it is still available if anyone is interested.
Rock On
....gord
-
All, this is a 1965 Riviera TriSheld flipper in pristine condition. Never used, heck its only been out of the box 3 times since I got it from Kreed a few years ago. I had all the intentions to put it on my 65 Riviera. Did not get around to it and now alas my 65 Riviera has been sold (yes the triple black was sold in May and Susan have decided to retire completely and move to Florida). Didn't want to move the classic cars, the place down there wasn't going to have enough garage space, so they were all sold. This is the first time since 1982 that I only had one car. We'll probably get something classic when we get settled in Florida, and yes I will still be doing door jamb switches as long as I got stock (the parts are packed and ready for the move now, so there will be a delay until early 2022 for switches). And yes we will continue to be members in the ROA, and will see you at a summer event if we ever get past the pandemic.
So the flipper ready to find a new home. I am asking $450 and it is worth every bit. You will not find anything this nice on the planet. If you would like any other pictures pm me and I will get them for you. PM me if you are interested and we can work out the details.
Rock On
gord
-
2
-
2
-
-
Tom, there were probably other considerations, like floor space, but I think the prime mover was the fuel lines.
Rock On
gord
-
Tom in some plants the fuel tank was put on a little ways up the final line after body drop, from assembly operators in the pit. It had to be attached to the fuel lines that were pre-attached to the frame, also done in the pit. The two tank straps would be hanging down, the tank would be positioned from the rear and then the fuel lines going to the fuel pump would be attached to hoses coming from the fuel tank sending unit. In other plants it was be put on in the Trim shop, and the cradle/engine/trans and rear end would be lifted up from towveyors and attached to the body as it hovered over the towveyor line. If I recall correctly, generally the unibody tanks were put on in Trim and the frame cars were done in Chassis on the final line.
Rock On
gord
-
1
-
-
I believe that is the deck alignment tang that contacts the rubber bumper, as stated above. It is used to help with alignment of the deck in the decklid opening, along with the striker in the latch. You can move the bumper in and out of the hole, as well as the tang can be adjusted up and down to properly fit the deck.
When these cars were built there was a body drop hoist used to put the car onto the frame at the beginning of the final line. Below are a couple pictures that I found that show what I mean. The body was held in the hoist by the rockers. When it was placed and aligned on the frame, by the assembly operators in the pit on the body mounts/cushions, the frame is like a scissor and opens up and returns to get the next body. Right after the drop the body bolts are put in by assembly operators.
Rock On
gord
-
1
-
-
I didn't specify an ww width. I just got the Cadillac ones.
Rock On
gord
-
TheTaxMan
Ask them for a copy of the receipt. They can keep the original and you get the info you want and another piece of paper to keep with your car. If they won't do that something may be fishy.
Rock On
gord
-
Mike aka 48Super, that is a shot of my tires in my garage. They are really wonderful tires, look good, easy to take care of and drive great. They are radials so they are not OEM Bias Ply. The 225/75-15 is what I ordered and what you see in that picture on a 65 Riviera.
Rock On
gord
-
1
-
-
It is a private message within this forum. Look up near the top right of this screen for something that looks like an envelope. Every one on this forum has it.
Rock On
gord
-
I will send you a PM
Rock On
gord
-
Yes that is my email and I have not received anything from you. Nothin in spam and i have received 64 emails from other sources today. My email is working.
You can also try gordon.wolfgang@yahoo.com or message me on the forum.
Rock On
gord
-
Tom, as we discussed, whenever there was a rule, exceptions were abundant. I am with you, there are tons of alternatives that could have happened. I think the bank fill alternative is plausible, but may not explain everything like we discussed last night. Heck I would even bet that folks that were there may not know the whole story. The speculation is the fun part. Its archeology. And we can't really be wrong, and we can change our model when new data comes in, to make our understanding better
This is great stuff and I like to contribute where I can.
Rock On
gord
-
Turnstedt was a stand alone division of GM from about 1948 to about 1969. It had several plants in Ohio, New Jersey, Michigan that I know of. They merged with Fisher Guide in 1969, a division later known as Inland Fisher Guide. It started in the 1910's and was acquired by GM when they were acquiring pieces to vertically integrate.
Turnstedt produced lots of different parts for GM. As I remember it included Hard Trim and Soft Trim pieces, ball bearings, and many more.
Rock On
gord
-
3
-
-
Tom,
Yes 64 non saleable pilot cars would be built earlier than 63 build out. There could've been some saleable 64s built before 63 build out (less likely), but they would not have been recognized as built until they were "shipped" from the assembly plant. There are several production pay points where different work in progress inventory relief was made (refer to my articles in the Riview from a few years ago for more detail).
The production counts that were in industry reports were only counting units shipped from the final assembly plant, and not still in the plants Work In Progress. That will slide some of the numbers into the future from "Real or Actual" or what logically seems correct.
Steady state production usually gets closer to Actual, because the rhythm of the production process is smooth.
Hope this helps.
Rock On
gord
-
Art,
Bodies were typically built to order, and a body plate/cowl tag were always put on a body when it was built in the beginning of the Body Shop process in the underbody area. Bodies-In-White (BIW) were expensive so we didn't build them without a specific order or reason. Pilot cars even had body plates.
The one exception I remember when an underbody didn't get a body plate/cowl tag because we were testing a new underbody welding fixture and used the underbody for destructive test of the welds.
Rock On
gord
-
In preparing for any automotive production year there are a few steps that are taken to prepare. The first is prototype, generally a hand build of the projected model, typically years before the model year. In carry over models (models with small changes, think 1963 to 1964 Riviera, there isn't really any prototype activity per se. Prototype doesn't involve the plants to a great extent if any.
There are then some pre-production processes, this includes the projected plant production site. The most important is the pilot, and most model years include a pilot even if it is a carryover model. If there are zero changes a pilot is not necessary, but most have some changes in parts, option content, production procedures or the like. The pilot comes while the prior year model, if it exists, basically dispersing the new model year cars with the current model year production. These cars are not sold, and used as a way to train the plant in the new build. This can be lots of cars (100's) or not many say 15-20. This proves out the production process, the design intent is nailed down by this point.
Then the plants build out the prior year and change over to the new year. This can be many weeks for large model changes, or several days for minor model changes. It can also be many months for new introductions. When the new model year starts production it typically starts slowly. It is to iron out bugs in the process, or maybe the design. In essence it is slow to provide the plant to get a rhythm in building the new model. Other variables like the economic environment, competition, labor relations, and other variables can also dictate how fast the production goes from slow to full tilt.
It has changed a bit over the years, but it is roughly the same as when I worked for GM in GM Assembly Plants from the 70's to late 90's. In the past the new model was introduced in September so the pilots would be in June. Depending on sales and the size of the change over the last current model year would probably end in July sometime, although it could be earlier or later. The last one would be driven off final line and destined for shipping to the last customer, and typically for small changes the next model year may be close behind it. The new model year would start at a crawl and pick up speed as everything was worked out. It was hoped to get to full speed in late August or September, but that too was not hard and fast. I would say everyone of the 20+ change overs, big and small wanted to be full tilt no later than October 1. This would go until the next model year, and so on.
There were always exceptions, bad sales, oil crisis of the 70s, hot sales for a new introduction, extending the model year, mid year introductions, etc. Generally August and September, had lower numbers. Most plants built 45 to 60 jobs/cars an hour at full speed. There were some faster, and in bad economic times or craft type builds (think Corvette) there were slower. The numbers Tom cites are within reason, I just wanted to give a little more flavor to the analysis. I can't speak great knowledge about Flint, I was there, but not until the 70's. But frankly things haven't changed all that much. I went on a tour of the GM Fairfax Assembly Plant a couple years ago at the ROA event in Overland Park, KS and they had new model year pilots running with the current model in June of that year. Heck some of the folks I knew when I worked there in the early 90s were still there.
I hope this helps a little.
Rock On
gord
-
7
-
Question on value
in Buick Riviera
Posted
If you want to sell it, price it to move. If you don't want to sell it, price it like its the last one, in other words ridiculously high. They will counter and it may make the sentimental pain less painful.
Rock On
gord