Highlander160

Did you ever sell the head or manifold? I may have a friend that has interest in both or perhaps just the manifold. It would go on a 41 160 Bus Cpe. Yes, a real one, not a club missing the back seat

You tell em Dave! I've never met a 34 8 I didn't like. Less the haughty air of a 12 it might be the best Packard model ever. Did you find a jack? Just curious...

I have a Super Clipper. I couldn't imagine the car with full "bird" out front, can barely stand the modified "Godess of Speed" but it's more svelte than the pelican. I prefer the simplicity of the standard, but then again if we all had the same taste the world would be fairly boring, yes? The only thing I'd add to mine is a pair of skirts. Well, that and a new name on the title (for sale)... And one with the Goddess of Speed from a google image search;

One last bump and it's off to bed for the winter. Will listen to any reasonable offers. A very fun and reliable car that won't disappoint.

If anyone still gives a rip, I looked at both 12 conv sedans. The 37 was head and antlers above the 39 in fit, finish, detail and more. The 39 had issues with all 4 doors. It had a few other things about the hood and quality of the chrome plating. I've never been a fan of 38-9 Packard models whether senior or junior. The front is just so cumbersome and out of place with the rest. Those fat fenders and grill that look like a 37 which suffered a head-on collision. I've heard a few folks gush about the split W/S on the 38-9 "...makes it worth so much more...", yeah. Worth so much more critique to me, and I'll go on record to say much of this is indeed just 'me' and my outlook. I won't add to the Victoria talk as there's volumes of such within this forum. So at the end of the day, Frank or Dean? Chocolate or Vanilla? Blonde or Brunette? 35-7 or 38-9? I think the selling price of the 37 really spoke to it's condition. If you had a free no rust no dent 37 12 you "couldn't get there from here", even with the 10% juice, at that price. Average national shop rate is something over $65/hr. There's about $40K in contracted services and new parts required, another $15K in paint and upholstery supplies, so that leaves about 3400 hours to do a full nut-and-bolt restoration at $65/hr. Anyone here that's gone through it on a senior Packard, either doing or paying for it, knows that estimate to be dead on. Me? I'd take a coupe version of the senior cars, 34 through 37, skip 38-9, jump to 1940-41. But that's me and I don't want everyone to think and like what I do. Do you? Cheers...

In "The magnificent Packard Twelve of 1934" by the late Ed Blend, the car is found and described as being fitted for the Roebling family of bridge building fame some time in mid 34. They had the roadster bodied car which could be from as early as 27 and liked it enough to have it refitted to a 34 V-12 chassis. The fenders appear to be modified 32s to fare better with it's early styling. The job was done by Rollston but it's not Rollston coachwork. He mused that it may even be an early Dietrich. Still, not all refitting and custom builds carry immediate reverence and subsequent values. This is a car that can be documented correctly if the Rollston records do indeed exist but the "look" is still a bit clumsy for mid-30s practices. I too would mercilessly chop the windshield and would never give a 2nd thought to it. Just an FYI or FWIW, you pick...

I'm currently enjoying a 47 Super Clipper, model 2103. It has new Silvertown radial WW tires that I have inflated to 36 in the front and 34 in the rear. So far so good, but I remain mindful of what's happened to some of out hot rod brethren and behave accordingly. It's very stable in normal driving, the ride is as cozy as can be, yet I won't be found on freeway ramps or sharp turns looking for the car's limits.Why? When I drive these old things i want the ride to last as long as possible. 55 instead of 65, take the long way over smooth roads vs a gravel road shortcut, and even past the tire thoughts I don't wind the engine real high between gears. It gets up to speed fast enough without making it sing a high RPM tune. Like an elder beautiful woman, these cars like some romance, attention, respect. Their performance-minded descendants like action, like to play harder, need much less attention than in times past, like a young beautiful woman. If that means my perspective on fine vintage cars borders on objectifying, I guess i agree. Nice topic, thanks for the coversation folks.

As asked for clarification. No tire salesman provided the info I mentioned about wheel failure. It has happened with my hot rodding associates though, and like I stated above more on the smaller cheaper wheels. "...grip the road better..." as in the cases we've seen and discussed, the grip is enough to add considerable side load on the rims. In the worst of some situations a wheel of the slightest questionable wear or erosion can also split the outside of the rim away from the drop center section. Why not a bias tire? It will slide on pavement well before a radial will, especially with even the slightest performance rated radial as found on select imports that use 16" tires. In order to dissect a measure of logic in my observations note that I mentioned HOT RODS. Hot rods are typically not built for low speed touring. "Enthusiastic" operation is much more common which is indeed a logical assumption. Please note that I said above that I didn't mean to give the impression of highways littered with vintage cars suffering broken wheels. Be aware that it can and has indeed happened. Surely given enough traction and the "perfect storm" of conditions, side loads and speed it could happen with any tire, but the odds are pretty high against it happening with a bias tire that would slide well before being able to impart such loads of traction and sidewall deflection. As always your results may vary, tax n title extra, no purchase necessary, void where prohibited, see your retailer for...

Tire pressure desires are like oil. Everyone has their favorite for their own reasons, but repro Firestone 700 or 750 17s, with tubes, on Packard models from 1101 to 1107 literally for decades, 32 in the front, 30 in the rear on open cars, 32 front and rear on sedans and such. Anything over that and they follow the tar strips in the road. The thing against radials on our old stuff, they grip the road real well and deflect just as well. Turn too fast and some of those old stamped steel wheels may come apart. Not to give the impression that our roads are littered with classics stranded with broken wheels, but it can happen. Believe it or not it's more common on steel disc wheels that are riveted, wheels like the beloved 40 Ford/Mercury style or something found on 120s or Clippers. The engineers who built this stuff had years of testing behind their recommendations. I find most are just right, but we have superior tire tech today and things can be better, or worse. Excess inflation will indeed wear the centers and also reduce contact patch. At speed that contact can get smaller yet due to tire growth. Don't kid yourselves, those tires will grow at anything much over 40 MPH. Be careful, enjoy the ride, but the best results will come from miles of fun testing. Throw a portable air tank in the trunk and go for a ride. Raise em, lower em, do some panic stops, make some "emergency" maneuvers, etc. Who thinks that wouldn't be fun?

Again...

Still available. You know you want it...

This is a very nice car. We're also always willing to hear a sincere offer, and again if you want to see something detailed or specific don't be shy. I'll show you whatever you'd like.

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Bump for the weekend crowd...

This is a nice one. A really good 63 Roadster with a slightly warmed up 350 installed. Just out of a few years slumber, she's still a good looking car. As seen in the pictures below, black vinyl hard top included, has factory side pipes, 4 spd,. rare power windows that work beautifully. Has a white convertible top, 160 MPH speedometer, woodgrain steering wheel, very nice to near perfect chrome and bright work. Was originally Sebring Silver with a red interior, now Ice Blue and black interior. There's one small area on the body showing through the finish on the right front fender, but past that there's no excuses or apologies. Clean frame too (not rusted or rotten) as well as a very presentable engine compartment, and we're also including a car cover. I'm selling this for a friend but I have the car for easy viewing. If you want a specific picture of something let me know. With the heat and my busy work schedule I might need a day or so but I'll accommodate anyone the best and soonest I can. Priced right and below market according to my research so it may not last long at $38,500. As always sincere and realistic offers will be considered. It's not a fire sale from our end but I'd understand if you feel pressed to get it. Thanks for looking in, and you can reach me here with a P.M., or:highlander809@gmail.comText or voicemail also welcome at 734 637 1421

Well there's one HUGE reason I'd pick the black vs the maroon, OVERDRIVE. The fact it's black and is being sold by Tom is just icing on the cake. Good luck in your choice, a 41 coupe is among my favorite Packard styles.

I meant my question in the best possible context, interesting vintage car conversation. Rare, totally on it's own definition doesn't have to mean uber valuable. I'd imagine the most rare of 1968 Pontiac GTOs would be a chrome front bumper, rubber floor mat, 3 spd stick shift and 2bbl carb. All were on the list, but really who gives a fat rat's hiney? Slow, not pretty, very hard to distinguish from the Plain Jane tempest or LeMans. I think C2 3 spd stick Corvettes are rare too, but again, who cares? Getting back to the big Buick in the topic, 586 is a fairly good number for a car of that ilk. Not a Packard, not a Cadillac 12 or 16, but surely majestic and impressive in a lot full of "bread n butter" models of any make. Even if there's 3 of them in circulation, or at least known to be, it's probably a fair thought to even double that number left and we just haven't seen them yet. Although with 'net communication and the generation shift we're seeing lately (my PC way of describing our elders passing on) you'd think something closer than in any recent time before could be figured out. I like the car, really like it to be totally honest. No shame in my game though, I can't spring for it.

I'd ask the membership, of the 586 produced is there also a list by body type? Does GM offer that info like they do for Cadillac?

Hmm, not sure how to take this or answer it. I guess that 1st the term "dumpster diving" is more colloquial than literal. As to walking by a part at Hershey near the trash on Sat and seeing that it's something you or a friend needs, hey I'm not so proud or holy that I'll leave because it was tossed in the trash. Conversely, I once had a guy who was just released from prison start preaching to me that I didn't know what it was like to have to eat from garbage cans. I was 15, he was 63. Used to showing respect for my elders I started to say something a bit polite but immediately switched to my "drunken sailor" language, informing him that he's right and I never will. Use you imagination as to the words I used growing up in a family of construction workers and race car enthusiasts. Then there's this "thing" that just chaps my hiney about the perception of our precious children today. They're our offspring, not some miracle or the 2nd coming or some prize to held up like a soccer trophy. I was 14 when I painted my 1st complete vehicle. At 13 I could use filler and spray primer. At 12 I could work a cutting torch. All during those formative years I also shoveled concrete, hauled bricks and cinder blocks, mixed mortar, helped build homes by hauling wood and even nailing down floors. There's more but it would take too long to list it, but it's safe to say that my Dear Ol Dad would have been tossed in jail for the things I was taught and allowed to do if it were today. That's a sad commentary on our society as far as I'm concerned. It's just as sad that many of our schools consider skilled trades as "alternative career path" jobs, as if some 1/2 wit could "only" be a plumber, carpenter, electrician, brick mason, welder/fabricator. All skills that today net close to and over 6 figures annually vs leaving all that college education with a 6 figure debt and the ability to make less than $50K/year (not all college courses but too many). My kid? Usable part on the ground or in the trash can? "Yo! Son! Grab that (fill in the blank)!" The look on his face of getting a score on any free part is worth more than anything you could imagine. Is this harsh? Unrealistic? Not when one considers the age of some of our most notable musicians over the last 50 years when they made their mark. But closer to our world, Franklin Hershey (Murphy Coachbuilders) was only 21 when he designed and coordinated the build of the car shown here. And for the record, yes I have indeed found things in the trash that were seriously valuable including some tools I still use decades later. I'm actually sad for those protected from such adventures and experience.

Pretty serious car with great "street cred" being Italian/American. A little research would net some answers. http://blog.hemmings.com/index.php/2011/04/07/hemmings-find-of-the-day-1969-intermeccaninca-italia/ There's lots more to be found.

I'd bet a cup of coffee it was clipped. It may take some disassembling of select areas to detect, but there were some really good "clippers" back in the day. Remove the "A" pillar trim, should be easy enough to do. Follow the floor from below, look for the meeting joint of the front (cowl/windshield/tunnel) section of the body to the rear. Along the rocker panels inside (should be easy, "X" frame car, right?) there's a lap joint as well. If there's unmolested Rivieras to compare you'll find everything you're looking for. As a GS it would have been worth saving back in the day, even at perhaps 10yrs old or more. It could also have been done by an independent "fixer" in his own gig after hours, content to mix n match what was easy or affordable availability. Having no clock to punch or boss checking his shirt size, the work could be stellar whether it was right or wrong. Is it kool? Sure, might be a real GS. Is it worth a bunch? Maybe not as much as the real thing, not even close, because some liberties were taken during preservation. I happen to be a 43+ year expert in many phases of restoration, fabrication, and even product development. I've seen some really nice cars that were simply as wrong as can be from a technical perspective only. The missing data tag as posted above is a tell. Personally I prefer the 65 in every way over the 63-4. Cleaner, "faster" looking, headlight clam shells, etc. I don't see it as having all the "best of" styling features offered on those as I prefer the lights in the bumper and the side scoops gone. Surely I'm not alone in that regard. Good luck in your archaeology of this car and embrace the challenge of sorting it out. And just for the record, none of this response, candid as it may seem, is meant to denigrate you or what you have. These things pop up all the time and like Matt said above, many of these old cars have the seasoning of a "chequered past" and sometimes there's no telling what someone did.

Well I'm really late to this party I see. 34 Packard? Who the he** wants one of those ? Sarcasm of course. I've done a dozen of em, many from the ground up. Some items I read in this topic were fairly clear and right, some seemed a bit off, but overall you seem to have lived a nice year plus with what I consider the high water mark of nearly all Classic Cars. I see you'll be selling it so there's not much I can offer you in assistance, but I don't think you'll have much trouble finding an owner. Of course it's no Ford or Chevy so don't expect an audience in 5 or 6 figures of interest, but they do have a loyal following. Here's a couple pictures of some of latest just to enjoy. I also noticed yours had the rather rare "Butt Walnut" woodgrain. Most are Burled Carpathian Elm with American Walnut trim. Nice car 'Riv...

You have a PM...

Looks like I'm a bit late for the Royale party, but I'm a fan for sure. I stand shamelessly guilty for the refinish of the 2 tone purple car from the Detroit area. The customer wanted the all silver finish and dark red leather and pin stripes. With polite and professional input the charcoal grey leather and stripe was chosen over the red. For decades I've taken a little heat for the use of silver on depression-era classic cars. It was indeed available and the formula exists in old paint books. Ditzler (now PPG) called the color "Steel Dust Iridescent", a very bright silver in it's original form. The poly in those days was ground as fine as possible giving an almost pearl effect when applied properly. Not many silver paints today can match that look. There is 1 that can and that's my "go to" color for anything silver from that time. The comments at shows ranged from ...was never available..." to "...got it right...". I guess one needs to read about finsihes and colors to make good choices. Frankly I felt it came out stunning. We went body-off, rechromed some things, fixed a few oil leaks, but overall it was a fine restoration to begin with. I think the color makes the car. I also think it really shows Mr Notrhrop's wind tunnel efforts the best. In the pictures you can see how the poly in the paint highlights the tucked under fender edges and rounded body shapes. The black top provides a sharp contrast to the windshield frame, further accenting how low the top assembly is compared to ther classic era cars with similar coachwork. At the tail end, the graceful curves were kept uncluttered by eliminating the gratuitous trunk rack. Having seen others minus that appendage I don't think it was a mistake. Enjoy these pictures from Amelia Island 2008. It's all I have of it finished. From the FWIW dept, I also woodgrained this car back in the late 80s or early 90s. That same finish is still there. I'll be happy to share in any comments or questions that I can.

I'd like to throw the Avalanche truck in there too. Body by LEGO along with a few other models. And that recent era of Cadillac's mid-size car where they bragged about their "folded paper design". Some of those belong right next to the trophy they give to all the kids on a team regardless of accomplishments. Sometimes I believe that those who decide such stuff, regardless of the manufacturer, intend to prove that they can make anyone buy anything. Scion anyone? How about those Honda SUVs with the different colored parts on the outside? Then those other Asian imports with white roofs, black fenders, colored body, what the heck were they smoking? All in all there were several 1942 models that were lucky to see such limited production. At least by 46-47 they figured some of it out, and not just "The General".