JV Puleo
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Posts posted by JV Puleo
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Pads? Do you mean linings?
Are you talking about the internal or external brakes? The external bands are thin steel and tighten around the outside of the drums. The internal brakes are similar but somewhat more substantial. But...you say the linings? are new...what are they? If you went to a brake shop and got the latest and greatest brake linings, they are completely wrong. You cannot use hard, modern brake linings in these cars. They take soft, woven linings, preferably with little brass wires in them. Some cars, like my 19i10 Mitchell had cotton linings about 1/4 inch thick. I've had two REO's, a 1910 and a 1911 so I'm familiar with the system. They work as well as any brakes of the period provided they have the right lining, there is virtually no play in the brake rods and the brake equalizing bar that runs across the chassis turns easily with no drag.
What do the drums look like? Those are pressed steel and can be heavily worn. They aren't thick enough to turn like a modern cast iron drum. I had a set spray welded and turned them back to flat.
Have you made absolutely certain that the axle seals are there and working? If it's leaking oil onto the linings you'll never get them to work properly. It's all very simple but quite unlike a modern car. The original seals were felt. If they are still in place they are badly worn. If they have been replaced look at the outer bearings and races. Those cars have a 3/4 floating axle with Hyatt-type roller bearings on the outside (they have tapered roller bearings on the inside next to the differential). The Hyatt bearings were never very good and if badly worn the axle will have excessive play. That will ruin any seal very quickly. I've seen a REO axle with a groove nearly 1/4" deep worn by bad Hyatt bearings...
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That's only 1%...I seem to remember Ed saying it was more like 2% with another 5% being driveable...but then, he was talking about "restored" cars.😋
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I've been away from the Mitchel project for the best part of three months now working on my house. I'm building an improved kitchen and while I'm happy with the way it's coming out it's a lot more work than I anticipated. The whole thing is complicated by the fact that this part of the house dates from 1703. Absolutely nothing is square or straight or built to conventional modern measurements. Probably the most useful tool I have is a thickness planer because that is the only way I can get things to be "almost" square. I've finished the tile work...but I still have a lot to do to get it workable and looking good.
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A nice car...too late and too complicated to interest me but this is a good example of the market correcting itself. Chances are it was inherited and the seller isn't interested in keeping it or advertising it for an outlandish price.
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I like working cast iron though it seems that most don't, perhaps because there is so much free carbon that your hands get really dirty. Deep cuts and slow speeds make it almost relaxing to work with.
What was the cold blue system yhou used? That looks to be a very nice finish.
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I've come to the conclusion that these complicated V engines aren't worth the time and expense. Personally, I'd stick with a 6 or an 8, straight engine. I like your
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Someone will want them...they are nowhere near "landfill" material. I didn't mean to be blunt but they are probably the most common brass car item out there. Oddly enough, they would be easier to sell if they were just generic Gray & Davis lights.
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No one ever junked a Cadillac and didn't save the lamps. There are a lot more of them than there are cars to put them on. You see them on ebay frequently, usually described as "rare" (which they aren't) and usually with a price tag much too high. I think you'd do well to get $200-$250 for the pair but you may have a long wait for someone who needs them. It's more likely they would go to some hot rod/rat rod builder who doesn't care about the name or what it originally went to.
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A screw jack. There isn't much else to say about them. They were a very common item and I imagine every car had one. I seriously doubt i9t was made for a particular car.
I like and use them. If you have the ground clearance they are much more reliable than hydraulic jacks since they can't come down on their own.
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If you are new here, pay heed to Ed. He really knows pre-war cars and makes his living correcting issues like this.
As to the king pins. Chances are you can find a NOS set with the bushings...or you could make them easily enough. The entire theory behind a king pin reamer is that it is a piloted with an extension on the end that projects through the other bushing and a tapered fitting that slides into the bushing opposite the one you are reaming. The two bushings have to be reamed in perfect alignment. Pilot reamers were a standard machinists tool so they can be found without any reference to cars. (Look for Critchley pilot reamers...or Cleveland Twist Drill) If you are not particularly experienced at this, it is very easy to ream the hole too large. Were I doing it, I would go through with the pilot reamer just a few thousandths after the bushings are pressed in. (Generally, bushings are slightly oversize on the OD and compress slightly when pressed in.) Then I would use a barrel lap to open the holes so that the pin slides in easily with no noticeable play. The beauty of this method is that it's practically impossible to take out too much material with a lap. It's slow but it will get you a superior job.
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I don't know how I could have missed BSA...especially since the Birmingham Arms Trade is my particular specialty. Like the others, they introduced their motor vehicles as a way to keep the works busy when the arms business was slow. In their case, they did much better with motorcycles although they did produce a car from 1907 to 1912 and again after WWI in an attempt to make use of a factory they had built and equipped during the war. In both cases, their primary business was small arms and when war broke out that was what they made...literally millions of rifles for the British army. They also made motorcycles for the British Army...I once had an M20 army bike...a 500cc single that was so untouched that it still had war department marked tires on it. I have an SMLE made by BSA in 1915 that has clearly seen long, hard service. The company was originally organized as a joint venture between the numerous Birmingham arms makers, none of whom could afford to organize and equip a factory with the quantity of mass-production machine tools that were needed to be able to compete with American companies.
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30 minutes ago, 1937hd45 said:
RUGER here in Connecticut, built two prototype cars in the 1970's that looked somewhat like a Blower Bentley, 427 Ford powered and used a Divco milk truck front axle. He also had a fine collection of restored pre war cars. Bob
The bodies were fiberglass, manufactured by the Dyer Boat Company in Warren, RI. I knew the member of that family who was managing the boat yard at the time and, after the Ruger experiment flopped (and they left one or two of the bodies behind) I was offered one for free. They had been laying in a corner of the boat yard for years.
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Winchester...
Benjamin Berkley Hotchkiss (originally from Connecticut) designed the Hotchkiss bolt action rifles and carbines that were given field trials by the US Army in the 1880s. It was the first bolt-action rifle to be considered for adoption. Hotchkiss was an inventor and small arms designer...Winchester made the guns. Hotchkiss also invented the Hotchkiss Revolving Cannon adopted by the Navy. He moved to France in the late 19th century and established a factory there because he felt business prospects were better in Europe. The cars and motorcycles were introduced when the arms business was slow to broaden the product line and keep the workers from seeking other employment. Winchester also signed a contract to build Hotchkiss cars but, although it was announced in the press it never happened.
Much the same is true of FN, originally established to manufacture M1893 Mauser rifles for the Belgian Army. It was a huge success but the licensing agreements under which they operated precluded manufacturing those rifles for export. (They did that and this resulted in a huge lawsuit in which the original directors lost control of the company.) Again, the automobile arrived on the scene at about the same time and they moved into that market as a means of diversification.
Stevens was, of course, a long time producer of relatively inexpensive single shot rifles and pistols, most used for target shooting and very popular as a "boy's rifle". They underwrote the Duryea brothers, hence the Stevens-Duryea cars.
The various Pope cars; Pope Hartford, Pope Toledo etc. were a product of the firm that flourished making the Columbia bicycle . Their first foray into self-propelled vehicles was directed by Hiram Percy Maxim, the son of Sir Hiram Maxim, inventor of the Maxim machine gun. HP Maxim also invented the Maxim Silencer.
And, of course, it isn't a coincidence that RR of America established their factory in Springfield just down the street from the Springfield Armory just as many highly skilled machinists were being let go with the end of WWI.
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Down the road from us within walking distance lived Mr. & Mrs. Angell. Mr. Angell was a WWI veteran whose family had been in the neighborhood since the 17th century. He also drove a Packard, probably 1938 or 39... pre-war in any case though having no interest in cars that late I never asked. We'd often see him out for a drive on Sunday afternoons. I've no idea what happened to it. The Angell's had no children and the property was inherited by a nephew who was so anxious to sell it he took a deposit before the will had been probated. I only know that because it was my sister & brother-in-law that bought the house and still live there.
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When I was in elementary school my mother would take my brothers and I up to a house in the next town where there was a huge horse chestnut tree in the yard. She'd ask permission for us to gather some. Dr. Marshall lived there. His wife invariably came out with a tray of milk and cookies for us and visited with my mom. Fast forward about 10 years and we now lived in that town. My friend John Zangari and I were on the lookout for old cars (i.e. pre-war cars). We'd heard there was one in the Dr. Marshall's barn so we went and asked if we could see it. By then it was his daughter who lived there and she was more than obliging to take us down and unlock the barn. This was not a "barn find" barn. It was perfectly maintained, the roof and doors was tight and the big open space clean and swept. In the middle sat a Franklin touring car, about 1928. It was light brown, the top was up and it was up on jacks...put away at the beginning of WWII and never moved since then. Though slightly dusty, it was clear it had been carefully maintained. Draped over the seat was a duster and in the driver's door pocket was a color Franklin brochure with a circle drawn around that car.
We did ask if it could be bought though it was clear neither of us could have afforded it...and this was in the late 1960s. No, she said. It had belonged to her father and was going to her brother who lived in, I think, Chicago. I've often wondered what happened to it. It was the best preserved car from that time I've ever seen and I fear it may have fallen into the hands of a "restorer".
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If I remember correctly that is close to a PI RR. I have the exact figure somewhere...probably in the PI technical data sheets that the RROC published about 40 years ago.
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Hurst, I get the feeling you are doing something I do constantly (hence I feel safe mentioning it)...I'm my most critical customer. I see flaws in almost everything I do but, truth to tell, if you are striving for perfection, as you are, the flaws are something only you will ever notice and after a time even you may not be able to find them. I particularly remember a part I made that was knurled. I made four of them and in one case the knurl didn't come out absolutely perfect. It kept me awake at night and I eventually decided to do it over. A week or two later, when I returned to the parts, I couldn't identify the one that was flawed. As someone who had a white MGA many rears ago I think yours is better than they were new.
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1 hour ago, alsancle said:
I think probably this conversation is too broad. What I think of as a "project car" and what others may be thinking are different.
This is a good point. In my case I was thinking of pre-war cars that are clearly not viable without spending many times their perceived value unless you have the capacity to do most of the work yourself. The aluminum head PI in Maine that was shown here some time ago is a good example. The price (I thought) was realistic at 30,000 but only if you have access to the skills and knowledge...regardless of the fact that "restored" (or at least running) examples usually carry a price tag closer to 3 times that. That was a project...My 1910 Mitchell is a "super-project". Incomplete to begin with, the ultimate floor sweepings car with even some of the parts that came with it not being right and impossible to replace. I wonder if I'd have undertaken it if I knew all that beforehand but I was looking for the largest, mostly complete pre-WWI car I could find. This was the best I could do on my budget and, truth to tell, I haven't seen a more attractive deal in the past 10 years. It's all well and good to say "buy the best you can afford"...if you can't afford much what you're really saying is "you don't have the wherewithall to participate".
No one is suggesting that anyone should go broke doing a project but life is full of choices. My income is probably in the bottom 10% in this forum. I don't eat out, go to the movies, play golf or watch television (so I don't pay cable bills). I'd rather be in my shop than the superbowl. (You'd have to pay me to go to a sporting event.) I've never made car payments and always driven bland, everyday used cars. When you don't do the things that society generally expects its surprising how much you don't spend.
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I don't either...and don't miss it.
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The problem with projects is the asking prices for them does not reflect the reality of the market. I attribute that to the many idiotic television shows and news items projecting the notion that there is "big money" to be made. Given the work I've done, my project was vastly overpriced...but I see that as the cost of admission. Markets adjust over time. This one is out of balance now but as things come to the market and there are no buyers, prices have to adjust. This is true with everything not just cars. I sometime wonder if this is and antique car forum or an antique car dealer's forum.
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Was it ever? I well remember "projects" that were unrealistic 40 years ago if you were kidding yourself that you could make a profit on it. There are a lot of good reasons why people undertake projects that will never show a profit...and why should they? As so many have pointed out, most "hobby's" don't do that...if any. A good friend took his wife to a pro football game last year for her birthday (she's the football fan). It cost him, all told, about $1000 between the tickets, parking and dinner etc. At least with a car you might get back 50 cents on the dollar which is a lot more than the golfers, sports fans and movie goers get. It seems to me that a lot of people in the car world are obsessed with profiting from their hobby which is, to my mind, simply absurd.
In my own case, I like engineering. I collect antique machine tools, 18th century arms and books. If I get hit by a bus some of those may be sold by my executor for more than I paid but I didn't get them in the first place in order to profit from them. I've already told him to simply give the machines away to one of my friends...I got them because they are important to me. I just gave away an antique drill press to someone who will use it. Any profit that comes from my collections will go to someone else.
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You have used JB Weld in the only way I've ever found it effective...as a filler to hide a mechanical repair.
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The first car I purchased was a 1951 Citroen. It ran but the transmission was badly damaged and I couldn't find anyone who could fix it. I didn't have a driver's license either and didn't get that until I was 18. My parents were not the slightest bit interested in cars and made no effort to encourage that interest. My second car was this one. I purchased it as a 1926 but I learned later it was really a '27. It was built in October of '26 and registered with that date which explains the confusion. Of course, I knew no one who knew any better than I did so this was my first car that actually drove. I was 19 when I bought it. I kept it for about two years and sold it to buy a 1929 PI RR.
I garaged it for the first winter. I was in college at the time so this wasn't a problem. Later, because I didn't feel confident driving it in the winter, I had a string of Corvairs which we were able to buy at the time for nearly nothing.
The Cadillac was painted a pale green. The sides of the body were a 1950s or early 60s repaint. The black fenders and above the belt line was probably the original paint. There wasn't a hint of rot in the wood frame and the mohair interior was very good showing just a little wear on the driver's seat and door panels that had been slightly damaged by water leaking down the window channels. I repainted the wheels a dark red and added a matching pinstripe. Today this would be touted as an amazing "survivor". At the time it was generally looked down on as both "unrestored" and a "closed car" two things that were an anathema to most local car guys.
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Rare is a word that has been reduced to meaningless but I think there is another that is commonly used and also has little meaning. To me, "worth" implies some intrinsic value. An automobile is a machine for moving people and things around and the only value old cars have is purely subjective. It's value is whatever someone will pay for it. They are "worth" something to me but no one needs to have one and most of the people I know don't place any value at all on them and especially on the ones I like. If I inherited a barn full of million dollar muscle cars I'd sell them without even looking at them so despite their being described as "worth" a lot of money, to me they are so much scrap metal but I'd happily take advantage of someone else's subjective assessment of their value.
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"PROJECT" has now become nearly unaffordable to ever do ?
in General Discussion
Posted
You are right. I'd originally thought my car would take 10 years. It's been 11 now but that doesn't include about 2 years of being distracted by other jobs (like rebuilding my mill) or the kitchen I'm currently working on. However, I think my purpose is unusual, if not unique for this forum. Beyond sharing technical information with like-minded enthusiasts, the social aspects of the old car world don't interest me...especially the desire to be "seen" by the general public. I've no interest in any of the local car shows...I'm not likely to be going on any tours and I don't own a trailer or even anything to pull it with if I did. For me, it's all about the challenge. I do like driving them and if I finish and still have the strength to do it I will go one one of my "adventures"...a long trip on back roads, probably alone and entirely reliant on my own skills to get where I'm going and back again.
Although it doesn't look it, my car is probably about 2/3 done. The difficult part will be assembling it because I can't do that in my shop and I don't have a garage. I do have a foundation so before I can put the car back together I'll have to build one. None of this makes any sense if the goal was to make money and leads me to being slightly hostile to idea that a "hobby" needs to be profitable.