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Stude Light

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Posts posted by Stude Light

  1. This is not necessarily a simple answer. The 1920 – 1922 Studebaker Light Six used a standard Morse Timing Chain (p/n 43567) with a 14-tooth accessory shaft sprocket (p/n 43309), a water pump shaft gear (p/n 43365) and a distributor gear (p/n 43873). For 1923 and 1924 the Light Six switched to a Morse Type 45 Timing Chain (p/n 120007) with a 15-tooth accessory shaft sprocket (p/n 120012), a water pump shaft gear (p/n 120010) and a distributor gear (p/n 120013). The water pump shaft gear is what I would call the distributor support housing drive gear and the distributor gear is what I would call the distributor support housing driven gear.

    When Studebaker made this change, the pitch of the timing chain changed along with all the sprocket profiles.  This forced them to go with a 15-tooth sprocket on the accessory drive which changed that shaft speed slightly.  To compensate, they changed the water pump shaft gear (the one that drives the distributor support) and the profile of the distributor gear (which is the distributor support driven gear).


    The correct timing chain sprockets are easy to identify as they will have TYPE 45 stamped on them.  Also, the accessory drive sprocket is easy to identify just by counting the teeth.  The water pump gear is also easy to identify as the earlier part (p/n 43365) has four lobes as viewed from the side, whereas the later part (p/n 120010) has a five-lobe side profile.  The later Type 45 parts are on the left in the photo.


    The issue is identifying the correct distributor gear. The p/n 43873 distributor gear was used on the Wagner and Remy 606A distributors. The p/n 120013 distributor gear was used on the Remy 626A and Wagner K97 in years 1923 and 1924 and on the 1925 ER Models. The difference in these two gears is just in profile which is not something you can see. So, you need to be careful to find the correct distributor gear that matches the profile of the driven gear otherwise the two gears will wear out quickly. Even if your car was made before 1923, it may have been changed over at some point.

    What may help is that in 1920, 1921 and part of 1922, the oil filler was at the fan support bracket.  At some point in 1922, the oil filler was moved next to the distributor which required changes in the “water pump/oil pump/distributor support bracket” and the “distributor support housing”.
    For reference, the 1920-early 1922 water pump/oil pump/distributor support bracket was p/n 43572 and the distributor support housing was p/n 45344.  There is no provision for an oil filler on these parts so if you find a distributor gear of one of these housings it is likely to be the older version (p/n 43873), that is, unless someone updated it at some point. Late 1922 – 1924 would use a water pump/oil pump/distributor support bracket p/n 45183 with a distributor support housing having p/n 45545.  There is a provision for an oil filler on these parts and would most likely have the p/n 120013 gear.


    It’s a lot of information, but as I said, it is not a simple answer.


    BTW - Studebaker did not offer a 4 cylinder engine beyond 1919 and they were very different engines from the more modern Light Six.  I checked the parts manuals and the Light Six did not share a distributor gear with any of the 4 cylinder models, so I'm not sure about the info from Valley Forge.


  2. I’ve restored and readjusted the Remy ones that Studebaker used. They have a cover that is removed with a single screw. Once inside you can easily adjust the cut in and cut out voltages. If I recall, the internals of the Wagner did not have adjustment screws so you have to bend the arms to get the voltages set.


    I’m guessing the generator in a 1926 is good for maybe 10-12 amps so you don’t need a huge diode. 

    You could reach out to Jason Smith from Advanced Electrical Rebuilders for some advice or just have him do the conversion.



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  3. 6 hours ago, Frank DuVal said:

    I'll go along with the batteries in that statement, but what resources are used in the electronics and motor that are not already used in vehicles today? 🤔  Motor is just copper wire wound on steel, common three phase induction motors.

    For the the higher efficiency motors it requires rare earth elements like neodymium which requires an intensive refinement process. The power electronics requires tin, tantalum, tungsten and gold- all require mining and processing.  

    While we make motors and power electronics today, we have to ramp up production of these which will require significant increased needs of all these elements.


    There is no free beer with switching to “environmentally friendly” EVs.

    • Like 3
  4. 4 hours ago, Peter Gariepy said:



    "All vehicles produce substantial life cycle emissions, and calculating them is complex. However, EVs typically produce fewer life cycle emissions than conventional vehicles because most emissions are lower for electricity generation than burning gasoline or diesel. "

    If we change “pollution” to “environmental impact”, the EV benefit is further reduced by the negative impacts created by the manufacturing of the batteries, electronics and motors which require a lot of environmental resources which are in limited supply.


    My point is EVs are no panacea. Just like bio ethanol fuels, there are a lot of trade offs when you look at the entire picture. 

    EVs will have their place as will some fully autonomous vehicles and ICE vehicles. 

    • Like 2
  5. 54 minutes ago, edinmass said:

    Just something for thought..............


    Virtually every tire guy working on a split ring, snap ring, clincher, ect...........has ABSOLUTELY NO CLUE about antique cars, has no clue about metal fatigue, has no clue on difficulty in replacement parts, ect. I can think of four or five shops that I would trust with my wheels. Today, I was doing tire work on my GMC crew cab tow vehicle. Last “good” shop that worked in it for me, that came with great recommendations........damaged my wheels, installed them incorrectly, over tightened the lugs, and didn’t properly apply never seize as I requested. I only spent 3k with them doing tires and some basic maintenance. I’m done with every shop I come across now.......I just do my own work. At least it’s done right, and I don’t have any middle of the night nightmares.....or a daytime driving disaster because 99 percent of all wheel and rim people today are fifth grade drop outs.........no craftsmanship, no pride in work, just shoddy service......and is it time to get high yet? 

    it’s worth fifty dollars per tire minimum to do snap ring wheels............just from the labor standpoint. Then another fifty to cover liability issues. Simply put.......,you can’t pay enough money to most shops to justify the labor, exposure to damage to the rim, paint, or tire. Then the nightmare scenario of a failure of some tire/rim/tube and a resultant loss of life? You got to be nuts to service early car wheels today.

    I couldn't agree more.  I just installed a new set of tires on my 1968 Pontiac Tempest. I had to order the tires since no one seems to carry 205/70R14s with a 3/4" whitewall. I took it to the "best" place around me.  They're basically modern tires- how hard could it be? I specifically mentioned the valve stem length and make sure they are correct so they stick through the wheel cover - no, they screwed that up.  I specifically discussed protecting my 3/4" whitewalls - tore one of those. No pride in work - just get it out the door.


    When I restored my 1923 Studebaker, I did all the work on the disc wheels, tires, tubes, flaps, 90 degree valve stems, split rims because I had all the tools - basically a small pry bar.  It took a while but if you don't rush, it is pretty simple, although you do need to go through great pains to protect the wheels from getting scratched and black paint will show every flaw.  I just took a few precautions when first filling them up. I've had no issues with those at all.

  6. 3 hours ago, MHuppguy said:

    If you are running tubeless tires , wether bias ply or radial ply, on a rim designed for tube type tires you must use a tube!  and a radial tube if you are going to radial tires.  Do this in spite of the laws in some states the ban the use of tubes in tubeless tires. The radial tube is thicker than the bias ply tire tube and will  wear much longer.  The tube is essential because it will hold the tire bead in place on the tube type rim.  The bead lock is a safety ridge necessary to keep the tire from separating from the bead under hard cornering situations.  The shape of the bead for a tubeless tire is different than that of a tube type tire and may not remain seated on the wheel rim in some circumstances.  For old, non tubeless rims, always use a "gutter strip" to cover the rivets in the drop center.  I have learned this over the last 62 years in the auto repair business and teaching automotive Technology for 30 years, so these are not just my opinions.

    It's the air pressure inside the tire that holds the bead in place during cornering - doesn't really matter if there is a tube in there or not.  If your tire is at the proper pressure the bead will stay in place, regardless of having an older rim. I run Diamondback radials on my 1939 LaSalle with no tubes and it corners quite fine.  Now, if you want to argue that underinflated tires will start to unbead at high corner loading and all it takes is a little bit of unbeading to immediately deflate your tire without a tube, then I can buy in to your argument. I make it a point to check my inflation pressures often and, with radials, it's pretty easy to see the bulge at the tire patch when the pressure is low.  This is especially true with Diamondbacks which run at 45 psi so they look like a bias ply (no bulge) when at proper pressure. One other observation....my rims are riveted and I didn't seal over the rivet heads inside the rims and none of the 5 tires have leaks. If I did it again, I probably would seal them - I just hadn't thought about it at the time.  

  7. Top failure - condenser.  I know you tried three so probably not that.

    Next failure is a bad coil.

    Next failure is bad points.  Just because you put in new doesn't mean they are right. I suggest getting a NOS set, as I previously suggested, or at least check the spring pressure.  Maybe you already did this. 


  8. I suggest looking around on eBay.  This 284-Y looks to have a little different base that is clocked about 90 degrees off of the 284-S. The 284 series coils are built the same internally but the suffix number generally refers to variations in the high tension lead connection, base mounting and clocking of the coil.  If your high tension lead can be mounted 90 degrees off nominal one way or the other, then this coil may work for your car.  Of course, it may not function at all - that's the gamble buying old parts.  I've had a number of these over the years and they all worked - some had a bit stronger spark than  others.



    Good luck,


  9. I really doubt the timing all of a sudden changed, so I wouldn't mess with that just yet. 


    I had a similar issue on my 1939 V8 LaSalle and racked my brain as it sure seemed to be fuel related.  It behaved similarly....would idle fine and run fine at higher rpms but as soon as you took it for a drive and put some load on the engine it would start dying out it as you tried driving faster. It turned out the spring pressure on my point set (which was new) was very low compared to the old set.  I looked up the specifications and did my best to measure the spring load and it showed low. I put a NOS point set in and problem solved.


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  10. 2 minutes ago, CarFreak said:

    The RE Olds Museum is awesome!  We've been going there since 1981 and appreciate their presence and how they present the history. 


    They were able to recently (last couple years) obtain ownership of their building and have embarked on many improvements.  We're going there shortly, in the next few months, for a club meeting.  We contributed to the new bathrooms which should help them be able to rent their facilities for events and contribute to their revenue.  Looking forward to seeing the changes. 

    You should come to the "Cars and Coffee" type event on May 1st or June 5th (8-10am and 1/2 off)

  11. https://www.reoldsmuseum.org/


    The RE Olds Transportation Museum is located in downtown Lansing, MI and is dedicated to Ransom Eli Olds and Lansing’s contributions to the automotive industry.  It walks you through the early stationary engines of the late 1800s, Olds’ early development of steam (1883), gasoline (1896) and electric (1899) vehicles and the formation of Olds Motor Works which employed the first use of a progressive assembly line for automobile production. It then covers Mr. Old’s second car company, the REO Motor Car Company and when Lansing, for a short time, became the Car Capital of the world having two of the largest automobile manufacturers.

    The museum owns about 90 vehicles and has over 60 on exhibit at any one time which includes vehicles from all eras. The focus is on Lansing built engines, equipment and vehicles which includes Oldsmobile, Viking, REO, Diamond REO, Durant, Star and a few miscellaneous GM built products including an EV1. They also host a REO powered equipment display (mowers, snowblowers, boat motor).  The museum has a large Oldsmobile archives and is recognized as having the largest collection of REO information. The location is recognized as a Michigan Historic Site as the vintage boardroom is part of the original Bates and Edmonds engine factory dating from 1904.  


    They host the Car Capital Auto Show in downtown Lansing in July each year. The museum and the boardroom are both available to rent.

    • Like 2
  12. Personally I would just use a decent brand straight weight like SAE 30 and save your money. ZDDP wasn’t even around when your car was built. It wasn’t until high compression engines with high valve spring pressures were designed in the 1940s to support the war that the additives were needed. Post war automobile engines began to be introduced that used the learnings from the war to create more power and those engines required a balanced zinc and phosphorus content to reduce wear issues. Running a high ZDDP content oil won’t hurt your engine but it certainly isn’t needed. What will hurt is adding too much ZDDP, like using VR1 and using a ZDDP additive. If you want to step it up a bit and buy synthetic oils those are about the best you can get.  My problem is, without an oil filter, the carbon content from combustion doesn't get filtered out and the oil gets pretty dirty in 500 or 1000 miles so I like to change my oil fairly often.  I stick with mineral based oils in my 1923 Studebaker for that reason.

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