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About pskinner

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  1. Overdrive was available on the 1960 Ford, but to date, no 1960 Edsels have ever been found with it. Of course the 1959 Edsel didn't list overdrive as being available but to date about a dozen examples have been found and verified as being factory equipment. What is also interesting is that while overdrive wasn't listed for the 1960 Edsel, in the shop manual an entire chapter is dedicated to it servicing and maintenance! When you do a history, don't forget to include all of the information from the data plate. Phil Skinner, Kelley Blue Book,
  2. There were actually only 76 Ranger convertibles produced for the 1960 model years. Due to the many shared body and chassis components between the 1960 Ford and 1960 Edsel, a few back-yard mechanics have created at least a half-dozen know counterfeit Ranger convertibles. Using parts, mostly from a two-door sedan and a Ford Sunliner, everything is pretty much bolt on. At least one individual went so far as to alter the frame numbers created a bogus "export" edition in light blue and then created another one with totally erroneous numbers altering a Los Angeles built car's ID numbers. If interested in purchasing one of these cars, it doesn't hurt to have it authenticated through on-line forums or feel free to contact me directly. We have accounted for 60 of the 76 convertibles built and pretty much know all the fakes. Phil Skinner, Market Editor, Kelley Blue Book.
  3. This is an interesting car, the 1960 Edsel went into production in early September 1959, went on sale October 15, and was discontinued on November 19, 1959. I maintain a registry for the Edsels and to date have recorded information from a little over 1,050 of the 2,846 Edsels produced for the 1960 model year. Let's break down the VIN of 0U12V700391: 0-1960 model year; U-Louisville, KY assembly plant; 12=Ranger 4-dr sedan; V=223 cid/145 HP "Mileage Maker Six" in-line 6-cylinder engine; 7=Edsel; 00391=391st Edsel for 1960 scheduled for production at Louisville. (Note: cars did not then, nor do they now, come down an assembly line in exact unit sequence order) The body code line breaks down as follows Body 58A=Ranger 4-dr sedan (1 of 1,228 produced), Color MJ1=(M) Polar White body (J) Regal Red roof (1) Two-tone paint scheme designator; Trim 20=Silver Moroccan vinyl bolsters with Black Pebble cloth inserts; Date 21J=September 21, 1959 as the day your cars was scheduled to be assembled; Trans 1=3-speed manual transmission; Axle 1=3.56:1 rear axle ratio. Of the 1,228 Ranger 4-dr sedans produced for 1960, I have on file 338 or just over 27.5% of total production. Out of that number I have only 7 others with this paint color, but this car is the only one on file with this trim code "20" listed (the others show trim code 25 which is red vinyl with black cloth). I hope you find this information useful. If any other members have Edsel questions, please feel free to contact me.
  4. I had the honor to personally inspect this car and interview the person repping the vehicle at a 2007 World Wide Auction in Houston. He had been an employee of the O'Neal funeral home on 11/22/63, and was at Parkland when the President's car arrived. The car being offered was a very early production 1964 model unit, and was one of the first Miller-Meteor units for 1964. It is the real deal, no questions on this one. The coach was used in regular service up to the 1990's, so there were a few minor changes, such as the curtains, tires, etc.
  5. Barry: I have not been to the Mark II forum. I have a passing interest in the Mark II, they are such an important and I think much over looked and mis-understood car. My main interest are Edsels. If you would like to e-mail me directly, try I am the Collector Car Market Editor for the Kelley Blue Book. Phil
  6. I think I misunderstood you. On the production order form, where does the engine number appear, in the number in the upper right corner or is it the hand written number below the trim description box, or somewhere else? I have also seen a number of early production Mark II's that had A/C and found body tags with numbers like "A/C 123". Your car came with out A/C, so this wouldn't apply to yours. Phil
  7. We are talking about the stamped number in the upper right hand corner, correct? I have never heard that theory. In the files at the Henry Ford, I have seen a lot of orders that were cancelled. Interesting. Phil
  8. Barry: One might think that logically when a order was placed, the chassis number would be issued. However, in the automotive world of production, logic rarely takes place. The following list are the Mark II unit numbers from 1110 to 1135 followed by their order numbers. 1110-126; 1111-131; 1112-134; 1113-143; 1114-132; 1115-Not on File; 1116-142; 1117-143; 1118-135; 1119-139; 1120-136; 1121-149; 1122-158; 1123-153; 1124-147; 1125-138; 1126-137; 1127-176; 1128-159; 1129-163; 1130-154; 1131-211; 1132-152; 1133-150; 1134-167; 1135-161. Also, the delivery dates are all askew if you look only at the chassis (VIN) number unit sequence. I also have found a number of orders that were cancelled, so that if you lined up the order numbers there would be plenty of gaps. However, your documentation about 1120 and your car 1126, being damaged in transport are priceless and your theory about those cars being diverted to Derham and H&E makes perfect sense! Any other questions, feel free to contact me. Phil
  9. Barry: According to my research, C5681120 was order #136, and was delivered to Downtown Motor Sales Co., Chicago, IL on or about Sept. 21, 1955, about five days before that letter you found. It was considered an introduction unit and was a non-air conditioned car, but did have tinted glass. It was Black (01) with trim 1E4L, Deep Gray leather biscuits and medium Gray leather bolsters. Hope this helps. Phil