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1910Hupp

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Posts posted by 1910Hupp

  1. Andrew 

    No clutch brake  You haven't adjusted the two screws on the side of  the gearbox?? As the last time mine did this  I had fiddled with them .  Try putting the clutch rod back as it was. If this doesn't work take the top of the box and have  a look what is happening inside when you move the gear lever- Karl 

  2. It's running fine -Leaning the mixture a bit fixed the excessive fuel vapour problem. Idles really well but is  slightly more sluggish at speed than with the Holley  but I suspect that will come dowm to air valve adjustment  and  needle settings which I will sort out over the next few weeks -Karl 

  3. David I'm glad one of us does it still confuses me !  I once asked my Grandfather a highly skilled mechanic (as was his father before him) how they set the timing before timing lights . He just laughed and said when it was set right  it ran right -a a trip round the block told you all you needed to know . Sometimes  I think we over complicate things -Karl

  4. No Advanced  as in early ignition is spark before (or closer to)TDC  and retarded as in late ignition is spark after  (or further away from) TDC . In the recent Thread "Timing the Model 20"   Max talks about  setting the ignition by turning the flywheel back by 3/8 of inch from TDC which will set the timing advanced by 2.7 degrees but of course this is the opposite of what the book says -Karl 

  5. The book does talk about  the advanced timing-  the point is  that setting it up as they suggest  does not give advanced timing but slightly retarded. (Only slightly as 3/8 of an inch is not many degrees on the flywheel ) . I suspect  the person who wrote the book  was the same person who labelled the 16.9 HP engine as 20 HP!! In the end it doesn't matter if it runs fine  when set up by the book that's great if it doesn't then  you just adjust it till it does. Karl  

  6. ......

    The Hupp also came with a fixed timing magneto originally, slightly advanced timing at proper setting (per period sales booklet).  I know some people swear by adding a variable timing magneto, personally I think there's little advantage over  a properly timed original set up. .  It sounds like, at full advancement on your variable set up, you're not quite at the fixed factory setting.

    David this confuses me the first mark on the front of the cylinder block is TDC ( I confirmed this with the engine apart) So if you set  the timing  to the mark  to the right of this (given  the  flywheel turns this way) then you are setting the  timing retarded after TDC not advanced! Am I right or am I deluded ?? Karl 

  7. Easy  to get the  gears milled.  If Phil posts the Diametrical pitch and  number of teeth etc  it might be fun to try and mill one  up on my lathe . I have all the gear to do gear cutting  but haven't had a crack yet -Karl 

  8. I've never used a  baffle  and  the oil  leak is minimal  -Perhaps  a drop under  the  cover  at the end of long run (given the oil leaks from the breather overflow this  is tiny in comparison) I do have the the lip seal in the  front  of the gear cover . Taking the  magneto out to set it up on  a bench is fine  but it's very easy to  knock the  mag drive installing it and upset everything again. The lip seal also  bears on the magneto drive shaft  meaning even a  slight knock to the gear cover may move the driveshaft and  upset the timing. I set mine up on the bench and then use Andreas  nail polish to mark the correct posiion of the drive wheel  to  make sure it stays correct -Still normally  end up doing  it a few times to get it right  -Karl 

  9. Phil When the distributor rotor is on segment number one and the points are just about to open is the point you want  . Surprisingly although it sounds easy   it  always seems a little  difficult  to  determine  the  exact position where the points are just about to  open. When you find this point  you  are  meant to mesh the magneto  drive  to  the camshaft  drive with the flywheel lined up with the second mark and  the timing is set .

    You can  put a timing light on the lead to Number  one  and power it with  a 12 v  car battery. Just like  normal it will  pulse  when  number one  fires  off which might help you as well -Karl

  10. Phil the first mark  is TDC and the  second mark  is  3/8 to the right of the first mark  and is the allignment mark. So if you line up with this 2nd  mark (as per the manual)  you are setting  the  timing retarded  after TDC . I firmly believe with fixed  ignition that  this must be wrong.  I do set my ignition like this  but have fitted  variable  ignition and I set it retarded on this  position and run with  the ignition timing advanced from this position.-Karl 

  11. After reading this thread, it would seem to me that possibly a sticking intake valve could cause this issue. However, as it has been a long time since I worked on a Breeze, I read the entire 56 page manual. I found this reference on page 41:

    Gas Blowing Back Through Carbureter. Automatic

    inlet valves have a vcry short lift, and

    when the engine has more than one cylinder, the

    springs in these valves must be of an even tension.

    If the springs are weak or have too rnuch lift, part

    of the gas will be blown backwards through the

    valves and the carburetcr in the compression stroke.

    Jon.

    Thanks Jon The Hup doesn't have atmospheric inlets and appears to have good compression on all pots. It only seems to happen at full throttle .

    Having said that I haven' touched it for the last few days as I'm laid up with a slipped disc . So cranking it over is out for a while :(

  12. Yes Thanks David I do - you kindly sent me the manual some time ago and I picked up the original booklet subsequently on ebay. However no mention of fuel vapour out of the bottom of the carburettor at full throttle in either -Karl

  13. The excessive fuel out the bottom of the carburettor at full throttle problem I think has been solved. When I got the rebuilt carb back for Stan Howe he had set it up with the throttle arm on the wrong side. It was a simple matter to swap it over to the other side. When I moved it however I didn't pay enough attention to the position of the throttle butterfly relative to the throttle arm . So with the throttle closed the butterfly was acually a little open as I opened the throttle the butterfly valve actually closed and the opened up but of course never opened fully at full throttle . This partial obstruction I think was the cause of the problem but time will tell!

  14. Thanks Phil -I vaguely remembered that this had come up previously. I still have some reservations about a cast crank but the low horsepower of the Hupp might mean one is ok. Certainly sounds cheaper but by the time we factor in exchange rate and shipping and then do machining on top of this I suspect there won't be a lot of difference in cost for us -Karl

  15. Roger - I spoke to Graham he thinks about $1800 to $2000 plus GST less 10% discount for VCC membership. He does say that the more he gets the cheaper he can do it - I'm deciding if I would like a spare. For our international friends NZ$2000 is today about US$1500 (GST is sales tax at 15% and I don't think applies for overseas sales ) Karl

  16. No problems Roger I'll give Graham a ring on Monday and let you know. I agree about not using it -My spare crankcase casting has a massive hole in the side of it where a crank obviously let go. I'm sure that we can get a crank made locally without having to worry about exchange rates and shiping costs . Will be in touch -Karl

  17. It lives !!! Thanks to all. In the end I think it was a combination of the needle valve not being opened enough and the air valve being open to much . Seems to idle well but when I open up the throttle I do seem to get a lot fuel vapor coming out the bottom the carb- I guess it will be a matter of fiddling with the needle valve and the air valve control settings to eliminate this - Ken ? Edgar? David? Karl

  18. Ouch Roger - I can get it done down here in the Manawatu . B and H engineering in Palmerston North do all the Vintage car engine work for this end of the island and a lot for overseas - Currently they are making 1912 Simplex engines from scratch for a customer . They have certainly seen the inside of my engine and have made a camshaft for me and it was pretty cheap ( about NZ$600) and most of that was the cost of getting it hardened etc . I would thoroughly recommend their work they also give a 10% discount for VCC members . When we had my engine apart they crack tested my crankshaft which thankfully was ok but Graham (the owner) didn't think it would be a big job to make another one if needed If you want I can talk to Graham and get a rough idea of what it would cost to make a crankshaft. Karl

  19. Max Tried the Model T gasket rings and they are a tad smaller than the ports. My plan was to use my copper rings and over the top of them use a copper crush gasket with an ID close to the ring OD. I think I will probably use my rings plus a gasket. The exhaust gasket for a Mini can be cut up to provide a nice size gasket for the ports- Karl

  20. Thanks a million Max -The frustration level was getting pretty high. Once I ruled out a blockage in the manifold I fiqured it was too much air getting in somewhere but didn't think of the air valve. Getting a seal on the inlet manifold block interface may also be a contribution to the problem . What I tried to do was turn down some 1 3/8 copper pipe so the OD fitted the ID of the manifold and block. The I parted off the pipe into to rings 50 thou longer than the combined recess in block and manifold . After annealing the rings I put them in and installed the manifolds . My plan was that the rings would squish up and expand and create a seal . However the recesses in the manifold are not of uniform depth and vary by about 15 thou round the circumference so perhaps I didn't get as much crush /seal as I wanted . Nice to know that after a 100 years the ANZACs are still looking out for each other ! Karl

  21. Well yet again I had a go at installing my reconditioned breeze carburettor and yet again it would not run. It was fully rebuilt by Stan Howe and I know it has been bench run and flow tested. It will start if I fill the priming cups but won't run for more than a few beats before stopping . Opening up the throttle makes no difference during those few beats. I wonder about the reproduction inlet manifold but it appears to have no blockages in it . I'll check it out tomorrow . Failing that I wonder about a leak at the manifold block junction. It ran fine with the old (butchered) manifold and Holly NH carb-Karl

  22. Thanks Phil looks ok . He states "some small parts missing but nothing major" Everything missing on a Hup 20 is a major! :) Having said that the only thing I can see missing is the magneto drive cover which I'm sure the new owner would never find and would have to get one cast up . -Karl

  23. Thanks Max I never knew that the Hupp engine was used in any other vehicle . I found this picture of a 1912 Little and sure enough its our beloved engine . More importantly it shows me how to mount a fan (I have searched and searched for a photo of Hupps accessory fan) Also I am intriqued by the way the rods are set up allow advance and retard of the mag. Karl

    http://www.conceptcarz.com/view/photo/399493,16959/1912-Little-Roadster_photo.aspx

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