1937 Buick 66C

https://www.ebay.com/itm/296315362230?mkevt=1&mkpid=0&emsid=e11021.m5057.l9429&mkcid=7&ch=osgood&euid=98afec5664a0405abd9eab8188a5df69&bu=43187102861&ut=RU&osub=-1~1&crd=20240324023325&segname=11021

This looks like the same car that sold on 2/29/2024, Lot 62, at Bonhams Amelia Island Auction for $59,360 ($30K markup in two weeks). At Bonhams it was stated to be from the George Holman Collection.

Best wishes to Terry for a rapid recovery. My Goldendoodle hasn't done me in yet...

If you are using the site https://www.autocolorlibrary.com/pages/1948-Packard.html you will see a one or two letters adjacent to each color chip. Those letters are what would appear on your dataplate to determine your car's color. My Station Sedan was Golden Green from the factory, therefore the code 'F' would appear on the dataplate. All Station Sedans are "Standard Eight" chassis, therefore use the 288 engine.

The Packard station wagon of this vintage is called the Station Sedan. The Station Sedan is a "Standard Packard 8", using the 288 cu in straight 8. It is my understanding that the colors for the Station Sedan are the same as those for the sedans of this vintage. The paint code for the car is stamped on the dataplate on the left side of the cowl, under the hood. The stamping is not embossed, so on my car the paint code was no longer visible. I am currently embarking on the reconstruction of the tailgate (and doing general wood maintenance) and finally figured out the color of my car when I removed the support boards under the cargo bed. Color cards are available at https://hdpaintcode.com/packard/ or https://www.autocolorlibrary.com/pages/1948-Packard.html. Per Ed Ostrowski of the Packard Club, there is a book by Robert Neal, entitled Packard 1948-50 that is a good reference book and contains a chapter specific to the Station Sedan. There is an image of my Station Sedan in the vehicles subsection of my website if you are curious. My Station Sedan has been repainted in an incorrect color, but the paintwork is presentable so I am not going to change it back to the correct color at this time.

Hello Evan, The symptoms you describe, as well as your observations indicate that the car is not running due to fuel starvation. Carburetors don't "go out" per se, and there are several potential sources for your symptoms. Your symptoms sounds very much like vapor lock (fuel boiling in the lines due to high temperature - the mechanical fuel pump cannot push vapor into the carburetor). I suggest the following steps to further isolate the problem: Add a couple of gallons of fresh fuel to the tank to make sure you have adequate fuel in the tank to cover the intake for the fuel pump. It is important to be absolutely certain that you have some fresh fuel in the tank. Disconnect the fuel line at the carburetor. (It's helpful to have a second person to do this and subsequent steps) Crank the engine as if to start it. Once the fuel pump has fuel (maybe 10 seconds) fuel should squirt out of the fuel line you have disconnected in pulses. If no fuel, your fuel pump is suspect and should be rebuilt. If you have fuel, reconnect the line to the carburetor. Again, crank the engine as if to start the car. After another 10 seconds, the fuel pump should have filled the carburetor bowl with fuel and the car should start. If the car does not start, peer down the carburetor with a flashlight and open the throttle by hand. There should be a squirt of fuel in each throat of the carburetor with each stroke of the throttle. If no fuel is observed, the needle valve in the carburetor is likely to be stuck. Try lightly tapping the top of the carburetor, near where the fuel line attaches with a metal tool. Repeat step 4. If still no fuel observed when opening and closing the throttle, there is either a problem with the needle valve or accelerator pump that will require that you remove the carburetor from the engine and disassemble it for overhaul on your workbench. Fuel containing ethanol is problematic in old cars. Of immediate concern is that ethanol dissolves the rubber diaphragms in mechanical fuel pumps as well as the o-rings and seals in the accelerator pump in your carburetor. If you have not had either your carburetor or fuel pump rebuilt in the last few years, you will need to do so for them to continue working with modern fuels. Specifically, if you are rebuilding these yourself, or having the work done, it is important to make sure that the soft parts you are using are ethanol resistant (viton). I also suggest that you consider installing an electric fuel pump as a supplement to the mechanical fuel pump. This will reduce the probability of vapor lock in the future, especially when using fuels with ethanol which have a lower vapor pressure than pure gasoline.

Hello Gino, I have two cars with Pertronix (1937 Buick and 1969 Porsche), so I'll take a guess at some things to look at. Are you very confident that the distributor and rotor are turning with the engine? I've had a distributor that was not fully seated, so it wasn't fully engaging its drive gear. I've also had a rotor that was slipping on the distributor shaft (bad fit on aftermarket part) that was not actually turning once the cap was installed. When I look at your second-to-last image showing the Pertronix pick-up and rotor, I am not seeing the "sender" that fits over the cam in the distributor to trigger the Pertronix. On both of my cars, the Pertronix "sender" fits over the lobes of the distributor cam where the original points rubbing block touched the distributor cam. On my cars, the top of the Pertronix sender is approximately level with the Pertronix pick up, as the sender has to fit over the cam lobes to get "indexed" to the position of the engine. Since you are having no spark at all, I'd be inclined to retrofit the new distributor with mechanical points, if possible. Mechanical points give you more options for diagnosing your ignition, and will also tell you if your Pertronix unit or your coil has failed. Can you rotate the distributor while cranking the engine to see if you can find a point where the engine fires? My 1937 Buick (straight 8 ) static times at around 10 degrees, so 17 seems like a lot of advance. In any case, you should get some response from the engine Hopefully these suggestions will lead you to a solution. Let me know what you eventually find...

Dave, We have a member (Dave Schneider) in our local club who has a warehouse full of hubcaps and wheel covers for sale. He might have one or more of these. He can be reached at 970-667-1720 or email: sneedley@msn.com.

Good Day Lars, I have 1937 66C and detailed images of the interior of the car from my restoration, nearly a decade ago. I can provide you with the images I have if you think they would be helpful, noting that mine is 1 model year newer.

I am the webmaster for the Rocky Mountain division of the Buick Club of America. I have recently been contacted to post two pre-war Buicks for sale on our website. The first (blue car) is a 1927 Buick Standard, model 115. I am not familiar with this car, but the images indicate good condition. The second (green car) is an unrestored 1929 Buick that has been owned by two different members of our club, and has been in attendance at multiple events over the last decade or so. You can access the ads directly on the classifieds section of the Rocky Mountain website: http://rockymountain.buickclub.org/

Another thing that is helpful, if you can do so easily, is to apply the ATF / Acetone mixture when the seized parts are warm (not hot, as the penetrant will flash off prematurely). As the part cools, the penetrant will be be drawn into the threads. As EmTee suggested above, the more cycles the better. If the car is running, you could start the engine to warm up the manifold, then apply the ATF / Acetone penetrant and allow to cool.

I concur with either "bump-steer" as noted by Bloo, or an issue with the rear swaybar links / bushings. You have had a full, 4-wheel alignment, right? A front end alignment alone is not sufficient.

I do encounter hot starting problems on all of my old cars (Buick, Chrysler, Packard). Hot-start problems are generally caused by one of two conditions, vapor lock or flooding caused by percolation. Let's look at each of these issues independently: Vapor Lock: Vapor Lock occurs when fuel boils in the fuel system, replacing liquid gasoline in the fuel line with fuel vapor. The engine is fuel starved and will not start. Modern fuels, particularly fuels with ethanol, have a much lower vapor pressure (they boil at a lower temperature than pure gasoline), therefore are more likely to cause vapor lock. Use ethanol-free fuel whenever available. Treating the fuel by adding Diesel, Marvel Myster Oil or Stabil fuel additive will reduce, but not eliminate, vapor lock. Mechanical fuel pumps are intended to move liquid, not vapor. When fuel has boiled in the fuel line is usually take place in the engine compartment and cannot be overcome by the mechanical fuel pump. Fuel no longer reaches the carburetor, and the engine will not start due to fuel starvation. Using an electric fuel pump, placed between the fuel tank and the mechanical fuel pump, will push cooler fuel from the tank into the fuel system, displacing the vaporized fuel with liquid fuel which will eventually allow the car to start. To hot start a car with an electric fuel pump, the fuel pump needs to run until the fuel system is pressurized. This is similar to running the electric fuel pump to prime the engine when the car has not been used for an extended period. Percolation (hot flooding): Percolation occurs when residual fuel in the carburetor bowl becomes heat-soaked and boils out of the carburetor into the intake manifole when the hot engine is stopped. This causes the engine to flood, and difficult to restart. You have percolation taking place if you observe any raw fuel leaking from the carburetor shortly after shutdown when heat from the engine has reached the carburetor. Watch around the throttle shaft a few minutes after shutdown for evidence that raw fuel is boiling through the carburetor. In order to hot start a flooded car, you want to crank the engine while holding the throttle open. When you press on the throttle you trigger one pump fuel from the accelerator pump in the carburetor, however this is not sufficient to flood the engine unless you repeatedly "pump" the throttle. On cars like Buick and Packard, where the throttle is used to engage the starter, you may need to hold the throttle open for a long enough period to deplete your battery charge. In these cases, you may want to sit in the car, engine off, and hold the throttle open for several minutes to allow the surplus fuel to evaporate without cranking the engine. You need to crank the engine long enough to allow surplus fuel to be evaporated from the carburetor, intake manifold and cylinders in order to hot start the car. Do NOT pump the throttle when attempting to clear a flooded engine, as each stroke of the throttle will inject additional fuel into the intake. Hold the throttle open, and crank the engine. Percolation can be reduced by putting an insulating block between the carburetor and intake manifold to reduce the amount of head being conducted from the engine into the carburetor. A spacer made from a block of phenolic material can be of great value here. You can have both conditions at once! My 1948 Packard demonstrates both problems concurrently. The fuel percolates into the intake manifold, flooding the engine. I can crank the car with the throttle open to clear the intake manifold and get the car started, but shortly thereafter it will stall due to vaporized fuel (vapor lock) in the metal fuel line in the engine compartment not reaching the carburetor. I am finding that the optimal solution is to not shut the car down unless I can leave it off for long enough to allow the fuel system to cool before attempting to restart. Opening the hood on the side where the carburetor lives improves the cooling.

Whenever my various old cars begin to run strangely, the fault is usually the points. Since you know that the points are slipping closed, I have a couple of things to assist with your diagnostics: Lubrication: Once the fiber block that rides on the distributor eccentric cam begins to wear, the points close pretty quickly. The distributor cam (eccentric) should be lightly lubricated with special points grease or vaseline. Lithium grease is not recommended because it hardens when subjected to temperature extremes. Wear: Remove the moving point and carefully inspect the fiber block that rides on the distributor cam. Ideally, if you have another unused point set available, you can compare the profiles of the fiber blocks to see see how severely worn it is. Once the sharp edge of the fiber block has worn off, the points will not remain in adjustment. Mounting Issue: When you revisit the points, after they have slipped, is the screw that holds the points in place still tight? I've had these small screws begin to strip in a way that is not obvious when you are tightening them, but the threads are sufficiently damaged that they will not adequately bind the points during heat cycles and engine vibration. If the screw is not really tight, the points will close up. If the screw is tight, maybe using a wavy washer under the screw to secure the points more aggressively. If the screw is suspect, you may want to replace it with a slightly larger, self-tapping screw and washer to secure the points. The ultimate solution is to replace the points / condenser with a Pertronics or similar ignition trigger that replaces your points and condenser with an electronic module. This change is not obtrusive, and solves all manner of issues related to ignition. I have made this change in my Porsche 912, and will do it to my 1937 Buick when I rebuild the distributor this fall.

Hello TooMany, I cannot answer your question at this time as my Light Eight is at my storage facility. If you do not receive a useful response, please advise me via personal email and I will measure and report back to you. If an image might be useful, one is available at the vehicles subsection of my website.

Good evening, I concur with 1939_Buick's post regarding the importance of keeping the carburetors level. The entire design and flow of the carburetor, especially the graduated air correction and full throttle enrichment jet behavior depends on the fuel level in the bowl. When the fuel level is not "balanced", the carburetor will not function as designed. When I first purchased my 1937 Century, it had an intake manifold from a 1939 on it, tilting the carburetor causing all manner of strange behavior. The engine would fuel starve under acceleration, then load up with excess fuel when braking. I found and installed the correct intake manifold, and these problems vanished. I note that this was also using a Carter WCD carburetor from a later Buick. The Stromberg carburetors work very well, although the automatic choke mechanisms on the original AAV1 and AAV2 carburetors for 1937 and 1938 are unnecessarily complex and tedious to deal with. Per my previous paragraph, the Carter WCD that was on my car when purchased worked more coherently and had a reliable automatic choke. I retro-fitted to the correct Stromberg AA series carburetor when I restored the car (I do show it). The Stromberg works find as a carburetor, although the automatic choke is a persistent challenge. A small amount of fuel dripping from the throttle shafts after you have shut the engine off and it is hot is normal. The carburetors get heat soaked from the exhaust manifold, the fuel in the bowl expands and leaks onto the throttle. This dripping should stop after a few minutes. The insulating blocks you have installed under the carburetors will reduce, but not eliminate this leakage.

Good Morning, The thermo breaker is a bi-metal strip that flexes when heated, and opens the contacts that provide power. It tolerates only the amperage that Buick anticipated with the factory lighting before it heats. When the thermo breaker temperature returns to normal, the contacts close and the connection returns to normal (there is no reset). The symptom you describe is the proper behavior of the thermo breaker when a persistent overload is present. The thermo breaker is an exceedingly simple and robust device and is not prone to failure. While your test may have initially tripped the breaker, your test may also have overstressed one of the other connections on the circuit that was marginal, and is now unable to recover. A spark at one or more of the other connection points, caused by the additional load, will erode the connection increasing resistance (similar to what happens to ignition points); More current is required to overcome the erosion, causing the breaker to trip. You will need to isolate which of the circuits on the light switch is creating the overload condition, causing the breaker to trip. In order to do this, you will need to disconnect all of the output wires from the light switch, then reconnect them one at a time to identify which circuit is creates the overload condition. Once you have identified the offending circuit, disconnect and clean each connection on that circuit. Be sure to check the wire where it attaches to each connector; There should be no discoloration of corrosion. The point where the wires attach to the connectors is a point of physical stress and may require replacing the connector. While you are doing these diagnostics, you should also clean the points on the thermo breaker with fine emery cloth to remove any corrosion introduced by sparks when the thermo breaker was opening and closing. You will not be able to connect auxiliary lights through the light switch without overloading it. It has been designed to tolerate only the amperage that Buick intended for the factory lighting. You will need to put a relay on the auxiliary light circuit, such that the light switch sees only the small amount of current required to trigger the relay. The contacts within the relay then provide switching of the power necessary to drive the auxiliary lights.

Good Afternoon, I have a few notes for you based on the restoration I completed on my 66C. My switch contained 5 of the little metal balls. The wiring harness to the glove box door is only 3 wires as you have observed; None are ground. Ground is provided through the door hinge, so the mounting screws need to be clean. One wire is for the clock power, and one wire each for the bulbs that illuminate the glove box and clock. It does not appear on the factory wiring diagram, I assume because the clock was an extra-cost accessory. You need to make a small opening in the left base of the glove box shell to route the wiring. The clock power and glove box light feeds need to be "always on", therefore I used the lighter as the source of power for the clock as the lighter is the closest source of continuous power to the glove box. I did put an in-line fuse (hidden under the dash, hear the lighter) so I can remove the fuse when I'm not using or showing the car so there is no battery drain from the clock (it isn't very much, anyway) when the car is not in use, and to reduce wear on the clock. I used the instrument light circuit for the lamp that illuminates the clock, tapping into the instrument bulb circuit at the radio. Attachments: 08_Glovebox_Light_Complete.JPG: My glovebox switch / socket after restoration. 03_Glovebox_Light_Detail1.JPG: Image of glove box switch / socket (note 5 balls made up the switch) 09_Clock&Glovebox_Complete.JPG: Back of assembled glove box door after restoration

Here is an image of the light switch, installed, also showing the cowl vent opening. I cannot help with the trunk bumpers, as I do not have a coupe.

Good Day BuickTom87, My 1937 66C had an oil filter installed when I purchased the car. It was Fram cartridge unit that was mounted to the RF of the engine, with the filter bracket attached to the intake manifold. It was tapped into the oil line between the engine block and the head (line which provides oil to the rocker shaft). I have attached an image of the oil filter as mounted onto my engine prior to removal. The image does not show the mounting very clearly, but will give you an idea of how these were mounted and plumbed into the engine. As I was doing a full restoration, and the filter canister showed evidence of leaking, I removed it. My thoughts on your desire to install this filter to your 1938 320 engine follow: These engines are designed for use of non-detergent oil, and no oil filter. Non-detergent oils do not "suspend" contaminants in detergents in the the oil as modern oils do. The oil pan is quite deep, and sediment was expected to settle out of the oil when stationary, and sink to the bottom of the oil pan, below the oil pick up. I would not install the filter on your 1938. These filters are not "full-flow", in that they only filter that portion of the oil that is going from the engine block to the rocker shaft. In reality, they filter only a minimal part of the engine oil. On my Porsche 912, the canister oil filter sees less than 10% of the circulating oil; I would presume that the volume of oil filtered in the Buick would be similarly small. Adding the oil filter to your 1938 presents additional opportunities for leaks at the oil line couplings and filter canister. There is a probability that the oil flow to the rocker shaft will be reduced as the oil now needs to pass through the filter where there was none planned at the time that the engine lubrication system was designed.

The starter on my 1936 C9 Airflow is giving me fits. After several occassions where the solenoid will operate, but will not run the starter motor, the problem became permanent resulting in a tow home. My shop has removed the starter (Autolite max-4003), and has disassembled the starter solenoid. They found that the hot side contact within the solenoid is not secure in it's insulator, preventing the plunger from landing on it properly. The shop thinks this is likely the source of the problem with the starter not operating properly. The contact is supposed to have a square opening that secures it to its insulator; The corners of the opening have been rounded off, no longer allowing the contact to be secure in the solenoid. We have been unable to locate the appropriate solenoid repair kit, nor have we been able to source a replacement solenoid. If anyone on the list has these parts available, or knows where they might be sourced, please advise me at your earliest convenience. I note that I plan on attending the national meet in Independence, MO, next week, so I could purchase an available item at that time.

Hello Drakeule, This sure sounds like a carburetor problem, especially since you have been doing work on the fuel system. On these old Buicks, there really isn't anything electrical that is different between idle and off-idle operation. If it is idling OK, probably not electrical. Based on your description, when you open the throttle, the blast of air leans out the mixture and the car dies. I suspect two probable culprits, or maybe a combination of both: The accelerator pump is not pumping fuel when the throttle is opened. With the air cleaner removed, peer into the carburetor with a bright flashlight. When you open the throttle, you should see a distinct squirt of fuel into the throat of the carburetor. If nothing, or a drip or two, some part of the accelerator pump circuit is not functioning properly or is blocked. To properly service, you will need to remove the carburetor, then get the pump working properly on your workbench. The main fuel jet has become clogged with some debris. You may be able to correct this by removing the carb cover and spraying carburetor cleaner into all of the orifices and openings you can see with the cover removed. If this is not successful, you will need to pull the carb and take it apart and clean blow out all of the orifices.

Excellent idea. Inspiration for me to build up a mount for the bluetooth rear-view camera screen and battery. I'm too short to be driving about in these old convertibles, with no rearward visibility!!

Good Evening Beastmode54, When you encountered these problems, what was the temperature gauge showing? Was the Buick overheating?

Good Afternoon Matt et al, Since this appears to be a persistent / recurring problem, it sounds like it's time to verify that the entire.fuel system is intact and operational. I have been dealing with several collector cars from the collection of my late father-in-law. In every case, fuel more than a couple of years old caused exactly the symptoms you are encountering. Fuel that is several years old is a major problem; It is most likely becoming varnish and is no longer usable. I would recommend taking a day and performing a full fuel system diagnostic; none of this is is particularly difficult to do. I strongly recommend acquiring a hand-operated vacuum pump (like a Mity-Vac or similar) where you can safely draw a vacuum on lines that carry flammable liquids. First, remove any old fuel in the fuel tank with fresh fuel. Put a couple of gallons of fresh E0 (non-ethanol) regular grade fuel is ideal, however regular fuel with a stabilizer can be used. You can drain old fuel from the tank using the Mity-Vac (at step #2, you can use thethe MityVac to establish a siphon to drain the tank from under the car, from the rubber line between the tank and steel fuel line secured to the frame) Fuel System Diagnostic: Crawl under the car and trace the fuel line from the tank to the input side of the mechanical fuel pump. Working from the back of the car forward, verify that all rubber fuel lines are intact, and have not swollen shut due to use of ethanol fuels. If uncertain about the lines you encounter, replace them. Using a Mity-Vac or similar tool, apply suction to each line and verify fuel flow. Check for any evidence of leakage from the steel fuel lines that run along the frame. They are steel, and are subject to rust-through. Any evidence of leakage from the steel fuel lines must be addressed; It is both a safety issue, and a point where air will be sucked into the fuel line during fuel pump operation. The mechanical fuel pump can only pump fuel, not air. As you trace the fuel lines forward, do you encounter a fuel filter and/or electric fuel pump installed between the tank and the mechanical fuel pump on the engine? These can obstructing fuel flow into the fuel pump if they have old fuel in them. Remove and bench test any electric fuel pump you encounter. Replace the electric pump if it does not test successfully (Older electric fuel pumps have rubber and plastic components that are not compatible with modern fuels, and the internals of the pump turn into goo. Note here that I am an advocate for installing a low-pressure electric fuel pump along the frame rail between the tank and mechanical fuel pump, therefore if bench testing the pump is unsuccessful, I recommend replacing it with another electric fuel pump). Replace any filters you encounter. If the electric fuel pump tests OK, return it to the car and verify that it is receiving power and pumps fuel when reinstalled. Remove the input fuel line at the mechanical fuel pump; Apply vacuum and verify good fuel flow. If you have an electric fuel pump in the line, you should still be able to draw fuel through the line to the mechanical pump. Reattach the input fuel line at the mechanical fuel pump, and detach the output line between the mechanical pump and carburetor. Again, apply vacuum and confirm fuel flow. (Note: When drawing a vacuum on the fuel line to the carburetor, it will take longer as the fuel will need to fill the mechanical pump, including the glass sediment bowl, before you will see fuel at the carburetor). If you are unable to draw any fuel to the carburetor, but you know from testing step #9 that you have fuel at the input side of the mechanical fuel pump, it is possible that one of the valves in the mechanical fuel pump is stuck shut. You may be able to get it unstuck by tapping on the fuel pump lightly with a hammer while drawing a vacuum on the fuel line at the carburetor. These valves can get stuck when old fuel turns into varnish and "glues" the valves shut. If tapping on the pump does not result in fuel flowing up the line to the carburetor, you will need to remove, disassemble and clean up the valves in the fuel pump. Once you have confirmed that you have fuel flow at the carburetor, you can verify that fuel is getting into the carburetor by operating the throttle while looking down the throat of the carburetor while opening and closing the throttle. You should observe a squirt of fuel each time you operate the throttle. If you do not observe any fuel, the needle valve inside the carburetor is likely to be stuck shut, again from accumulation of varnish. You may be able to free it by tapping on the top of the carburetor near the fuel line connection, otherwise you will need to remove the carburetor cover and clean the needle valve. I hope this helps. Please feel free to contact me directly if you have additional questions or concerns.