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#180431 - 09/24/03 12:11 PM *DELETED*
Anonymous
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Post deleted by 'LiL Reatta. "Because it turned into a Circus".

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#180432 - 09/24/03 08:25 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett
EDBS0 Offline
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Registered: 09/03/01
Posts: 3302
Loc: A.K.A. Easily Distracted by ...
I believe you have a 330 Ohms resistor with + or - 5% accuracy.

It should simply "advise" the ECM to provide maximum spark advance (1 to 2 degree extra) yet still retain proper knock sensor and all other engine function.

The increased idle is confusing.

What pins do you have it installed on?

calculator


Edited by EDBS0 (09/25/03 07:48 PM)
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#180433 - 09/24/03 08:35 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett
2seater Offline
Member

Registered: 11/01/02
Posts: 740
Loc: Appleton, WI
This resistor is installed in the MAF? Can you tell what the diagnostics shows after the install? I understood this went in the MAT sensor but maybe misunderstood or incorrect recollection? The MAF signal is frequency based, not a strictly voltage driven signal, so I am unsure what a resistor across the power feed and signal wire would do? Maybe Padgett has some insight. Very peculiar that a simple $0.10 part could be installed and the GM never thought of it.
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Formerly Turbocharged Reatta

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#180434 - 09/24/03 08:42 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: EDBS0]
2seater Offline
Member

Registered: 11/01/02
Posts: 740
Loc: Appleton, WI
Hmmm, if the spark advance is increased, it will increase the engine speed, especially if the IAC cannot go closed far enough to reduce the speed to the programmed value. If you have ever watched what happens to the spark advance when you go from park/neutral to any gear, the advance jumps 4-6 degrees to help pick up the additional load. If this is indeed the case, and the IAC simply is unable to compensate, the base idle setting on the throttle blade can be reduced to increase the control range for the IAC. Interesting phenomenon.
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Formerly Turbocharged Reatta

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#180435 - 09/24/03 08:51 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: 2seater]
padgett Online
Long Time Member

Registered: 06/02/01
Posts: 6036
Loc: Orlando, Florida, mostly now.
Well the frequency of a resonant circuit is an RC (we'll skip L) function so putting a resistor in parallel should lower the frequency and probably show up as a lower gm/sec value. ED21 is the sensor value that would change and I would be interested in just what the effect was.

Airflow vs rpm is a factor for developing the spark advance table (lower airflow for a given rpm-> lower manifold air pressure->more vaccuum = more advance providing you do not run into knock which would negate everything (do they advise you to run premium fuel ?)
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#180436 - 09/24/03 08:53 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: 2seater]
EDBS0 Offline
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Registered: 09/03/01
Posts: 3302
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The part I am thinking of is for the air temperature (spoof) fools the ECM into thinking it is cooler so more advance is provided.

What do you have??? Does it connect at the air box???

is this it?
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#180437 - 09/24/03 09:07 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: EDBS0]
padgett Online
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Registered: 06/02/01
Posts: 6036
Loc: Orlando, Florida, mostly now.
MAT sensor only has two contacts. A-C on the MAF would tie the hot lead to the output (A-B would just get hot) so makes sense.
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#180438 - 09/25/03 10:07 AM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: 2seater]
Buick Mike Offline
Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 299
Loc: New Orleans
Quote:
Very peculiar that a simple $0.10 part could be installed and the GM never thought of it.


Bingo!

[tiresome rant] It will never cease to amaze me that people will put bilge pumps in their intakes, resistors across their MAF's, swirly things in their airboxes, a few ounces of whatever in their oil/gas/transmission fluid, etc, etc, and expect to see performance increases. If it was that easy the smart, well educated, highly paid factory engineers would have thought of it. [/tiresome rant]

Reality check...A 20HP increase on a 165HP engine would be immediately apparant as soon as you tipped into the gas. The sentence "Cant really tell any increase in HP as of yet but, will give it some time and update this Post soon." would never have been written. It would have been "Holy sh!t, what a difference!!!" No difference was discernable because there was no difference.

Sorry, I'm just in one of those moods today.

Mike

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#180439 - 09/25/03 12:07 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: Buick Mike]
EDBS0 Offline
Long Time Member

Registered: 09/03/01
Posts: 3302
Loc: A.K.A. Easily Distracted by ...
I have got a
Quote:
"Holy sh!t, what a difference!!!"
finished my cone filter with a CAI and there is a very disenable improvement. Still working on a ram air will report then.
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#180440 - 09/25/03 12:20 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett *DELETED* [Re: Buick Mike]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Post deleted by 'LiL Reatta

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#180441 - 09/25/03 04:18 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett *DELETED*
Anonymous
Unregistered


Post deleted by 'LiL Reatta

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#180442 - 09/25/03 04:35 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett
poncho Offline
Member

Registered: 08/28/02
Posts: 103
Loc: Northern Minnesota

I would imagine that it would be a good idea to reset the computer after this installation, yes? If you can, would you provide a picture of your installation?

Also, please report any further observations that you have with this modification. I'm a skeptic when it comes to cheap and seemingly insignificant performance upgrades, but if this resistor does what you say it does, I'll run down to radioshack TODAY!!!
_________________________
--- 89 Buick Reatta - Red / Tan 92 Olds Cutlass Ciera S - Dk Blue --- Previous Vehicles: --- 69 Pontiac Grand Prix Model J - Black 84 Pontiac 1000 - Beige 88 Chev Caprice Classic - Burgundy 00 Chev Lumina - Dark Green

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#180443 - 09/25/03 04:44 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: poncho]
poncho Offline
Member

Registered: 08/28/02
Posts: 103
Loc: Northern Minnesota

Here's a handy resistor identifier, by the way.


Attachments
182738-colorCode.gif (47 downloads)

_________________________
--- 89 Buick Reatta - Red / Tan 92 Olds Cutlass Ciera S - Dk Blue --- Previous Vehicles: --- 69 Pontiac Grand Prix Model J - Black 84 Pontiac 1000 - Beige 88 Chev Caprice Classic - Burgundy 00 Chev Lumina - Dark Green

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#180444 - 09/25/03 05:12 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett
Buick Mike Offline
Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 299
Loc: New Orleans
Quote:
Well... Just returned from my 100 mile test drive and "Holy sh!t, what a difference!!!"

<img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" />


<img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

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#180445 - 09/25/03 06:08 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: Buick Mike]
spongebob Offline
Member

Registered: 08/01/03
Posts: 510
Loc: big pine, california.
on the motorcycle side of things...suzuki makes a model
that is there performance item (gsx-r).
it was learned by owners that suzuki had "instructed" the
computer on these bikes to "retard" the timming in the
first 3 gears, for what reason, no one knows..but most problible reason was emissions..anyway some one figured a way to "fool" the computer into
thinking it was in fourth gear when in fact it was in first..result
was more power in the 1-3 gears...
this little resistor cost me $13, and was ready to install..price is now up to $30, and even more on e-bay..
it worked on my bike...and on every bike it has been installed in(according to the gsx-r web site...).
theres a post there that will give you instructions for the doit your selfers. for $.15
_________________________
90 reatta red w/tan interior w/245/45ZR17's 98 blue/white gsx-r750 :^) 87 S-10 4X4(2.8v-6)soon to be a 3.4 v6.. 06 K30 4X4 ext.cab duramax/6speed allison 07 suzuki kingquad 700 4X4

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#180446 - 09/25/03 07:42 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: poncho]
EDBS0 Offline
Long Time Member

Registered: 09/03/01
Posts: 3302
Loc: A.K.A. Easily Distracted by ...
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#180447 - 09/25/03 08:32 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: EDBS0]
twistedmooch Offline
Member

Registered: 01/24/03
Posts: 134
im a little amatuer at all this but im curious to try this on my reatta because im not to happy with its performance, im assuming that the (MAF is the mass air flow sensor) but im not sure what the MAT is. just trying to get an idea of what you guys are talking about lol.

thanks,
amatuer reatta owner

P.S. if anyone can get some detailed pictures would defiently help out <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />


Edited by twistedmooch (09/25/03 08:33 PM)
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89 Red Reatta 90 Oldsmobile Trofeo (Parts)

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#180448 - 09/25/03 09:43 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett
2seater Offline
Member

Registered: 11/01/02
Posts: 740
Loc: Appleton, WI
Perhaps my comment was poorly phrased. The proverbial ten cent part apparently does what they claim, however it probably compromises some aspect of the designed operation. I am certainly not against that, if it does what I want, and I for one, do appreciate the feedback. Essentially, we can all save money and improve performance, due to your "test". As for max. performance from the factory, they could have made it a premium fuel engine from the start, or other things as you mentioned, so they apparently made a decision not to do so. It will be interesting to see how it works out long term. Some sensor readings of the "new" MAF signal would be helpful. <img src="http://www.aaca.org/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I wonder if this is like the theory of carburation: "If some is good, more is better, and too much is just right"? The point being, how far can this be taken?
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Formerly Turbocharged Reatta

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#180449 - 09/25/03 09:47 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: twistedmooch]
EDBS0 Offline
Long Time Member

Registered: 09/03/01
Posts: 3302
Loc: A.K.A. Easily Distracted by ...
MAT is manifold air temperature. The sensor is in the air-box the other end connects to the MAF.


Not completely certain but sounds like a 330 ohm resistor is placed between pins "A" and "C" on the MAF. Something I think that I will try too.
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#180450 - 09/25/03 10:01 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: 2seater]
EDBS0 Offline
Long Time Member

Registered: 09/03/01
Posts: 3302
Loc: A.K.A. Easily Distracted by ...
Quote:
As for max. performance from the factory, they could have made it a premium fuel engine from the start, or other things as you mentioned, so they apparently made a decision not to do so.


My small 3 litre 1989 Yamaha SHO engine cooked out 220HP stock out of the box. If GM wanted to do the same for the Reatta they could have after all Ford did it.

I would give my eye teeth to have this in my Reatta.
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#180451 - 09/25/03 11:06 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: EDBS0]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Okay so lemme get this straight. I take off the connecter of the MAT to the MAF, stick this resistor on the A and C, fold the resister OUTSIDE? of the plug and then reconnect? Reset the comp and go? Hrmm, someone make sure I am doing this right before I go to radio shack tommorow.

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#180452 - 09/25/03 11:19 PM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett
FlyByNite Offline
Member

Registered: 04/26/01
Posts: 350
Loc: Winchester, Va.
You will be resetting the computer when you disconnect the battery before starting the procedure.
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1998 Riviera Emerald Green/Tan Sunroof, CD, Supercharged Daily Driver and Highway Cruiser 1990 White Coupe/Blue Sunroof, CD, 16 way seats 1993 Nissan SE V6 4X4 Wood Hauler and Farm Use

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#180453 - 09/26/03 07:02 AM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett [Re: 2seater]
Greg Ross Offline
Member

Registered: 06/19/00
Posts: 1888
Loc: Prince Edward Island, Canada
The other side of this equation is the "Block Learn" that's going on as a consequence of this alteration. The high idle could be a result that will be learned away and over several days the response should get smoother as the ECM rebalances it'self.
Good Stuff.
_________________________
"Betsy Blue" One Owner?
Over 1/2 way to 1/2 a million miles
The only known 5-spd S/C Reatta on the Road.
BCA 37147
and Member BCA (The Bluewater Cruising Association)

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#180454 - 09/26/03 10:36 AM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett *DELETED*
Anonymous
Unregistered


Post deleted by 'LiL Reatta

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#180455 - 09/26/03 10:56 AM Re: 20 HP+ PART - Attn. Padgett
Anonymous
Unregistered


Went and looked at the car's engine, and just wanna triple check Im doing this right. Its the plug that goes into the black box thing on the MAF that says A B C on it right?

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