Split Rim Jack for 21 Studebaker

[BBStude21]

Hello All,

Does anyone have a Split Rim Jack for a 1921 Studebaker 24" rim? If you know of someone who has one that they would like to sell please call me at 707-208-9433 or email me at stude21@gmail.com

Thanks,

BBStude21

[Guest sean o bennett]

what do you mean by a jack? I know what a jack is but didnt know 21 sps six had a specific one...do you mean a tool for compressing the split rim ?

[dictator27]

That would be a rim spreader. They're not a jack nor do they compress the rim.

Terry

[oldstudemike]

I have a rim spreader if thats what you are looking for. This tool remove the ring that holds the tire to the rim

[Guest stude8]

Take a look at this photo, if this is what you are looking for you can find them on Ebay frequently, I bought this one a year ago, all painted Mint Green to.

Stude8

[Brian in Oz]

Er, what's the purpose of that thing, pls Stude8? I've always twisted my rims open with a rounded lever on the opposite end of my Stude wheelbrace, then used a big screwdriver or jemmy to get it off. Getting 'em back on has always been a matter of persuasion with a mallet and jumping on the wheel with the big boots.

[Richard Lichtfel]

I have a commercial Weaver Slit Rim tool. It will collapse the rim allowing you to slip the tire and tube off the rim and slip a new one on without the use of irons. It will then expand the rim back and you can lock it. I can do all four wheels in less time than than I used to do one. No more pinched tubes.

It is so easy that I change tires for friends with the old split rims.

RHL

[dictator27]

Brian in Oz

The rim spreader is used to put enough tension on the rim to allow easy removal of the split rim pin. Once that is out, releasing the tension should result in the rim springing inward, disengaging it from the tire bead and allowing easy removal of the tube. It shouldn't take much effort to remove the tire. To replace, it is almost a case of putting the rim in the tire, not the tire on the rim. Use the spreader to to push the sprung part of the rim back into place and permit easy re-installation of the pin. They were a very common item in the teens and twenties and shouldn't be hard to find at a swap meet or on ebay(I have two of them, both of which found me!). They are heavy cast iron, so finding one in Oz would be plan A. Shipping costs might be steep.

Terry

[Brian in Oz]

Right, thanks, Terry. I now realise (doh) that these are quite different 'split rims' to the ones on my wire-wheeled 1928 GB. I have to separate and remove the entire rim on one side, after which it's an easy task to slip the tyre and tube off. Btw, I have a new set of 600x20 tires but will be in need of tubes. Anyone know a good source, please?

Cheers, Brian.

[Guest stude8]

This is for Brian,

The purpose of the 3 arm "Rim Jack" is to both "retract" the rim end inward to reduce the rim diameter enough to get it off the mounted tire.

Two of the arms are fixed in length but can be rotated right or left to change their position on the rim opposite the crankable arm that either grabs the rim edge and pulls it inward or pushes it outward with the motion of the crank lever.

When reassembling the tire to the rim it is cranked the opposite direction to "expand" the rim until the ends are meshed and tire is inflated to hold its shape until remounted on the wheel fellow and bolted in place.

I don't have a photo of it on a rim in retracted position but here are a few images to see how it is used. The Kelsey rims on my 1928 just have the two meshing ends with not keeper pins like some others have so the expansion tool is a must to get the Devil back meshed against the power of the tire rim that doesn't want to expand.

Stude8

[Brian in Oz]

Thanks, Stude8, I see it all now! My GB's wire wheels are a different story. The owner's manual shows how to prise the locking ring apart with a lever and, yes, with a foot firmly planted on the deflated tire! This system generally works well if the rims are kept clean and rust-free. It has presented the occasional problem, such as when one popped off on a busy highway at 50 mph. I heard the 'sproing' and wondered what was happening--then saw the locking ring overtaking the car! :eek:

Cheers

Brian

[Guest stude8]

Brian

Starting in 1929 and 30 Studebaker wire spoke wheels used a snap ring lock system to prevent launching the ring from the rim in event of a tire blowout.

I can see in your photos the snap ring is warped such that the ends do not align with each other, was this the ring that left the rim while in motion? It should be reformed so the diameter is correct all the way around so the ring engages the rim groove firmly when in place.

Attached is a 1930 20" wire wheel from a President I once owned. You can see the "Barrette" clasp that has an inward facing prong on each end that engages lock holes in the two ends of the chrome snap ring behind it. The retaining nut threads onto a special headed screw (Similar to a "Carriage Head" bolt) that extends outward through the snap ring and clasp and held in place by tire bead. A cotter pin prevents the nut from rotating off the screw threads.

Stude8

Edited March 26, 2010 by stude8
typo (see edit history)

[Brian in Oz]

That Barrette clasp looks nifty, and also a bit fiddly, but it must have been seen as a desirable safety feature. Only once did my rim come apart, as I've related, and I'm sure it was my own fault for not carefully socketing the snap ring in. Both components have to be squeaky clean and free from rust. (A lesson well learned.) There is no warpage, but the rings are pliant enough to be slightly twisted by hand, as I did for the photo. It's now straight again, lies flat and doesn't appear distorted. I guess I'll review the situation when the wheels have been cleaned up and powder-coated, and the new tires go on. I'll certainly take on the idea of hard-chroming the snap rings.

Is there any special advantage in locating the join right next to the air inlet, as in your pic? At the very least, it comes under close inspection every time the tires are checked.

Cheers

Brian

[Guest stude8]

Brian

The snap ring lock location near the inner tube valve stem is not by chance, they have a "Key" pin in the snap ring groove located about 1" from the valve stem hole that can be seen in the photo of the rims being painted. *Look close at right wheel in foreground where valve stem hole is visible then above to right about 1" is the "Key" pin in ring groove.

The snap rings with the locking devices also have a notch on their ID that index's to the rim groove "Key" pin. So they can only assemble in the same location when being serviced. I don't have an image that shows the snap ring details but these rings have several holes for the lock to engage then, a bolt hole for the lock retaining bolt , the groove "Key" notch and even a square notch on the ID to insert a prying tool near where the two ends abutt to start the ring removal when needed to be detached for service.

Probably all things they learned over time to help users when working on a flat tire or new tire replacement.

Stude8

[GE Dictator 1928]

I am in the process of changing tubes on two of my wheels on my '28 GEF. I wanted to ask Stude 8 (as you have had experience with this) once the rim is off the wheel, I noticed that the inside of the rim has the "devil back" interlock like your Kelseys (possibly mine are Kelsey's as well). My question is, which way is the rim prone to go once it is out of interlock? Will it spring inward or will it want to spring outward? I just want to be prepared either way so there are no projectile injuries or unwanted holes made in the garage roof

Thanks!!

Keith

[Guest stude8]

Keith

I assume you are talking about a wood spoke wheel detachable rim and not the wire spoke wheel last talked about.

The rim shown in response #10 will want to contract inward when the clasp is separated. You can see the piece of wood jammed between rim ends to prevent it from springing inward for the photo session.

Believe me nothing will launch across the garage, it will be difficult to get off the old tire especially if the rubber is old and hardened like they get with age.

You can expect to need several crow bars to progressively pry the rim free around the inside diameter of the tire. If you are using the 3 arm rim "Jack" to contract the rim don't over do it too much, you want the rim to retain as much expansive effort to keep it expanded against the tire beads when reassembling the rim to tire. That is where the rim jack has its best assist in expanding the rim during reassembly while you use large screw drivers or small pry bars to get the clasp ends re-engaged. You will see that all the care in the world will not save you from scratching the paint finish of the rim getting the ends re-engaged. Good luck in the experience.

Stude8

[Echo Robert]

Right, thanks, Terry. I now realise (doh) that these are quite different 'split rims' to the ones on my wire-wheeled 1928 GB. I have to separate and remove the entire rim on one side, after which it's an easy task to slip the tyre and tube off. Btw, I have a new set of 600x20 tires but will be in need of tubes. Anyone know a good source, please?

What did you find in your search for tubes? I'm planning on purchasing tires and tubes this winter and I have the same size as you do.

Robert

[Guest stude8]

For the record I just installed new tires on my 1928 GB Commander Big Six Victoria last year. I used Denman 6:00x20" for authentic tread pattern and load capacity along with previous experience with the same size tires on my 1930 President FH Victoria that I rode on for 10 years with good performance, low noise from road contact from the tread pattern and generally good handling. I used tubes from Coker Tire along with the tire purchase because they delivered free to the Indianapolis IN swap meet so I drove over and picked them up since I was planning to attend that meet.

Stude8

[GE Dictator 1928]

Thanks Stude 8!! I will attempt this again. The tires that are on the car now are probably about 40-50 year old Goodyears. I looked for the Denham tires you mentioned because of your good report and they look real good, but I understand Denham is closed now having filed bankruptcy, so I guess I have to settle for Goodrichs now.

I just noticed while I have the rims off the wheels, is that the tie rod ends appear a little loose and so is what I guess is the ball joints ( I don't know what they call the area that mounts the brake backing and spindle to the front axle). What do we use for replacements for that stuff? Is there a truck tie rod end or something that can be used as a replacement?

Thanks again!! I greatly appreciate your help. I am learning a lot through this and really appreciate your knowledge and help!

Keith

[Guest stude8]

JUST GREAT! I checked Google and you are right, Denman went under in Jan, 2010 and assetts were bought at bankruptcy court by Titan Tire Co. in July.

I had held off buying a 5th Denman 6:00x20 for my spare for a while until the car was road worthy. Now I guess my Wards Riverside De Luxe Highway Special 6.00 - 20 from around 1950 will be my spare by default.

Hate to hear another USA name brand is down the drain, also hate to hear the 267 employees in the Leavittsburg, Ohio plant are in unemployment line. Denman was founded in 1919.

Stude8

[GE Dictator 1928]

I had no idea they had such a history. It is so horrible when so many employees are out of work. Very unfortunate!

[Guest sean o bennett]

Many of us want to thank STUDE 8 for all of the help,on many a topic/subject/item..John you are such a wonderful man ,club member and of course mechanic.From the great president 8 to the 21 sp six you can always get us out of a fix!All the best to you and the best of health.The SOB in the east,thank you

[Brian in Oz]

What did you find in your search for tubes? I'm planning on purchasing tires and tubes this winter and I have the same size as you do.

Robert

Hi, Robert. After getting a few rather hefty local quotes, I counted myself lucky to find an A-model-Ford supplier a coupla thousand miles away in Victoria who carries Denman tyres and 600/650-20” long-stem tubes ($45 each) and heavy rim flaps ($32 each). The postage for 5 tubes and 5 flaps was less than $50. I didn't need tyres, having squirrelled away a set of 5 new ones in the 1980s. The flaps are too wide for my rims and will have to be cut to size with a Stanley knife, but the spare rubber could come in handy elsewhere.

Cheers

Brian

[Guest stude8]

I have to say thank you to Sean O Bennett for the compliments in his post for helping new Studebaker prewar car owners where possible. I have a large collection of technical publications accumulated over many years in this hobby and can relate to help given me years ago by knowledgeable people like Bill Cannon founder of the ASC before I had this info. I can appreciate how helpful sending brake adjustment instructions to a new owner can be when these books are seldom seen at swap meets anymore.

Always glad to see another Studebaker return to the road if I can help.

Stude8

[Guest manitoba27stude]

I met a gentelman that had a pail full of them,40 dollars gave me the pick of the litter.

what a time saver,and also saved the fresh paint i had applied.

[rbk]

I have a nice one for sale

PM me for info!

Robert Kapteyn

studebaker@mac.com (I am already on thousands of spam lists)