freeing up an engine

[Joe Werner]

my buick engine is currently froze up water got down is a couple of clynders and rusted em up.(before i bought it) what is the best stuff to use to get them freed up i have been filling them up with wd-40. is there anything better?

thanks joe

[Guest De Soto Frank]

Many folks swear by Marvel Mystery Oil, or Kroil, or PB Blaster...other folks swear by Coca-Cola...

I've freed a couple of "lightly stuck" engines using MMO, letting it soak for a week or two...

If your cylinders are "rusted-up", might as well pull the head so that you can clean the scale out of the bores before you try moving any pistons (such an engine would most likely be headed to the machine shop for some work)...if the cylinder walls have a coating of rust on them, and you try to turn the engine or drive pistons out, unpleasant things such as bent connecting rods and broken ring lands can occur...I would suggest cleaning up the cylinders as best as you can with a wire wheel; if the block design will allow removing the pistons from the bottom, after removing the crank shaft, then you won't be trying to force pistons over the worst parts of the cylinder bores....

Take your time; better to disassemble and clean rather than try to "get 'er runnin" and possibly do some real damage...

Good luck !

[HarryJ]

Joe.... The first thing you need to do is to determine how the water got into the cylinders in the first place. Do you have a crack in the block or head, or is there a blown head gasket? If it is just humidity that has settled on the cylinder walls due to car sitting for a long period of time, most penetrating oils will free it up; however, if it is serious rusting due to large amounts of water a tear down and rebuild will be called for. You did not mention the year and model of the Buick. Buick's have overhead valves, so, if the spark plugs were left out for a period of time without the hood on, the probability of water running into the cylinders is small. For flat head engines this is a scenerio for serious rusting. The bottom line is that once you free it up; and try to run it broken rings and scored cylinder will probably be the result. If your car is an older model I would tear it down, hone the cylinders and replace the rings at the very least.

[Joe Werner]

my buick is a 1942 buick i think the water got down in there because the oil breather cap is gone. the cylinders that have the most rust on the are 1 2 3 the rest are free. the rockers for these cylners has some rust on them too. my grandpa looked at it today he didnt think it was too bad, he is a retired car mechanic. the head is currently off the car.

[The Old Guy]

Joe, WD-40 will displace water, but is not really a good penetrant. As mentioned in an earlier post, PB blaster or Kroil are much better at cutting rust. I have freed engines up mostly with patience. Liberal amonunts of the aforementioned rust cutters, and time are you best allies.

[Guest imported_PackardV8]

Yeah, go ahead and pour any all of your favorite snake oil in the cylinders that u want to and let it soak a day or 2.

NOW, lets get serious. U'll need an air compressor that will pump at least 125 psi. Choose a cylinder with BOTH valves closed. get a spark plug hole adapter for the air hose and pump that cylinder full of air from the compressor.

NOTE: that the compressed air might have to set in cylinder for as long as a week. Alternate to other cylinders. try to make sure that the piston is not at the bottom of the stroke.

HOWEVER, THE best way is to first make sure that none of the valve train is seized. If it is that will ahve to be freed up or removed before the compressed air is introduced to the engine.

I've used this method several times over the years. It has only failed one time on an outboard motor. 4 years ago i freed a 56 Packard V8 that i got from AlK (who subscribes to this list). the engine had sat in the car outside for 20 years and was locked SOLID. I actualy got the engine running and it ran good except for alot of smoking.

[DizzyDale]

Dear Joe,I have just read all the posts regarding your question.ALL sounds like GREAT advise.When my brother and i were 13 we used Coke on a Model A my Dad bought for us.The next morning it was free,imagine what it does to your guts.diz

[HarryJ]

Joe.... Sounds like all you need is a honing and ring replacement coupled with a good cleaning and oiling of the parts before reassembly. I would also check for a ridge at the top of the cylinders and plastigage the rod bearings while I was attending to the rust problem. Might as well thoroughly check it out while you have it down rather than having to go back into it later on. You can probably perform these tasks by dropping the pan and removing the head with the block still in the car.

[Guest Albert]

I have use diesel and tranni fluid poured down the cylinders to free things up, i did a 54 Packard a few years ago that had been parked since 1959, when i finally tore down the motor 3months later even the rings came loose without breaking. I have a 54 Packard Panama, that I picked up yesterday that has a liter of diesel and about the same of ATF (tranni fluid in it) will see what happens in a week or so...

[Guest Indiana_Truck]

PB Blaster, ATF, and deisel and a lot of time and it will move. My Hercules for the 1925 had been sitting since about 1950 I was told and it now turns easy. had one cyl. full of water but it had not been in there long. Spark plug had been removed. I am rebuilding it but after 3 weeks of soaking it did free up.

Bob

[Guest imported_tigermoth]

joe, skinned knuckles has had a few articles on this subject. they mentioned the use of coca cola(let it soak for a few days, but don't let it dry out).they also talked about soaking with kerosene for a couple of days. in one extreme case they had the engine out,soaked the cylinder bores with kerosene for a couple of days and turned the engine upside down and packed dry ice in the back of the piston and tapped the piston out with a mallett and a 2x4. good luck

[Guest Hal Davis (MODEL A HAL)]

I've never tried this, but some of the hit and miss engine guys take the head off and pour about 1/4" of brake fluid on top of the piston then set the brake fluid on fire. Seems like some let it soak for a few days first. Anyway, the theory is that the heat will expand the cylinder, but the liquid will keep the piston cool (or at least cooler than the cylinder). Don't know if it will work with aluminum pistons, though. Hit and miss engine pistons are cast iron.

Another trick is to make an adapter for the spark plug hole so you can put a grease fitting on it, then use a grease gun to pump the cylinder full of grease. A grease gun will generate some hefty pressure. Never tried this one myself either, but it has worked for several people on hit and miss engines. On multi-cylinder engines, I would take the crankshaft out before trying this and also remove the push rods, that way you could do as many cylinders at once as need be without worrying about pushing down on a piston that is trying to come up or pushing all the grease out of an open valve .

[Guest stude8]

I have read every war story so far and no one mentioned yet that there are parts other than the rings and cylinder walls to worry about.

I have found in several free up exercises that the valve lifters were rusted where they had stopped outside their guide blocks and thus cannot go back down without wire wheel treatment or removal. Since they will hold the valves open you won't get enough compression for the engine to even try to start. Worse case is they can result in enough drag to break a tooth or two on the cam gear if it is a gear drive engine or stretch a cam chain to the point it might jump timing.

I had a 1931 President 8 engine recovered from a Dyer, Tennessee field that spent many years in the weather, it was an updraft manifold engine so didn't get much water in the cylinders but condensation had stuck many rings. A week of penetrating oil and trans fluid in all cylinders finally got it where I could rock the crank back and forth a little more each day until it would rotate all the way through. It actually ran again without pulling the head but it was an old saw mill job that needed bearings bad. Stude8

[R Walling]

I tried to free up a 1972 402 Chevy that sat indoors for 20 years, I had driven it in at that time. I was able to turn it over about 1/3 of a turn before I stopped trying. The problem was not in the cylinders as I thought, but in the #1 crank bearing. The lower 1/2 lost all oil and the crank was rusted on the bottom only. Turning it over damaged the crank to a point that it will have to be ground.

[Guest AlK]

I have never tried this myself but the mechanic who worked on my 55 patrician swears by it and guarantees results. Pour white vinegar down in the cylinders. Let set for 24 hours. Motor will turn over freely.

[Guest Albert]

Well i got my 54 Packard Panama to turn over last weekend after 3 weeks of diesel and tranni fluid and it was only parked in 1967, kinda happened by accident when i put in a battery and hit the starter by accident and it broke free, still had to pull the head and free up the valves though but that seems normal on the flat head straight 8's.

[36 D2 Coupe]

On ‎30‎/‎11‎/‎2004 at 7:06 AM, Hal Davis (MODEL A HAL) said:

I've never tried this, but some of the hit and miss engine guys take the head off and pour about 1/4" of brake fluid on top of the piston then set the brake fluid on fire. Seems like some let it soak for a few days first. Anyway, the theory is that the heat will expand the cylinder, but the liquid will keep the piston cool (or at least cooler than the cylinder). Don't know if it will work with aluminum pistons, though. Hit and miss engine pistons are cast iron.

Another trick is to make an adapter for the spark plug hole so you can put a grease fitting on it, then use a grease gun to pump the cylinder full of grease. A grease gun will generate some hefty pressure. Never tried this one myself either, but it has worked for several people on hit and miss engines. On multi-cylinder engines, I would take the crankshaft out before trying this and also remove the push rods, that way you could do as many cylinders at once as need be without worrying about pushing down on a piston that is trying to come up or pushing all the grease out of an open valve .

I just talked with an old friend who described using the grease fitting routine  after soaking the cylinders in a seriously seized old Cockshutt tractor with diesel fuel for a couple of weeks. First order of business was to make sure all the valves moved freely, then in a cylinder where both valves are closed, applied hydraulic pressure via the grease. He said this way you don't pound on the pistons and damage them. Caution of course not to damage other parts that may also be seized. Getting the grease out IS a little messy, he said   I had never heard of this approach so thought I'd check it out on the forum. The ingenuity I find here is truly amazing.

[automaschinewerks]

ive never tried the grease fitting trick, I read about it when I was working on a seized hit n miss,  I tried everything else I read about and nothing worked.  some people wrote in that they had cracked the cylinder wall from the pressure from a grease gun.

[Rusty_OToole]

If your 42 Buick means anything to you take it apart, inspect bearings etc, do a valve job, hone the cylinders with a bottle brush hone and put on new rings. Minor pitting of the cylinders is all right, the pits will quickly fill with carbon when the engine is running. I mean pin head size pits. Do it right and the engine should purr like a big cat and run great for another 50,000 miles. This assumes cylinders are not tapered over .007 and crankshaft and bearings are not chewed.