PreWarQc

Pre war cars insane prices

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1 hour ago, mike6024 said:

s-l1600.jpg

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1941-Buick-Roadmaster-Super-/183262492700?

 

Lets see where the bidding goes on this one. Make a guess at the final high bid.

 

 

Now wait a cottin' pickin' minute!  There is a world of difference between the value of a 1941 Buick Special, Super, Century, Roadmaster and Limited.  I can't even tell what the length of this engine is.  I also don't know the body style.  You have to do better than this to get an estimated value.

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10 hours ago, Xander Wildeisen said:

Your car is worth $6,000-$8,000.  I am in the market for a car like this, and I will pay you $12,000. I just need to send you $50,000 in a bank check, and then you send me back the change. It has to be done this way, because I am the King of a different country. And I am looking to move all of my money to your country of USA. Please let me know if this interests you. But you need to act fast.:lol: 

Hahaha.  Do you know what KMA stands for?  No joke, there are a bunch of crooks out there who try this on gullible old people.  The moral of the story is don't fall for it.   hahahahahaha.  Now let's be serious:  The man asked a sensible question and was looking for opinions.  I don't know how he can make any sense out of all of these conflicting opinions, but that was his purpose.  And entry was trying to give a valued opinion based on over 60 years in the hobby since I was 16.  All of us should have been serious in trying to provide a valued opinion. Most of us have, some have not.  We need to welcome each new person into this hobby no matter his age, status, education, ability or any other reason.  Just my opinion folks.  I'm outta here.

Edited by Dynaflash8 (see edit history)
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1941-Buick-Roadmaster-Supers-l1600.jpgs-l1600.jpg

 

It's got one bid so far. I kicked off the bidding.

 

This car has original interior in very good condition. Body has original paint with no rust or dents. The fenders have some dents. It runs very nice, like new. Quiet and smooth running engine with dual carbs.  
Near new battery and carb rebuild. Tires are wide white radials. Steering wheel probably has cracks. All glass is good. Has an oil leak on bottom end. Have the gasket set. 

Year:    1941    VIN (Vehicle Identification Number):    14192886
Mileage:    57,894    Number of Cylinders:    8
Make:    Buick    Transmission:    Manual
Model:    
Roadmaster
Body Type:    Coupe
Trim:    Super    Warranty:    Vehicle does NOT have an existing warranty
Engine:    248 Straight Eight    Vehicle Title:    Clear
Fuel Type:    Gasoline    Sub Model:    super
For Sale By:    Private Seller    Exterior Color:    black
Drive Side:    Left-hand drive    Interior Color:    Gray

Edited by mike6024 (see edit history)

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30 minutes ago, Dynaflash8 said:

Hahaha.  Do you know what KMA stands for?  No joke, there are a bunch of crooks out there who try this on gullible old people.  The moral of the story is don't fall for it.   hahahahahaha.  Now let's be serious:  The man asked a sensible question and was looking for opinions.  I don't know how he can make any sense out of all of these conflicting opinions, but that was his purpose.  And entry was trying to give a valued opinion based on over 60 years in the hobby since I was 16.  All of us should have been serious in trying to provide a valued opinion. Most of us have, some have not.  We need to welcome each new person into this hobby no matter his age, status, education, ability or any other reason.  Just my opinion folks.  I'm outta here.

My comment was posted to throw humor at the fact that people trying to buy/sell cars are hit with crap like that all the time. The video I posted was to throw some humor into the back and forth that was getting a little testy between people trying to explain different opinions coming from different views/angles. If you post a wanted ad, or list a car for sale. A person will get hit with a lot of bogus crap, so not knowing the level of the OP's knowledge of buying/selling cars. All of these comments/posts by people do help, when you look at things from different angles. The combined posts/knowledge of people on this forum do a great job in explaining different things about a subject, or a question a person might have. You just have to be able to step back and think about what people are saying with their comments. I think the OP has gotten an incredible amount of different thoughts and opinions on his original question, you want conflicting opinions, it makes you think. I do not think a person would get very far on this forum/club trying to rip off, or take advantage of old car folks. It would get called out pretty fast.

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2 hours ago, ols car dog said:

Let me give it a try.My 1930 studebaker President has been for sale for 18 months.It,s listed on three A.A.C.A forums.

Classic cars.com---Hemmings. It has been on Pre war.com.and the Antique Automobile magazine.That equals to over 14000 total views.

What amazes me the most is the lack of contact except for four people.One potential buyer and I agreed on a price (lower than asking 

price)$38500 contingent on his inspection.Seemed fair to me!!

He backed out the next day.

I don,t know if 38500 is an "insane" price or not,but if someone has any interest at all you would think they would say I,m interested in your car at$xxxxx dollars.and we see if we make a deal.

This is a AACA Senior and CCCA classic auto.not a project.

l have been told on this forum by a couple of people that it,s not priced high enough.Go figure..

Grundy has no problem insuring it for more than my asking price ,they raise the value(and the premium)every year.

So here we are!!!I really don't want to go the E Bay route if I can help it,so I will wait it out some more and see where it goes

Ken

 

I've seen your advertisement, and I agree it's a cool car, but I think this forum thread on your car from last year probably explains pretty well why the market isn't responding at that price point.  It's a good example, though, of how a nicely restored CCCA car can be had at a reasonable price.

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3 hours ago, PreWarQc said:

 

The top of my list is a 1930 Essex Super Six sedan.

Otherwise, I prefer cars from the late 10'', early 20'... Studebaker Special 6 would be nice but I don't think I've ever seen a car from this period that I don't like... they are all pretty spectacular to me.

 

I’m curious… what car would that be?

 

 

It seems we share similar taste in cars....... :)

 

PreWarQc........my dream car is the one in my avatar....... ;) .......and there 

 

 

May22_2018.JPG

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15 hours ago, 1912Staver said:

Hi trimacar and others in this conversation. While your comment about project cars not selling unless priced at near scrap prices is probably generally true it isn't really a hard and fast rule. As I mentioned above I have a decades long attraction for a number of the better later teens / early twenties "sportier" cars. Marmon , Kissel, and nickel era, pre Vertical 8 Stutz  amongst others.

  The past decade has made the purchase of such a car in running condition an impossibility, however even as a long term project/ basket case they are still quite expensive.  There are a group of dedicated individuals with sufficient resources to accumulate the few parts and projects that come on the market. Ron Hausmann comes to mind regarding Kissel, Don Short was his counterpart in the Stutz world and I am sure that there are others.  The only ones that usually end up on the open market are the seriously overpriced examples.

  All this leaves the person with a shortage of resources no real hope of ever being involved with cars of this sort. And bear in mind I am not talking about serious money cars, just Nickel era upper middle class cars.    A further roadblock to someone such as myself who lives in a Foreign country is that even if I found a reasonable starting point , incomplete basket case for a price I could swing, I can't even legally remove it from the U.S. unless it has a valid title. How many lower cost , basket case cars from the later teen's have you seen that come along with up to date paperwork ? Probably very few indeed. Really no viable solution as far as I can see. Other than borrowing for a want, something I have always been advised to avoid at all costs.

 

Actually, in Cal at least, in my experience, paperless cars which have been unregistered for 20 years are off the data-base. This means that they can be exported. It took me a morning in a Long Beach DMV to verify this. Writing to the DMV head office in the state from which they will be exported, asking for clarification, could be time well spent.

The car in question was last registered prior to the introduction of computer data-bases, but I doubt that it makes a difference.

Mick

Whoops, sorry Staver. I have just read your later post, and see that my information is out of date. 

Edited by Bush Mechanic
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11 hours ago, Dynaflash8 said:

No joke, there are a bunch of crooks out there who try this on gullible old people.

 

My life's experience has taught me the opposite. There are a lot of old people ready to take advantage of the young ones. Lots of old farmers around here with their mattresses stuffed with money and they will get the fish hooks out of their pocket fast if they think they can "steal" something. This topic mentions cars that have been sitting for 20 to 40 years. It ain't young whippersnappers, still wet behind the ears, or greenhorns that has owned those cars for so long.

 

I saved this pair of pictures that I found a few years ago because it really related to my experience.

olds1948.jpg.987a3971f9a8d621c94b7a6bd817cd19.jpg

 

"Well, Elmer, you really cashed in on those city boys. I almost busted out laughing when you said you were going to use the money to fix up the Porch."

mother-porsche1.jpg.2ae09e524df9ae363562de1842403fb6.jpg

 

We had coffee up at the convenient store this morning, ages 93, 85, 79, and two 70 year olds. I told them about this topic and we all agreed you gotta watch out for old guys, especially the old farmers.

Bernie

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If the authorities out here would look into what you are talking about Bernie, they would be the ones getting the hooks in the real problems with this hobby/industry/trade.

 

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13 hours ago, PreWarQc said:

The top of my list is a 1930 Essex Super Six sedan.

Otherwise, I prefer cars from the late 10'', early 20'... Studebaker Special 6 would be nice but I don't think I've ever seen a car from this period that I don't like... they are all pretty spectacular to me.

 

Hey PreWarQc, great to see a guy interested in the "nickel" era.  I do not own a 1920s car but historically have always thought this period was a very interesting time.  In the old car world it is also a place for bargains as the cars of, say, 1915-1927 are now rather overlooked as you probably know.  Consider our earlier advice to join a relevant club like the AACA (or the VMCCA or Horseless Carriage Club which I am less familiar with).  Remember what some of us said about club members selling to club members.  Meet some local car people too and let them help you in your search.  There should be few also looking for 1920s cars unless you befriend a speculator looking to buy and "flip" such a car for quick profit (but he should be able to find an easier target).  Go to shows and study the club magazines and bargains will begin to appear.  Be selective, you may end up with more possibilities than you expect.  Hold out for the best car you can afford but do remember that the owner of a 1920s car cannot be totally hands off.  Even with a previously restored car you will need to have space and capability to perform some maintenance that local mechanics will be totally unfamiliar with, there will not likely be a guy in your neighborhood to help fix your vacuum tank.  Good luck, Todd C        

Edited by poci1957 (see edit history)
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53 minutes ago, 60FlatTop said:

 

My life's experience has taught me the opposite. There are a lot of old people ready to take advantage of the young ones. Lots of old farmers around here with their mattresses stuffed with money and they will get the fish hooks out of their pocket fast if they think they can "steal" something. This topic mentions cars that have been sitting for 20 to 40 years. It ain't young whippersnappers, still wet behind the ears, or greenhorns that has owned those cars for so long.

 

 

 

I agree, it all comes down to the individual. As many older gents are crooks as young ones.

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If my Son saw me rubbing dirt on a freshly repaired and painted spot under the car he would be appalled. My Daughter would just shake her head and smile.

Bernie

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1 hour ago, 60FlatTop said:

 

My life's experience has taught me the opposite. There are a lot of old people ready to take advantage of the young ones. Lots of old farmers around here with their mattresses stuffed with money and they will get the fish hooks out of their pocket fast if they think they can "steal" something. This topic mentions cars that have been sitting for 20 to 40 years. It ain't young whippersnappers, still wet behind the ears, or greenhorns that has owned those cars for so long.

 

I saved this pair of pictures that I found a few years ago because it really related to my experience.

olds1948.jpg.987a3971f9a8d621c94b7a6bd817cd19.jpg

 

"Well, Elmer, you really cashed in on those city boys. I almost busted out laughing when you said you were going to use the money to fix up the Porch."

mother-porsche1.jpg.2ae09e524df9ae363562de1842403fb6.jpg

 

We had coffee up at the convenient store this morning, ages 93, 85, 79, and two 70 year olds. I told them about this topic and we all agreed you gotta watch out for old guys, especially the old farmers.

Bernie

Oh come on!  Who has been feeding these people, NOT IN THE HOBBY, all that crap about barn finds being so valuable?  Hobby media sources, that's who?  Who can blame them for not wanting to be ripped off.  What I was talking about were old people who are or have been in the hobby, who understand that not every barnyard car is not worth a million dollars; but are approached by crooks who offer them cellar prices when they need to sell because of an impending nursing home, or worse yet when the husband has passed and the wife really has no idea what to ask for those cars in the garage. 

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Or young car builders/restorers who struggle with a business, and older customers use the car product as a way to string along a business. In order to drive the business into the ground, or force the business owner into shady stuff.

Edited by Xander Wildeisen (see edit history)

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51 minutes ago, Xander Wildeisen said:

Or young car builders/restorers who struggle with a business, and older customers use the car product as a way to string along a business. In order to drive the business into the ground, or force the business owner into shady stuff.

I don't quite understand what you are talking about.

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1 hour ago, Dynaflash8 said:

Who has been feeding these people, NOT IN THE HOBBY, all that crap about barn finds being so valuable?  Hobby media sources, that's who?  Who can blame them for not wanting to be ripped off.

 

The problem is older than that. Back in 1961 when I was 12 I was taking my usual two week break (for my parents) and staying in a  small Vermont town where my grandfather ran the store and my grandmother was postmistress. I haung around with one of the local farm kids and reslly had the run of the farm. In one of the barns there was an old Model "T" touring that had  been there 20 or 30 years. Upholstery gone, rusted, tires rotted, etc. The kid told me the owner of the farm told them that it was worth $3000. You could have bought the farm for $3000 in 1961 !!! I had just bought a running, driving, pretty rusty but interior OK Sport Coupe with perfect rumble seat upholstery for $100. The year before my father  picked up a very nice 1933 Pierce-Arrow in Boston for $300 (number 3 condition) that we drove home from Boston to Rochester for $300.

 

The only hobby media back then was Hemmings which I think was still the old black and white small format. OK - AACA magazine (almost forgot). I remember well the Mercer restored by Ralph Buckley on the cover of one issue. Another had a Stoddard Dayton. Dream cars. Anyway  - all the owner of the Model "T" knew was what people had told him it was worth verbally. The next year we chased down a Durant that at the time was probably worth $75 and the old farmer wanted $1500 for it. This was almost 60 years ago so the problem has been around awhile.

Edited by vermontboy
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1 hour ago, vermontboy said:

 

The problem is older than that. Back in 1961 when I was 12 I was taking my usual two week break (for my parents) and staying in a  small Vermont town where my grandfather ran the store and my grandmother was postmistress. I haung around with one of the local farm kids and reslly had the run of the farm. In one of the barns there was an old Model "T" touring that had  been there 20 or 30 years. Upholstery gone, rusted, tires rotted, etc. The kid told me the owner of the farm told them that it was worth $3000. You could have bought the farm for $3000 in 1961 !!! I had just bought a running, driving, pretty rusty but interior OK Sport Coupe with perfect rumble seat upholstery for $100. The year before my father  picked up a very nice 1933 Pierce-Arrow in Boston for $300 (number 3 condition) that we drove home from Boston to Rochester for $300.

 

The only hobby media back then was Hemmings which I think was still the old black and white small format. OK - AACA magazine (almost forgot). I remember well the Mercer restored by Ralph Buckley on the cover of one issue. Another had a Stoddard Dayton. Dream cars. Anyway  - all the owner of the Model "T" knew was what people had told him it was worth verbally. The next year we chased down a Durant that at the time was probably worth $75 and the old farmer wanted $1500 for it. This was almost 60 years ago so the problem has been around awhile.

Oh yes, I've been there and done that too in 1961, but there was still talk on the radio and tv every once in awhile when a nice car sold for a good price for the time.  You forgot to mention Cars & Parts.  I was subscribing to that magazine (1959) and Motor Trend (from 1953 with Classic Comments inside each issue)  before I even knew about the little sized Hemmings Book.  The point I was making was that people distant from the hobby collecting society picked up on tidbits from all the sources and came to thin ALL old cars were worth a fortune.  There were always stories back then where Ford or GM would trade a brand new car for some old car they'd built in the past.  They probably did that once or twice and it made all of the papers.  If some old guy had a car salted away................well, he thought every old car was worth a fortune.  He'd never been to a car show or a club meeting to know anything condition or restoration.  That's the point I was making.  I've run into guys who sold one of several barn cars back in the day and found out the guy sold it for a lot of money.  Never mind what they spent before they sold it.  You couldn't pry another car from that guy if your life depended on it, because he thought he'd been ripped off on the first one he sold.

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1 hour ago, vermontboy said:

In one of the barns there was an old Model "T" touring that had  been there 20 or 30 years. Upholstery gone, rusted, tires rotted, etc. The kid told me the owner of the farm told them that it was worth $3000.

 

Around here the old farmer told everyone the "Ford people" offered him a new car for his, but he knew they were trying to cheat him out of it. He wouldn't give a price. You had to make an offer.

The early '60's was about the right time frame Old men were nasty back then.

 

You probably remember the Model T roadster pickup that sat on the weigh scales on the curve in Fancher. There was a Model T center door sedan on the side of the building and a couple open Model A's in the back shed. I saw the pickup disassembled in a pile about 20 years ago. And 2 years ago the rest of the stuff got bulldozed into a pile when they cleaned the property.

 

One old guy had a brand new '49 Ford with only 6 miles on it, the distance from the dealership to his garage. He said he bought the car and only used it one time for his wife. If you got down real close you could still see her lipstick on the tailpipe.

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Those old guys liked to get the ear of news reporters a lot. I think it was an Illinois paper that quoted an old farmer about the wheat crop. He told them : "The crop didn't meet our predictions this year, but we didn't think it would anyway."

 

There have always been cultures that valued craftiness and trickery over what they perceived as those who were wealthier or stronger. Those old hoarders and extortionists lived up to it. AND carried a big chip on their shoulder.

Crackerbarrel.jpg.2b29b82aa4bb83165fc68288fb2e013d.jpg

 

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I have a feeling that many of those 1960's old codgers were people that suffered economically  through the depression and then the world war and were then largely bypassed by post war prosperity. If some young, rich { comparatively} fool was interested in the old pile of junk out in the barn then they were going to pay through the nose to buy it.  

 

Greg in Canada

Edited by 1912Staver (see edit history)
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Sad to say what strikes me about this young man's narrative, is his self centered, convoluted sense of entitlement. My take is that he is asking me (us) to pass on a car that I have, for a value much less then market. His only provocation for this seems to be that I have the car and he wants it, and that I'm old and will dye soon, and he is young and can enjoy it more then I can, and he wants it right now. Not only does he want a car for less then market, but he wants a car that he can use right away, and one that he doesn't have to do any work to.

 

I'm speaking for myself, I don't sell my cars vary often, but when I do it is because the buyer willing to pay market value, and is a person who has earned my respect. This means that by deed or action they have shown that they are willing to maintain the car as I would, or are willing to take the car to the next level.  If I pass on a car for less then what I think that it is worth, it has to be to a friend. In other words, the new owner has had to have paid his dues. I don't see this young man's willingness to do this on any level. It will be interesting to find out if this gentleman is able to find what he is looking for.

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Bill, I have followed this thread from the start and I have not seen anything suggesting the OP is self centered or has a convoluted sense of entitlement. 

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2 minutes ago, GregLaR said:

Bill, I have followed this thread from the start and I have not seen anything suggesting the OP is self centered or has a convoluted sense of entitlement. 

I haven't either.

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3 minutes ago, GregLaR said:

Bill, I have followed this thread from the start and I have not seen anything suggesting the OP is self centered or has a convoluted sense of entitlement. 

 

I also think that is reading a little too much into it.

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