1922 Elcar K6 Coupe Ultra Rare For Sale

[cblaufus]

Survivior unrestored 1922 Elcar K6 Coupe

It starts easily, and runs and drives well. Inline 6 Continental engine with 3 speed.

Of the 61 total documented surviving Elcar models featured in the book "Elcar and Pratt Automobiles: The Complete History By William Locke", this is the only k6 coupe remaining, and has been in the same family for more than 60 years.
It was primarily used as a parade car for the Whittier Elks lodge by my wife's grandfather before being passed down to her uncle, and finally to us. Lots of documented history. 

The Elcar was an American automobile briefly manufactured from 1915 until 1931 by the Elkhart Carriage Company, of Elkhart, Indiana, which had been in business for over 30 years before producing its first car. Known to be a high quality car in it's day, production was limited and eventually ceased due to the stock market crash and subsequent great depression.

A true piece of history from the early days of American automobile makers. Keep as survivor or an excellent restoration candidate.
 

[keiser31]

Price? Location??

[JFranklin]

Looks darn modern for 1922!  What would it take to buy it? and how far is it from my house?

Edited April 13, 2018 by JFranklin (see edit history)

[ksparks]

looks great. i will share to my FB site.. do you have the radiator emblem etc and or script motor meter,,,price on the car?   same engine as in my Auburn 1922   7R

Edited April 13, 2018 by kmstrade (see edit history)

[Lahti35]

9 hours ago, keiser31 said:

Price? Location??

Hard to get excited about contacting a seller when there's no price or location listed in the ad...

[George Albright]

Please send price and phone number to call u to my email.  Gnalbright@gmail.com.  Thanks George Albright. Ocala Florida 

[Curti]

I like the looks of that little coupe. The disk wheels really set it off ! 

[cblaufus]

Sorry about the delay in replying to all the posts. The car is located in San Jose, Ca. I am open to offers at this point. Shipping is not a problem. Yes those Desteel wheels are a stock option.

[keiser31]

I like it, too, but I do love most coupes.

[John_S_in_Penna]

On 4/14/2018 at 9:04 PM, cblaufus said:

Sorry about the delay in replying to all the posts. The car is located in San Jose, Ca.... 

 

Mr. Laufus, thanks for giving your location.

You still should provide some contact information.

Someone seeing this ad may want more information;

and newcomers to the forum tend not to check their

pages every day.  Furthermore, not every car fan

has joined this forum, so non-members would have

absolutely no way of posting or sending private messages. 

 

We trust (for now) that you're not a scammer!

Edited April 17, 2018 by John_S_in_Penna (see edit history)

[mikewest]

Laufus- so if you are taking offers would $4000.00 buy the car?

[Joe in Canada]

He is asking $10,000. I found this add for it   https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/cto/d/ultra-rare-1922-elcar-k6/6553801250.html

 

favorite this post ULTRA RARE 1922 ELCAR K6 COUPE LONE SURVIVOR - $10000 (san jose south) hide this posting unhide

<image 1 of 4>

 

 

 

[mikewest]

2 hours ago, Joe in Canada said:

He is asking $10,000. I found this add for it   https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/cto/d/ultra-rare-1922-elcar-k6/6553801250.html

 

favorite this post ULTRA RARE 1922 ELCAR K6 COUPE LONE SURVIVOR - $10000 (san jose south) hide this posting unhide

<image 1 of 4>

 

 

 

Ill make a wager how that is going to work out for him....

[George Albright]

Seems like a nice fellow who owns it. The $4,000 figure Mike West offered is exactly what I thought it is worth. Rare car but looks tired. At least its being saved. George Albright

[old car fan]

Love to have it.we have several odd car's in our car corral.but at 10 grand,not feasible.

[trimacar]

Well, I think you guys at $4K are low ....  Yes, it's an odd car, but it's also a marque one doesn't see often if at all....and while $10K might be slightly high, I can see $6-8K pretty easily for someone with an eclectic collection of cars, don't restore and keep as is for a wonderful discussion piece...

[mikewest]

David, $4000 purchase + $1000. delivery+$2000.00 (tires , tubes, repairs /upgrades to make a runnable car ) = $7000.00  Im  not one of the guys in this hobby that brags I have "Twice invested what its worth" Its a odd duck , and there isn't that many homes for it". This  is a hobby for me, not a business. Ill stick at $4000 where it sits.

[cblaufus]

Thank you to everyone for your input, and although we always want to get the highest price when selling a car, that's not my goal here.  Since it was in my wife's family for so long (60 plus years), and the pride and joy of her departed grandfather, I want to make sure it goes to  someone who is  genuinely enthusiastic about the car.  I feel that posting it for a higher price will separate the serious buyers from the tire kickers, and I don't want it to go to someone who wants it for the engine or parts. This car has a ton of documented history and it would be a shame for all that to be lost forever. As far as it looking tired,  don't be fooled by it's appearance,  It may be old but its still  strong. It doesn't smoke, it drives and stops, and it's rarely used. Don't get me wrong it's not perfect, but at 96 years old it is in pretty good shape.  If I could keep it I would leave it as a survivor.  

[cahartley]

My first collector car was a 1920 Model T Coupe survivor.

I loved it but soon realized I would love it more to have a car that would accommodate more than two people so I sold it.

Being old, a survivor and a Coupe it was the easiest sale I ever made.

I think the right person might pony up $7-$8K for that car but not 10.

[jeff_a]

Speaking of 2-Passengers, one of the photos shows a r.s. seat much smaller than the l.s. seat. In that time period, it usually suggests an Opera Coupe with a bench seat in back for two and a kind of jump seat(in front, r.s.) that folded out of the way for rear seat access. I was wondering if that's what it is.

Edited April 18, 2018 by jeff_a (see edit history)

[cblaufus]

Yes the car has a full back seat and the small folding passenger side seat.

[1912Staver]

Part of the problem might be that many of the people on the forum already have at least one car from whatever era they favor, and many of us have several.  As a result of this very few of us will have  spare garage or storage space. In order for a "for sale" car to attract a buyer on this site the car in question must be exceptional in some way. Exceptional to the degree that one of will either expand our covered space or reduce our existing collection to accommodate the potential newcomer. 

 Exceptional at the lower end of the market usually means a near give away price.  The financial upside potential  of a 1920's Elcar coupe is near nil. I am certainly not talking about making a profit, we all know that is generally a pipe dream with old cars. Rather just getting back a reasonable fraction of the money spent over the time an individual owns and cares for something like this. A very low buy in is more or less essential at this end of the spectrum.

 You are correct, Craigslist and the Bay attract people actively looking for a car, occasionally for preservation but as often as not as a blank canvass to realise their vision of "the build".

If you want to place an old car in the hands of its next caretaker this forum is probably as good a place as any to advertise.

If you want to turn over a unit of inventory then by all means expand your potential pool of buyers using all avenues of advertising.  Vintage car enthusiast's are often short on one resource or another. Ebayer's often have cash and a vision.

 

Greg in Canada

Edited April 19, 2018 by 1912Staver (see edit history)

[Terry Harper]

I am glad to see this survivor and I hope it goes to a good home. I have always been interested in Elcar - they produced some interesting and powerful automobiles for the time.

This discussion reminds me of the Locomobile Junior 8 that was recently for sale. In the case of the Locomobile we had a wonderful survivor from a low volume, high quality prestige manufacturer and yet it took forever to move out of the low ball numbers.  As with this Elcar would it ever be worth a big buck professional restoration? No but sensitively restored by a DIY type person and it would be both rewarding and unique.

 

For a further discussion on Elcar:

http://forums.aaca.org/topic/286100-elcar/

 

 

[1912Staver]

This particular Elcar unfortunately has little of the qualities that make the Classic era Elcar's special. It is a interesting but none the less somewhat plain, middle of  the road, early 1920's coupe. It would be an interesting starter car for a old car enthusiast that can't spend much. I agree that $4000.00 sounds too low, and $10,000.00 is definitely too high.  Perhaps it looks better in person, but in the photo's it looks quite ordinary.

 

Greg in Canada

Edited April 19, 2018 by 1912Staver (see edit history)

[Grimy]

I find it to be an interesting car, and certainly rare if not particularly attractive (the latter common to closed cars of this period).  The wheels and tires appear much too small for the car's proportions (they appear to be later, smaller wheels and balloon tires which did not appear until about 1924), and would be a major and costly effort to change back.  If I'm correct on this point, I can understand that the preservation of this car required changing the wheels before reproduction high-pressure tires were available.  Today, the tires are easy --but not cheap -- to obtain, but wheels are much more difficult and costly. 

 

On the other hand, we have an active Nickel Age Touring Club in the Bay Area which would welcome this car to participate in our activities. 

[mikewest]

Must be some of you guys have a magic carpet to transport cars for free  and a favorite uncle with a parts /tire store . This is a neat little coupe but the reality is there is a very small demand for these non describe  oddball makes. The owner asked for a cash offer - no asking the wife or see if I can get a Ebay loan.... smile... Its not where you start on these old cars its where you are going to end up. In my opinion if this car was a AACA winner it wouldn't pull $20,000. Its neat and rare but so are DODO birds.

Edited April 19, 2018 by mikewest (see edit history)

[Grimy]

I just looked at the Standard Catalog entries on 1922 Elcars.  The tire size is not mentioned, but both the K (35 hp) and the R (55 hp) rode on a 117" wheelbase.  The 127" wheelbase, and more gracious styling, arrived in 1925. A period catalog photo of a R sedan shows wheels and tires which fill up the fender opening and don't make the front fender overhang look so awkward.  The Standard Catalog implies, but does not state, that the K was 4 cylinders and the R was 6 cylinders.  OP, please post some photos of the engine.

Edited April 19, 2018 by Grimy
correct typo (see edit history)

[mikewest]

Richelieu,

I agree with you totally on the shipping costs being the buyers burden.  That's why I ALWAYS factor every expense that I may incur when buying a car that I don't need . When dealing in high priced merchandise , say a 50K car a $1000.00 shipping bill is only 2%. This amount can usually be absorbed into the costs of the car , but when offering $4000.00 for the purchase , that equates to 25% of the cost of the car. Im sure  everyone on this site can add and subtract,   but this is how I don't get over invested in a old car. Again I want to say this car is neat , odd and would be fun to play with but why own it wrong?? It may be a 7-8k car but if I buy it I want it ready to go in MY driveway for 7-8- not in Texas. The more I look at the pics it looks like a lot of work with no reward in site if fixed.  Also the owner asked for a offer and I obliged him! Mike

PS - I REALLY enjoy looking at your great collection of unrestored cars! Id like to visit sometime and see them!

[cahartley]

5 hours ago, RICHELIEUMOTORCAR said:

 I don't know the seller or the car, however, with so many guys here thinking this car is not worth much just because it's such an oddball car, let me ask this one question to all.... If any of us owned a complete, running and driving early 1920's Elcar, or any other early 20s era running and driving car, would you sell it for only 4k? 

 

It isn't a matter of selling for 4K........it's GETTING 4K....... 

[trimacar]

On ‎4‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 9:26 PM, cblaufus said:

Thank you to everyone for your input, and although we always want to get the highest price when selling a car, that's not my goal here.  Since it was in my wife's family for so long (60 plus years), and the pride and joy of her departed grandfather, I want to make sure it goes to  someone who is  genuinely enthusiastic about the car.  I feel that posting it for a higher price will separate the serious buyers from the tire kickers, and I don't want it to go to someone who wants it for the engine or parts. This car has a ton of documented history and it would be a shame for all that to be lost forever. As far as it looking tired,  don't be fooled by it's appearance,  It may be old but its still  strong. It doesn't smoke, it drives and stops, and it's rarely used. Don't get me wrong it's not perfect, but at 96 years old it is in pretty good shape.  If I could keep it I would leave it as a survivor.  

I think this is as honest as an answer to price criticism as could ever be posted.

 

I further feel it's a solid $8K car.  No, you may not want it at that price, but someone will and does.  It's a unique piece of car history, one that is rarely if ever seen, and there's no reason to beat cblaufus up on his asking price, unless you're a serious buyer.

 

I think he's answered the question, I would submit that further criticism is not needed, I sincerely hope this car ends up with someone who appreciates the historical value of such a car.

[cblaufus]

I really enjoy reading everyone's posts and  fortunately I grew "thick skin" in the military. HaHa. Anyway  I wanted to get back to Grimy with the 6 cyl vs 4 cyl  and the steel wheels.  I have a copy of the owners manual and a price list and here are a few pics. 

[Grimy]

Excellent information, thank you for posting!  The Continental 7-R engine at 55 hp is fairly well known, and an inducement to own (sorry, I'm not a prospect, but I hope someone local sdopts this car).  I find it interesting that Elcar used a different letter of the alphabet for each body style.  I can't imagine the company using a smaller 35 hp engine in the same wheelbase, but that's what the Standard Catalog said.  There are so few Elcars of any year that the vast majority of us know little about them.  There is a book devoted to Elcar but it's not in my library.  The engine photo is helpful; can you post one of its right side?

 

I'm still puzzled by the wheels, which appear too small.  Paige (with which I'm much more familiar), for example, offered disc wheels as an option to wooden spokes during the 1920s, but of the same size including tire size.  Could you please post the tire size cast into the tire sidewalls?  

[cblaufus]

The car is at my wife's mother's house  I will get the tire info and another engine pic the next time I go over there. I Have a copy of the Elcar book and the car is listed in the "surviving cars" chapter . 

 I contacted the author a few years ago , he knew the car by it's serial number, and spoke of his contact with my wife's grandfather.   Attached is a pic of the book and the car in the book.

[old car fan]

I love the car,we have many. Orphaned car's,by the tlme we get it from California,out of budget.would love to see it  at our corral

[nzcarnerd]

Looks odd on those fat tyres. The book says original size was 33 x 4, or 31 x 4 for the 1923 four cylinder car.

 

I would have though original period replacement Disteel wheels would look more like these.

 

[jeff_a]

On 4/19/2018 at 5:40 PM, trimacar said:

I think this is as honest as an answer to price criticism as could ever be posted.

 

I further feel it's a solid $8K car.  No, you may not want it at that price, but someone will and does.  It's a unique piece of car history, one that is rarely if ever seen, and there's no reason to beat cblaufus up on his asking price, unless you're a serious buyer.

 

I think he's answered the question, I would submit that further criticism is not needed, I sincerely hope this car ends up with someone who appreciates the historical value of such a car.

David,

I think it's a unique piece of car history, too. A little early for a coupe. Though the model list seem to just call it a 3- or 4-Passenger Coupe, it's looking a little like an Opera Coupe with the seat in back. I wonder if it has a top hat compartment behind the driver.  

 

To the British, it's all about what connections something has to royalty; the French are keen on how you pronounce things; the Germans are more interested in the mechanical details. We Americans obsess over how something looks. This car has a somewhat dowdy paint job currently....but if it had 8 hand-rubbed coats of Copenhagen Blue lacquer & a shiny Elcar motometer or Pegasus radiator ornament, and an elegant couple in evening dress popped out of it....there would be a bit more of a rush for the car.

 

Did you know there's an Elcar Museum? My grandpa's favorite car, a '26, wound up there.   Jeff

Photo:  from v.milke and W.S. Locke. 1926 Elcar 8-81 Landau Roadster(owned by Glenn D. Brown 1926-1990) in front of the CCCA Museum circa 2012.

Edited April 26, 2018 by jeff_a (see edit history)

[John_S_in_Penna]

5 hours ago, jeff_a said:

Did you know there's an Elcar Museum? My grandpa's favorite car, a '26, wound up there.   Jeff

 

I really like seeing the unusual cars.

I recall reading that there are several Elcars on

display in Elkhart, Indiana, where they were made.

Maybe someone here can tell us more.

[trimacar]

Such a neat car.  I sent you a private message, thanks....

[g-g-g0]

3 hours ago, John_S_in_Penna said:

 

I really like seeing the unusual cars.

I recall reading that there are several Elcars on

display in Elkhart, Indiana, where they were made.

Maybe someone here can tell us more.

 

Maybe you are referring to S. Ray Miller Museum. It officially closed in 2009 and the contents were sold at auction. The museum housed and featured several Indiana built cars such as Dusenberg, Auburn, Cord, Elcar and Elkhart. Maybe others! Just can’t remember as it has been a few years back. A very nice and well done museum that got caught up in an estate settlement disagreement that resulted in the collection being sold. The city of Elkhart was not interested in purchasing so it ended in the sale. Very sad to see as a very similiar happening with the Hudson Museum in Shipshewana, IN being auctioned off later this year.

[jeff_a]

The Elcar Museum is in Bristol, IN. I haven't had gas money to go there or checked about it recently, but there was an article about an event there in 2010 in Hemmings Motor News.

Some years ago the contact information was wslcar@gmail.com. It's a private collection -- and I don't know how open to the public it may be.