Matt Harwood Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 I just bought this cool '56 Chrysler Windsor wagon for my wife after admiring it for a while. It's been for sale for quite some time at a dealership where I have some friends, so we worked a deal today. I know a pink station wagon isn't for everyone, but Melanie is in love with it and how can you not dig a big pink luxury wagon? V8 power, nice interior, lots of options, what's not to love? So we'll give it a try after selling her '64 Impala wagon a few weeks ago. Three rows of seats should be great for kids. Melanie plans to drive it every day. First up: chrome wire wheels. Yes, I know a lot of people don't like them, but if you're going to drive a car like this, I think it needs them. The plain Jane hubcaps aren't doing it any favors and some sparkling wires will really dress it up. I like the look. However, I'm seeing that there are two bolt circles for these cars: 5x4.5 and 5x5. Can anyone confirm which this wagon might have? I'm guessing it's the larger size since it's a heavy car, but maybe the larger size was just for the Imperial. Does anyone know for certain? I'd like to get some wheels ordered ASAP so they're ready to go on when the car arrives in a week or two. I'm sure I'll have many more questions after we spend some time with the car. Just hoping to make it a great driver for the summer. Thanks! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auburnseeker Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 Neat car I like 50's wagons. I had a 56 Dodge Sierra Wagon out of CA back in the mid 90's. It "needed paint " by standards then, though we would have left it alone today. I stripped it to bare metal (a turnkey car) Then it sat in the corner of the garage (surprisingly never flash rusting) for 10 years, until after trying to sell it for a year or so, I got the idea to finish it, even buying a few nice pieces of chrome I still have hanging in my office, Of course, that's when someone came along and gave me a fair return on my investment. Unfortunately looking back, I should have kept it. Looking further back, I should have never stripped the paint off it. Thus the reason I harp on guys to not tear cars apart, unless they are sure they can get them back together. It would have been a lot more fun to own if I could have been driving it. The colors on that were Chinese Coral and Iridescent Charcoal Metallic. So Pinkish bottom and gray roof and upper. I did have a full set of wires for it as well, but they were painted with the chrome simulated knockoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maok Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 "So I guess I'm a Chrysler guy now" - its a good problem to have....:) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 (edited) They used the larger bolt pattern on Imperial, limousine and 8 passenger sedan and station wagon models. I don't know about 1956 but it seems likely. One of us should pop a hubcap and look. You are closer than we are. Hope you grow to appreciate the quality of Chrysler built products. Road tester Tom McCahill observed of the 55 New Yorker, that every part on the car appeared to cost more to make than the corresponding part on competitive makes. Edited March 9, 2018 by Rusty_OToole (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c49er Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 (edited) I've never seen a small bolt pattern Chrysler wagon through 1954. My 1950 Chrysler wagon has the 5-1/2" pattern with 12" brakes. The wagons have heavier bigger suspension parts and drum hubs. Same as the Imperials.... not the Crown Imperial Limo's. You should measure the pattern to be sure. Edited March 9, 2018 by c49er (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plymouthcranbrook Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 (edited) Pleased to have you in the Tribe. I expect that it will quickly grow on you and you will wonder how you ever did without it. As i have suggested to others look here for more help if needed. http://p15-d24.com/page/index.html Edited March 9, 2018 by plymouthcranbrook (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpcdfan Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 Matt, Your wagon definitely takes the large Imperial bolt pattern wire wheels. I have a set if you're looking for some nice used ones. If so, drop me a pm and I'll dig the out and send you some pics. Great car, the only thing better is if it would have been a New Yorker which had the hemi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dosmo Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 For the sake of safety, I'd think about converting to a dual pot master cylinder. As a daily driver in today's traffic, she's gonna have to mash that brake pedal pretty hard to whoa that thing down. It's not a great experience to jam the brake pedal, and feel it go to the floor. I've been there, done that. Great car, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c49er Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 Those cars stop very very well if the brake job is done properly.You can lock em up easily if you want. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 Chrysler brakes were state of the art for the times and are very good if properly maintained and adjusted but this must be done precisely according to the manual. I would keep the stock brakes but the dual MC is a good idea. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithb7 Posted March 9, 2018 Share Posted March 9, 2018 (edited) That is a very nice looking car. Congrats. A daily driver for your wife and kids, please do all you can to make it as safe as possible. Seat belts all around. Upgraded brakes. At the least. My understanding is the aftermarket Chinese built brake parts are not very good quality. Wheel cylinders are culprits I hear. Repeated leaking issues they say. Edited March 10, 2018 by keithb7 (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dosmo Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 21 hours ago, c49er said: Those cars stop very very well if the brake job is done properly.You can lock em up easily if you want. Agreed, they stop very well, and you can lock them up easily - unless the master cylinder blows out. I blew out the MC on a 1954 T&C Station Wagon - every single thing had been rebuilt or replaced in the braking system, with the exception of the power booster. Traveling about 50 mph, I topped a hill, only to see traffic backed up at the bottom of the hill. I hit the brake firmly, to give enough time to bring that heavy beast to a stop. The pedal caught for a moment, then slammed to the floor. I'm very grateful that the car had a good-functioning emergency brake. That taught me a lesson I won't forget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c49er Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Got to use high quality parts and keep up on the maintenance for sure. Your 1954 T&C of course has the booster under the floor and I've seen and had my share of complete instant failures with those boosters. Never a instant M/cylinder though. With the old cars I drive very cautiously because of all the fast and crazy traffic. Old cars can never compete with new cars in acceleration handling and stopping. Even with un-engineered upgrades Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted March 12, 2018 Author Share Posted March 12, 2018 Thanks for the advice everyone. I'm excited to get the car and we'll see what it needs. It purports to be above average, but every car needs something. I'll take dpcdfan up on his offer for some chrome wires--I think the car really needs them to be dressed properly. Once I have it, I'll measure the bolt circle and make sure they'l fit. It's SOP at our shop to go through the cars that we buy, including brakes, and particularly since my wife and kids will be driving it regularly. No worries there. It appears to already have seat belts in place, which is a plus, I suppose, as long as they're properly installed. Melanie is already asking about adding A/C.What would it have looked like in this car in 1956? Would an under-dash unit be appropriate? We're pretty excited to see it. Will get more photos once it's in my hands. Thanks, everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpcdfan Posted March 12, 2018 Share Posted March 12, 2018 3 hours ago, Matt Harwood said: Thanks for the advice everyone. I'm excited to get the car and we'll see what it needs. It purports to be above average, but every car needs something. I'll take dpcdfan up on his offer for some chrome wires--I think the car really needs them to be dressed properly. Once I have it, I'll measure the bolt circle and make sure they'l fit. It's SOP at our shop to go through the cars that we buy, including brakes, and particularly since my wife and kids will be driving it regularly. No worries there. It appears to already have seat belts in place, which is a plus, I suppose, as long as they're properly installed. Melanie is already asking about adding A/C.What would it have looked like in this car in 1956? Would an under-dash unit be appropriate? We're pretty excited to see it. Will get more photos once it's in my hands. Thanks, everyone! Hi Matt, I'll be digging those wire wheels out and get you some pics this week. Haven't forgotten you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
36 D2 Coupe Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 Chrysler had some remarkable colours in the '50s. I learned to drive in a '59 Dodge Mayfair (Canadian Plodge) that had a pink body and deep wine or maroon roof! Could always find it in a parking lot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted March 16, 2018 Author Share Posted March 16, 2018 It has arrived! Dead battery in the trailer, so we jumped it and it fired right up. Pretty serious exhaust leak at the manifold collector, so it sounds like junk but we'll get that fixed later today. Otherwise, extremely straight, clean car that appears to be wearing original paint. Runs very well, idles nicely, pushbutton transmission shifts without hesitation. Even the power windows and seat work! The rear leaf springs are shot, so we have a guy locally who can re-arch them or add a leaf, so we'll take it to him next week to get it to sit right. I just ordered new shocks, since the ones on the car appear to be original. There's no rot anywhere on the car, it's really impressive, although it's obviously scruffy and dirty underneath. Interior is new and someone just spent a lot of money on detailing the engine bay and a new correct wiring harness. It's also sitting on relatively recent BFG wide whitewall radials, which is nice. One puzzling thing is that when we put the battery charger on it, the generator started to buzz--you could feel it through the belts as if the battery is driving the generator. Is there a cut-out in there somewhere that should prevent this from happening? It seems to generate properly when the engine is running according to the ammeter, but when the charger is on it, it seems energized. Also, connecting the battery charger, the terminals sparked as if something was on, although everything was off. Can a Mopar electricity expert offer some thoughts? I'm guessing regulator but it seems to be operating properly. Maybe just because the battery was so flat dead? Things on the list to do: 1. Fix exhaust leak. 2. New fluids throughout (looks like the brakes have been recently serviced with new cylinders and hoses at least) 3. New seal on pinion. 4. New shocks. 5. Fix loose exhaust hanger. 6. Wire wheels! (I confirmed it has the large bolt circle) 7. Add A/C under the dash 8. Don't kill me, but if this is going to be a regular driver, we're thinking about a late-model 4-speed automatic overdrive transmission so Melanie can take it on long trips home to Canada. Best of all, Melanie is IN LOVE with it. She's extremely excited. So we'll have to get it dialed in before the warm weather hits. Thanks for the advice! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpcdfan Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 (edited) Matt, Still working on the wire wheel situation. I own a restaurant so I have to work the car stuff into my program. Haven't forgotton you! Edited March 16, 2018 by dpcdfan mistake (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ply33 Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 Should be a cut our section built into the voltage regulator. If the points on it are stuck closed it would account for your generator buzzing when you put the charger on. It would also explain the dead battery. I hope that fully discharging the battery through the generator didn't overheat anything inside the generator. The fact that it seems to charge normally when running is good, so maybe there wasn't too much damage to the generator. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Posted March 16, 2018 Share Posted March 16, 2018 (edited) Ply33 nailed it. There is a cutout in the regulator and it must have stuck. Resist the temptation to just buy a new one. Take it off of there, pop the cover off and have a good look. I think you will see which one is stuck. Maybe it welded itself, maybe there is just dirt in the pivot or something. Pop the contacts apart. Be careful not to bend anything as it affects the setting. The cutout setting is not as critical as the others, but it pays to be gentle. You can clean contacts gently by putting some electrical solvent or brake cleaner or something on a strip of copy paper and dragging it between the contacts, while closing them lightly with a finger. That may be enough. Don't go directly to filing, though you may have to. There could be some precious metal on the contacts to improve life and reduce maintenance. Try not to remove it. The contacts don't necessarily need to look good (and they won't), just make good connection. In the old days there were "spoon" files meant for scraping the crap off of those contacts without damage. I don't know where you would find one now. Sandpaper has always been a no no. Have fun! Edited March 19, 2018 by Bloo (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted March 19, 2018 Author Share Posted March 19, 2018 On 3/16/2018 at 2:56 PM, Bloo said: Ply33 nailed it. There is a cutout in the regulator and it must have stuck. Resist the temptation to just buy a new one. Take it off of there, pop the cover off and have a good look. I think you will see which one is stuck. Maybe it welded itself, maybe there is just dirt in the pivot or something. Pop the contacts apart. Be careful not to bend anything as it affects the setting. The cutout setting is not as critical as the others, but it pays to be gentle. You can clean contacts gently by putting some electrical solvent or brake cleaner or something on a strip of copy paper and dragging it between the contacts, while closing them lightly with a finger. That may be enough. Don't go directly to filing, though you may have to. There could be some precious metal on the contacts to improve life and reduce maintenance. Try not to remove it. The contacts don't necessarily need to look good (and they won't), just make good connection. In the old days there were "spoon" files meant for scraping the crap off of those contacts without damage. I don't know where you would find one now. Sandpaper has always been no no. Have fun! New exhaust gasket installed and it runs smooth and quiet. Nice! Then we pulled the regulator and all the points are free--it's shiny and clean like it is a new regulator. Points are all smooth and free. I do note that on one of the terminals (the one that looks different from the other two, which I presume is the cut-out), they have it adjusted pretty tight. I did buy a shop manual, so we'll see what needs to be adjusted, but it seems like it's just tuned too tightly to release the points. I'll keep you posted. Thanks for the feedback that confirms what we suspected! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted March 23, 2018 Author Share Posted March 23, 2018 So we futzed with the regulator for two days without any luck. Adjusted it to spec, cleaned the points (which were in really good condition), and all we were able to do is make the generator stop generating. Against Ply33's advice, I went ahead and bought an NOS regulator on eBay for $25 and I received it today. We'll install it tomorrow and see what it does. The generator is working properly, as grounding the field coil sends it to full charge--it has to be the regulator. I suspect it was bad and the previous owner just cranked them tight to essentially ground the field coil and just make it put out 100% all the time. It would be good enough to make it run and it wouldn't be his problem. That kind of bugs me because it's exactly why people in my business get a bad reputation. I would never let a car go out of my shop with something like that amiss. Anyway, we have a new one and I'll be able to double-check everything tomorrow. I don't expect any issues. I'd just like to take it for a drive now that the roads are dry. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
c49er Posted March 23, 2018 Share Posted March 23, 2018 Hope you didn't purchase a new Chinese regulator! NOS factory Autolite is the way to go. Especially on that nice car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ply33 Posted March 23, 2018 Share Posted March 23, 2018 13 hours ago, Matt Harwood said: . . . Against Ply33's advice, . . . I think it was Bloo who advised against buying a new one. My suggestion was only that the cut out section of the regulator wasn't working properly. Anyway, I hope that the new regulator solves the problem for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted March 23, 2018 Author Share Posted March 23, 2018 (edited) 11 minutes ago, c49er said: Hope you didn't purchase a new Chinese regulator! NOS factory Autolite is the way to go. Especially on that nice car. No worries there. The box crumbled in my hands--it was from the 1950s. Definitely not modern Chinese stuff. In fact, it's more correct-looking than the one we took off, which seemed to be a generic replacement. The one I bought matches the one shown in the manual. I take that as a good sign. Although as these things always go, I found that two of the three connectors for the wires on the regulator were barely crimped on and fell off when we disassembled it. That might be part of the problem. So I'm trying to solder on some flag connectors that look right. Unfortunately, I don't seem to be able to get the flag connector hot enough--I don't know why, it worked perfectly on my '41 Buick when I was wiring up the fog lights. I might have to resort to modern eye connectors and some shrink-wrap. The way it's fighting me, I hope there's no bad juju on this Chrysler. I've had to walk away from it twice now... Edited March 23, 2018 by Matt Harwood (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
auburnseeker Posted March 23, 2018 Share Posted March 23, 2018 2 hours ago, Matt Harwood said: The way it's fighting me, I hope there's no bad juju on this Chrysler. I've had to walk away from it twice now... She's just showing you who is boss. She is making you earn your play time with her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hudsy Wudsy Posted March 23, 2018 Share Posted March 23, 2018 Matt, depending on her tastes, perhaps your wife would enjoy accessorizing her new wagon by doing a little antiquing. Vintage picnic baskets and various totes, overnight cases and luggage, as well as blankets are cool little things to have in the spacious rear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted March 23, 2018 Share Posted March 23, 2018 Matt....that is an awesome car! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted March 23, 2018 Share Posted March 23, 2018 37 minutes ago, Hudsy Wudsy said: Matt, depending on her tastes, perhaps your wife would enjoy accessorizing her new wagon by doing a little antiquing. Vintage picnic baskets and various totes, overnight cases and luggage, as well as blankets are cool little things to have in the spacious rear. Fifties transistor radio, lawn chairs, all from the era and you are set for any car show. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted March 23, 2018 Author Share Posted March 23, 2018 53 minutes ago, Hudsy Wudsy said: Matt, depending on her tastes, perhaps your wife would enjoy accessorizing her new wagon by doing a little antiquing. Vintage picnic baskets and various totes, overnight cases and luggage, as well as blankets are cool little things to have in the spacious rear. Funny you should mention that... The car has been used for several magazine photo shoots. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hudsy Wudsy Posted March 23, 2018 Share Posted March 23, 2018 That's great fun, Matt. That tailgate display is adorable. The pink and brown cake takes me back many years. Pink and brown was a popular color combination in home décor. I'm a little surprised that it never became a thing with cars. I occasionally drive past a fifties house around here that is pink with brown shutters. Tell her for us that we all think that she has great taste and we wish her many years of fun with her new toy. How does she feel about toy poodles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted March 24, 2018 Author Share Posted March 24, 2018 No toy poodles, just Rocket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hudsy Wudsy Posted March 24, 2018 Share Posted March 24, 2018 Rocket's plenty cute! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted March 25, 2018 Author Share Posted March 25, 2018 (edited) Whew. OK, the regulator is installed and operating correctly but what a fight. First I couldn't get my soldering gun to make enough heat to install a flag terminal, so I had to resort to a dreaded ring terminal and some shrink tubing. It worked out OK. Problem two was that the mounting screws were apparently just screwed into the sheetmetal of the firewall--there were no blind fasteners on the other side--which resulted in two hours of cursing, shouting, and jumping up and down. I explained to the Chrysler that I had the means and the willingness to wad it up into a little ball and push it out into the street. It seems to have understood. With some help from Melanie, I found some appropriate nuts and secured the regulator's bolts from under the dash. Glancing at the wiring and the BAT FLD and ARM terminals and their associated wires, I noticed that it appeared that the wires were not connected properly. However, that's how they were on the other regulator. Doing a little checking with my DVOM I found that it was indeed connected correctly and that somewhere in the harness, the green and yellow wires changed places. Connecting the battery and hitting the starter, the engine fired easily and the ammeter showed full charge which gradually decreased to 0 after about 30 seconds. I'd call that working correctly. Check out the wire colors--if you look closely, you can see that the red and green wires go the generator armature and field terminals, respectively, and the yellow wire goes to the junction block just behind the battery on the fender. Connecting it as shown in the first photo, however, and the system works correctly. Strange. Then I noticed that every few seconds, there would be an audible click under the dash and the ammeter needle would bounce around. I figured that it was just the regulator at work and maybe it was supposed to be isolated on rubber feet or something. But I stuck my head back under the dash and found that it was coming from above the radio where the secondary switches are--headlights, wiper, lighter, etc. CLICK! Feeling around up there, I was able to generate some rather substantial sparks by moving some wires around--yikes! I had Melanie pull the battery cable and did some investigating until I found the metal control cable sleeve for the heater was red hot! Apparently it was shorting against the back of the wiper switch and the click sound was the wiper switch's circuit breaker cycling and resetting every few seconds as it overheated. I pulled the cable away and wrapped it in some rubber hose to permanently insulate it against rubbing against anything else. Problem solved. We let it run for a while and the gauge showed it was very hot but my little infrared thermometer tester said the water pump and radiator were 120-130 degrees. Does that sound right? I could put my hand on the upper hose and radiator tank and keep it there. I'm guessing the sending unit is bad, so I'll replace it, but it idled for about 20 minutes and never got much warmer than that. The fan moves a HUGE amount of air and I looked in the top of the radiator and could see coolant moving, so the water pump is working and the thermostat must have been open. Does that sound right? Next up, we put it on the lift to chase some exhaust noises. Two of the hangers were worn out, so I replaced those, tweaked the positioning of the driver's side muffler a bit to make some clearance against the frame, and tightened a bunch of nuts and bolts, from the manifold back to the tailpipe. Much better. No more rattle and clunk underneath, although I'm still getting some minor exhaust leaks that bother me. I think I'll try to get some new manifold gaskets and see if I can seal it up properly. But it sounds pretty healthy now. Last step was to adjust the parking brake. Since the car has no Park position in the transmission, this is really important and on this car, it did exactly nothing. I read in the manual that they want you to remove the driveshaft to adjust it so you can determine whether it's easy to move, but I was able to rotate it back and forth slightly by hand to determine whether the shoes inside the drum were dragging. I used a crude tool I made to adjust the star wheel (just like on regular drum brakes) until it was snug. Pull out the E-brake and it grabs tight after about 6 clicks. Nice! I noticed that the brake light warning switch was buggered, so I'll get another one and fix that part, too. I'm hoping to take it for a drive tomorrow. I have fresh shocks to put on, but I'm going to wait until we take it to the spring shop and get the rear springs re-arched before I worry about the shocks. Let's just make sure it drives right, first, eh? Edited March 25, 2018 by Matt Harwood (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keiser31 Posted March 25, 2018 Share Posted March 25, 2018 EXCELLENT! One thing I might mention is that the handbrake is not like the drum brakes where you want them to be snug enough to hear a slight drag. If you do that with the handbrake band, it may heat up and cause problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted March 26, 2018 Author Share Posted March 26, 2018 4 hours ago, keiser31 said: EXCELLENT! One thing I might mention is that the handbrake is not like the drum brakes where you want them to be snug enough to hear a slight drag. If you do that with the handbrake band, it may heat up and cause problems. Correct. I adjusted it so there's zero drag at full release. I don't know how long the shoes inside last, but I didn't want to risk burning them down to the rivets. No worries there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Harwood Posted May 3, 2018 Author Share Posted May 3, 2018 Wire wheels showed up today--big thanks to dpcdfan (Gary) for delivering in a VERY big way. We're cleaning them up a bit (although they really don't need much) and we'll have them mounted Friday or early next week. It's going to look awesome! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpcdfan Posted May 3, 2018 Share Posted May 3, 2018 Thanks Matt... glad they went to a great home. Looking forward to seeing them on the car!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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