Body wood pattern for 25-45 touring

[Oregon Desert model 45]

Here are some photos of progress i have made in figuring out body wood pattern for my 25-45 touring. Most of this wood is old softwood lumber plus a few oak pieces that my dad made back in the 80's that are now rotten at the bottoms.
 I finally got the cowl attached to sills so thought it was time to try hanging a door.
i started working on door wood last fall using original wood from a rear door as a pattern. That old wood was pretty weathered and rotten, but i learned that corner joints had tenons angled at 3 degrees.

I copied that design when making my first door frame, assuming it should sit flat on its back side, but that was wrong - front doors are twisted slightly to close at the bottom. 

 3rd photo shows passenger door with flat backed wood frame, bottom of the door sticking out 1 1/2".
As i was looking at the frame trying to figure out what angle to adjust the tenons to make it twisted, and I had this crazy idea to flip the bottom horizontal rail over and pound the frame back together (it was tight going back together with this twist).  Now the frame was twisted and it matched the door opening. I had to plane some more wood off to make the frame fit into the door skin, but it's pretty close. 

I will fit the next door frame properly to the skin with this twist and see if it improves. Fitting is just hand planing to add the curvature to match the complex curvature of the body sheetmetal skin.
4th photo is a wood door frame with angled tenons visible, sitting flat on the tablesaw.
5th photo shows not yet fitted flat backed wood frame and "warped" door frame.
photo 6 & 7 is warped door hung, and fitting up to the body pretty good. The hinge pins are worn which lets the door droop a little.

Last photo is how i got the cowl sheetmetal over the front door posts. I would like to know how they did this at the factory - its really shoehorned over the support structure.  I got the dash panel and windshield support brackets installed after this, but there is a wood tack rail that goes under the rear lip of the cowl, over the dash panel that was held in place with carriage bolts which now cannot be installed. I might try installing a wood T nut into the tack rail and installing bolts from behind.

All these parts need to be assembled together a first time to check for fit up, then adjustments can be made to correct body mismatch, until finally the doors all open & close and line up straight.

Old softwood lumber works just fine for developing these patterns - its easy to cut & plane by hand, plus it does not cost me anything.

 

Kevin

 

[27donb]

Beautiful work. 

 

That dash is complicated to remove, I was attempting it on my 24-45 but abandoned the idea.  Seeing that last picture now I know why. 

 

I thought it would come out as easily as the 27's do, but I was mistaken. 

[sligermachine]

Man that dash is is place with all kind of bolts ,screws , .I was just looking at mine and remembered this pic. thanks --kyle

 

[Oregon Desert model 45]

I have been making progress with the wood.  After many iterations of door wood tennon joints, the doors now fit better, but they still need a more adjustments.  I haven't gotten back to working on the cowl and dash yet.

 

Kevin

 

 

[sligermachine]

The door is back I made a lot of patterns be-four it was done for sure .looking good keep it up 

[Oregon Desert model 45]

I finally got the motor started, and it was Marvel-less !  I had swapped out the Marvel for a Rochester during some earlier trouble shooting, so I just left it there since it was now plumbed to the vacuum fuel pump cannister as a temporary gas tank.  The Rochester seemed to work pretty good, with no hesitation when I opened up the throttle.

  This happened after getting a lesson in aligning the timing gears from the Hard Knocks school of Auto mechanics !  when I assembled the motor, I had aligned the fiber timing gear mark with the flywheel timing mark stamped on the crankshaft gear. 

I attached a short piece of 2" pipe to the manifold, so it was pretty loud, and I won't know if it was making any other noises until I get a full exhaust pipe with muffler. 

This might have been the first time this motor has run since the 1940's, based on a 20 year working life of an average car.

 

Kevin

 

[sligermachine]

On 3/7/2018 at 7:19 PM, Oregon Desert model 45 said:

front doors are twisted slightly to close at the bottom. 

AS I have seen work good 5/8'' the bottom tucked in wile the rest purity flat bottom corner made my doors fit good .

[sligermachine]

On 3/7/2018 at 7:19 PM, Oregon Desert model 45 said:

is warped door hung, and fitting up to the body pretty good. The hinge pins are worn which lets the door droop a little.

the hinges I cut in a little but shimmed them out latter . As they fit and looked better but when the hinges were recessed even a little the door could not be removed  with out touching the door to the cowling  . No paint on it yet but soon that would leave a scratch . ouch  but looks much better lined up I am still thinking of turning off set pins to fix this . that is why their is no paint on my car yet.  -kyle

[Oregon Desert model 45]

I made new front door post wood plus the nail strip that mounts against the instrument panel and tucks up underneath the cowl overhang.  I made a drill jig and used a bushing with a chamfered nose to fit into the hinge countersink to keep the drill perfectly centered when drilling thru the door post. The hole has to line up with hinge, door post, and cast bracket on the back side.  The cast brackets support the windshield posts, so getting it located correct is important.  I stuck the windshield posts into the sockets and mounted the frame to see if it all lines up correctly, and I can't really be sure if everything is in the right place. The lower windshield frame was bent out on one side, so had to be straightened, and now the gap between the cowl and lower frame is narrow in the center, and wider towards the sides. Also note on the upper windshield frame how the mounting holes for a wiper motor are on the right hand side. Is the upper frame from an export model ? 

The nail strip is made from 10 pieces of wood laminated to give it some strength. I cut some shallow slots in the back side of the nail strip to clear the 6 bolt heads that fasten the instrument panel to the heavy brackets which support the windshield posts. This was so i could push the nail strip in place and check how it fits.  I have been thinking of installing tube nuts in the nail strip so the fasteners can be installed from the under side. There is no easy way to get the cowl sheetmetal over the top of the fully assembled structure.

 

 

Kevin

 

[dibarlaw]

Kevin:

 Flip the windshield. The side curtain snap studs are on the inside of both of my 1925s. I know it confused me also as I had seem many other cars of that vintage with them on the outside.

George's 1925-45 at the 2016 Old Car Festival. The side curtains mount to the inside.

 Alan's  All Original car in Long Island. No studs on the outside.

[Hubert_25-25]

That is why the wiper motor holes are on the passenger side as well.   You have one wiper on the drivers side.  My 25-25 has the pins on the inside as well.

 

 Your wood looks great, and nothing wrong with tube nuts.

[Oregon Desert model 45]

Windshield frame is now "rightside out", and some of the bends straightened out. That lower frame looks like it was taken off a car when it was still nearly new, and hung up inside someplace dry. It has no rust, almost all the original paint is still there, just scuffed up, shiny on the inside facing surfaces, a little faded on outside. 

Door hinge pins had varying amounts of wear, which was not helping with door to body alignment,  so I installed new pins on every hinge.

The Door leveler pads located in the jamb were completely worn thru on the lower side from the constant weight of sagging doors rubbing against them, probably from driving on rough unpaved roads back in the day.  I made a bending form by grinding a piece of scrap steel plate until it would just fit inside one of the unworn upper pads.  A  1 x 1-3/4 blank piece of sheetmetal with corners trimmed could then be clamped against the bending form in the bench vise, each edge bent over the form with a hammer.  The final inside radius was formed by hammering with a blunted cold chisel. The only excess remained on the ends, which was trimmed using snips.  The new pads fit over the rubber just like the original, and should last for another 93 years or so.

 

Kevin

 

[dibarlaw]

Kevin:

 Yes I had to make new pins for my Standard doors. The Master doors will be needing them also good thing I made extra.

[Oregon Desert model 45]

Here are some of the latest wood working projects I have tackled on the 25-45:   In the first photo, the left side body contour front to back is slightly crooked in the center pillar area, while the right side, second photo, has a nice smooth contour.  I was able to improve the left side by making a new wood piece for the top of the center pillar.

The seat back wooden corners have a slight helical shape where they mount to a metal strap which was formed by twisting a piece of flat bar.   I have managed to copy the old weathered wooden corner piece in the third photo,  which I believe to be the only original wood piece from this car.  Fourth photo shows the assembled seat back rail with corner pieces.  This wood is not just a tack rail,  but along with the sheetmetal corners it acts as center body stiffener that keeps the body from wiggling when the doors are slammed shut.

The front door levelers had been dragging on the center pillar jamb area, and after looking at the door latch alignment, I realized the door jamb could be trimmed back 1/8" to  provide enough clearance between door leveler and the pillar. Trimming the door jamb first requires the use of a router template to cut the curve in up/down direction, then run thru the tablesaw with blade tipped 7 degrees to match the bent angle of the latch , and finally some hand planing to smooth out any mismatches. There is a tablesaw blade burn mark visible right around the latch in the last photo. I am still trying to think of a repeatable way to cut the 7 degree surface using the router.

 

Kevin

[Mark Shaw]

Excellent progress Kevin.  I am patiently waiting for my ride....

[Oregon Desert model 45]

The rear axle is now attached, making it one step closer to having it ready for Mark's ride !

First photo is using the come-along to pull the axle forward and mate the driveshaft to universal joint.  

Before installing axle there was a small hickup getting the universal joint installed. It fit real tight over the transmission output shaft, so had to use the big nut to finish seating it home, and then it was bound up and would not turn. Apparently the speedo helical gear behind the universal would not go past the geared speedo output shaft. I had to use a puller to back the universal out a little, then remove the speedo output shaft, seat the universal, and install the speedo shaft afterwards. Then everything turned freely like it should.

 

Kevin