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Car Ads which don't include the price


crazycars

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The logic of not including a price in a "car for sale" ad escapes me. I see this all the time in Hemmings. Lets face it, isn't the bottom line the price?

Perhaps its done in an effort to keep out tire kickers but I find it plain annoying.  Calling up the seller gives you a feeling of obligation, best avoided.

I found that, in my flea market selling days, it always paid to put a price on everything because people were generally reluctant to ask .  Pricing items resulted in much greater profits.

Human nature, I guess.

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I agree with you guys for the most part, but if it's something that I want, I'll usually go through the effort of engaging the seller. It's true that often the seller will have unrealistic expectations, but most often they just need an education about the market and what their vehicle is worth at the moment and in the place where it sits. I try to be patient and kind, leave my name and number, and once in a while I'll get a call back after others have rudely told them how nuts they are.

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6 hours ago, John_S_in_Penna said:

And the claim that "If you have to ask,

you can't afford it" is not valid, for any car

at any price.  Even well-off people I know

are concerned about the cost, and they don't

spend profligately.

 

No one ever got rich by going shopping.

Twelve points for "profligate" use!

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6 hours ago, 1937hd45 said:

,,,seeing the price on cars you do have an interest in at least lets you get a feel for what they may be worth.   Bob 

 

I know a price helps, and it certainly used to be the case 

that Bob said.  But often with dealers, and sometimes

with other optimistic sellers, the asking price is double a

car's value.  I know cars that sold, for instance, for $30,000

and the dealer immediately asked $60,000, taking the

car's affordability away from many potential buyers.

Or $75,000 to $150,000.  For some, that's seems almost

to be a formula.  In these cases, seeing a listed price is

almost as futile as having no price.

 

Such asking prices give the wrong impression of our hobby.

I always try to point to newcomers that antique cars can be affordable fun.

Edited by John_S_in_Penna (see edit history)
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A common marketing tactic is to overprice so the customer believes he is getting a deal.  Harbor Freight is a good example because almost nobody buys anything at Harbor Freight that is not "Sale Priced".  Selling cars is no different. 

 

A local friend (who has since passed), displayed his high dollar collector cars at a "Casino Museum" in Las Vegas at no charge with the understanding that they were authorized to sell them if some "high roller" came along to buy them well over market value for a negotiated commission to the casino.

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I find that omitting the price increases the number of tire-kickers and dreamers exponentially. I list a price if, for no other reason, to just cut down on the number of nonsense messages that I have to return. "Hey, do you take trades? I have a hot tub that was only used once..."

 

There's a counter-logic that seems to state that if you can get someone to call about whatever you're selling, they're engaged and then you can talk with them about the item and make them forget about price. The belief is that you can get an idea of what the buyer might be willing to pay and you can negotiate right then and there. That might have had merit in the days before the internet and a phone call was the only way to contact someone, but today, it just means you'll get bombarded with crazy lowball E-mails and rude messages demanding, "Price???!?!?!?!????!?" You can't open a meaningful dialog at that point, and certainly not by E-mail. Either you reply with your price and they go away because it's too much, or they buy (which is what you wanted in the first place), or you continue to play coy and tell them that there is more negotiating to be done before you'll give them a price and they need to call you instead so the potential buyer goes away pissed off.

 

In my professional opinion, there is zero advantage to not putting a price on your listing. Treating this like a game or being paranoid that you're going to give your stuff away too cheap is foolhardy. Too many guys watch that pawn shop TV show where the #1 rule is to make the other guy put a number out there first so you know where you're starting. That's BS. Set a price and live with it. Don't act like you're holding all the cards because you're keeping the price a secret. You're only making your job harder.

 

Edited by Matt Harwood (see edit history)
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20 minutes ago, Matt Harwood said:

Set a price and live with it. Don't act like you're holding all the cards because you're keeping the price a secret. You're only making your job harder.

 

Amen and hallelujah ... I believe it is the rare individual who doesn't know the dollar figure they want for an object, and if one knows the figure, then state it.

 

Recently I was discussing an antique artifact with the owner, who claimed they "had no idea what it's worth".  After I expressed interest in the item, and a few back and forths,  the owner then stated "Oh, but one just like it sold on Ebay, and another at such and such auction, so it seems they bring....."  So yes, they DID have a pretty good idea.  I will say that the artifact was right there in my hands, very desirable, and the price he quoted was slightly below full retail, so I did get it!

 

I once found out about a car for sale, I was very interested.  I called the owner, and though I repeatedly asked for some idea of price, he went on and on about rarity, condition, and so on....for almost an hour.  He finally, when pushed, named a price...that was just about three times market value.   I'd say he wasted my time, but it was actually ME who wasted it, I should have demanded in some way a price before listening for an hour....

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26 minutes ago, Doug Novak said:

Slightly off topic, sort of, but what amazes me are the Adds on TV for New Cars and Trucks. They do not mention the price to buy the vehicle, they only tell you what the Monthly Leased Vehicle Cost starts at for the vehicle?

Because they know that telling the list price will make most folks have a stroke.  Ever notice when you go into a Dealership the first question from the salesperson is "What do you want to pay per month"  Why do you think leases are becoming popular again.  Many people have a monthly amount that they can spend and if the price fits, they buy.

Edited by plymouthcranbrook (see edit history)
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Just for the record, I never buy New Cars! I wait and look for cars that are 2 to 4 years old. Many of the 4 year Old cars at places like Carmax are Leased Vehicles that the Leasing Companies are rotating out. We recently bought one from Carmax, a like new 2014 Chevy Equinox with 16,000 miles on it for a price less the half the cost of the new ones. Carmax gets the cars from the Auto Auctions  that only Brokers can attend. When you trade a car in at Car max it too goes directly to the Auction, not to their Show Room or Sales Lot to be sold. Basically they are flipping cars. We traded in a VW Tiquan which covered half of the sell price Carmax wanted for the used  2014 Equinox. The Trade in lowered the cost to where we could pay cash for the like new Equinox. No Car Payments, or loans. 

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15 hours ago, Doug Novak said:

Slightly off topic, sort of, but what amazes me are the Adds on TV for New Cars and Trucks. They do not mention the price to buy the vehicle, they only tell you what the Monthly Leased Vehicle Cost starts at for the vehicle?

Yeah, I believe that for some time now people have been shopping for monthly payments, rather than total cost. I genuinely think that most people don't ever want to know what the total cost of a car, plus the cost of the loan is. Then, of course, there is the cost of complete insurance on a new car. I, too, only buy used and pay cash. My general method has been to bide my time until a car around eight or ten years old shows up for sale with very low miles. It used to work. but of late I'm finding too many things breaking just because of age and not miles.

Edited by Hudsy Wudsy (see edit history)
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I cant recall where I saw it recently ( memory loss :() but it was stated that only 5% of buyers pay cash for new cars. The other 95% are either on monthly payments or leased. So the target market for the advertisers is this demographic. Lending money to car buyers is really big business.

I'm a cheap SOB and must be a relative of Hudsy's 'cause that's how I buy my daily transportation too.   

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As a former car salesperson I can tell you that most customers who buy new cars should be leasing. I do think used cars are a better value, but there is nothing wrong with liking new, and frankly folks who find value in that want to do it sooner than later, and leasing saves money compared to trading in before your loan is up. Frankly, it usually saves money even if you do wait until your loan is up!  You have to keep a vehicle 8-10 years to really "break even" compared to a lease. This is simply the math compared to buying brand new, and you get the added gain of a new vehicle more often with less repairs, more flexibility in your families vehicle needs, and better aversion from deprecation risks. There are exceptions, but not too often from what I saw.

Why do car sales people focus on payments? Two reasons. First, 99% of people come in with a payment in mind more than price. Second, it has potential to hide profits. Frankly, the first one is more important. It's far more important to make the sale than to make lots of money on the sale. Not making the sale is no money. Most customers come in with a payment completely unrealistic to the price of the vehicle they want. As a salesperson, you really have to cater to the 80-90%, not the few who bother to do basic math before coming in. Some folks try to be savvy and go just for the price, and honestly, most of them try to negotiate they payment then too because the payment is higher than their budget! Most people really don't agree to a $500 payment on a $20k car... And the real price you pay is payment times term... so while a salesperson can hide things in a payment, a two second calculation also shows the entire cost and any customer able to make that math would be able to see if something was hidden.

Why does it matter? Well there are lots of hidden fees, and these do vary by state. Doc fees differ, and are even mandatory in some states. Some places allow destination to not be part of the price, and rather an added fee. Some places charge preparation fees on top of this. So it's very easy to find a pick up truck identical in two states advertised for $2000 difference, but the reality is they are priced identically. Most customers don't realize this, and for some reason, most online articles don't talk about this (too focused on all the sneaky ways a dealer tries to make a few hundred bucks on a car than how to make sure you get a really great price from your local deal who should be there when you have issues if you build a relationship with em).

Sorry for the long rant. In the end, it was part of why I left the industry (the other being I have doubts of sales peoples future in the new car industry at a professional level). Customers really don't want someone to help them through the process, and most folks assume the sales guys are ripping them off and the dealers have some secret huge income (other than the service department). You lose alot of sales and money trying to help people. All that being said, I sold plenty of vehicles at full sticker over the years. Funny, not one person who paid "too much" gave me less than a perfect survey... The folks who we nearly broke even on, or even lost money, were the folks most likely to give a bad survey, to the point that when I started getting a sense someone was a likely bad survey I'd send them down the street. You see, part of our bonus structure is based on survey scores, so even worse than making no money losing the sale is losing money making a $100 commission and losing your bonus! Selling insurance actually feels so much better and customers treat you much better too. So do a little research (cell phone), bring a calculator (cell phone), buy local, and once you've picked a make and model, shopping around wastes everyone's time, especially yours with very little gain in 99% of cases. Used cars and antique cars... that's a whole different world. List a darn price!

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