1929 Dictator headlight questions

[keninman]

I have managed to adjust the headlights a bit better on my 29 Dictator but they still fall far short of what is necessary for safe night time driving. Keep in mind this is not highway driving but county roads though other cars are often traveling 50mph or faster. Hopefully someone can answer a few questions.

 

1st, I took the screw out of the lens cover but could not remove the ring. Rather than force it I thought it more prudent to ask advice about removing the ring and lens. Perhaps it has to be rotated a quarter turn or some such trick. 

2nd, though the "brights" setting produces a white light the "dims" are not really any better than a modern auto's parking lights. Even the "brights" setting is not really safe at more than 25mph or you overdrive its lights. 

3rd, though not necessarily correct for the period, what replacement 6v headlight bulbs are available such as LEDs that will produce many more candle power (in the interest of safety). 

4th, What do you do about safety from behind. I move faster than the 25mph for a SLM emblem but with only a single tail light I am afraid that an auto traveling at 50 to 60mph might not notice me and rear end us. I considered clipping a flashing bicycle tail light to the bumper or using reflective tape. 

[1934 commander]

 4th there are so called third brake led suction cup mount  stips on the market think I saw them on early ford site    3rd I have installed leds   all around  dash , headlights  and added signal lites also led

   working on a reworked led strip lite for rear window with both brake and signal lites. all 6 volt  

[Guest trap442w30]

see this about brake light

http://forums.aaca.org/topic/292598-asc-tour-led-brake-light-bar/

 

[Spinneyhill]

Is the position of the bulb adjustable? The location of the filament affects the light focus and thus brightness at the target. On some the bulb holder location is adjustable: it adjusts back and forth. Brighter bulbs don't necessarily improve things if the filament is not at the focal point of the reflector. If the filament is behind the focal point, you get a divergent "beam" of apparent low intensity. If in front, a convergent beam with near focus and divergence past that; again, a dim beam.

 

The usual reason for dim lights is the earth = ground. Paint doesn't conduct electrickery very well. The sparks get to the light through the body (on +ve earth, hence paint restricts them) and return through the wire, which is usually not the problem. I suppose the simple test is to run temporary earth wires from the light bodies to the battery (or chassis) and observe the difference.

 

One-make outfits like The Filling Station sell rear window LED strip brake lights. I think others (e.g. Ford parts shops) do too. That TopServe light looks good too. As a first stage, I have manufactured and installed a second tail light on my 1930 Dodge Brothers. Next will be high brake light and direction indicators. I have replaced the incandescent 3/18W tail light bulbs with LED too. The car is +ve earth. The bulbs came from http://www.classicandvintagebulbs.com/. Take note of the mounting: mine are BA15D (opposite pins), some are BAY15D (offset pins).

 

I am not familiar with Studebaker headlight switches. Does the "dim" setting just introduce a resistor into the circuit? If so, are the connections clean for that resistor?

 

The Dodge has the correct 19 cp bulbs in the head lights and they are adequate for night driving within the capabilities of the car.

Edited August 26, 2017 by Spinneyhill (see edit history)

[Guest trap442w30]

My 1917 originally had 12 candlepower single filament bulbs, but I thought I'd be really slick and put it a pair of 32 candlepower bulbs.  They don't really seem any brighter on high....but my car uses a resistor for the low beams.....and with the 32 candlepower bulbs on low beam it barely makes the filament glow.  I need to get the smaller candlepower bulbs for more light when on the low setting.  Mine also has the ability to "focus" the lights.  The light socket slides fore and aft to focus the beam and that makes a big difference.  Mine also has a ball and socket mount for the headlight to adjust the direction of the beam.  I also added a second taillight.  I got the model T pair of dual filament bulbs from Snyders.  They look almost identical to my 1917 Studebaker single taillight.  But instead of mounting with a couple screws and having a single screw in conduit connecter in the center, they mount with a single post and have the wires come out the bottom.

[keninman]

Though I still have not managed to get the driver's side headlight door off I did get the passenger side opened. I found that someone had installed 1154 bulbs. I looked these up and the filaments are 21cp and 3cp. This would explain their dismal performance. There is also a smaller GE 63 bulb at the top of the reflector. I am not sure why. It is on with high and low beam but also there is a 3rd on position that turns both it and low beam on. I am wondering if there is a miswire somewhere. I assume it is supposed to be some kind of parking lamp. The classic and vintage bulb website in Australia seems to be not filling orders until late October and I am not giving Don's bulbs $40 buck apiece for the 1110 bulbs.

 

 

[Guest]

I believe that your 1110 bulbs have a BA15d base as do 1000  which are 32/32 cp and 1186 which are 50/21 cp.  If I am right and either of these bulbs would work for you I have some spares for a lot less that $40.00 each.

[keninman]

Thanks Tinindian, I ordered 1188 bulbs and hope my electrical system will handle them. They are supposed to be 52/30cp bulbs. I also discovered through testing that never are both filaments on together. This seems odd to me but perhaps having that much heat on for an extended period would cause the bulb to fail. I appreciate your offer though. If you find a source for LED bulbs I would really like to have some. 

[Spinneyhill]

You will have to adjust the generator up a bit at night. They are 5.7 A each or 11.4 A for two headlights. Here is the information on 1188 bulbs from http://www.donsbulbs.com/cgi-bin/r/b.pl/1188~candlepower-incorporated.html

Your wiring and switch will be designed for half that current and may get warm (which will raise its resistance and dim the lights).

 

[Guest]

I found that I had to change and install a 6 volt alternator to use the 52 cp bulbs.  I was doing a lot of night driving, maybe 3 or 4 hours 4 or five nights a week and after a couple of weeks the battery was too low even with the three brush generator set to it's max.  Some nights when I got home and looked under the hood the generator was way too hot to touch.  If you are only out an hour or so occasionally  you should have no problems.

[keninman]

I do very very little night driving. I do like to see when I do it though  How many amps does the generator put out?

[Spinneyhill]

4 minutes ago, keninman said:

 How many amps does the generator put out?

It should tell you that in the Owners Manual or Instruction Manual. The D-R in my 1930 Dodge Brothers 8 puts out the maximum 16 A at 20 to 22 mph. For continuous driving the rate should never exceed 12 A.

 

So if yours is similar, the 1188 headlights will take pretty much all the allowable current.

[keninman]

I don't find anything in the owner's manual. I have a service reference for a 917 (A&E) however mine is a 955U. I did find specs for a 955 (K&H) and these show normal charging at 5-6 amps but max current of 15-20 amps. I have an ammeter in the dash. With the engine slightly revved with no load it showed 12-14 amps. With my bright headlamps on it dropped down to about 4-6 amps. With the engine off and the  brights on, (these are the 1154 bulbs that are in it about 2.8 amps each @ 6v), on brights it shows discharging at 5 amps. I assume since it shows discharging and charging it is only showing the current to and from the battery and not generator output. 

 

I thought I would use my digital multi-meter to see how much voltage I was putting out but it would not measure it. Just getting it near the running engine would send it awry. The display flashed multiple numbers. I tried keeping it from the engine and measuring at the battery but that fared no better. The leads seemed to act as an antenna. 

Edited August 28, 2017 by keninman (see edit history)

[Guest]

All the ammeter tells you is whether you are taking from the battery or putting back into the battery, in other words discharging or charging the battery. 

[1934 commander]

the top bulb are running lights   does your generator have a third brush which can be moved to increase  voltage output   

[keninman]

I believe it has the third brush. I will need to get an analog meter I fear because my digital does not like the car at all. 

[nvonada]

I hit that too when I was troubleshooting my voltage regulator.  The rapid pulsing of the regulator threw my digital meter for a loop.  However you can check voltage at the battery.  The battery serves as a buffer and smooths things out.  If you have a dwell meter they usually have a voltmeter mode.  My old one died so I bought this one for a whopping $21.  Works great:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00062YUUS/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

 

Nathan

[ply33]

On 8/27/2017 at 11:23 AM, keninman said:

Though I still have not managed to get the driver's side headlight door off I did get the passenger side opened. I found that someone had installed 1154 bulbs. I looked these up and the filaments are 21cp and 3cp. This would explain their dismal performance. There is also a smaller GE 63 bulb at the top of the reflector. I am not sure why. It is on with high and low beam but also there is a 3rd on position that turns both it and low beam on. I am wondering if there is a miswire somewhere. I assume it is supposed to be some kind of parking lamp. The classic and vintage bulb website in Australia seems to be not filling orders until late October and I am not giving Don's bulbs $40 buck apiece for the 1110 bulbs.

 

 

 

At least on my similar vintage other make car, the #63 bulb on the top of the headlight reflector is the parking light.

 

I'd be really careful about putting a 50 cp incandescent bulb into your headlights: It draws significantly more current than the 21 cp bulb that was likely the original for a 1929 vintage car and your electrical system is likely to be overloaded. I know that on my '33 it would be pushing the generator to its limit and strongly suspect that it would be overloading the rating on the headlight switch too. I currently have 25w quartz-halogen bulbs in my car, they draw about the same current as a #1000 (32 cp) bulb but deliver about the same light as the 50 cp bulbs. On the plus side, the deliver that much light on both high and low beams whilst the only 50 cp bulb I know of is, the #1188, is 32 cp on low beam.

 

Regarding having a resistor in the path of the low beam: That is a lost cause. When I was going through my lighting system I figured that 2 ohms of unwanted resistance would basically ruin the performance of the headlights. I don't know the details of your electrical system, but if you have a separate filament for low beam I'd simply remove the dimming resistor from the system. I have seen some cars of that vintage where a single filament headlight bulb is used and a dimming resistor is used. I guess if that is your situation you are stuck with it (just run with undimmed headlights all the time).

 

The third brush setup is an issue if you do any significant amount of night driving. It sounds like that is not an issue for how you use your car.

 

Anyway, my current setup, and the logic I used to get there is documented at http://www.ply33.com/Repair/lights

 

I am strongly considering trying out some LED bulbs that were mentioned on another thread on the AACA forums a little while ago. In theory, they should give good light without overloading the electrical system, even if the system has some age related issues. Not sure what the thread on the forum was, but the link I saved is http://www.dynamoregulatorconversions.com/led-headlamp-bulbs-shop.php I haven't yet contacted that vendor much less purchased so I can't say first hand anything about the quality of the lamps, etc.

[keninman]

Thanks Ply33. One issue I am having is finding any LED or Halogen headlight bulbs in the US at a reasonable price. The one's from Dyanamoregularorconversions.com are $71 + the shipping to the US.

 

I went ahead and ordered two 6V LED BA15D  42cp non-polarity bulbs that should draw less than 3W each but are turn/tail lamps so they would drop substantially on dim. I also have LED BA15S 13 CP positive Earth bulbs that run at less than a 10th of an amp that should arrive in the next couple of days. My guess is that with these for parking lamps and the LED 1157s on dim I will get more light than the brights are now. I will let everyone know how the experiment goes. 

 

Just swapping out the #63 bulbs for LED drops my draw by about 4 amps. I am including in my calculations 2 parking bulbs, 3 dash bulbs, tail light and stop bulb. 

[keninman]

I finally received my LED bulbs to replace the #63 bulbs in the dash, parking, tail and brake lights. They are working good and the ones in the dash and the parking lights create a kind of eerie glow. I put in the 1188s and the low beam setting is a significant improvement with a bright white light. They do drop charging down to 2 to 5 amps. The high beam setting does not offer any improvement, the light yellows and the charging drops to nil. I did meet a few cars and none seemed bothered by the low beam setting, probably because they are still much less bright than modern bulbs. Hopefully at some point I can get the proper LED headlamp bulbs for them.