mrcvs Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 I am having a terrible time with the Johnson carburetor flooding this year, despite rebuilding it. The cork float just doesn't operate properly. I have an original K D carburetor which is what would have been on the car originally. It seems to me the Johnson replaced a problematic K D. Without regard for historical accuracy, what functional carburetor would you use that encourages reliability? It seems to me all this stuff would operate properly if you could still get "real" gasoline in this country, but this is the subject of another thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hwellens Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 I had the same problem with a 1912 car with a Holley carburetor cork float. Ordered some replacement material and cut to fit. . RestorationSupplyCompany 1.pdf 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty_OToole Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 (edited) Cork floats were originally sealed with shellac. Shellac dissolves in alcohol. Modern gas contains alcohol. I don't know what they use now to paint the floats. If the old float is intact you can leave it in a warm place until it dries out and reseal it. Edited July 9, 2017 by Rusty_OToole (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hidden_hunter Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 What car? Generally the best carb is going to be the one it was designed for (or at least a direct replacement) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carbking Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 There is no absolute answer. If you wish to continue to use a brass carburetor, then the offerings of Stromberg (after the glass bowl series) are certainly usable: Model L 1915~1919 (6) Model M 1915~1920 passenger, 1915~1935 truck and tractor (6) Model O 1919~1929 (7.5) Also brass Zenith models L and O (6) If you are not interesting in retaining a brass carburetor, then (alphabetically) Carter BB-1 (9) Stromberg SF, SFM (9.5) Zenith 63 and 263 (9.5) My rating on a scale of 1~10 in parenthesis (others will obviously rate them differently). And for vehicles before 1910, the Schebler model D is certainly acceptable (bet you thought you would never see me post something good about any Schebler ) Stewart (Detroit Lubricator) made decent carbs, but very few enthusiasts understand their workings; and in the absence of understanding, maybe the other units mentioned would be a better choice. Jon. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrcvs Posted July 9, 2017 Author Share Posted July 9, 2017 1 hour ago, hidden_hunter said: What car? Generally the best carb is going to be the one it was designed for (or at least a direct replacement) 1917 Maxwell. The Johnson carburetor would not have been original to the car but I don't know why it would have replaced the original K D carburetor other than perhaps because the original carburetor proved to be problematic??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hidden_hunter Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 5 minutes ago, mrcvs said: 1917 Maxwell. The Johnson carburetor would not have been original to the car but I don't know why it would have replaced the original K D carburetor other than perhaps because the original carburetor proved to be problematic??? Another option you could do is look around for literature from the time and see if anyone manufactured a replacement at the time, you can find period ads for people advertising alternatives to the buick carb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carbking Posted July 10, 2017 Share Posted July 10, 2017 From 1913 to 1923, Maxwell used the following carburetors: Maxwell Stromberg Kingston Zephyr Holley Rayfield K & D Johnson Eagle Zenith Stewart And I still have no records on the original carb for the 1913 model D or the 1913 model J. If I wanted to be original, I would "lie" about the year and use either the Zenith or the Stewart. Jon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrcvs Posted August 1, 2017 Author Share Posted August 1, 2017 I started looking on eBay under Johnson carburetor, limiting to automotive parts, to restrict results. In addition to some parts carburetor, some synthetic modern floats come up. Any ideas as to what would describe my cork float such that it translates into the nomenclature of a modern float, such that the correct size might be ordered? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hddennis Posted August 1, 2017 Share Posted August 1, 2017 MRCVS, see if this helps explain building a float for an early carburetor. Howard Dennis Maxwell KD Carb Float rework.docx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Shaw Posted August 1, 2017 Share Posted August 1, 2017 Cork will still work if it is encapsulated in Krazy Glue, model airplane dope or ethanol resistant gas tank sealer. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrcvs Posted August 13, 2017 Author Share Posted August 13, 2017 Please refer to the attached photographs. Shown is the currently installed Johnson carburetor and the replacement K D Type B carburetor. This is what would have originally been on the Maxwell but the Johnson carburetor has been on this car the 6 years I have owned it. I have not ordered a Zenith carburetor as I already had a K D. I have not encased the cork float in an ethanol resistant material, and both are options. The K D float is not cork. To start with...this Johnson carburetor has always been problematic. Not sure why it was installed other than to replace an even more problematic K D??? So, right now, although the game plan could change, I will give the K D carburetor a try. I believe all threading is pipe thread, and it looks like 3/8" flexible copper tubing would work, flare the ends, and I think the end at the fuel line is 5/8"; threading at carburetor 1/2". Does this sound right? Reason why I ask is local Ace Hardware did not have pipe threading for what I needed so have To order on line. But, the issue at hand "that I just don't see", is how is the choke assembly affixed to the K D carburetor? I just don't see any such mechanism in place--but there just had to be such! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrspeedyt Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 i'm watching with baited breath... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hddennis Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 I'd take the K D to the local NAPA parts store and get the fittings. Mine uses 5/16 copper tubing and the nuts take a 5/8 wrench. These flare nuts are not pipe thread but are tubing thread. You should have a metal stamping on the right side of your dash that should have a knob and short shaft drilled for a .012 or 30MM wire. I used a guitar string from the local music store. It was twisted around a homemade clip resembling the parts book illustration. The metal stamping should also have a lever that slides left or right from "rich" to "lean". It needs a rod with a 90 bend and cotter pin on the top end and goes through the floorboards and threads into a ball joint type fitting that threads into the mixture needle arm on the K D. Howard Dennis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrcvs Posted August 13, 2017 Author Share Posted August 13, 2017 Okay, the lower toggle piece makes sense as being for the choke. I thought it would be similar to the choke on the Johnson carburetor. I thought of plumbing supplies to make this work, as AutoZone didn't have what I needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrcvs Posted August 13, 2017 Author Share Posted August 13, 2017 51 minutes ago, mrspeedyt said: i'm watching with baited breath... What's that supposed to mean? With other obligations and limited time and space to work on cars, things sometimes move slowly around these parts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrspeedyt Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 (edited) i know next to nothing. and my getting my 1923 buick fuel system and carburetor to cooperate has been a frustrating challenge to me ever since i bought this car. 'with baited breath' is like a short series of shallow quick breaths while you anxiously wait for the next moment. taken from some passage i read many years ago. probably some 'adult' content. Edited August 13, 2017 by mrspeedyt (see edit history) 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Schramm Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 (edited) On 8/13/2017 at 2:29 PM, mrspeedyt said: i know next to nothing. and my getting my 1923 buick fuel system and carburetor to cooperate has been a frustrating challenge to me ever since i bought this car. 'with baited breath' is like a short series of shallow quick breaths while you anxiously wait for the next moment. taken from some passage i read many years ago. probably some 'adult' content. Welcome to the "frustrating challenge to me ever since I bought this car". club. We have all been there and to get a car drivable and reliable some times can take years. Standard process for getting an old car reliable and drivable is Drive it, break it, fix it, repeat. Typically the older the vehicle the more repeats. Edited August 15, 2017 by Larry Schramm spelling (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrcvs Posted August 13, 2017 Author Share Posted August 13, 2017 3 hours ago, mrspeedyt said: i know next to nothing. and my getting my 1923 buick fuel system and carburetor to cooperate has been a frustrating challenge to me ever since i bought this car. 'with baited breath' is like a short series of shallow quick breaths while you anxiously wait for the next moment. taken from some passage i read many years ago. probably some 'adult' content. Okay, fair enough! I AM moving very slowly on this. Something called "work" gets in the way of my hobbies! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trimacar Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 According to a well known, late (as in passed away), early car guy, cork needs no sealant nor sealing to work correctly. Cork is, by nature, a closed cell structure, and will work perfectly in gas tank floats with no other surface treatment. Those who say "it will fail" base the comment on 50 year old or more cork. I can tell you from personal experience, after 50 years, a LOT of things start to fail! 'nuff said..... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marty Roth Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 32 minutes ago, trimacar said: According to a well known, late (as in passed away), early car guy, cork needs no sealant nor sealing to work correctly. Cork is, by nature, a closed cell structure, and will work perfectly in gas tank floats with no other surface treatment. Those who say "it will fail" base the comment on 50 year old or more cork. I can tell you from personal experience, after 50 years, a LOT of things start to fail! 'nuff said..... I'll agree with trimacar's comment with regard to not "needing" sealant on cork. I have, however, sealed cork with varnish with good effect on early carburetors and gas tank floats. Yes, after 50 (or nearly 75 to 100 plus years), some things do fail - the memory is the second thing to go.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 13, 2017 Share Posted August 13, 2017 Amen to trimacar's post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edinmass Posted August 14, 2017 Share Posted August 14, 2017 It's a well known fact the the primary functions of a Johnson carburetor is to make the car owner pull his hair out, and then leak gas, then cause running problems, when all of the items mentioned have been accomplished, it's final function is to cause a no start condition or fire. I fought mine for years before I got it right..........Ed 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Wilkie Posted August 14, 2017 Share Posted August 14, 2017 well , an extreme move would be to flip the intake and use a down draft or even a more extreme would to be also flip the intake manifold and put a modified throttle body fuel injection unit on it. That would be a challenge. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest domachining Posted September 29, 2017 Share Posted September 29, 2017 On 2017/8/13 at 9:35 PM, mrcvs said: Please refer to the attached photographs. Shown is the currently installed Johnson carburetor and the replacement K D Type B carburetor. This is what would have originally been on the Maxwell but the Johnson carburetor has been on this car the 6 years I have owned it. I have not ordered a Zenith carburetor as I already had a K D. I have not encased the cork float in an ethanol resistant material, and both are options. The K D float is not cork. To start with...this Johnson carburetor has always been problematic. Not sure why it was installed other than to replace an even more problematic K D??? So, right now, although the game plan could change, I will give the K D carburetor a try. I believe all threading is pipe thread, and it looks like 3/8" flexible copper tubing would work, flare the ends, and I think the end at the fuel line is 5/8"; threading at carburetor 1/2". Does this sound right? Reason why I ask is local Ace Hardware did not have pipe threading for what I needed so have To order on line. But, the issue at hand "that I just don't see", is how is the choke assembly affixed to the K D carburetor? I just don't see any such mechanism in place--but there just had to be such! Seems like casting and welding Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hddennis Posted September 29, 2017 Share Posted September 29, 2017 Check post #14, it shows the piano wire and clip that attaches to the bottom of the choke arm on the KD. Howard Dennis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Shaw Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 On 7/9/2017 at 1:25 PM, Rusty_OToole said: Cork floats were originally sealed with shellac. Shellac dissolves in alcohol. Modern gas contains alcohol. I don't know what they use now to paint the floats. Rusty, I coat my cork floats with either Krazy-Glue (per Harold Sharon's book "Understanding Your Brass Car") or more recently, alcohol resistant gas tank sealer. I currently have several cars with cork floats working fine for years using modern ethanol/gasoline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrcvs Posted October 3, 2017 Author Share Posted October 3, 2017 And the K D Type B carburetor leaks. Not as bad as the Johnson (that would be downright impossible!), but still a persistent drip, as installed... The saga continues! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hddennis Posted October 4, 2017 Share Posted October 4, 2017 MRCVS, notice the flattened nose on the fitting I sent you, it should be tapered to (I believe) 37 degrees? so it will seal against the inner cone of the copper lines flare as shown in the illustration. You need to get an internal seal because I believe your leak is going through the threads of that barrel fitting you have in between the fuel line and my fitting I sent you. Howard Dennis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrcvs Posted October 5, 2017 Author Share Posted October 5, 2017 Absolutely! I am leaving for Omaha for work shortly and will be away for work for a few weeks, but I will angle the carburetor like yours and make a new fuel line and eliminate that barrel. Much thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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