Help - lost keys, car is stranded 300 miles from home

[gregleck]

I drove my 1962 Olds Dynamic 88 three hundred miles to my college reunion at Tufts University in Medford, Mass, just outside of Boston.

 

While walking around campus, I lost the keys.  After three hours of retracing my steps, contacting campus police and checking all the places I visited, I still did not find them.

 

Keys are ignition, trunk, and locking gas cap - three keys.

 

Called AAA but every locksmith they contacted told me they cannot do the job

 

Taxi driver told me I should just be able to pull the wires off from the back of the dashboard, and wire a new switch in.  Then crowbar off the locking gas cap.  (There is only a quarter tank of gas in the tank - not enough to get home.)  Luggage can go in the back seat.

 

Will this work?  I am now ten miles away from car so cannot fool with it until Saturday morning.

 

Other option is to call GM dealers in the area and see if they have the ability to pull the cylinder and make a new key, or replace the cylinder.  Car would have to be towed there.

 

Anyone have any other ideas?

 

At this rate I will be missing most of the reunion.

 

The ironic part is the car ran perfectly and had no trouble keeping up with 70 mph traffic.

 

Greg

[Spinneyhill]

How do the doors lock inside? Push buttons? If so you can spring the top of the door an inch or so with no damage and use a loop of plastic packing strap to hook the lock to get in. The key locks: a locksmith should be able to deal with that, maybe without taking them out? Ring some and ask. Else just hot-wire it and drive to locksmith?

[gregleck]

Car is unlocked.  I almost spent the night sleeping in it.

 

Problem is locksmiths tell me the car is too old and they cannot make keys. I have spoken to half a dozen.  No one wants to be bothered.

 

The taxi drive (old timer mechanic) told me to reach under dash and pull the wires out, then rewire a replacement lock cylinder.

 

However, I don't want to go anything destructive if it is not going to work.

 

Will start calling dealers in an hour once they open.

 

 

[61polara]

I suspect the locksmiths you have talked to don't have the blanks that GM used in those years.  I think there were only four, alternated between years.  Your best bet is an old time independent locksmith.  If there is a chance you locked the keys in the trunk, any locksmith should be able to pick it and open the trunk.  Making keys without a key to copy or the code number of the key is a long process unless the lock cylinder is out of the car.  I would pull the door panel and remove a door lock.  I think that is the same key as your ignition.  When you find a locksmith with blanks, he should be more willing to make a key with a lock in hand.

Good luck

[MCHinson]

61polara is correct any old time independent locksmith should be able to solve your problem. 

 

If you need to remove the igntion switch, you can do a google search and find several sites online with instructions on removing the ignition switch.  Here is one: http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/173697/

 

It should be easy to remove the door panel and remove the lock cylinder to read the four digit code to make a key. Originally the door and ignition should have used the same key. If one of them has been changed over the years, you are going to need to remove the ignition lock to make a key. The locksmith should be able to do that without damaging the lock. He or she can then cut you a key.

 

   

[auburnseeker]

I think you can take the back seat out pretty easy to look in the trunk,  if there is a chance you left them in their.  The only thing is it may be hard to get the cardboard trunk liner out to see or get in their.  I've done it before after locking the keys to my 56 olds in the trunk. 

[keithb7]

I'd certainly consider the ignition route, however you'll need some tools. The wires can be removed and jumper'd. The car will run.  I am not sure if you are into Facebook or not. There are very many

vintage car enthusiast forums on there. I would immediately join a few in the Boston area and start posting. Ask for help. Someone will surely come an help out a fellow vintage car owner. If I were there, I surely would pack up

some tools and be on my way within minutes. Good luck. 

 

This is a good reminder to stash an extra keys in my old Chrysler. Up under the chassis somewhere.

Edited May 20, 2017 by keithb7 (see edit history)

[edinmass]

Disconnect all the wires to the coil, run a jumper to power and ground, jump power to the starter solenoid and the car will run without touching anything else. As long as there is no steering or trans lock, your good to go. Probably your best bet is to just tow it home, spend the money not to damage the car, and just right it off as a minor setback.

[Lebowski]

Don't you have a spare set of keys at home? If so have someone bring them to you. I know it's 300 miles but if you had called them last night you would have had them by now. Good luck....

[padgett]

Used to have a bet I could walk up to a locked 60's car and have it open and running in under five minutes. for your car one jumper to turn ignition on and a second to crank the starter is all you need but may not have accessories ('nother jumper). Can often be done easiest under the hood if the solenoid is reachable. Starter should be big purple wire.

 

Can just go to a flaps and buy a starter switch with key and a set of gator jumpers to DIY. Just leave hanging under dash.

 

Remember at one show the sales critter was extoling the anti theft qualities of something new, think a Vega, really visible starter, reached in with two quarters and had it running.

 

Hard part might be the gas cap, may require and addco binder clip.

[joe_padavano]

A couple of things. First, GM uses the same key blanks from the mid-1930s to 1966.  There is only one actual blank.  The octagon and round heads were designed to let you differentiate between the ignition and trunk key, but both have the same "blade" and will go into either lock (though obviously will not turn unless cut correctly).

 

Second, the lock code is stamped on the door lock cylinders.  If you can disassemble the door and remove the lock cylinder, there will be a four character code stamped on the outside of the cylinder.  The Curtis code book translates this into the actual key cut pattern.  I have this book. I actually have the blanks and the Curtis key clipper machine, but I'm in the D.C. area and can't really get you a key quickly.

 

Third, this car is EXTREMELY easy to hot wire.  Run a power wire from +12V to the "+" side of the coil.  Temporarily apply +12V to the purple wire that runs to the starter.  The car will start.  You will need to disconnect the wire to the coil to turn the car off.

 

Fourth, like the door/ignition key, the glovebox lock has the same code stamped on it for the trunk key.  If you can get the glovebox lock off, that code will allow a trunk key to be cut.  If not, you can remove the back seat and use long extensions on a ratchet to unbolt the trunk latch and get the trunk open.

 

Fifth, you are out of luck with the aftermarket locking gas cap.  Do people even use these anymore?

 

Feel free to contact me if I can help on the keys.  My cell is 703-927-9196.

[28 Chrysler]

Like padgett said

These cars are simple to hot wire, all you need is a length of wire for the battery / coil connection and a screwdriver to jump the solenoid.

My 1958 Chevy key was the same as my neighbor's 1964 Impala's key.

[Pomeroy41144]

1 hour ago, Lebowski said:

Don't you have a spare set of keys at home? If so have someone bring them to you. I know it's 300 miles but if you had called them last night you would have had them by now. Good luck....

 

 

My antique auto came with only one set of keys. 

 

As soon as I got my antique car home after purchasing it I had two sets of extra keys made immediately. 

 

I use those two sets and have preserved the original 1937 keys.  Always make two extra sets of keys. 

 

 

.

.

.

 

Edited May 20, 2017 by Pomeroy41144 (see edit history)

[padgett]

That is correct, you can get it to run with 12v to the coil, but not for long, a GM 12v coil is designed to run through at ballast resistor at 9v. Jumping at the key switch rather than the coil will do this. This is so it can get a full spark when cranking with a weak battery.

[Digger914]

This is a 62 and you can hot hire these old cars with a big paperclip pushed into the contacts on the back side of the switch if that's all you have to work with. Getting the gas cap off so you can fill the tank will take tools. Mobile locksmiths didn't carry gas cap key blanks 20 years ago, but they all had jiggle keys that would fit the hole.

 

Old cars don't have unleaded restrictors in the filler neck and the fastest easiest way to remove a locking cap is punch the lock out through the belly of the cap, squeeze the spring wings and pull the cap. It will be two big parts going to the bottom of the tank and the odds of them causing any kind of problem anytime down the road are slim to nil.

[mercer09]

go to uhaul and rent a pu and trailer...............................

[gregleck]

OK - here is what happened.

 

Unscrewed the retainer ring, pushed the ignition unit out, unplugged unit from wires.

 

Now, all I had to do was remove the lock cylinder and then I could use a screwdriver turn the ignition.

 

(Remember, all tools are locked in the trunk, but I could buy a screwdriver.)

 

However, at this point I decided to check the last place on campus I was unable to check last night - the library - one of my last stops before returning to the car at 6PM and finding the keys gone.

 

It was 9AM and they were closed (this being graduation day) but I saw someone in the building and pounded on the door. 

 

And there, on the floor in front of the circulation desk, were the keys.

 

Plugged everything back in, inserted the key, turned the ignition and she turned right over.  The very next thing I tried to do was get the keys copied.  However, the old time hardware store (there before I was a student 40 years ago) did not have the blanks so I will pick some up online.

 

So I go to actually enjoy some reunion events today.  Now headed to the class dinner, then it is a long drive home tomorrow.

 

Many, many thanks to all - some good information and good advice, and hopefully I will never need any of it again!

 

[Grimy]

A b-i-g WHEW!!  Congrats and enjoy the reunion!

[Lebowski]

I'm glad you found your keys. My local Ace Hardware store has old GM key blanks so you may want to try them before looking online....

[Pomeroy41144]

Great ending.  Glad you found keys. 

[Frank DuVal]

The blanks are B-10 (octagon head). 1935 to 1966 GM, made by Briggs & Stratton. I also have the blanks and a Curtis clipper like Joe does. And like Joe I am in Virginia, just south of him. I sell code cut B-10 (and B-11, the pear shaped one for the trunk) keys all around the county. All I need is the 4 digit code on a lock cylinder. The easiest one to read now is the ignition, since you have a key. Turn cylinder CCW, insert paper clip in little hole, continue to turn CCW and it comes out in your hand.

 

PM me if you need my help. (Click on name, click Message button on that page, I guess)

 

I am very gad you found the keys!!!!!!!!!!!

[cahartley]

6 hours ago, gregleck said:

However, the old time hardware store (there before I was a student 40 years ago) did not have the blanks so I will pick some up online.

 

 

 

Apparently there ARE no old time locksmiths there.

I wouldn't expect a hardware store to have auto keys but for a, so called, locksmith to not have them is inexcusable.

"Didn't want to bother".........if I had done that in my business it would have closed years ago.

At any rate........good show on finding your keys!........ 

[Guest rb1949]

Glad luck found the keys. You have tips on starting techniques, but that won't help add gas. Good luck with keys. The experienced old gal at my local ACE found blanks for my '49 ignition, and the locking gas cap.

[Paul Dobbin]

 

Next stop should be an auto parts store for a magnetic key holder to hide a key or two under the car.  Hide a spare trunk key and hide the other keys in your trunk.  Good idea for old an new cars.

This can happen again or you might also lock your keys in the car accidentally.

[60FlatTop]

Whew! Close one. Well, back to work at the NSA and normal again.

[fordrodsteven]

I have been successful a few times getting cars opened and started if necessary just by using any key I could get to fit into the cylinder. I was at a wedding and one of the bridesmaids came running in all upset that she locked her keys and a gift in her car. I asked if anyone had a key for that brand of vehicle. I put the key in and jiggled it up / down and back / forth. I had the car unlocked in about 30 seconds and all was good! I have opened cars and even padlocks using this method. I would definitely NOT start ripping into wiring on my car. I am 99% certain I could get it open / started using another person's key.

[Frank DuVal]

I too try every key before I resort to destructive methods to remove a lock cylinder. With the method described above, I have good results with my key collection. Of course, there were probably not many people carrying keys for pre-67 GM cars to try that weekend.

 

At Hershey recently I saw a fellow selling the master set of keys for 1935 to 1966 GM vehicles. On a large board, not something to carry around with you...

[gregleck]

<<Fifth, you are out of luck with the aftermarket locking gas cap.  Do people even use these anymore? >>

 

Actually, I learned you can drill a small hole off center, and insert a small bore Phillips screwdriver, angled toward the center, on some types of locking gas caps.  This will hold the inner part to the outer so the outer will not rotate without turning the inner part. 

 

Since both turn together, you just unscrew it.

 

As for putting a non-proper key in and pushing it in and out to get the lock open, it is pushing the tumblers around - this is called raking.  The key profile must be similar but the teeth don't have to be.

 

 

[gregleck]

FLAPS - Friendly Local Auto Part Store

 

"go to FLAPS and buy a starter switch with key and a set of gator jumpers to DIY. Just leave hanging under dash."

 

This is what my 65 year old immigrant cab driver and former mechanic told me to do.  However, after speaking to half a dozen countermen at six different auto supply stores (both independent and national chains) they all told me there is no such part in stock today.  Used to be but not now.

 

"Second, the lock code is stamped on the door lock cylinders.  If you can disassemble the door and remove the lock cylinder, there will be a four character code stamped on the outside of the cylinder."

 

I told all the locksmiths that the door cylinder key was the same as the ignition key.  But not one told me the key code was on the cylinder.  In a similar manner, every one thought the ignition was in the steering column, which complicates things tremendously, and I had to explain that the ignition unit was in the dashboard and could be accessed easily.  But they said without a key to copy, or without a key code, they could not make a key from the cylinder.  Or, apparently, they could but did not want to.  One, Boston Car Keys, admitted it could be done but would take five hours and they were not going to do it at 7PM on a Friday night, despite being a 24 hour service.

 

"you are going to need to remove the ignition lock to make a key. The locksmith should be able to do that without damaging the lock. He or she can then cut you a key."

 

The one locksmith who did show up tried to remove the cylinder.  WITH the key in place it is easy, but without the lock you have to pick it so you can turn the cylinder CCW while another instrument is in that hole.  After 15 minutes he gave up and offered to drill it out.  Thankfully I declined the offer!  Even if still successful, we still had the problem of no key blank.

 

"That is correct, you can get it to run with 12v to the coil, but not for long, a GM 12v coil is designed to run through at ballast resistor at 9v. Jumping at the key switch rather than the coil will do this. This is so it can get a full spark when cranking with a weak battery."

 

Padgett, can you expand and clarify this?  When you say "not for long" do you mean the 12 volt battery charge will eventually burn the coil out?  And will that happen if you jump at the ignition key switch, or at the coil?

 

 

.................................

 

 

There is, of course, no steering or transmission lock on this car, so I also considered jump (push starting the car), even though this is an automatic transmission.  I was told it is possible with older automatics, but more difficult than standard transmissions.  However, I think the campus police would have put a stop to any attempt like that pretty quickly.

 

I did notice that one of the six metal contact prongs had broken off the ignition unit (the one that says "power") and the broken part was stuck in the socket attached to the wires.  I don't know if this happened when I took the ignition unit off, or whether it broke 50 years ago.  In any event, I hope that there would be contact, and there was.  I drove 350 miles home, stopping a number of times, and the car started right up every time.

 

I've gotten two extra sets of key blanks on order, as well as a new ignition switch.  Now I just need a small magnetic box to keep the spare set under the hood.

 

I wouldn't wish this experience on anyone, However, hopefully this discussion thread will serve as a good starting point for anyone who has this problem in the future.

 

 

 

[PFitz]

Glad to hear you got it solved.

 

FYI, for anyone else not so lucky to find their keys...... 

 

Many of the marine supply houses such as, Jamestown Distributors, sell universal ignition key locks with keys. Looks like many of the dash mounted ignition locks from the 20's and 30's. Come in a verity of, on/off, or on/off /assessor, or off/on/momentary on for starter solenoid cars. They look so much like some of  the originals that I've used them in several 30-31 restorations that had original pot metal ignition switches that were too far gone to reuse. By machining the hexagonal retaining nut round and re-plating it, they pass for many originals.  

 

As for keys from the same car manufacturer,... 

During my wedding reception, knowing the new wife and I were going on honeymoon by car, my practical-joker Father tried to hide my car. His 73 Hornet door/ignition key easily open the door on my 72 Javelin. Luckily for me it wouldn't work in the ignition lock.

 

Paul

[Frank DuVal]

If you jump 12 volts direct to the + terminal of most GM cars, you are going to burn the points at a quicker rate than normal. This is because most GM cars of that period use a resistor inline with the + terminal of the coil, so the coil normally runs about 6-8 volts. The starter solenoid shorts out the resistor, giving the full 12 volts (which of course due to the current drawn by the starter motor  is now actually 10 volts or so) to the coil for better starting ignition voltage to the spark plugs. Of course this excessive voltage means excessive current (ohms law E=IR, R stays the same E bigger then I bigger), which the coil can handle for a while, but the points are now breaking more current, so they wear faster.

[Frank DuVal]

BTW, cutting a key by code takes maybe 5 minutes....

 

Finding the code can take hours!

 

Cutting a key without a code using several locksmithing techniques can take a really long time if the stars and planets do not align.... Trial and error....

Edited May 22, 2017 by Frank DuVal (see edit history)

[Harold]

It my have been mentioned before, but GM keys have letter designations to identify the keyway (the grooves in the side of the key).  So if your ignition key is an 'A' blank (for example) you should be able to use a newer style (big rectangular head) 'A' blank and cut a key.  

 

The automakers were notorious for having very few key combinations.  In the 1960's, my mother, aunt, and cousin went to a bingo game in my aunt's '55 Buick.  When they left, they got into another '55 Buick and drove away in it.  My cousin spotted my aunt's car still parked at the curb!  My aunt put the other car back where it was, and no-one was any the wiser.

[Pomeroy41144]

Not sure why we need locking gas caps in this day and age of $2 gas. 

 

 

[Guest]

This is the type of situation that should never ever happen.  The first thing I do when I get a new (to me) car is to get one or two extra sets of keys made. In fact I won't buy a car from a dealer, new or used, without the dealer providing me with extra keys   For me it's a deal breaker.   I always have three sets for every vehicle.  One stays at home (to be retrieved if necessary), one in my right pocket to use for driving and one set in my left [pocket in case I were to get locked out.  Never ever needed the second or third set.  I learned this lesson 57 years ago when I locked myself out of my 53 Buick in the winter in Winnipeg. Twenty below and easiest solution break a vent window.  Have never locked my keys in a car since and have never lost a key, house or car and I started carrying an house key when I started school.

[joe_padavano]

1 hour ago, Harold said:

It my have been mentioned before, but GM keys have letter designations to identify the keyway (the grooves in the side of the key).  So if your ignition key is an 'A' blank (for example) you should be able to use a newer style (big rectangular head) 'A' blank and cut a key. 

 

The letter key blanks started with the 1967 model year.  The car in question is a 1962.  As noted on the first page of this thread, GM only used ONE key blank from 1935 to 1966.  Yes, there were octagonal and round heads, but the blade part of the key had exactly the same grooves.  These early keys are different from the letter blanks.  The tumblers and "cuts" on the key are also different.  The 1935-66 keys used six tumbler positions, each with one of four possible depths.  The letter keys also used six tumbler positions but with one of five possible depths.

By the way, if you do the math, you will find that there were only 4 to 6th power (4x4x4x4x4x4) possible key combinations, or only 4,096 different keys (counting both ignition and trunk) over that THIRTY ONE year period for all GM cars!  In reality, the number was even smaller, since GM did not use key combinations where all four tumblers were the same (making the key straight across), nor did they use combinations where one cut was the smallest and one was the deepest, to prevent the key from hanging up in the lock.

[joe_padavano]

1 hour ago, Pomeroy41144 said:

Not sure why we need locking gas caps in this day and age of $2 gas. 

 

 

 

Locking gas caps came into popular use when gas hit $1.00/Gal.

[JACK M]

19 hours ago, Frank DuVal said:

If you jump 12 volts direct to the + terminal of most GM cars, you are going to burn the points at a quicker rate than normal. This is because most GM cars of that period use a resistor inline with the + terminal of the coil, so the coil normally runs about 6-8 volts. The starter solenoid shorts out the resistor, giving the full 12 volts (which of course due to the current drawn by the starter motor  is now actually 10 volts or so) to the coil for better starting ignition voltage to the spark plugs. Of course this excessive voltage means excessive current (ohms law E=IR, R stays the same E bigger then I bigger), which the coil can handle for a while, but the points are now breaking more current, so they wear faster.

 

Easiest way to deal with this is to hot wire at the ballast resister. The engine will usually start without the boost but if it wont then jump to both sides of the resister and unhook the coil side after it starts.

I am sure that is how they stole my 66 Impala with a stick tranny. Open the hood, Hook up a wire and give it a little push and pop the clutch.

[joe_padavano]

1 hour ago, JACK M said:

 

Easiest way to deal with this is to hot wire at the ballast resister.

 

Olds typically used a resistor wire built into the harness, not a separate ballast resistor. 

[Frank DuVal]

Yes, GM typically used the resistor wire. There are exceptions, like the 62/3 Spyder that used a ceramic resistor mounted on the rear body crossmember.

 

Another hint to how many different key combinations from 1935 to 1966, all the codes start with either 8 or 9.

 

Once the letter keys started (1967 is correct), the code became numbers and letters.

 

Yes, the 1967 models had the small octagon and pear shaped (B-10 and B-11 looking) heads on their A and B keys, and the later large square (rectangular) and round (oval) keys will fit. Now, a regular A key will not fit a resistor pellet ignition A cylinder, the length is different. Don't ask how i found out....  

 

Now if someone worked at Briggs & Stratton and can tell me why the A keys are B-48 and H keys are B-45? You would think the letters would follow numerical order of the part numbers.....?