bunchabuix Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 It started out as a valve job, usual pieces removed, etc. Let's pull the lifter cover, & while we're at it, why not the timing chain cover! Let me add, the engine is IN the car, ('56 Century, 83K miles) Radiator, etc. is out of the car. Also, I've been thru 248 St 8s before, but out of the car, never a nailhead. Here's a few observations/questions: Lifters - Flat across the top, no slight curve, circular wear marks, per the shop manual, are OK to re-use? Cam: visually looks OK, no evidence of scoring, chipped, etc.. Can I remove the cam while still in the car? What about cam bearings? Is a special tool needed to remove/install cam bearings? Timing Chain & Gears: deflection approx. 1/8 - 1/4 ", teeth look fine, nothing broken, chipped, etc. assume minimal wear. Here's my thoughts: If I can remove/install the cam & bearings somewhat easily, I'll do it; & the timing chain & sprockets. OR leave well enough alone, as it ran well, (except for one bad valve), good oil pressure, quiet, etc. I drive the car approx. 1K a year. Here's another issue: I took pains when removing the lifters to keep them in exact order, BUT now many are mixed up!! Is this a major concern, if I just put it back together w/o replacing parts? If I decide to replace the cam/lifters/ timing chain & gears, I'd appreciate suggestions for reputable sources. Many thanks for reading this and for your constructive comments & suggestions. Jerry BCA 1518 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 From my understanding the cam removal while in frame is difficult at best. Best the engine removed and cam bearing installed by someone in the know. Concerning leaving well enough alone, I did in my 264. Complete valve job. New rings. Left the cam and push rods alone. I did install new lifters. Engine runs great. Don't create a problem where there is none. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD1956 Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 Leave the cam in place. New timing chain if possible to find one but even that does not sound bad. Do you have the technical services bulletin book? If not check the one on the hometown Buick site. There was a bulletin on the harmonic balancer bolt. This is very important in my opinion. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 (edited) 9 minutes ago, JohnD1956 said: Leave the cam in place. New timing chain if possible to find one but even that does not sound bad. Do you have the technical services bulletin book? If not check the one on the hometown Buick site. There was a bulletin on the harmonic balancer bolt. This is very important in my opinion. Torque the balance bolt to proper foot pounds. Harmonic Balancer to Crankshaft 200 Minimum Edited March 22, 2017 by avgwarhawk (see edit history) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD1956 Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 Besides the torque there is a second issue regarding the bolt in the 56 crank. Some cranks were not drilled deep enough. The fix is an extra washer between the bolt head and the balancer. I lost my extra washer before I knew about this issue and ruined my balancer in about 1000 miles. To fix it I brought the replacement balancer to a machine shop and bought a second balancer washer, then had them enlarge the center to clear the step of the crank. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 (edited) Concerning the timing chain, I believe Mudbone purchased a new set that was slack as slack could be right outta the box. If I'm not mistaken he reused the original set as a result. Edited March 22, 2017 by avgwarhawk (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron65 Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 I'll add to the chorus...LEAVE IT ALONE! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Bruce aka First Born Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 37 minutes ago, Aaron65 said: I'll add to the chorus...LEAVE IT ALONE! Same here! Ben 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 3 hours ago, avgwarhawk said: Concerning the timing chain, I believe Mudbone purchased a new set that was slack as slack could be right outta the box. If I'm not mistaken he reused the original set as a result. Get a 491 timing chain that is sold in a long box (if it folds into one hand it will be slack) This: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dynagear-Engine-Timing-Chain-for-Buick-Ford-C491-/282234264131?hash=item41b6791a43:g:HIcAAOSwn7JYETsD&vxp=mtr Or this: http://www.ebay.com/itm/1970s-Ford-Ford-Truck-Econoline-Engine-Timing-Chain-C-491-/322430812800?hash=item4b125fc280:g:jIIAAOSwe7BWzjKo&vxp=mtr Ok to reuse the gears if you cannot catch a finger nail on the chain marks. It would not hurt to replace the lifters since they may be mixed: 896 lifters Rockauto or ebay 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron65 Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 (edited) If you do replace the lifters, it's never a bad idea to break them in like you would a new cam...30 minutes at 2000-2500 RPM, varying speed. Use a break-in oil for your first fill. Use a thin smear of moly lube on the base, and make sure to get that engine started immediately (don't crank and crank). Edited March 23, 2017 by Aaron65 (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 (edited) I would fix the one bad valve and put it back together. If you grind all the valves you risk tightening up the top end of a worn engine. Blow by on the rings could increase and you will have little puffs of cloud coming out of the road draft tube. The guys at the entrance gate will see it when you drive up and you will get really annoyed explaining it every time. I like to use a hand valve spring compressor like this: to tighten the spring and slide each valve out for inspection. Only fix the other valves if the guide is worn and they are making an irregular seat. If you have bad seats just hand lap. Don't grind or cut or do a three angle job. If you can fix it and duplicate the wear of the rest of the engine you should be good. But don't make anything better than the rest. Bernie Edited March 22, 2017 by 60FlatTop (see edit history) 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTX5467 Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 In addition to the moly lube paste for the lifter bottoms, many cam manufacturers also sell a liquid "cam and lifter pre-lube". The "old" method was to pour a can of GM EOS Concentrate over the cam and lifters before you closed the valley. There are also some tricks about soaking the lifters in motor oil overnight before installation in an attempt to get oil in them before the engine starts. The ONLY lube the cam lobes get is from "splash", rather than pressurized oil (as main and rod bearings), which is why the recommendation of the higher rpm for 30 minutes when a cam/lifters are replaced. The oil slinging off of the crankshaft bearings is "splash", so putting some variation into the rpm after it runs a while gets oil to different places. IF you decide to replace the cam sprocket, a dab of moly paste where it contacts the block might not hurt, plus some of the liquid pre-lube on the chain and sprockets so there'll be something there until they get their normal splash oiling. If you do remove the sprocket, the current one, some additional oil would be good, too. It IS possible to change cams "in chassis" on many vehicles. BUT look at what's in front of the water pump (radiator, grille, etc, which will all need to be removed to gain access to the cam. The only time you need to change cam bearings is when a block is "tanked" as the solution dissolves bearing material. The cam bearings have to be knocked IN and OUT, for which the engine MUST be removed and secured on a holding fixture. Getting the camshaft out is one thing, getting it back IN is another! Even if you use a holding "tool" for the cam to carefully guide it into the bearings, all the way to the back, even on an engine stand, it's not as easy to get back into place as it was coming out. PLUS being strong enough to hold it steady so any cam bearings aren't "nicked" going back in. I fully understand the "While we're here . . ." orientation, especially as we all desire the best outcomes for what we're doing. BUT, as pointed out, there HAS to be a stopping place somewhere while also fixing what started it all in the first place. As some have mentioned . . . "Less is best", many times as "more" doesn't seem to work as well as we thought it might. NTX5467 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 For my lifter replacement I did the following: 1. Soak in oil for a while with the oil hole in up position to allow air out and oil in. 2. Used old push rod and pumped the lifters while submerged in oil. 3. Used engine rebuild lube. Coated cam lobes, face of the lifter that rides the lobe and top were the push rod sits. 4. Started the car and ran at 1500 RPM for 10 minutes. It taps like crazy but you can hear each lifter go silent as oil is introduced and pressure builds. Do not think to shut down the engine for the clatter going on. You would think it is running itself to death. Let it run. The above steps worked for me. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
60FlatTop Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 Buick makes pretty good lifters. I bought one new set back in the early 1980's and they weren't needed. But I sure did learn to check for wear on the bottom side of the rocker arm shafts after that. Take a look there. Bernie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 I would think the lifters could be cleaned up internally and re-used. The manual has good instructions for cleaning. If the lifters are wearing well, reuse! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunchabuix Posted March 23, 2017 Author Share Posted March 23, 2017 THANKS folks for your great input. Looking forward to more replys & I'll digest all of it & let everyone know the results. Go Buick! Jerry BCA 1518 AACA ROA 8691 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NC-car-guy Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 1 hour ago, avgwarhawk said: I would think the lifters could be cleaned up internally and re-used. The manual has good instructions for cleaning. If the lifters are wearing well, reuse! Except he did mention that he got them mixed up. If they were still in order this might be good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 48 minutes ago, wndsofchng06 said: Except he did mention that he got them mixed up. If they were still in order this might be good. Bummer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Bruce aka First Born Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 The manual is talking about disassembling the lifter. I believe Jerry just mixed up the assembled lifters. No harm done. Ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 And to be sure, Willie and I determined, when working on a top engine problem, that the cam and lifters in my 54 was replaced with a 55/56 cam and lifters. The push rods being shorter than the 54 originally had. If you decide to go full bore with the valve train plan on replacing all components. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTX5467 Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 When removing the rocker shaft assys, isn't there something about putting them back in a particular orientation when put back onto the cylinder head? ANYTHING that moves, after cleaning, needs some pre-lube and/or moly paste on it when reassembled, to me. Please keep us posted on yorr progress. NTX5467 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunchabuix Posted March 27, 2017 Author Share Posted March 27, 2017 Over the weekend, I examined the rocker arm assembly & pushrods. Now I recall, the R.A. assembly is fairly new, maybe 10K miles, looks as new. Pushrods: I noticed that several are showing cracks along the seams, I'm replacing them all. Bernie (Flattop) the heads are done, a few months ago. One bad exhaust valve replaced, all seats just cleaned up, no cutting/ reaming done, as shop sez all was fine. He mentioned what you said , Make it too good & you'll pull oil thru the original rings. Exhaust valve, by the way, was worn from the stem, to within .080 of the spring keeper. It damaged the rocker arm (replaced). All valve springs, etc. were within specs. I plan soon to re-examine the lifters, if all are worn the same, as I suspect from the prior look-see, I will plan to re-use, even though most lifters got mixed up & they will NOT go back in the same order. (bummer) Chris! I do NOT plan to change the camshaft either. Again, I appreciate everyone's input; any further thoughts/suggestions are welcomed! Jerry BCA 1518 ROA AACA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted March 27, 2017 Share Posted March 27, 2017 1 hour ago, bunchabuix said: Exhaust valve, by the way, was worn from the stem, to within .080 of the spring keeper. Usually the only way valve stem above the keeper is short is because it was ground down to compensate for valve seat recession: Valve stem height is 1.525 to 1.550 measured (in inches) from valve cover rail to valve stem tip. That is the only adjustment other than keeping all parts within specs. A stem too long is worse than one too short. Put a straight edge over the assembled valve stem and they should near equal height. If there is valve seat recession a valve from an early Buick 364 will work...install seats as a last resort. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunchabuix Posted March 29, 2017 Author Share Posted March 29, 2017 Old Tank - Thanks for the reply. The valve stem was worn down due to poor/defective metal/manufacturing. I never had the engine apart 'til now, & I doubt the original owner ever did. as I bought the car w/ 27K miles in 1972, now has 83K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTX5467 Posted March 29, 2017 Share Posted March 29, 2017 There is, many times, a wear pad on the end of the valve stem at the valve/rocker arm interface. Check the rocker arm tip(s), too, for wear, PLUS related oil supply to the rocker shaft and rocker arms, for good measure. The wear pad can be seen by a thin "line" between the end of the stem and where the pad is attached to it. I suspect that if that valve stem end is that worn, you might do the service manual recommended check of valve stem-to-guide clearance. As the rocker arm end pushes the valve stem "down" to open it, there is also a force vector "sideways" on the end of the valve stem (plus rubbing/sliding friction), which relates to valve guide/valve stem wear as use-time accumulates. NTX5467 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KAD36 Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 On 3/22/2017 at 5:48 PM, Ben Bruce aka First Born said: Same here! Ben Coming a little late to this one, but having unsuccessfully trying to specify and validate a 56 factory cam grind for installation in a 55, yes, leave it alone unless the cam is really flat spotted. Or be prepared to settle for a Frankencam (compromise) or a specialty grind. Recommend dialing in the cam if you want to verify lift and duration. Not necessary but educational. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTX5467 Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 A good while back, I installed several camshafts (one at a time!) in an engine short block. Got out the magnetic base dial indicator, one valve lifter, one pushrod, the timing chain set, a crankshaft degree wheel, AND a pointer (after I found TDC on #1 cylinder). This was a very interesting way to spend an evening or two!! I had bought an aftermarket camshaft and was able to determine that their advertising was correct in the shape of their cam lobes. I also had a factory HP cam that I tried, too. With the aftermarket cam, the valve remained at "max lift" for a full 10degrees of crank rotation. By comparison, the factory cam was at "max lift" for about ONE degree of crank rotation. These were "flat tappet" pieces rather than "roller cam" pieces. When checking lobe lift like this, you have to multiply that value by the leverage ratio of the rocker arm ratio to get "valve lift" at the valve stem. INFORMATIVE CHEAP ENTERTAINMENT !! NTX5467 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted April 1, 2017 Share Posted April 1, 2017 (edited) … all good vibes and info going on here, however, never, never presoak a clean or new hydraulic lifter in the hopes if doing so that oil will migrate into the internals of the lifter … this is complete folly and the one thing you do not want in a newly installed hydraulic lifter is oil, as you want the action of the push rod only as the mechanism to suck oil into the internals of the new or freshly cleaned lifter. If you presoak or "inject" oil into a lifter prior to install, you run the very real risk of eliminating lifter lash … the result will be a fluid frozen lifter that will bend the pushrod and in turn bend a valve stem or worse yet introduce the head of the piston into the face of the valve … ouch … all newly installed hydraulic lifter must have the spec lash amount and the only way it can have that is with no oil inside of it's internals … also regarding mis matching willy-nilly lifters once removed then randomly back into the engine is Rx Prescription for ruining your perfectly good original lobed low mileage cam …. Edited January 30, 2018 by buick man (see edit history) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted April 1, 2017 Share Posted April 1, 2017 14 hours ago, buick man said: … all good vibes and info going on here, however, never, never presoak a clean or new hydraulic lifter in the hopes if doing so that oil will migrate into the internals of the lifter … this is complete folly and the one thing you do not want in a newly installed hydraulic lifter is oil, as you want the action of the push rod only as the mechanism to suck oil into the internals of the new or freshly cleaned lifter. If you presoak or "inject" oil into a lifter prior to install, you run the very real risk of eliminating lifter lash … the result will be a fluid frozen lifter that will bend the pushrod and in turn bend a valve stem or worse yet introduce the head of the piston into the face of the valve … ouch … all newly installed hydraulic lifter must have the spec lash amount and the only way it can have that is with no oil inside of it's internals … also regarding mis matching willy-nilly lifters once removed then randomly back into the engine is Rx Prescription for ruining your perfectly good original lobed low mileage cam …. Good theory but... You cannot possibly soak or pump a lifter up to the same point as a working lifter that has been in service. I always pump my lifters in a can of oil just to demonstrate that they will take some oil and they rattle like hell until fully pumped. I have seen the 'dry' method: once I found one that was totally collapsed with the plunger stuck in the bottom; another was free, but refused to pump up...an engine disassembly could have been avoided. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NTX5467 Posted April 1, 2017 Share Posted April 1, 2017 (edited) The new hydraulic valve lifters I've seen have ALL been oiled with a lighter viscosity assembly lube. They were NOT totally "dry", which would mean that once oil was introduced into the lifter oil feed hole, air bubbles would be less prone to exist as an "oil path" was already in the lifter internals. I suspect that if this oily lube was not in the lifter, to the degree it usually is, new oil introduced would tend to not flow easily into the lifter body and the propensity to have initial "air bubbles" would be increased. IF the lifters were installed "full of oil", I strongly suspect that as the rocker shafts were installed and sequentially torqued to the cylinder heads, that would allow a good deal of time for the lifters to adjust to their new environment and the lifter plungers were be repositioned to their operating position as all of this is being done. In being around old-time mechanics do valve adjustments on small block Chevy engines, with the engines running, it was not unusual for when they were adjusting the pre-load after first getting that lifter "quiet", if the 1/4 turn at a time was done too quickly, the engine would miss a few times as that lifter's plunger was forced further down into its bore (holding the valve slightly open until it did adjust). The first time I saw that happen, I asked why and it was explained as to why it ran smooth, then missed, then smoothed back out again . . . each time. If the adjustment tool was turned quickly, the "adjustment period" for the lifter existed, but if it was done gradually, no misses or they were minimized. And, of course, prior to the engine being started, the oil system could be pressurized with an auxiliary pressurized oil device OR by using a drill motor to spin the oil pump (wit the distributor removed) and pressurize the system BEFORE the engine is fired. When Buick engines were designed, some of these strategies and equipment items were not available or "dreams", I suspect. As for the "mixed" valve lifters, I believe you can use some appropriate abrasive paper to scuff the bottom of the lifters, removing the existing wear pattern such that a new wear pattern can start. WITH appropriate cleaning and lubing of the valve lifter's contact surface prior to assembly! I seem to recall reading that in an "Engine Overhaul" section of my 1966 MOTOR Manual, or something similar. Akin to honing a cylinder wall when installing new rings on an un-bored cylinder? ANY time a lifter is installed into its place in the engine assembly, cam lobe/lifter lube needs to be used!! If the engine is to run in a few minutes, then a more liquid "pre-lube" (that will not have time to fully run into the crankcase) might be considered, but I'd also use plenty of the moly paste AND the more liquid pre-lubes, just to make sure, myself. Initial lubrication is important, no matter what, until the engine has run and lubed the camshaft lobes (as it normally does). NTX5467 Edited April 1, 2017 by NTX5467 (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted April 2, 2017 Share Posted April 2, 2017 (edited) 21 hours ago, buick man said: … all good vibes and info going on here, however, never, never presoak a clean or new hydraulic lifter in the hopes if doing so that oil will migrate into the internals of the lifter … this is complete folly and the one thing you do not want in a newly installed hydraulic lifter is oil, as you want the action of the push rod only as the mechanism to suck oil into the internals of the new or freshly cleaned lifter. If you presoak or "inject" oil into a lifter prior to install, you run the very real risk of eliminating lifter lash … the result will be a fluid frozen lifter that will bend the pushrod and in turn bend a valve stem or worse yet introduce the head of the piston into the face of the valve … ouch … all newly installed hydraulic lifter must have the spec lash amount and the only way it can have that is with no oil inside of it's internals … also regarding mis matching willy-nilly lifters once removed then randomly back into the engine is Rx Prescription for ruining your perfectly good original lobed low mileage cam …. I presoaked my new lifters when completing a cylinder head job on my 264.. Laid each lifter on their side with the open hole to the top. Small bubbles of air escaped. I then used a push rod and pumped what oil I could into each. I installed the new lifters on a cam with an estimated 10k on it. The engine, when started, required time to fill each lifter as expected. You see, no matter how much I think I can manually pump oil into a new lifter I simply can't pump each like a rotating crank and oil pump. Each clattered and got quiet as the engine was maintained at 1500 rpm. Nothing got bent or broken. The cam did not grind itself into fine shavings. The engine has just over 1000 miles on it since this repair. Runs like a watch. Video of the day she was started. Lifters filled and running fine: Edited April 2, 2017 by avgwarhawk (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avgwarhawk Posted April 2, 2017 Share Posted April 2, 2017 (edited) 6 hours ago, old-tank said: Good theory but... You cannot possibly soak or pump a lifter up to the same point as a working lifter that has been in service. I always pump my lifters in a can of oil just to demonstrate that they will take some oil and they rattle like hell until fully pumped. I have seen the 'dry' method: once I found one that was totally collapsed with the plunger stuck in the bottom; another was free, but refused to pump up...an engine disassembly could have been avoided. I manually pump oil into new lifter. Certainly not as efficiently as a running engine but for me it was an once of prevention. Worked fine as you know and the helpful phone call we had deciphering my cam/lifters/push rods are from a 55. Edited April 2, 2017 by avgwarhawk (see edit history) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buick man Posted April 3, 2017 Share Posted April 3, 2017 yeah great points on bathing or soaking oil and lifters together so be it, …. however, our point here was to point out the simple operation of the internal spring and valve seat in a hydraulic lifter which acts by internal suction and that single little hole in the side of the skirt of the lifter expels air and adds oil … so this is just the mechanical nature of the function of a properly functioning hydraulic lifter and it's just what it is no more, no less. If you have proper lash upon inserting the lifter then no problem, and that can still exist with just a tad bit oil in the lifter itself but our point is if you install a new or surgically clean hydraulic lifter and you took great efforts to fill it up completely with oil via various means or possibly by taking it apart adding oil then reassembling like what could be possible if your were cleaning your lifter, and then reinstall that lifter back into the engine it would then have no lash. Lash is verified by depressing on the rocker and push rod which goes into the seat head of the hydraulic lifter. If it has proper lash and is not hydraulically set one would see the push rod rebound quickly upon depressing that particular rod into that lifter due to the free travel of the internal piston and spring inside the lifter. But if you have no rebound i.e. no lash, then one runs the very real chance of having a fluid frozen lifter which if is the case, then movement will be completely restricted resulting in at least a bent push rod or more damage up and into the rocker and valve train as well … This is not an opinion or judgement call this is just how hydraulic lifters work and what can happen if you install a lifter that cannot demonstrate lash before beginning start up and if you fill the lifter with oil prior to installation this will happen. As for the cam, placing distinct wear pattern lifters back into cam plugs that were not the original one for that cam lobe can cause premature wear on the cam lobe and depending on how worn the heal of the hydraulic lifter is or has concentric wear that is not matchable to the given cam lobe it interfaces with, can be a cause for longevity concern down the road … all this does not mean one cannot luck out and button up your engines willy-willy and nothing down the road happens, but a proper provincial approach in following spec protocol is always a good practice … Drive on ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunchabuix Posted January 25, 2018 Author Share Posted January 25, 2018 Well, I'm back to assembling the engine, after a many month absence. Lifters were inspected by a well known Buick factory engine engineer from the nailhead days. He said they all looked fine, all had even wear, and to re-use them, even though I mixed them up. I cleaned the light scale from the lifter sides, prelubed them w/ assembly lube, & the cam lobes, and dropped them into place. The timing chain & gears show minimal wear, no sludge, so I'm leaving it alone. Now to my current question: I've installed a new synthetic rope crankshaft oil seal supplied w/ the chain cover gasket set, tapped the shedder with the seal into the cover, test fitted the cover over the crankshaft, and the clearance between the seal & crankshaft is approx. 1/4" + - . The shop manual says to use a Packing Expander Tool # J 5250-2 to expand the packing into place and size the opening for the crankshaft, ( page 2-27, subpar. B. ) What can I use to expand the seal, since I don't have this tool? Is a similar type tool available?? Thanks for your continuing assistance. Jerry BCA #1518 ROA #8691 AACA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old-tank Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 It will probably expand to fit adequately when the pulley/damper is installed. If the timing cover is still off, have the machine shop install lip seal for Buick 455 (National Oil #450446). I say machine shop since that seal is a 0.020" interference fit and will be destroyed without the proper tools. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1956322 Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 Are we sure about the harmonic balancer torque of 200 odd foot pounds..I keep seeing this mentioned everywhere but what I don't see anyone mention is that that spec is for 57 and newer 56 322 shop manual lists 55-65 foot pounds actually just checking 57 says 100-110 so without digging further not sure where this 200 plus spec is coming from 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beemon Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 47 minutes ago, 1956322 said: Are we sure about the harmonic balancer torque of 200 odd foot pounds..I keep seeing this mentioned everywhere but what I don't see anyone mention is that that spec is for 57 and newer 56 322 shop manual lists 55-65 foot pounds actually just checking 57 says 100-110 so without digging further not sure where this 200 plus spec is coming from Nailhead experts that know more than the engineers that designed the engine. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1956322 Posted January 26, 2018 Share Posted January 26, 2018 That's what I'm seeing Beemon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1956322 Posted January 27, 2018 Share Posted January 27, 2018 Looks like in 59 they changed it to 200-220 foot pounds of torque however that is far from true on anything before that according to the shop manuals... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beemon Posted January 29, 2018 Share Posted January 29, 2018 More torque on the crankshaft with the 401. Can you imagine someone spinning a 322 bolt to 220 ft lbs and shearing off the head? Oops. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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