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Karr Rubber Manufacturing - California.


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I doubt a professional auctioneer was hired.  As I mentioned before, there were no auction advertisements or signs on the building, only the legal notice.  I drove by there on Friday.  Looks much the same as last week but, there is some clean-up activity going on.  Equipment is still in place.  If I was the landlord I would want an empty building immediately.  Maybe another old car rubber manufacturing facility is moving in.

 

And, the molds may have been removed from the property by Craig Karr prior to the manufacturing equipment being declared abandoned.

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My apologies to TVC15 et al---i failed to review whole thread, and'd forgotten he'd already published the Notice, and that it'd been referred to by others...(mouth in high, brain in low)......

As stated  above, it was most likely an auction by Declaration, by  the property manager or someone connected with the landowner, no professional auction company involved,  just standing on the sidewalk and announcing, verbally, the auction was taking place.....

Assuming a professional appraiser was involved, to give landowner legal cove re' code sections,  he/she may not have considered Karr to be a going concern, the eqpmt obsolete, and therefor of little or no commercial value...

Whether the newspaper would divulge the party placing the notice is another question...

KLUGHTERFO---can you get anything specific from your uncle---date of last contact, any names/addresses???

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Does this building, 133 Lomita, have only one tenant? ie, not subdivided?

 

It seems we need to find/ask the property manager what happened because if the equipment is still inside maybe no-one actually bought it. Maybe someone did buy it and took some and left the rest to go to the trash. No-one is even sure if the molds were left behind when it was vacated.

 

It shouldn't be too hard to find the property manager. They would rarely actually visit a building but someone, such as neighbors should know who it is.

 

If all the molds were gone, before the auction even took place, then this will be a waste of time in the end.

 

Karr.JPG

Edited by mike6024 (see edit history)
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Guest Clam Estate Wagon

My daughter put a couple of letters through the letterbox again last night.

 

It was dark when my daughter dropped of the letters last night so she couldn't see anything inside other than that all letters she noticed at her last visit now was gone from the floor.

Today she got a phonecall from the propertymanager (don't know her name). Phone 310 535 9050

The propertymanager said the building now was empty.

She (the propertymanager) was also surprised when told that we had been there mid May and found Craig at the property as she was not aware of anyone being there after January.

The lady wouldn't give out any information but said she had forwarded our details to the Trustee and that we had to file our claim with them. Then said she had said to much already.

Tried to say we were not looking to file a claim just to find out where the contents had gone but the lady hung up mid conversation.

 

Also I walked through the building with Craig in May and it was all one ompany it looked like. Office and a "customer area" at the front and one big storage/production facility at the back.

Craig was very aware of the value of all his moulds/dies. He kept on repeating that he was the only one with the moulds to make these items. So maybe he has sold them to someone in the business or are storing them somewhere. It is starting to sound a little fishy to me as he took my $500 and his phone was cut off less than a week later. He also said he was on his way to his lawyer/attorney as we left the building. Together with other info coming out now and the (in hindsight) strange behaviour by the two employees that was at the shop when we were there it is all abit strange.

 

But he is also an 87 year old man, his house in a very nice neighbouhood (million dollar houses) is in dire need of repair with an "unsafe" note frome the authorities on the door.

He was not in a good way after his accident having a hard time both walking and breathing. He might just have given up and walked away from it all. As someone else mentioned earlier in this thread he had noone to take over.

He had no email, his faxmachine/copier was broken, no website up and running. No good in 2017, specially with the amount of vintage cars being restored now and people with money to spend.

I wish I had told him what I told my daughter driving away after paying the deposit on my parts. "I wouldnt mind taking over this, getting it up and going again... its got potential.... You have to tell him that when you pick up the weatherstripping for me."

Hindsight....

 

 

Also contacted the El Segundo Herald but no callback or answer as of yet.

 

 

Edited by Clam Estate Wagon
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I was in E.S. today and drove by again.   Looked the same as Friday.  Definitely not empty.

 

 

9 hours ago, mike6024 said:

If all the molds were gone, before the auction even took place, then this will be a waste of time in the end.

 

Not necessarily, our collective effort might locate the mold  that was in the custody of Karr Rubber, owned by PFitz.

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Oh, definitely curiouser and curiouser....

   So the property manager was surprised Karr was occupying the premises in May, apparently having been advised the property was vacant since January...and then felt she'd said too much...

   To someone who's wondering just what she'd felt ske'd  overspoken, it could be there's a statutory time period of "abandonment" before this Code section  auction  can be used---that "vacant" since January was good, but vacant from June is not good, which could mean the auction was  irregular/subject to attack or even legally void...this would fit any concern about new claimants suddenly appearing...

   Property owners don't like their property managers disclosing possible problems, nor would she want her other clients to know she was involved (if she was involved) in a questionable auction per her not making inquiries personally...

  And, what "Trustee"??  Does this statute require the party holding the auction act as a trustee in handling any monies or values  obtained, in the auction??   Was Karrs trip to his atty to file Bkcy,. and the auction was held by the Trustee in his Bkcy??  If the property manager passed on erroneous info, and the Trustee in a Bkcy acted on it, that could be embarrassing (Bkcy seems unlikely: it's a Federal procedure, and the Notice published seems too Mickey-Mouse)...

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12 hours ago, TVC15 said:

 

I was in E.S. today and drove by again.   Looked the same as Friday.  Definitely not empty.

 

 

 

Not necessarily, our collective effort might locate the mold  that was in the custody of Karr Rubber, owned by PFitz.

  Thank you very much TVC15, for checking in for us distant folks.

 

Just to be clear to all, the extrusion die to make swing-out windshield sponge rubber weather seal is not mine.  The H.H. Franklin Club paid for it and still owns the rights to it. I just provided the original sample and made the contacts with John throughout the process of getting the die and first several runs of it made.

 

Some info about the process. The machine to extrude sponge rubber seals is a very specialized one and few rubber manufacturers have such equipment. As far as I know, Karr Rubber was the only one making sponge rubber weather seals for the early antique cars. And John once told me he made extruded rubber seals for some of the other rubber suppliers.  

 

The dies are not molds. They are just aluminum plates with a hole cut in the middle that is the shape of the cross section of the rubber to be extruded (not molded). The plates are sized to fit into the extruding machine. A batch of rubber is mixed, put into the machine, and then forced through the die to make one long piece of rubber. One "batch" was enough to make about a 500 foot long piece for the windshield seal I mentioned (see picture below of a cutoff cross section piece) . Then Club volunteers would cut up that 500 feet to lengths needed for the windshields. The Club would sell it keeping all the proceeds. And all profit from that project went to help fund more of the Club's reproduction parts projects.   

 

There is a special tube inside the machine to inject air into the rubber just before it is forced through the die. The tricky part is getting just the right amount of air flow to make the proper amount and size of air bubbles inside the sponge rubber..  

 

BTW, that seal is used by other makes of antique autos. I mentioned it to NC Industries in Pennsylvania, who specialize in making replacement windshields for many antique cars and trucks, but I never received a list from them what other makes use the same cross section of steel frames, therefore, they might also use the same weather seal.  

 

Paul

DSCN4509.JPG

Edited by PFitz (see edit history)
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  • 2 weeks later...

To everyone who is interested.  Good to see that Karr Rubber was not a forgotten footnote.  I went by the shop yesterday, Sunday.  Loading all the machinery on a flat bed.  It is over.  Door was open but nobody seemed to be there.  Strange.  I knew Craig for over 30 years.  There was never a "John".  Craig was prone to paranoia and always was short with the bills.  He answered the phone as John.  Sort of humorous but not really.  Money was owed.  I have a feeling he has passed.  Was in very poor health after a catastrophic fall a couple of years ago.  He would not give up.  Amazing work ethic for some reason.  He told me that he had given the business to the husband and wife in the back who did the actual work.  His children did want the business.  Hopefully the workers got the machines and dies.  Boxes and boxes and boxes of extrusion dies.  Nothing was labeled though.  So it goes.  Makes me sad to hear that his home was in such poor condition.  Nobody deserves to live in such conditions especially after working hard for a lifetime.  So it goes.  He truly did love life and he loved Classic cars.  Impressive he lasted as long as he did.  Can't take anything with us.  Enjoy it while you can.................

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2 hours ago, rbf said:

To everyone who is interested.  Good to see that Karr Rubber was not a forgotten footnote.  I went by the shop yesterday, Sunday.  Loading all the machinery on a flat bed.  It is over.  Door was open but nobody seemed to be there.  Strange.  I knew Craig for over 30 years.  There was never a "John".  Craig was prone to paranoia and always was short with the bills.  He answered the phone as John.  Sort of humorous but not really.  Money was owed.  I have a feeling he has passed.  Was in very poor health after a catastrophic fall a couple of years ago.  He would not give up.  Amazing work ethic for some reason.  He told me that he had given the business to the husband and wife in the back who did the actual work.  His children did want the business.  Hopefully the workers got the machines and dies.  Boxes and boxes and boxes of extrusion dies.  Nothing was labeled though.  So it goes.  Makes me sad to hear that his home was in such poor condition.  Nobody deserves to live in such conditions especially after working hard for a lifetime.  So it goes.  He truly did love life and he loved Classic cars.  Impressive he lasted as long as he did.  Can't take anything with us.  Enjoy it while you can.................

 

Funny how I don't understand this post at all. Oh well. So it goes. Doesn't really matter I suppose. 

 

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Mike6024  Sorry you did not understand my post.  At all?  There was a thread talking about Karr Rubber's existence (fate).  Seems like there was a lot of speculation on what was happening.  I was a long time customer and friend of Craig's.  Drove by the shop Sunday the 15th and saw everything coming out and being taken away.  Can't paint a better picture than that.  Maybe photos but I was a bit shocked.  Sorry.  My opinion, for everyone that was wondering, is that this business is over.  Craig Karr has possibly passed away.  He was secretive enough to make it difficult to contact him..(John).  Rest in Peace.  I hope this clarifies my previous post.  It matters to some.

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Guest SaddleRider
1 hour ago, mike6024 said:

 

Funny how I don't understand this post at all. Oh well. So it goes. Doesn't really matter I suppose. 

 

 

What is it - please be precise, be specific  that you don't understand about rbf's post?  

 

Let me caution you I am not the only one reading these posts who knew Craig,  and got a big kick out of being friends with him.  Yes...Craig matters to some of us...!

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I had no idea how timely this discussion is.  My shop is in El Segundo.  Close to Karr Rubber.  I always take a peek while driving past to see if anyone is inside.  Craig  had disappeared and the building has been dark for a while.  I was shocked to see the equipment coming out.  Without succumbing to gossip I know that was not what Craig had planned for his business.  If someone is gone everything changes.  Suddenly.  I was always aware of the value of the dies to the hobby.  I tried to "suggest" that they at least be labeled.  You cannot tell a  man how to take care of his affairs.  My fear is that they became scrap.  Even then without the machines, the "feel" of making rubber and the determination to do that type of work how far do you go? 

There was, is, and will be a great need for rubber manufacturing.  Nobody that I found wanted to small custom runs.  If such a person exists, who and where is he? 

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Guest Auto electrician CHIC

know the guy that bought the Machinery from car rubber Manufacturing in El Segundo California he also has a lot of merchandise and products that were left behind I will check and see what exactly he has.

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Thank you. Sounds like you may be able to contribute some REAL INFORMATION to this thread, for a change!

 

Did he buy it with the intention of continuing the business? If you could find that out we'd appreciate it.

 

If he does not, I think there may be some individuals here that may be interested in buying the equipment and dies from him.

 

We knew it was auctioned, but that was about it.

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11 hours ago, Auto electrician CHIC said:

know the guy that bought the Machinery from car rubber Manufacturing in El Segundo California he also has a lot of merchandise and products that were left behind

 

 

Is there some way to contact this man ? I'm in need of some of the products Karr produced.

 

Paul

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Molds for rubber extrusions are not massively complex. Steele rubber makes their own extrusions. IF the Karr Rubber molds are lost, the car hobby will survive. Still, I do hope someone can find the tooling and equipment from Karr Rubber, and keep things going. 

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5 hours ago, Curti said:
13 hours ago, Auto electrician CHIC said:

And it is to my understanding  that CRAIG DID NOT PASS AWAY

If he did pass away, there would be an obit .

That is not correct.  There is no legal requirement for an obituary to be posted if someone dies.  As an old saying goes "it aint the things we don't know, but the things we know that ain't so that cause us the most trouble".

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2 hours ago, lump said:

Molds for rubber extrusions are not massively complex. Steele rubber makes their own extrusions. IF the Karr Rubber molds are lost, the car hobby will survive. Still, I do hope someone can find the tooling and equipment from Karr Rubber, and keep things going. 

 

When I was getting estimates for the Club's project, Steele had the same shape weather seal to fit the swing out frames 1928 - 32+. But it was a molded rubber seal. And being that it was not soft sponge rubber like the originals, it was difficult to install. I had previously installed a Steele molded one in a 28 Victoria and was too hard to get the windshield closed without the risk of bending the frame and cracking the glass. It took 6 months of about once a week slightly tightening the frame closed before the molded rubber would deform enough to allow the frame to fully close.  And it was very expensive compared to the Karr-made duplicate of the original extruded soft sponge rubber seal, about double the price back then. The Karr seal fit and worked just like the original, allowing the W/S frame to be fully closed the same day that the seal was installed.

 

Checking Steele's website today, I don't even see the molded seal listed.  The only swing out seal listed will not work with the frames that the Karr seal will.

 

Paul   

Edited by PFitz (see edit history)
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1 hour ago, Tinindian said:

That is not correct.  There is no legal requirement for an obituary to be posted if someone dies.  As an old saying goes "it aint the things we don't know, but the things we know that ain't so that cause us the most trouble".

OK, I'll buy that !  The police or the county coroner knows if Craig ( John ) died or not. 

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Guest Auto electrician CHIC

Ok so the equipment bas been resold. But he does have half a truck load of assorted product and some dies. I will snap some picturesand post them this evening...

 

It is to my understanding  (& mind u that this is 3rd party  information) but i believe the son claimed his Dad was losing his mind and had him committed.

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This is good news that Craig did not pass away.  To have the business go away like this I hope he not too aware or suffering.  The equipment was probably dated to the start of the Industrial Revolution.  I had helped him  a few times over the years to keep it going.  The dies would help someone get going if they still exist.  I looked through the window yesterday and where they were sitting on a desk is now empty.  Sad scene inside.  Making a die is straightforward.  Cut by hand or laser cut.  The difficult is getting someone who is used to pumping out multiple yards of rubber all day to stop production and run enough for one windshield.  Then supply your customer who then might complain.  And then possibly not pay.  Sounds easy and there is definitely a BIG demand but real life sometimes throws a curve ball.  Craig did it for decades.  He did not have it easy.

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My father Luis Arteaga was the person who worked for Craig Karr for the past 25 years. My father was the person who managed everything at Karr rubber Manufactoring. If anyone needs any parts that need to be reproduce please contact me at my following number : (310)7437909. Sad to say that the Craig closed the company. My dad is willing to start his own company. He is a professional at his job. Any questions please contact me.

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Did your father acquire any of the machinery and tooling from the sale?  It's great that someone wants to keep the service going, just wondering what resources he has, hopefully he's able to save the business.  The business has helped a lot of people restore old cars over the years, and at this point in time we sure hate to lose resources.....

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3 hours ago, trimacar said:

Did your father acquire any of the machinery and tooling from the sale?  It's great that someone wants to keep the service going, just wondering what resources he has, hopefully he's able to save the business.  The business has helped a lot of people restore old cars over the years, and at this point in time we sure hate to lose resources.....

My father kept all the dies, he makes them, so even if loses them hes able to remake them... the machinery,tools and molds was lost since he wasn't aware of anything regarding the auctions... but he's able to make molds with no problem as long people have a sample of the parts they need. He wants and is going to keep the service going on. 

Edited by Jasminejl (see edit history)
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1 hour ago, Auto electrician CHIC said:

Im curious  ...then why did you take so long to post  this info????

 

On 10/18/2017 at 12:17 PM, Auto electrician CHIC said:

Ok so the equipment bas been resold.

 

Well you're the one who could tell us who actually has the equipment now. Your friend bought it at the auction. And then resold it to someone else. Can you tell us? What this new owner plans to do with the equipment? Go into the business? Or resell it yet again?

 

Mainly I think everyone would like to see it all, the equipment and etc go to someone who will keep supplying the products people need. Is it possible we could get all the equipment back to Jasmine's father? And for how much $$$?

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1 hour ago, mike6024 said:

 

 

Well you're the one who could tell us who actually has the equipment now. Your friend bought it at the auction. And then resold it to someone else. Can you tell us? What this new owner plans to do with the equipment? Go into the business? Or resell it yet again?

 

Mainly I think everyone would like to see it all, the equipment and etc go to someone who will keep supplying the products people need. Is it possible we could get all the equipment back to Jasmine's father? And for how much $$$?

Great idea but for what i know all the equipment that was bought has already been sent far away to tennese so theres no way to get it back. And for my understanding they are not going into business. For what they dont know what My father does or want to work with car parts. My father is willing to work and is working for himself now. Most of the stuff my dad did, he made it by hand but some equipment is still needed. Craig passed away and my father didnt even know about this, till recently.

Edited by Jasminejl (see edit history)
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Thank you to JASMINEJL for her update.  So sad to hear that Craig passed.  He was a friend for over 30 years.  I just wish he had reached out to others when he was in need.  He was a good man at heart and had a work ethic that could be a model to all of us.  Sometimes things go in directions not expected.  time runs out for all.  Rest In Peace.  I wish Luis and his wife the best.  They tried to help for a long time.  If Luis has the dies without the machinery how far can he go?  It is a bit of a complicated process.  To MIKE6024.  Were you a customer of Karr Rubber?  Were you going to step up and buy the business?  Is this man's fate of any real concern or just another old car subject?  If the equipment is on the way to Tennessee maybe you can do the hobby a favor and make sure it gets used for its purpose.  Just a friendly suggestion.

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You Sir just answered my questions.  Exactly as I imagined.   Please use this Gentleman's passing to realize that you should enjoy it while you can. 

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1 hour ago, rbf said:

Thank you to JASMINEJL for her update.  So sad to hear that Craig passed.  He was a friend for over 30 years.  I just wish he had reached out to others when he was in need.  He was a good man at heart and had a work ethic that could be a model to all of us.  Sometimes things go in directions not expected.  time runs out for all.  Rest In Peace.  I wish Luis and his wife the best.  They tried to help for a long time.  If Luis has the dies without the machinery how far can he go?  It is a bit of a complicated process.  To MIKE6024.  Were you a customer of Karr Rubber?  Were you going to step up and buy the business?  Is this man's fate of any real concern or just another old car subject?  If the equipment is on the way to Tennessee maybe you can do the hobby a favor and make sure it gets used for its purpose.  Just a friendly suggestion.

Craig Karr was an amazing man and now he's resting in peace. My parents always helped him out in any possible way sad to say hes now gone.

My dad can't do much without the machinery. He can only reproduce dies and custom rubber but not the extrutions.

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Guest Joseluis arteaga

Hello i am joseluis jr arteaga my father is Jose Luis Arteaga he worked for craig for 25 years or more. Even after karr rubber has been closed my father continued to make moulds and rubber. All my father will need in order to make the rubber will be a sample of the rubber in order to make the mould. My father speaks spanish but im here to translate for him my number is 310 850 4433 call for any informacion. 

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Guest Auto electrician CHIC

Im sorry but to the people that say  thier father worked for Mr .Karr for 25 YEARS... IF THAT WERE TRUE THEN U WOULD  KNOW THAT BE HAS NOT PASSED AWAY HE IS VERY MUCH ALIVE...HIS SON HAD HIM  PUT AWAY..(IM unsure of the rest  of details)

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Guest SaddleRider

for rbf - suggest you recognize what is going on in this "thread".    If you are interested in doing business with some of these folk....I have a business proposition for you...I can give you a great deal on a slightly used bridge in Brooklyn, New York....( needs paint...!)

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11 hours ago, Auto electrician CHIC said:

Im sorry but to the people that say  thier father worked for Mr .Karr for 25 YEARS... IF THAT WERE TRUE THEN U WOULD  KNOW THAT BE HAS NOT PASSED AWAY HE IS VERY MUCH ALIVE...HIS SON HAD HIM  PUT AWAY..(IM unsure of the rest  of details)

Well im sorry to say but thats what his son and Craigs sister told my father. So if they are lying to my father then god forbid them. We will try to find out if he's still alive but for what we know he passed away a month ago.

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