Kill switch for 63 Riviera

[rodneybeauchamp]

Am wanting to fit an ignition kill switch to my 63 Riviera to reduce the chance of theft.

 

Would be interested to hear from others who have done this or are thinking of doing it as to which circuit would be best to tap into.

 

I gather that to start it without a key you would normally run a hot wire from battery to the coil (but not 100% sure as it has been too many years since I saw this done) and then bridge the starter motor terminals with a screw driver or similar until it starts.

 

"Then you drive it like you stole it!"

 

So need something to prevent ignition happening with or without a key, perhaps grounding a circuit or similar. Any help would be appreciated.

 

Rodney

 

[Seafoam65]

              Rodney, the best way to do it on an old car is to tie into the negative wire on the ignition coil down underneath the

distributor where the wire comes out the bottom of the distributor base where it can't be seen as an extra wire on the ignition

coil negative terminal, then run your tapped in wire through the firewall to a hidden toggle switch under the dash somewhere

that has a wire grounded to the dash as the other lead to the switch. When you trip the switch, this grounds the negative wire

to the points and the car will have no spark. The beauty of this setup is that the thief can't use a jumper wire to start the car.......he will have to be smart enough to find the extra wire and cut it......not very likely 

if you tap in under the distributor.

Edited December 8, 2016 by Seafoam65 (see edit history)

[RivNut]

I bought a Jeep one time that some previous owner had installed something like this.  Except the "key" was not as obvious as the one pictured.  Out of sight and easy to access.   I've included a link.  

 

http://www.stargardusa.com/index.html

 

http://www.stargardusa.com/index.html

 

 

[rodneybeauchamp]

Winston,

i like this idea.

 

OK so what happens if I forget the switch is on,

 

would the grounding of the hot wire from the coil be enough to cause a fire or melt down of the wiring or ruin the switch?

 

Or cause any other issues with the ignition system.

 

If not it is certainly doable, as the distributor and coil are out at the moment.

 

 

[Seafoam65]

17 hours ago, rodneybeauchamp said:

Winston,

i like this idea.

 

OK so what happens if I forget the switch is on,

 

would the grounding of the hot wire from the coil be enough to cause a fire or melt down of the wiring or ruin the switch?

 

Or cause any other issues with the ignition system.

 

If not it is certainly doable, as the distributor and coil are out at the moment.

 

 

Rodney, it doesn't hurt anything if you forget to flip it....it just  won't make any spark with the negative side of the coil grounded all the time.

[rodneybeauchamp]

Winston,

thank you for the reassurance. 

 

So the only way to "hot wire" the ignition with kill switch on would be to cut the kill switch wire.

 

And as you mention if it feeds from the distributor so it would look OEM and quite the part. And unless you know how a Riviera is supposed to look under the hood, it would not stick out like a sore thumb except to "those in the know".

 

I think what will really put off wannabe joy riders is that that won't be able to find the bonnet release under the dash board. Most of our cars in Australia were fitted with release cables. And they will think the steering wheel is missing ( Tis on the other side)

 

well we we can only hope!

 

will keep you posted.

[rodneybeauchamp]

Winston, 

looked at the distributor last night and there is a second hole through the body that a wire can easily pass through, so should be an easy peasy modification that would look very factory. The hole is near where the vacuum advance connect to the breaker plate.

When done will post a photo.

 

cheers

Rodney

[RIVNIK]

I use an battery cut-off switch that attaches to the neg.batt.pole. It has a knurled knob which you unscrew one turn to interrupt the current. When leaving the car in a "shady" area, you can remove the knob and the car is disabled. A smart thief may spot it, but in the dark and in the heat of the moment it appears as a regular battery terminal. Also very handy when working on the car, as it provides you with an emergency cut-off, and I can disable the courtesy lights with a twist of the knob. When in doubt, I back it up with "The Club". Both are non-invasive, old-school and low-budget, which I love! Look for battery cut-off switch on Ebay, starting around $1.50.   RIVNIK

[Seafoam65]

  Rodney.......... I would recommend using a black wire.......a lot less noticeable and harder to spot.           

Edited December 14, 2016 by Seafoam65 (see edit history)

[rodneybeauchamp]

Winston,

my thoughts entirely, reasonable gauge black wire with terminal to points that feeds to kill switch under dashboard. Should be able to tape it into another loom that heads in through the firewall to look OEM. Will post some pics when done, thanks for your suggestions.

cheers

Rodney

[Turbinator]

On 12/9/2016 at 4:35 PM, rodneybeauchamp said:

Winston,

thank you for the reassurance. 

 

So the only way to "hot wire" the ignition with kill switch on would be to cut the kill switch wire.

 

And as you mention if it feeds from the distributor so it would look OEM and quite the part. And unless you know how a Riviera is supposed to look under the hood, it would not stick out like a sore thumb except to "those in the know".

 

I think what will really put off wannabe joy riders is that that won't be able to find the bonnet release under the dash board. Most of our cars in Australia were fitted with release cables. And they will think the steering wheel is missing ( Tis on the other side)

 

well we we can only hope!

 

will keep you posted.

Gents, here is a pic of a kill switch that does not require any holes drilled in the automobile. I used original screws to ground and mount the switch holder on the steering mast. Mr. Seafoam provided instructions on the "how to" to make the kill switch function as intended.

[Turbinator]

Alright, I’ll find a better place to hide the switch

 

how about here?

Edited April 17, 2018 by Red Riviera Bob
Add pic (see edit history)

[60FlatTop]

No need around here. The watchful eye of the Law would spot unauthorized use of a Riviera in a minute.

[Turbinator]

On 4/11/2018 at 9:09 AM, 60FlatTop said:

No need around here. The watchful eye of the Law would spot unauthorized use of a Riviera in a minute.

Seems to me The Constabulary would be seated in a warm police car?

Edited April 17, 2018 by Red Riviera Bob
Error (see edit history)

[KongaMan]

You could always put a small push button switch in the bottom of your lighter socket.  Activate it by pushing in the lighter.  Push it in again to deactivate.  Just hope that one of your smoking friends doesn't try to fire one up while you're toodling down the road.   

[Turbinator]

3 hours ago, KongaMan said:

You could always put a small push button switch in the bottom of your lighter socket.  Activate it by pushing in the lighter.  Push it in again to deactivate.  Just hope that one of your smoking friends doesn't try to fire one up while you're toodling down the road.   

Mr. Kongaman, Nosmo King dare not light up in my Red Riviera.

Your clever idea to use a push button kill switch connected via the cigarette lighter is top level designer thinking. The credit for the kill switch solution goes to Mr. Seafoam. Mr. Seafoam said to connect a wire to the negative side of the coil to a double lead switch. The other lead on the switch goes to ground disabling the points. Why that works I do not know. I can understood the difference between white and pink noise in audio easier than auto electric. Go figure.

RRB

[60FlatTop]

Those are actually Neguanee cops. They think it's Spring.

 

28 degrees this morning, took the truck up to town for coffee because the cab is smaller to heat; dropped the keys in the cup holder while I was inside.

Bernie

[1965rivgs]

On 4/11/2018 at 6:57 AM, Red Riviera Bob said:

Alright, I’ll find a better place to hide the switch

 

how about here?

When I park my car in an area or situation where theft is highly unlikely I pull the keys from the ignition and place them in the ashtray and close it. Hate to say it, but if I was looking for the keys to a car, like unearthing a barn find, etc, the first thing I would do is open the ashtray and look there. The second place I would  look is behind  the sun visors...

The kill switch performs the same function as the ignition points. The points ground the primary circuit in the coil. When the points open they break the primary circuit which produces spark from the secondary side. If you never break the primary circuit, as when the points remain closed or a kill switch grounds the circuit, a spark from the secondary circuit will not occur.

Tom

[Turbinator]

On 4/17/2018 at 12:35 PM, 1965rivgs said:

When I park my car in an area or situation where theft is highly unlikely I pull the keys from the ignition and place them in the ashtray and close it. Hate to say it, but if I was looking for the keys to a car, like unearthing a barn find, etc, the first thing I would do is open the ashtray and look there. The second place I would  look is behind  the sun visors...

The kill switch performs the same function as the ignition points. The points ground the primary circuit in the coil. When the points open they break the primary circuit which produces spark from the secondary side. If you never break the primary circuit, as when the points remain closed or a kill switch grounds the circuit, a spark from the secondary circuit will not occur.

Tom

Tom, I’m with you on checking for the keys, under the floor mat, under front seat, visor, and ash tray. My arms are not long enough to reach under the dash while seated in the driver’s seat. I could fill the ashtray with coins to cover the toggle and leave a key on top the coins? 

Some of the gents wrote about using a cigarette lighter and power antenna switch for the kill switch. I’d need a tutorial on ‘how to” for the antenna or cigarette lighter kill switch. For now, I’m going to take my chances with “ the club” and the kill switch in hopes those two are enough to change a thief’s mind for a chance score. I appreciate your explanation how the kill switch works or doesn’t work with primary circuits and secondary circuits. Without me having a solid understanding of auto electric, or electric and circuits in general I have no knowledge of how it works. I can replace parts and wires, but understanding how they operate is an going lesson. I know if you have an open circuit what happens, but how the points, ignition, distributor, cap, rotor, shaft, dwell, timing, spark work together is a lesson I’ve yet to learn. The local community college has auto tech courses I could take from the basics forward. It would not hurt for me to invest the time in classes, or at least a book on basic auto electric,  and start from scratch.

RRB

[Turbinator]

On 4/17/2018 at 9:17 AM, 60FlatTop said:

Those are actually Neguanee cops. They think it's Spring.

 

28 degrees this morning, took the truck up to town for coffee because the cab is smaller to heat; dropped the keys in the cup holder while I was inside.

Bernie

Bernie, I’m surprised you turned on the heat. It is April!

Red Riviera Bob

[kegart]

I am guilty of leaving the ingnition unlocked so you don't need a key. The keys I had were not cut right and didn't work well. I took the glove box lock out to get the numbers and had new keys made.

 

 

[60FlatTop]

2 hours ago, Red Riviera Bob said:

It is April!

 

Almost May, looks like 34 will be the peak today.

 

Mix of rain and snow now that it is warmer.

 

Spring? Fascinating.

[Turbinator]

On 4/17/2018 at 9:17 AM, 60FlatTop said:

Those are actually Neguanee cops. They think it's Spring.

 

28 degrees this morning, took the truck up to town for coffee because the cab is smaller to heat; dropped the keys in the cup holder while I was inside.

Bernie

Bernie, I know it is great living upstate NewYork with all the fresh air and cool weather 9 months of the year. The only thing better than in Maryland are home made crab cakes with Old Bay seasoning.

[Turbinator]

On 4/18/2018 at 4:47 PM, kegart said:

I am guilty of leaving the ingnition unlocked so you don't need a key. The keys I had were not cut right and didn't work well. I took the glove box lock out to get the numbers and had new keys made.

 

 

Sir, the kill switch in the ashtray is not the best place to hide. I’ve been told a person looking for keys will try try ashtray. Well, I’ve filled the ash tray with silver coin to cover the switch and lay a spare key on top the coins. All the while the kill switch is activated. It could work.

Red Riviera Bob

[offdensen]

I've been weighing my options for a kill switch but in the mean time I've always just opened the hood and taken the coil wire out. Ain't going anywhere without it, at least I can hope 

[telriv]

Most today DON'T use the cigar lighter. Dis-connect the incoming wire & hook-up the extra wire from the distributor to the bottom of the lighter. Push in the lighter & the system is grounded. Pop the lighter up one notch & the circuit is free to work as designed. NO switch to hide.

Another thing. If you look next to the junction block you will see a yellow & purple wire in a 2 wire plug. They go to the starter. The purple is for the starter solenoid & the yellow is for the 12 volts to the coil while cranking. '63 doesn't have the yellow wire I believe. If you jump the purple wire to the stud where the battery cable goes you can get the starter to crank independent of the key. Down at the starter I cut the purple wire & run it to a starter button. This starter button is under the rug in fairly close proximity of the dimmer switch. While trying to crank the starter over with the key you step on the starter button at the same time & the starter will now turn.  Even IF someone knows about this purple wire at the junction block they will NOT get the starter to crank. UNLESS you know the starter button is under the rug I dare just about ANYONE to find it. IF they did it would now take two thief's. They could look ALL day. As long as the button doesn't make a lump in the rug it will be UNDETECTABLE.

Just one of the ways I do it.  No switches to hide that are an easy access for you thief's will also know where to look. These techniques only stop the opportunists NOT the guy that's intent on stealing your car by loading it on a flat bed truck.

And in an emergency "have I flipped the switch the correct way???"   Just pull up on the lighter or even remove it.  Damn, where did I put that darn  knurled knob???   Just step on the starter button.

 

 

Tom T.

 

 

 

[KongaMan]

It seems to me that if you're at the point of worrying about a kill switch, you must not have much else on the car that needs attention.  

[telriv]

These are things I have done to customers cars that have been stolen & recovered more than once.

[Turbinator]

18 hours ago, offdensen said:

I've been weighing my options for a kill switch but in the mean time I've always just opened the hood and taken the coil wire out. Ain't going anywhere without it, at least I can hope 

That is absolutely true and 100% effective. I knew of that option. Sometimes I go out dressed up a little better than usual. I don’t want to get my hands dirty and/ run the risk of getting grease on my clothes. The Mrs. will rag on me for getting dirty.Ha!

[Turbinator]

12 hours ago, KongaMan said:

It seems to me that if you're at the point of worrying about a kill switch, you must not have much else on the car that needs attention.  

Mr. KongaMan, I’m closing in on my level of satisfaction with my 63. I put in a kill switch. Seems to be a lot of thieves around my area. I’m sorry to say we’ve had robbers ride around in broad daylight and invade homes. I guess Baltimore area has more than its share of bad guys.

Once I get my steering box in, new emergency brake cable installedand number 4 vacuum diaphragm replaced all I have to do is wait for something to fail.

[rodneybeauchamp]

As the instigator of this topic, I have to report that I am more than happy with choosing a solution using an existing switch to ground the ignition.

 

It is great peace of mind to park somewhere and know that you have done something to try to thwart joy riders ( car thieves by a nicer name) who might want to ruin your day. And my insurance policy asks that one be installed, so that was an incentive.

 

If I am parked for any length of time, I also use the battery isolation switch as a second deterrent.

 

1. I figure most young car thieves won’t know how to open the bonnet, they will be looking for the hood release cable.

1.1. A percentage will give up because the central locking will not open all doors.

1a. A certain percentage will give up because the won’t find the steering wheel, it’s on the wrong side down under.

1b. A small percentage won’t know how to release the park brake.

2. The battery isolation will fool another percentage of would be thieves.

3. The kill switch will deter the rest of the them.

 

Even while secured in our garage at home, the switch is active.

 

My suggestion is that the small effort required for the install is much easier to deal with compared to the nightmare that could be if you don’t!

 

Rodney ?????

 

 

[Ben Bruce aka First Born]

40 minutes ago, rodneybeauchamp said:

As the instigator of this topic, I have to report that I am more than happy with choosing a solution using an existing switch to ground the ignition.

 

Even while secured in our garage at home, the switch is active.

 

My suggestion is that the small effort required for the install is much easier to deal with compared to the nightmare that could be if you don’t!

 

Rodney ?????

 

 

 

  Well , dang, Rodney, you forgot to tell us what you used!

 

  Ben

[offdensen]

Just make sure you got the roa sticker on your car, that'll scare them away and make them think twice 

[RivNut]

Here's my contribution to deferring someone from stealing your car by driving it off.

 

 

 

[rodneybeauchamp]

9 hours ago, Ben Bruce aka First Born said:

 

  Well , dang, Rodney, you forgot to tell us what you used!

 

  Ben

 

Let me give you a cryptic clue.

 

My Riviera came with a Sonomatic AM radio with manual antennae as you will see in the photo below ?  

 

[RivNut]

18 minutes ago, rodneybeauchamp said:

 

Let me give you a cryptic clue.

 

My Riviera came with a Sonomatic AM radio with manual antennae as you will see in the photo below ?  

 

The power antenna switch next to the courtesy light switch. 

[Turbinator]

On 5/31/2018 at 12:32 PM, offdensen said:

I've been weighing my options for a kill switch but in the mean time I've always just opened the hood and taken the coil wire out. Ain't going anywhere without it, at least I can hope 

Sir, maybe you are taking your cool Riv out for an event and your are “ cleaned up” for proper company. Do you want to raise the hood and remove the coil wire? In case you come back and it is dark and you’ve had an adult beverage it could be hard to see under the hood. Of course, you could have a flashlight under the hood in a safe place. I’m not making fun by any means, I thought Ofremoving the coil wire myself. Knowing me I’ll end up with half the dirt from the engine on my clean shirt while trying; to remove the coil.

in case you missed it, I filled my ash tray with silver coins to hide the switch. I laid a spare key on top the coins, but the switch is activated. Only an idea.

[RivNut]

Can someone tell me the last time their Riviera was stolen by being driven away?  You might be better off installing an alarm system.  

[BetsytheRiv]

I was just thinking about this last night for my 65.  I was trying to think up a way to do it by hiding it in plain sight without having to drill new holes.  Next I've got to get creative on door locks because I'd prefer not to have an alarm.  

 

I live in a nice enough neighborhood but there was an idiotic law passed in 2014 known as "Safe Neighborhoods and Schools Act" where you get a citation for theft under $950.  Since then there has been an unpleasant uptick in vandalism and petty theft.  Big box home stores have cameras beeping ever 2 minutes when you're down many of the aisles because they can get robbed for less than $950 and if they catch the putz and call the police all they can do is give them a citation and send them on their way.  Officer friend told me he saw the same guy get 2 citations in the same day and there's nothing they can do about it.

 

While I know my 65 is worth well more than $950, I've seen what obscure parts are going for on e-bay and craigslist lately and they can really screw me over on some of the harder to find stuff if they know what they're shopping for.  I've had several neighbors in a two mile radius who had their garage doors pried open and tools taken so I'm very wary now.  I've got my house wired up with automation so any door lock or garage door opens I get a text about it.  If they get creative to get past that then they'll be greeted by my 120lb Rottweiler and his two terrier henchmen who are very devoted to protecting our home and the classic car that takes them to the park and dog beach.

 

I restored a 57 T-Bird at 15 y/o and put in a kill so it would only start in neutral.  I lived in LA and from time to time I'd get stuck at a place with only valet parking so I'd leave it running and tell them where to park it so they don't have to move it only to return and before I give them my ticket to pull it up they're asking me why it wouldn't start...  Nobody was going to Ferris Bueller my car!  ?  It even tricked my dad and he helped me put it in!

[SwedeDownUnderR63]

6 hours ago, BetsytheRiv said:

...

 If they get creative to get past that then they'll be greeted by my 120lb Rottweiler and his two terrier henchmen who are very devoted to protecting our home and the classic car that takes them to the park and dog beach.

...

 

Out of topic but as you touch on it:

what do you have in place to protect the interior when you have the dogs in the car?

Our mix breed is tiny compared to your giant (only 70lb) and I love to have her in the car but haven’t got a great solution to protect the interior from her as most that is available is hanging on the modern front seats head rests.

Edited June 7, 2018 by SwedeDownUnderR63 (see edit history)