Jump to content

Modern Radials on Pre-War Rims?


Jon37

Recommended Posts

This question has probably been asked several times, here.

 

I have a 1937 car with 600 x 16 tires and I'm considering switching to radials (merely for the ride and handling; the bias ply tires are much more authentic looking).

 

What worries me is the possibility of stress fractures on my original rims, from the sideward forces of the radial tires.

 

I'd be grateful to hear from anyone who switched to radials (Coker? Diamondback? Other?) on their original 600 x 16 rims, and who has been driving on these tires for several years (or several thousand miles). 

 

I've read some testimonials from car owners who had recently switched to radials and were happy with the ride, but haven't been able to verify that these people had put any great mileage on their new tires.  I'd feel better about investing all that money if I knew of a few long-term success stories!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Don't do it unless you make new rims. The hubcaps tend to fall off due to rim deflection. I have seen rim failure on a 1940 Cadillac. I recently removed a set off a Pierce Arrow we recently purchased. Very expensive tires, I am sure the car would have suffered wim failure. I have seen a few people weld on the rims to stiffen them. It seemed to work, as the caps have stayed on. Truth is people tend to run cars too fast with radials on pre war cars. Just run bias with high pressures, they work fine. Also, most radials don't fit in side mounts and the tire profile and looks are usually off. Good luck.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have had a set of Diamondback tubeless radial tires (Hankook) on the original wheels of my 37 Packard Six for many years. No problems what so ever. They ride smoothly, not affected by grooves in roads, stop straight, do not lose air, and generally perform in an excellent manner. Highly recommend the Diamondback brand radial tires.

 

(o{}o)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ask the question on the fordbarn.com site.  Plenty of people on there running 600 - 16's on their early Fords with good results.

 

You can also buy radial tires now that look like cross ply tires if thats the look you are after.

I have wondered about radials on antique rims for a long while. And now that Coker has radials to fit my size rims I wonder even more. I really would like to stop fighting the rain grooves and have a set of tires last longer than 10,000 to 15,000 miles and it seems radials could do that.

 

But I am not sure if the early Ford group's experience is relevant: Near as I can tell from Model A on up you can get modern manufacture replacement wheels for practically any Ford. So even if there is an issue with the original wheels all is not lost, simply buy replacement wheels. For those of us with no source of duplicate looking modern manufacture wheels this option is not available and it concerns me.

 

I've talked with a number of Model A owners who are running the Coker radials and they all speak highly of them. But they are all running new wheels and seem to back off a bit in their enthusiasm about converting me to radials when the realize that I have no source for new wheels.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

[The Model A's would not be running 600-16's unless they were using 1935 wires and yes you can buy that size as a reproduced size however the later V8s up to the end of the 1939 production used what is called "wide 5" rims (like a volkswagon with a large hole in the centre) and to the best of my knowledge these are not reproduced. 

Many people are running radials on these original rims.  I had a 39 Ford sedan for many years with original rims and radial tires and it drove and rode far better than when it had crossplies on it.

There are new wide 5 rims avalible from places like Speedway motors for circle track racers but they look nothing like the original Ford ones and I dont think anyone would use them on a road car.

 

wide 5 rim

 

 

post-101323-0-79339000-1432984605_thumb.

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've always thought the radial tire problems on original rims was an urban myth.  Remember the tire is rubber and will always flex more than #10 steel rims. I'd like to see some science behind the stress numbers, not opinions.  I found this article and think it might be an eye opener...

 

http://www.dbtires.com/rimstress.html

 

Frank

Link to comment
Share on other sites

[The Model A's would not be running 600-16's unless they were using 1935 wires and yes you can buy that size as a reproduced size however the later V8s up to the end of the 1939 production used what is called "wide 5" rims (like a volkswagon with a large hole in the centre) and to the best of my knowledge these are not reproduced. 

Many people are running radials on these original rims.  I had a 39 Ford sedan for many years with original rims and radial tires and it drove and rode far better than when it had crossplies on it.

There are new wide 5 rims avalible from places like Speedway motors for circle track racers but they look nothing like the original Ford ones and I dont think anyone would use them on a road car.

 

wide 5 rim

 

 

attachicon.gifwide 5.jpg

 

 

These wide five wheels inspired by the early Fords are still used in stock car racing (mostly on dirt)

My 'dirt late model' stock car runs 14 inches wide, but they are available in narrower widths. I have a 6 inch wide one that I have to put on the RF so the car will fit in the trailer.

They are aluminum by the way and quite light. I have a set that are half carbon fiber that are not legal any more. That factory burned down several years ago. They had a $100 guarantee. If you ever broke or bent one they would send you the parts to fix it for a hundred bucks. I kind of liked the vulnerability of the carbon fiber wheel as it would break before doing damage to the other components like steering or spindles. The carbon fiber wheels are a two piece wheel that is aluminum on the inside and carbon fiber on the outside.

If anybody want to see pics of these things just post here and I will be happy to take some.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well Frank, the article you posted is from a radial tire dealer. There are and have been rim failures. My car tips the scale at almost 7000 pounds. Radials will add additional loads to the rim. Yes they ride better. If you are talking about post war cars you will probabley be ok. Pre war rims with a radius or rolled edge tend to rust at the rims edge. Add to that a heavy car and additional loads from the flexing of the radial and rim failure can and does occur. That's why you can order new rims for the pre war cars in stock or thicker material. The vintage racing guys all spend the 20 grand making better rims to run on......... Weather or not they are running radials. Risking the damage or loss of control with a rim failure is just not worth the chance. Just one more comment, if you add radial tires why not add a modern transmission, disk brakes, fuel injection,ect? Drive stock. My best, Ed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't doubt that rim failures occur, but in many prewar cars, the rims may have problems due to age and the rust-out that you mention. To attribute the rim failures only to the use of radial tires is a stretch, in my opinion...

 

Frank

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't doubt that rim failures occur, but in many prewar cars, the rims may have problems due to age and the rust-out that you mention. To attribute the rim failures only to the use of radial tires is a stretch, in my opinion...

 

Frank

 

I agree with Frank. I have seen rim failures in a 1920 Hup. They were rusted and the tyres were cross ply.

 

I think it comes down to people trying to drive a car designed for 45-50-55 mph at 60-65-70 mph with components not designed for it or not enough of them left to handle the loads. Metal fatigue may also play a part - maybe some makers' rims have lower fatigue life compared to others?

 

So it seems to me the most important thing with fitting new tires is to make sure the rim is in good condition first, for any type of tyre. If you are "hoping for the best" with rusty rims, good luck!

Edited by Spinneyhill (see edit history)
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...