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A. K. Miller Stutz hoard

Guest Silverghost

By Guest Silverghost
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K8096 10,000+ Points

K8096

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The disassembled autogyro was on the 2nd story of that barn - it was gone before the auction though. The Franklin sticking it's nose out was a sedan in pretty rough shape. The grey Stutz is a 1931 SV 16 5 passanger sedan. Kind of homely looking with the wooden artillary wheels. The glass window shades on the tops of the doros are the only ones like it I've ever seen on a Stutz. The grey sedan is now owned by a collector in the NYC area.

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Seldenguy 2,500+ Points

Seldenguy

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Who was Imogene, wife, sister as inferred in a earlier post or just an eccentric companion? I seem to recall the '24 Stanley is now in the Northeast Classic Car Museum in Norwich NY. I was unable to attend "one of the greatest show's on earth", but that's my misfortune. Sounds like all attendees have fond memories.---Bob

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alsancle 25,000+ Points

alsancle

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Considering it was 1996 there were absolutely no bargains - maybe the Bearcats. There is something about unavailable/untouched cars at no reserve that puts everyone in a frenzy to spend money.

This was a similar sort of deal and I couldn't believe the prices the cars went for. They may have given the planes away I guess but I don't know much about them. I had delusions of the Horch.

http://www.rmauctions.com/auctionresults.cfm?SaleCode=JS06

Edited by alsancle (see edit history)
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Guest Silverghost

Guest Silverghost

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The former A K Miller Rolls~Royce Silver Ghost Picadilly Roadster was bought at this A K Miller auction by noted collector John W Rich of Pa.

Mr. Rich also owns the Rolls Royce P III with the unusual radical stylish Lobourdette body that was displayed at Hershey 2010 .

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Guest KTS

Guest KTS

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Brad's last post brings up an interesting question in my mind - has anyone tracked or compiled the current whereabouts or owners of the Miller collection? Would make an interesting study. I can add that I am buying lot 28 (1922[sic] 6/7 passenger tourer [its actually a 1921]) from the person who bought the car at the auction, and who restored it. The original monobloc engine was replaced wih a DH unit by the restorer. It needs a litle work (2 broken tappet guides), but I am hopefull of getting it back on the road for 2011.

If no one is keeping track of these as a group, I'd volunteer to start doing so, so if you have one of the Miller cars, send me the information! Thanks. Koke Twigg-Smith (ktsats@aol.com)

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Guest KTS

Guest KTS

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Thanks Brad - not sure if its a WISE offer, but I will pursue this listing. Info in this forum gives a very usefull start. By the way, I was the underbidder on that STuTZ in the shed on the back cover, think it was listed as a 1921 bearcat. I had at the time 1921s of Mercer, Bentley and RRSG, wanted the final piece for the ultimate comparison test! Unfortunatelt the guy who bought it (not Leno, but a trucking company exec, if I recall) had several, and wanted this one for its top as a pattern. Paid pretty dearly for the top. It was a great auction, can't believe its over ten years ago! Well, better get started on compiling the data I have. ANYBODY ELSE GOT ANY INFO ON WHO OWNS WHAT OTHER THAN WHATS IN RECENT FORUMS? THANKS! ktsats@aol.com

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Guest Silverghost

Guest Silverghost

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Funny you should mention that you were the underbidder on the Stutz~

Dad & I were the underbidder on old A K Miller's Springfield Rolls~Royce Silver Ghost Picadilly Roadster !

I only found-out by accident a few days ago that John W. Rich also of Penna. was the winning bidder !

I have never been to his great museum !

On his great museum website you can see the R~R Roadster restored today ! His website text there also describes old A K Miller and his property & "Hoard " !

Google search: John W. Rich Auto Museum Pa.

Platinum Classics still had one of old A K Miller's unrestored Stutz DV Coupe's displayed at their Hershey booth just a few years ago !

Edited by Silverghost (see edit history)
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ksparks 2,500+ Points

ksparks

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Who was Imogene, wife, sister as inferred in a earlier post or just an eccentric companion? I seem to recall the '24 Stanley is now in the Northeast Classic Car Museum in Norwich NY. I was unable to attend "one of the greatest show's on earth", but that's my misfortune. Sounds like all attendees have fond memories.---Bob

Imogene was a very sweet person. My dad, mom and i would often drive down to their place from st johnsbury during the summer months

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Landman 5,000+ Points

Landman

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CHRISTIES CONDUCTED THE AUCTION, NOT SOTHEBY. I FEEL YOUR CHARACTERIZATION MAY BE OFF THE MARK AS I FEEL THAT HE AND IMOGENE GENUINELY LIKED US. HE HAD NOTHING TO GAIN OTHER THAN FRIENDSHIP AS I HAD NOTHING AT THE TIME. WE SAT AT THEIR KITCHEN TABLE IN THE LEANING FARM HOUSE WHICH HAD QUITE A FEW GERMAN MUSIC BOXES WHICH I DID NOT SEE AT THE AUCTION. WHEN I TOLD A.K. WE WERE GOING TO A MOTORCYCLE MEET IN NEW JERSEY HE DETAILED A ROUTE WHICH WAS PERFECT IN EVERY WAY THROUGH GORGEOUS COUNTRYSIDE DEVOID OF TRAFFIC , A FEAT I AM SURE NO GPS TODAY COULD REPLICATE. I THINK HE HAD A FONDNESS FOR CANADIANS AS HE SPENT WW2 IN THE RCAF AND TRACKED DOWN A FEW CARS UP HERE. I KNOW OF ONE OTHER CANADIAN THAT ALSO GOT ALONG VERY WELL WITH THE MAN. HE CLAIMED TO HAVE BEEN ON FRIENDLY TERMS WITH CANNONBALL BAKER AS WELL!

I wonder if he got this one? This photo was taken in Ste-Justine , Québec. That is near the Maine border.

post-59904-143139180887_thumb.jpg

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Peter Zobian 1,000+ Points

Peter Zobian

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Imogene was a very sweet person. My dad, mom and i would often drive down to their place from st johnsbury during the summer months

Imogene and Alex were both very nice persons, once you got to know them. I was just a kid when my family met them. My dad was a teacher on Long Island and we had summer farm near Washington, VT. We went to a church supper in East Orange, VT. At the time we owned a 1931 Chevrolet ex-Fire Department Hose Truck, and as we were parking, A.K. and Imogene pulled up in a 1934 Packard 734 Boattail Roadster. A.K. got out and removed the "Sliding Boy" radiator mascot and locked it inside the golf club door. We were amused as we were in a country church parking area and didn't think that anyone would even think about stealing it. As we were getting ready to go inside, A.K. noticed our big nickel plated spot/search light mounted on the open dash of our Fire Truck and asked my dad how much he wanted for it. My dad said it wasn't for sale and A.K. asked him his name. My dad said "Jim Zobian" and A.K. said "do you have a brother called 'Easy'? My dad's brother was named Ernest and because his initials were E.Z., he was called "Easy". It turns out that A.K. Miller was from Montclair, NJ, and played football with my dad's brother (my uncle) at Montclair High! That started a long friendship between my family and the Millers, and it probably greatly influenced my future as a car collector. In fact, I think for several years I was the only kid allowed inside A.K.'s barns to look at his collection. Years later I was in College in upstate NY and remembered a Stutz Monte Carlo sedan that A.K. had stored in a neighbor's barn. I wrote him a letter asking if he still had it and would he consider selling it to me. He responded with a very nice letter and said, yes but he thought it might need too much work. I never did buy it.

I remember that the Miller's had a small business selling Real Ice Cream with a small sign on the dirt road in front of their home. That was their only visible means of support, but they always had money. One day they both showed up at our farm (we were 3 miles from our nearest neighbor on a one lane dirt road -- no electricity and no phone) in a open Rolls-Royce touring car -- either a Silver Ghost or a Phantom I. They were on their way to Texas to bring back another Stutz. My day asked them how were they going to do that. Alex pointed to the big rope coiled on the back floor and said they were going to tow it back. Alex said he would drive the Rolls and Imogene would sit in the Stutz to steer and use the brakes when necessary. All the way from Texas to Vermont! And they did.

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Peter Zobian 1,000+ Points

Peter Zobian

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One day, my mom and one of her friends were visiting Imogene in her parlor. With a twinkle in her eye she asked my mom and her friend (who was a buff tennis player and swimmer) to see if they could pick up a trunk that was on the floor in the corner. They could, but only barely. Imogene laughed and opened the trunk. It was filled to the brim with silver dollars, and it was a big trunk!

A.K. did not like paper money, he preferred silver or gold

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ksparks 2,500+ Points

ksparks

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One day, my mom and one of her friends were visiting Imogene in her parlor. With a twinkle in her eye she asked my mom and her friend (who was a buff tennis player and swimmer) to see if they could pick up a trunk that was on the floor in the corner. They could, but only barely. Imogene laughed and opened the trunk. It was filled to the brim with silver dollars, and it was a big trunk!

A.K. did not like paper money, he preferred silver or gold

she was a very sweet lady.

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alsancle 25,000+ Points

alsancle

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My copy came in yesterday. Have not read the whole book but well worth the money for any Stutz guy or any prewar car guy in general.

In this book preview :: The Stutz Stash of A.K. Miller by Nicholas Whitman: History | Blurb Books

...did anyone catch that some of the calendars hanging in AK's car sheds have the name 'B J Pollard' at the bottom??? They're on pages 97 & 98 and dated '49 & '51 (IIRC).

If that's a pure coincidence, that's pretty amazing.

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Peter Zobian 1,000+ Points

Peter Zobian

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always hard to defend ones reputation when one has been gone since 93. as a young kid and teenager they always treated my father, mother and myself like gold in the late 60s early to mid 70s. we enjoyed lunch with them many times and helped out in the sheds while my mother visited. i last saw imogene in 95 during the summer. my father was offered a custom blackhawk body once if i remember but he never pushed nor felt his right to ask about purchasing cars unless mr. miller brought it up. i guess if we all had such a great collection which took years to accumulate we might not be in a hurry to depart with it.[ATTACH=CONFIG]200833[/ATTACH]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]200834[/ATTACH]

I guess some people thought A.K. was a curmudgeon, but he really wasn't. He was a gifted pilot, mechanic, engineer, and restorer. I think the people who wanted something A.K. had didn't like it when he said "no". But that was his choice, after all he was the one who thought ahead and collected when few others were. I graduated from high school in 1956 and went away to college; my dad retired in 1965 and my parents sold the farm, so we sort of fell out of contact with the Millers. My dad passed away in 1996 at age 86 and my mom passed away in 2000 at age 90, but we always remembered our time in Vermont and Alex and Imogene Miller. I have been collecting cars for almost 60 years, and A.K. Miller had a lot to do with it.
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ksparks 2,500+ Points

ksparks

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I guess some people thought A.K. was a curmudgeon, but he really wasn't. He was a gifted pilot, mechanic, engineer, and restorer. I think the people who wanted something A.K. had didn't like it when he said "no". But that was his choice, after all he was the one who thought ahead and collected when few others were. I graduated from high school in 1956 and went away to college; my dad retired in 1965 and my parents sold the farm, so we sort of fell out of contact with the Millers. My dad passed away in 1996 at age 86 and my mom passed away in 2000 at age 90, but we always remembered our time in Vermont and Alex and Imogene Miller. I have been collecting cars for almost 60 years, and A.K. Miller had a lot to do with it.

Thanks, i also miss those vermont days spring, summer and fall. not winter as much. chasing antique car leads through out the state and new hampshire etc etc. The highlights will always remain those visits to the Millers. Whether his type writer collection, box of old political buttons, a lincoln letter and his cars,parts etc etc, will always remain the experience of a life time. I always remember a Minerva though in the large barn past the house. Never sure what might have happened to that one. i drove up and visited his homestead in 2008 or 7 while visiting Chelsea. The neighbors or a new owner was going to tear down that barn. We walked inside and it was not very stable. There were still auction lot numbers etc scattered on the floor, walls.

Edited by kmstrade (see edit history)
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Guest KTS

Guest KTS

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Haven't checked this thread in awhile, but note the five pictures posted by kmstrade. The one in the center on the left is not the car in the pictures caption, but rather is lot 28, listed as a 1922, but actually a 1921 6-7 passenger tourer, which now sits in my garage fully restored. The car is seeing being loaded up fr it's ride to Woodstock, Vt after the auction.

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Guest KTS

Guest KTS

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Just enlarged that photo I refer to in the previous post. Dave Brownell is walking in front of the white truck in the background. I think Jerry Literri is at the wheel of the Stutz. They were hired by Christie's to appraise and help organize the auction. Jerry recently gave me a DVD of the auction he made. Many of you will recall Dave as the long time editor of Hemmings. He and Jerry run an automobilia auction nice or twice a year, or at least did before Dave had a severe stroke, I believe. Anyone know if he is still with us?

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Peter Zobian 1,000+ Points

Peter Zobian

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post-135682-0-13515500-1432151687_thumb.To: silverghost,

 

Brad, I'm a member of the RROC and I don't see the 1926 Springfield Rolls Picadilly Roadster from the A.K. Miller collection currently listed. I own S460MR, a 1930 Springfield Phantom 1 Brewster Regent Convertible Coupe. I've always lusted after a Picadilly and almost bought one at an auction in about 1994. That one came out of a museum in Texas and was quite original and nice. If I remember it sold for about $70,000. Oh well... 

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Ivan Saxton 5,000+ Points

Ivan Saxton

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I always remember a Minerva though in the large barn past the house. Never sure what might have happened to that one.

One possible person who may be worth asking is Ernie Toth jnr of Cleveland. His late father, Ernie senior was one of natures gentlemen; who had a high regard for Mr Miller, and enjoyed his trust in return. From the early 1960s, we were a group of owners of Stutz cars in Melbourne; and produced a semi-regular newsletter which carried whatever historical information we could gather. Melbourne had a very active Stutz agent in the 1920s, and we had reason to believe that around 200 of the eight cylinder cars may have been imported and sold by them. We had correspondance with AK. It seems that his prices for parts were not unreasonable, and helped people get their cars back on the road in reliable working order. I can remember one letter requesting possible help to get a Minerva oil pressure gauge. These had a peculiar look on their face. When the engine was running, the oil pressure would slightly turn a disc which had a series of red and white painted segments behind a fixed mask with similar segmental holes cut, so that the red segments would vanish. Well I happened to find a nice Minerva oil gauge. In those days people generally gave us things like that; and we would give them to whoever needed just that. The reward was satisfaction in helping someone else. I wrote that I had one for him. But I was at university, and I did not have money for parcel post. A little later, one of my friends organised himself to visit USA; and he was quite happy to visit AK and hand over the goodwill. Unfortunately his notes must have been faulty; an I gather the Minerva oil pressure gauge was insistently donated to some person who did not have a Minerva nor have a clue what one was. There was not a thing I could do about the mix-up.

Curiously, the Rolls Royce agent in Melbourne also handled Minerva, and that is how they sold a lot of Minervas. When the gentry from the land drove their Rolls Royce to Melbourne for servicing, They would be given free use of a Minerva in town. Many would buy a Minerva as a second car, because they were considered nicer to drive than the Rolls

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