ex98thdrill Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If that judge had not looked at the car, I suspect that I would not have received the Senior Grand National</div></div> Maybe not Matt. The Model 'A' class can be a tough class. You've already scored a minimum of 385 points and you've been 5 points within the best car in your class. Now when you go for a Senior Grand National, all you have to do is score a 390.The beauty of the AACA awards is that once you get your First Grand National, the issue of competition is over..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCHinson Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 Incorrect finish on bolts could theoretically add up pretty fast at a point each with a maximum of 10.With a car that was restored 19 years earlier, I did not want to give up any unnecessary points. I know of a couple of potential lost points that I can't reasonably fix. 10 points could add up pretty fast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest windjamer Posted April 20, 2009 Share Posted April 20, 2009 Matt how do you keep the bolts from getting small surface rust?I pull my exhaust manafold bolts once a year and replace with new. Repos. from Year One are $20. a set,if I wire brush the heck out of them then they have the wrong finish. Im thinking of putting in stanless all year and swaping for Nat. shows and putting the stanless back after the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCHinson Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 It is easier on a Model A Ford than it is on later cars. The primary bolt finishes are, Cadmium, Black Paint, Dull Black Paint, Unfinished, Raven Finish (similar to gun blue) and Ford Engine Green.I wire brush the ones that are supposed to be unfinished. Touch up the paint as needed on the ones that are painted, and have replaced a few that have significant issues with other finishes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhigdog Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Matt how do you keep the bolts from getting small surface rust</div></div> Are you guys saying that points are deducted for surface rust on exhaust manifold bolts?......Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCHinson Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 No, I just answered the question about how I try to keep all of the bolts on my Model A looking like they did originally when delivered from the factory. It is a pretty constant battle to keep it in shape for the next Grand National, while also using the car for Touring.After competing for a Repeat Senior Grand National, I will probably become much less obsessive about it, and just drive the car and enjoy it more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R W Burgess Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 Model A in question on the show field. Let it be known that Matt is already driving his car on AACA Tours, as I followed him around last year on the Sentimental Tour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest windjamer Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 Rules say no deduction for painted exhaust or slight surface rust. I just dont like it on my cars. 20 bucks a year wont brake the bank,but Im getting old lazy and tired of changeing exhaust bolts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldsmoREO Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 I learned a while ago not to worry about winning, just drive the car and enjoy it. That is what it was built for.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bhigdog Posted April 21, 2009 Share Posted April 21, 2009 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Rules say no deduction for painted exhaust or slight surface rust </div></div> That's a relief. Now I won't have to start another rant......Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Siegfried Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 I live near Hershy and have judged all the Hershey meets for the past 14 years. I'd be honored to look your car over. Just respond to this and I'll get back to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imported_Bob Hill Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Semi-Intelligent</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I live near Hershy and have judged all the Hershey meets for the past 14 years. I'd be honored to look your car over. Just respond to this and I'll get back to you. </div></div>I think you may be responding to the OP's (65newyorker)original post but he has been banned after his rants and attacks on folks here. I for one do NOT miss him in the least. He attacked everyone who tried to help him because they wouldn't agree with him about his car. BOB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 "No deduction for slight surface rust" refers to unpainted exhaust systems ONLY, not misc chassis nuts and bolts. Just a clarification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest windjamer Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 Restorer, now you have me thinking. I would consider exhaust manifolds and bolts that hold them to the head as part of the whole.I dont think I would deduct for SLIGHT rust. Looks like that will be my next CJE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Restorer32 Posted April 28, 2009 Share Posted April 28, 2009 I wouldn't deduct for slight surface rust on manifold or exhaust system bolts. I would deduct for surface rust on other chassis bolts except on very early cars where fasteners were not finished in any way. It's a judgement call for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Siegfried Posted April 30, 2009 Share Posted April 30, 2009 Thanks for the information. The LAST thing I need is to offer to help someone out who would probably just rip me a new one for my efforts. Seems to happen to often anymore..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbirdman Posted May 2, 2009 Share Posted May 2, 2009 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: MCHinson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Incorrect finish on bolts could theoretically add up pretty fast at a point each with a maximum of 10.With a car that was restored 19 years earlier, I did not want to give up any unnecessary points. I know of a couple of potential lost points that I can't reasonably fix. 10 points could add up pretty fast. </div></div> Here's a supposely AACA senior up for aution this month and I count 40 bolts holding the water jacket that should be painted and are polished instead. I guess 10 points per bolt were not deducted in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shop Rat Posted May 2, 2009 Share Posted May 2, 2009 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tbirdman</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I guess 10 points per bolt were not deducted in this case. </div></div>It would not be safe to assume that. If that car was the highest scoring vehicle in the class, even with ten points deducted from the score for incorrect finish on bolts, and it scored 375 or better it could get a Senior Award. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
novaman Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Here's a supposely AACA senior up for aution this month and I count 40 bolts holding the water jacket that should be painted and are polished instead. I guess 10 points per bolt were not deducted in this case. </div></div>Matt's post was : <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Incorrect finish on bolts could theoretically add up pretty fast at a point each with a maximum of 10.With a car that was restored 19 years earlier, I did not want to give up any unnecessary points. I know of a couple of potential lost points that I can't reasonably fix. 10 points could add up pretty fast. </div></div>So on "your" supposeley AACA Senior car it isn't 10 point per bolt, it's 1 point each up to 10, the other 30 are "freebies". Max deduction 10 points. If the car was otherwise perfect it still would have gotten a 390 and it's Jr & Sr awards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbirdman Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 OK, so if the same bolt is used in a another place, and the max was already reached on another area such as the water jacket cover, does it get no deduction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shop Rat Posted May 3, 2009 Share Posted May 3, 2009 There are four general areas to each vehicle that is judged. Chassis, engine, interior and exterior. Each area has it's own list of items plus an area where "other" items not listed can be deducted for.Look on page 54 of the on-line Judges Guidelines book for the judging form. There are items that have a mandatory deduction and we must take that amount (Halogen headlights are 10 points no matter if there is one or up to four for example). There are areas, like the bolts, that there is a maximum that we can't take more than that per area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbirdman Posted May 4, 2009 Share Posted May 4, 2009 Thanks for the explanation and I looked at page 54. I had never been judged at a AACA meet. I understand the maximum point deducted per area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shop Rat Posted May 4, 2009 Share Posted May 4, 2009 You are very welcome tbirdman.If you get the chance go to a judges training class and get a free copy of that manual. They are usually held the day before a show. The class does not cost anything to attend.Everyone is welcome whether you decide to judge or not. But you learn how and why we do what we do. The day of the show you can also attend a CJE class of your choice to learn more about the areas judged and other aspects of judging. Just be sure to hand in the card they give you at the end of each class. That way you will get credit for attending incase you do decide to give judging a whirl. You will meet many great people along the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C4GY Posted May 28, 2009 Share Posted May 28, 2009 I was fortune to have worked in Chrysler, Dodge and Plymouth dealerships in the late '60s -early '70s so I know exactly what new cars looked straight from the factory. I set the new cars up for the first owners and few cars on the show fields meet the standard I saw. Most way up ,some way done, few in the middle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1953Fords Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 I wouldn't feel too bad about 2 years. I have been trying for 1st Junior for 12 years. I bought this original 1953 Ford Mainline in 1997. I drove it for a while on tours but decided to go for show. I have been doing something to it every year for the past 12 years. I still drive it to shows. I was at Gettysburg this year and got 2nd Junior again. I now have (1) 3rd Junior, and (4) 2nd Juniors. Its a lot of work and satisfying to show the car. Its also a challenge too since there are those that have lots of money to invest in a restoration and you are against the best. I think you should think it as a challenge to yourself and enjoy the hobby. I love working on the cars ( I do all my own work except upholstery). I also have a 1953 Victoria and a 1953 Ford Sunliner I have been working on since 2000. It takes time but enjoy the time you work on it. Its a great hobby for rich and poor.AACA Life Member Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R W Burgess Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 '53, I can appreciate your tenacity in reaching for that elusive first junior.May I suggest you send a letter to Joe Vincini, asking about your judging sheet info. Then, you may possibly spend your extra time on the areas of your car that need help. Wayne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shop Rat Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W Burgess</div><div class="ubbcode-body">May I suggest you send a letter to Joe Vincini, asking about your judging sheet info. Then, you may possibly spend your extra time on the areas of your car that need help. Wayne </div></div>Good idea Wayne. Here is the address he needs to do that.Here is the name and address to send a request, <span style="font-weight: bold">along with a S.A.S.E.</span>, for a highlighted copy of the judging sheet. Joe Vicini - V.P. - Class Judging3 Robbins Nest DrivePerrineville, NJ 08535And when he gets the copy he needs to park his car in bright sunlight and compare the sheet to the car. Also, he might only be one point out of making the ten point spread so he needs to correct even small things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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