Matheson automobile

Hi all - hoping you can help.

One of my Dad's lifelong dreams is to see a Matheson car in person. He's currently the owner and operator of Matheson North American Van Lines in Forty-Fort, Pa (by Wilkes-Barre, Pa) which my grandfather purchased from Frank Matheson. Yes, that Frank Matheson! My Pop-Pop used to work for Mr. Matheson, and moved his way through the company, beginning as a teenager sweeping the floors in the assembly plant (now the moving warehouse). The moving company warehouse used to house the Matheson Auto Co. assembly plant. My dad inherited the company from my Pop-Pop, and is a huge fan of the Matheson automobile. He has a number of collectible pieces (ads, etc.) but has never seen one in real life.

I would love to make my Dad's dream of seeing a Matheson automobile in person come true. So, after searching the internet for the location of one, and failing, I'm turning to you, the experts. Father's Day is about a month and a half away, and I'm really hopeful that my sister and I can make this year's one to remember by finding one of these automobiles and taking my Dad to see it in person. Please help my sister and me make this the best Father's Day ever for one of the best guys there is!

Thanks so much in advance for your help.

- Westyn

There's a Matheson, about 10 miles from me, at The Nethercutt collection, in SoCal. Just a hop, skip and a jump from PA

There was a Matheson on display at Hershey a few years ago. Go on the 2015 Glidden tour and you can see one in a private collection on the tour.

Thanks so much for the lead - I just emailed the chairman of the Glidden Tour to see if he could help. The southern California jaunt sounds like a really nice adventure, but I'm hoping to find something a little closer to home. For now!

I'll keep you all posted and am hoping to be able to someday post a picture of my dad in front of the Matheson automobile. Thanks again!

These guys never cease to amaze me ! If it is about cars, they always have the answer ! Wayne

I know where the factory race car is in a private collection in Oaklahoma. It's in one of the best and largest private collections in the world. I am sure they would let you see the car. If that location is where you want to see it, PM me and I will get you the address. If memore serves me correctly, it was the world record speed holder for 1905 from Ormand Beach. My best, Ed

Westyn, the Matheson referred to above now in the Nethercutt collection was first restored by Bob Laurens of Wayne, PA. who did a huge amount of research on the company and the Matheson brothers, Frank and Charles. I acquired Bob's material many years ago and there are letters and pictures of Matheson employees, perhaps your grandfather is one of them.

to the best of my knowledge, the Nethercutt Silent Six is among the few survivors. there is the made up car in OK and another is being made up from an engine that was on display at the Ford museum, I believe. Send me a PM if I can be of further assistance.

As mentioned, there was a Matheson shown at Hershey a few years ago (10 years ago). I thought I had a photo of it, but I can't find it. I suspect the car was owned by someone in the east. I'm pretty sure it wasn't the Nethercutt car, or the one in Oklahoma.

The car shown at Hershey in 2004 was owned by Ted Davis of Oklahoma. It was a touring car if I remember correctly.

According to correspondence and a picture from Bob Laurens' files, this Oklahoma car was reconstructed from the remains of a chassis found in the desert. The Matheson big fours were magnificent high end cars that did well in competitive events such as Giants Despair and road races.

I finally found the photo I took in 2004 at Hershey.

Close to me is a Matheson four engine being restored, if you follow Unimog's posts you've seen some of it....huge engine with intricate engineering, quite a beast.....and the rest of the car, soon headed to an East coast restoration facility, has to be equally magnificent....

West's photo of the Matheson would make a good

Father's Day card for a Matheson enthusiast!

I'll bet he'd let you use it if you ask him.

I finally found the photo I took in 2004 at Hershey.

A great photograph of a classy looking car. Wayne

There are numerous Matheson photos from the Bob Laurens collection on David Greenlees www.theoldmotor.com.

At the 1982 Henry Ford Museum Auction, there was a complete and restored 1908 50HP Matheson chassis as well as an additional, complete 1911 50HP engine. My memory is a bit fuzzy now, so I am not sure which units were used to create which currently existing cars. Here are photos taken from the auction catalog.

Boy oh boy, this auction was full of great treasures like the 1922 Joswin Town car powered by a Mercedes Flugmotor, 1911 DeDion V-8 roadster, the earliest known Isotta (1902), one of the first Leland Lincolns, 1905 Swiss Martini touring car, a 1958 BMW 507 with 19,000 miles, multiple significant Fords including "specials" such as Edsel's 6-cylinder Model T speedster and the 1955 T-Bird #2. There were also lots of huge and rare engines, fire trucks, carriages, scale and operating models of all types, antiques galore, etc, etc. etc and lots of rare et ceteras.

There's still some incredulity (wow, a fifty-cent word! May or may not be grammatically correct) in the collecting and curator worlds that the Henry Ford let some of that stuff go to the public....had to be a poor committee decision....there's a saying about committees (and meetings) that the cumulative apparent IQ of the group is reduced for each additional member, regardless of individual IQ's......

How about that 1957 Ferrari Testa Rossa that The Ford got rid of a few years ago? One recently sold for $40 million.

I suppose there are two ways of looking at museum "de-accessions" which is the fancy, academic word for "selling stuff". On one hand, it is unfortunate that museums sell things. All museums-automotive or otherwise- have had to do this. In the past couple of decades, great (and not so great) cars have been sold off from The Henry Ford, Payne/Seal Cove, Crawford, Swigart, Museum of Science and Industry, AACA, and several others.

On the other hand, now these cars are in the hands of private collectors that are likely to be in a better position to give them proper care and use. These vehicles are now likely to have more exposure to the public than if they were sitting in a lonely museum or a museum's warehouse. Think about all the great cars in museums that have not and will not ever be operated again, taken to a car show or driven on a tour. A perfect example is the Matheson engine and chassis mentioned above that have now been made into complete cars. Had they been retained by The Henry Ford, they would just be gathering dust with thousands of other neglected artifacts.

Good point, Mr. Icons. For the earlier cars, though (say 1920's

and prior), I think many "collectors" tend to keep their cars stationary,

and as a result, fewer people will be able to see them.

They become beautiful, inoperative paperweights.

I agree that it's good to have cars out in the public, but I was looking at it from the museum standpoint. Why would the Henry Ford museum sell a 6 cylinder Model T, for example, that should be one of their main displays!

I agree on the dust. I really like the AACA, and the museum, but it was painful to hear that Henry Becker's Pierce Arrow 66 had been donated to that museum. That car was driven to every Pierce meet for 50 years by Henry and his wife, no matter where the meet was....driven to, not trailered...he said he'd get it on the road at about 45 to 50 mph and just go for 8 or so hours, if meet was across country then they'd take a week to drive there and a week to drive back. Now, the car probably won't get 100 miles a year, if any. So, great it's in the museum, a shame it's not on the road.

The Swigart sell-off was another whole sad story of a family torn apart by money. That wasn't a committee decision, it was a legal one.

Good point, Mr. Icons. For the earlier cars, though (say 1920's

and prior), I think many "collectors" tend to keep their cars stationary,

and as a result, fewer people will be able to see them.

They become beautiful, inoperative paperweights.

Not necessarily true. While you don't typically see early cars at local cruise nights and local car shows, there are events such as the Horseless Carriage Club (HCCA) National Tours where you will see lots of these pre-1916 cars being aggressively driven for days. The upcoming New England Gas and Brass Tour will typically have around 80-100 pre-1916 brass cars being driven-not displayed-on some of New England's most challenging roads with daily runs averaging 100 miles in length. The AACA's Reliability Tours have no problem getting participants who are looking to exercise their 100 year old pieces of iron either. I have toured with brass era cars for since I was 18 and it never ceases to amaze me the amount of brass cars being toured throughout the US and other parts of the world. Same with the later Full Classics that are driven on long distance CCCA Caravans. The older cars are certainly out there getting driven and enjoyed-you just have to look for them!

As MI states, there's a very active community of early and brass car collectors. The HCCA promotes touring first, and shows, not so much. Since brass cars don't show up at local events very often these days (I can tell you from experience that at small local shows, brass cars get a lot of yawn who cares), a lot of people assume that part of the hobby is dead.

It's much like people who listen to their I-Pod or phone for music think that vinyl records are dead ( if they've even seen one), yet there's a large group of people who collect and listen to LP's and 45's, feeling the sound is richer and fuller.

Brass cars are alive and well....as mentioned, you just have to look for them...

Somewhat off topic, but David, you really should venture forth and head north for the NE B&G tour (assuming you have not already been on them) - with or without one of your brass cars . I have not been on one for many years but they are great tours with wonderful people who car less about shows but who love to tour.

A very good point gentlemen. My only real interests are in brass and pre-1930 big cars. I generally go to 1 show a year and that only because there are a couple of older collectors who I hope to see. At last year's show there were maybe 500 cars on the field and of those, only 2 I'd have driven 40 minutes to look at. I'd go so far as to say that the loud "pop" music, hotrods and a field overrun with late post-war cars have pretty much driven me out of the hobby, at least on the local level. I know I'm not the only one to feel that way. When my car is back on the road I will be driving it, but not to local shows.

I find it amusing that anyone would think brass is dead. I wouldn't have a car at all were it not for a small inheritance, the economic recession and the fact that the car I bought is a bodyless, dismantled wreck. It looks to me that its the only area of car collecting that has never had a downturn in price and I'm one that wishes it had. Even pedestrian, mid-size brass cars often reach 6 figures. Big cars, 50HP and up are all in that range and total basket cases, missing unobtainable, parts are often in the middle 5 figures.

I don't think that anyone would say brass cars are dead.

People noted the pre-1916 events, and the Classic events,

which many devoted collectors follow.

But the in-between years, whose cars used to be the staples of

shows in the 1960's--are seldom seen on the road these days.

The 1925 Haynes, the 1922 Dagmar, the 1917 Pilot MAY get out

once a year to one of our great Pennsylvania shows, but

more than likely they are sitting forlornly in the back corners of an

older collector's garage, or are parked in museums. Our members

have many more early cars than we typically see.

It would be nice to see more of them.

Certainly, some brass-era cars bring megabucks. But there are plenty for sale in 5 figures. Here are some from today's Cars For Sale page on the HCCA website - some have already been sold.

'13 International high wheeler $20,000

'05 Cadillac single-cylinder touring, old restoration, $55,000

'13 Chalmers original, unrestored, running, $32,500

'14 Ford roadster $21,500'12 REO, old restoration, $25,000

'03 Curved Dash Oldsmobile $70,000

'07 Buick G 2-cylinder roadster, National first 2013, $67,000

'06 Buick G roadster, $49,000

'07 Cartercar 2-cylinder touring $44,000

'12 Maxwell 36-hp touring, $59,000

These are, of course, asking prices. Selling prices may be lower. While these amounts of money aren't chump change, these appear to be presentable, running cars for a lot less than six figures. And they're typical of what you'll see on HCCA tours.

Hi everyone - a happy update! I'm currently in Oklahoma with my dad and my little sister. We're joining the Glidden Tour to take my dad to see Mr. Boulden's Matheson tomorrow. He is more excited about this than maybe anything ever. Thank you all so, so much for your input and advice. I'll post a picture of my dad with the Matheson tomorrow!

Visiting Don Boulton's garage yesterday to celebrate his 90th birthday, and seeing the Matheson was a great experience (we had visited there a couple of times before).

I've attached photos of the 1908 Matheson as well as a shot of myself congratulating Mr. Boulton on his 90th birthday, as well as thanking him for making his collection available to us as a part of the 2015 GLIDDEN TOUR in Oklahoma City. I have many shots of his other Brass beauties, and will post some at other times... 

love the Pierce-Arrow 4-cylinder motorcycle).

Marty, I am so glad to see a photo of a beautiful Matheson automobile. They were made just a few miles from here in Forty Fort, PA, near Wilkes-Barre.

The plant is still standing and is still called the Matheson building.

Is the Matheson car in Marty Roth's posting (#29)

the same car as in West Peterson's photo (post #11)?

They look the same to me, though the later photo

shows a car dulled a bit from storage.

The 1908 Matheson that was in the Henry Ford Museum is currently being restored