Which oil do you recommend?

I'll preface this by stating that I know there are probably dozens of threads on oil. Oddly enough, when I search "oil" it tells me there are no matches. So, if there's an existing thread you recommend or a good article on the topic, please post a link.

That said, I'm wondering what oil people are using on their Prewar Buicks. The engine in my '30 is a recent rebuild and has about 500 miles on it. Also, I have the oil canister from Bob's that will hold a newer filter.

I appreciate any insight you have.

Others will have better insight than I have, but I have learned that you have to use at least two words to search, e.g. "motor oil."

http://forums.aaca.org/f165/motor-oil-291584.html

Thanks. I did search "oil recommendation" with no luck. The link you posted is the sort of thing I hoping to find..

Others will have better insight than I have, but I have learned that you have to use at least two words to search, e.g. "motor oil."

http://forums.aaca.org/f165/motor-oil-291584.html

64C,

Asking about oil is like discussing religion.

That said, I use Shell Rotella 15/40 in my untouched engine, with a can of "Restore" from Walmart, just because it makes me feel better.

Mike in Colorado

Since you have a fresh rebuild, you can use modern oils, and after the break in period you can use synthetic oil if you'd like.

My engine has not been rebuilt so I use straight 30 weight Pennzoil.

64C,

Asking about oil is like discussing religion.

That said, I use Shell Rotella 15/40 in my untouched engine, with a can of "Restore" from Walmart, just because it makes me feel better.

Mike in Colorado

I also use Shell Rotella for my teens vehicles.

Agree with my fellow Coloradoan, Rotella 15/40 that I get at Sam's Club. 1933 90 engine-

I also like Shell Rotella 15W-40 from Sam's Club, and buy it by the case of 6 gallons. It works for my diesel tow vehicle as well as for my cars

What about sae 30 non detergent from Napa . Im using that on my 37.

Since you asked about non detergent I will chime in. I also use non detergent in mine as it is my belief cars that do not have a full flow oil filter are better off with non detergent oil. Non detergent is designed to drop contaminants in the bottom of the pan. Detergent oil picks up and carries the contaminants through the engine continually in my opinion causing more wear. Admittedly I am in the minority.

Carl

Since you asked about non detergent I will chime in. I also use non detergent in mine as it is my belief cars that do not have a full flow oil filter are better off with non detergent oil. Non detergent is designed to drop contaminants in the bottom of the pan. Detergent oil picks up and carries the contaminants through the engine continually in my opinion causing more wear. Admittedly I am in the minority.

Carl

That seems to me to be sound reasoning BUT, a better choice would be to add a filter, even a by-pass filter as second choice, and benefit from the rest of the additive package besides detergents for optimal protection. Just my opinion.

TexasJohn,

Admittedly an oil filter would be good on my cars but as the engines have never been rebuilt I still would run non detergent as I don't want to dislodge all the crud hidden throughout the engines.

Carl

My 1941 buick 248 straight eight motor is apart now ,but for the past 14 years I ran straight 30 weight detergent , changed oil once a month while hot for the first summer of driving . Years later found "Brad Penn" has all the ZDDP additive in it - so used it as straight 30 weight .This being said I added another mechanical oil pressure guage to my 1941 Buick special because oil pressure would drop down to minimal when hot idling , 14 years later and maybe 6,000 miles . This is a picture of my babbit rod bearing . I am rebuilding my engine because didn't want to start when hot along with smoking at idle . I will be using a straight 30 weight detergent along with STP additive when rebuilt too.

TexasJohn,

Admittedly an oil filter would be good on my cars but as the engines have never been rebuilt I still would run non detergent as I don't want to dislodge all the crud hidden throughout the engines.

Carl

Copy that. Again, sound reasoning.

And by the way , is there any chance of instaling an electric / extra oil pump on these engines . Specially for the front of engine pistons and head . I know it sounds crazy but i would take it just to make sure that long 8 would be always lubed!

I find the numerous Shell comments of interest.

They lost me as a customer (forever, I have a long memory and a grudge) yearsago with their Fire and Ice debacle. I'm certain there is nothing wrong with Rotella. Just a comment.

I am a believer in the API ratings of a name brand product (in spite of Shell) and here's why. When the 3800 engine was developed and validated in the mid 1980s, it was done so, with Mobil 10w30. Not synthetic, just plain old Mobil10w30. I found that of interest so I asked why. Turns out, Mobil had the best price with the required GM spec (API etc) 10w30 and got the contract and delivered it to the engine plant in Flint by the rail car tanker. We got the exact same oil in 55 gallon drums, from the same lots/tanker at random to validate with it in Engineering. Our validation requires we do it with 'factory fill' oil.

If you've ever seen an engine run in a dyno room, with glowing orange manifoldsfor 1200 hrs W.O.T., full rated load cycle (peak torque to peak HP ERPM cycle)then you can begin to understand how hard (and well) the engine oil is working. No additives, no Marvel Mystery Oil, no STP . . . just good old run of the mill Mobil 10w30 in this case.

I also find the rod bearing pic above of interest. There is no scoring or discoloration that would come with lack of oil film and temperature. What I see is sub-surface babbitt fatigue. If it's and old part, the weak babbitt (by today's bearing standards) fatigues in compression. This is often combined with micro etching (eating) of the tin in the babbitt by the acid in used oil sitting in the bearing and under a microscope it looks like worm holes in the babbitt. Sometimes it's so bad you can see it with your eye. Takes a long time like 50 years.

Also, you straight 8 guys need to check those little screens in the head, are they plugged? Do you need them on a clean engine rebuild?

I also find the rod bearing pic above of interest. There is no scoring or discoloration that would come with lack of oil film and temperature. What I see is sub-surface babbitt fatigue. If it's and old part, the weak babbitt (by today's bearing standards) fatigues in compression. This is often combined with micro etching (eating) of the tin in the babbitt by the acid in used oil sitting in the bearing and under a microscope it looks like worm holes in the babbitt. Sometimes it's so bad you can see it with your eye. Takes a long time like 50 years.

I agree with Brian's assessment. Once you get a pit or crater in the bearing material, hydraulics on each firing stroke will continue the rapid destruction of the bearing surface. I would compare it to a pothole in the pavement filled with water, hydraulics quickly enlarge the pothole when a wheel runs thru it. With each firing of the cylinder, the rod and bearing slams down on the crank and high pressure continues the damage. Upper and lower bearings are easily distinguished to the trained and experienced eye, different load conditions leave different wear patterns.

Straight 30 WT out here on the West Coast in my 1932 Buick Series 80-86.

My 1941 buick 248 straight eight motor is apart now ,but for the past 14 years I ran straight 30 weight detergent , changed oil once a month while hot for the first summer of driving . Years later found "Brad Penn" has all the ZDDP additive in it - so used it as straight 30 weight .This being said I added another mechanical oil pressure guage to my 1941 Buick special because oil pressure would drop down to minimal when hot idling , 14 years later and maybe 6,000 miles . This is a picture of my babbit rod bearing . I am rebuilding my engine because didn't want to start when hot along with smoking at idle . I will be using a straight 30 weight detergent along with STP additive when rebuilt too.

Mr. Buickkuhm, Your rod broke up from to much clearance. The condition of the babbitt easily shows this, as being hammered.

So with to much clearance, your engine would smoke at idling from the rods and mains unable to keep the

oil contained, and created more oil in the windage tray, and the rods through the excess oil in the cylinders, where the rings were

bombarded with more oil then the rings could turn back.

This condation is very commonplace.

Thanks,

Herm.

Mr. Buickkuhm, Your rod broke up from to much clearance. The condition of the babbitt easily shows this, as being hammered.

So with to much clearance, your engine would smoke at idling from the rods and mains unable to keep the

oil contained, and created more oil in the windage tray, and the rods through the excess oil in the cylinders, where the rings were

bombarded with more oil then the rings could turn back.

This condation is very commonplace.

Thanks,

Herm.

I knew the day would come that I have to rebuild her , now that it is here , trying to make her better and even more drive able than it was for my family . I am glad the motor knew to have a progressively worst condition to show up compared to hurting more in the engine .Thank you for your knowledge and your babbitting thoughts .

Before my partial engine rebuild this summer I was running Valvoline 20W-50 to keep the pressure up. After the rebuild (rings and reshimming the connecting rods) I put in Pennzoil 10W-40, hoping that with tighter connecting rods the pressure would come up some. But no, it was down again. On the 60 mile run home after the trans and rear work, it was idling at probably 3 to 5 lbs and maybe 15 to 18 lbs at speed. Many say that's fine for these old engines but that's in the white knuckle zone as far as I am concerned.

So after looking into it some, I ended up putting in Penrite Shelsley Medium, which is non-detergent full zinc 25W-70 oil. I also replaced the oil in the filter can with Shelsley Light 20w-60. So far so good, with the engine at full hot after running it today it was idling at abt 10 to 12 lbs and running at 30 lbs at speed. Next summer I hope to get the mains tightened up so with any luck I will be able to go back to 10W-40.

Go Aussie oil!!!

Cheers, Dave

My '41 had really good oil pressure even before the rebuild, the mains did not show much wear on them, still within spec, but I took one shim out on each, which snugged to the close side of the spec's. I use Shell Rotella 10-30, but I can't always find it that grade, usually its' heavier, 15-40, but I don't like to use that, as the engine has lots of oil pressure without it. So my usual formula is to use 4 quarts of 10-30, plus 2 of non detergent 30, which brings my to full. My oil pressure at hot idle is still in the 25+lb range, and 45 when driving with this grade.

Keith

Before my partial engine rebuild this summer I was running Valvoline 20W-50 to keep the pressure up. After the rebuild (rings and reshimming the connecting rods) I put in Pennzoil 10W-40, hoping that with tighter connecting rods the pressure would come up some. But no, it was down again. On the 60 mile run home after the trans and rear work, it was idling at probably 3 to 5 lbs and maybe 15 to 18 lbs at speed. Many say that's fine for these old engines but that's in the white knuckle zone as far as I am concerned.

So after looking into it some, I ended up putting in Penrite Shelsley Medium, which is non-detergent full zinc 25W-70 oil. I also replaced the oil in the filter can with Shelsley Light 20w-60. So far so good, with the engine at full hot after running it today it was idling at abt 10 to 12 lbs and running at 30 lbs at speed. Next summer I hope to get the mains tightened up so with any luck I will be able to go back to 10W-40.

Go Aussie oil!!!

Cheers, Dave

Penrite is great (not just because I'm Victorian where they're based) they seem to cater well for the enthusiast market and is by far the easiest supplier to find stock of things like steam cylinder oil

http://www.penriteoil.com.au/tech_pdfs_new/VVC_Brochure.pdf

Before my partial engine rebuild this summer I was running Valvoline 20W-50 to keep the pressure up. After the rebuild (rings and reshimming the connecting rods) I put in Pennzoil 10W-40, hoping that with tighter connecting rods the pressure would come up some. But no, it was down again. On the 60 mile run home after the trans and rear work, it was idling at probably 3 to 5 lbs and maybe 15 to 18 lbs at speed. Many say that's fine for these old engines but that's in the white knuckle zone as far as I am concerned.

So after looking into it some, I ended up putting in Penrite Shelsley Medium, which is non-detergent full zinc 25W-70 oil. I also replaced the oil in the filter can with Shelsley Light 20w-60. So far so good, with the engine at full hot after running it today it was idling at abt 10 to 12 lbs and running at 30 lbs at speed. Next summer I hope to get the mains tightened up so with any luck I will be able to go back to 10W-40.

Go Aussie oil!!!

Cheers, Dave

Dave,

You should check out my photo album for the picture of my oil pump bottom plate, like we discussed when you were here, I EMORIED IT FLAT and stuck a 3/8" nut behind the pressure relief spring.

In my "untouched" motor, we run Shell Rotella 15-40w and have 60# at a cold idle, 30# at a hot idle and 40# cruzing @ 55mph.

I do use a small bottle of ZDDP with each oil change and a can of "Restore" from Walmart, just to make me feel better.

Mike in Colorado

Mike - how are you? Yeah, I did all that and it's still low, probably the mains are just worn. Currently with the Shelsley I am 45 lbs or better cold, and after a long run (I took it out yesterday) I am just below 30 at 2000 rpm and maybe 12 at idle. Not great but I can live with it until next year.

Cheers, Dave

Do any of you guys use the Hemmings oils? I use the 10/30 blend for my 40 special. The engine has been rebuilt with low mileage.

They claim it is blended for flat tappets and has zinc. I use Amsoil 20/50 in my Model A. It has also been rebuilt with about 7000 miles on it. That's what the former owner used. Wondering how the Rotella compares to these oils? Thanks, Roger