Brake Accumulators Back?

I was checking The Reatta Store and Amazon.com and while browsing through parts I found that there may be some more accumulators in stock at a decent price. Here is what Amazon says. The only downside being that the shipping is within 1-2 months. Hopefully there is more than just a few in stock.

Who knows at this point. That is more info than they gave me when I tried to order from amazon. So, maybe the fact they have an ETA is good news. I got spooked at the possibility that we were at the end of the line and rounded a couple up from other sources just in case. That was almost 4 big ones I didn't care to spend right now but wanted to be certain I was covered if no more were forthcoming.

If they do come in a month or two out, I'd suggest anyone who thinks they will have a Teves equipped Reatta on the road for the foreseeable future should buy one if at all possible. This is a safety critical part and while there is at least one third party replacement apparently available I would be more comfortable with the officially spec'd and approved part on my cars.

KDirk

If you read the comments portion of that site you will see that owners of other car brands use our accumulator, so that increases the demand, which is a good thing. But I wouldn't count on that because most people today when they have a brake issue take their car to a repair shop and the shop orders the factory approved part for that car. So other then the forum followers of that make we will see very little cross over to increase demand.

In other words the price offered is a great price you should order now to increase demand and have the part on hand when you need it [and I assure you one day you will]. If you sell the car and no longer need the accumulator you will surely be able to sell it [even with a profit for you] because in time this will be a highly sought after part.

There is nothing like having back up parts on hand. Just 2 nights ago I heard a noise under the hood. At first I thought it was the power steering pump, but it turned out to be the tension pulley. I had one in parts, surprised even myself.

Don't depend on the current parts sellers to always bail you out. Even the local parts houses don't have a lot of parts for our cars at ready access anymore.

Several accumulators are back-ordered that were ordered through the Reatta Store. I check daily to see if any of them have been shipped. As soon as I see them being shipped again I will post here and let everyone know that they are back in stock.

Several accumulators are back-ordered that were ordered through the Reatta Store. I check daily to see if any of them have been shipped. As soon as I see them being shipped again I will post here and let everyone know that they are back in stock.

Suggest you also include a reminder/request in that announcement for the new recipients of those accumulators to check on the inner box for that label that appears to be a European date code (dd/mm/yyyy). Would love to know if they are a new batch!

The outlook for accumulator shipments is not good. I noticed this morning that Amazon is no longer taking orders for the accumulators on their website. For whatever reason Amazon has chosen to set the accumulator price in the Reatta Store at $300.69 and says the are "Not Available - stock arriving soon". I don't think Amazon has any idea when, or if they will ever, have more of the accumulators in stock.

We have purchased the entire balance of the US stock of the Reatta ABS brake accumulators. We have several in stock.

Please contact us directly for pricing.

Yesterday morning I ordered and received confirmation from Amazon for two accumulators at a price slightly less than $100.00 each. Shipping date on the confirmation is shown as October 9 through November 7th, yep 2014.

Who knows what will happen. I have been down this road before and ended up cancelling my order and in this case Amazon may cancel. Last time I waited quite a while before cancelling and will wait again this time. A pretty close toss up whether the bank or Amazon holds my money!

Kingsley Baker

www.reattaspecialtyparts.com

I am surprised this [accumulators] turned into an issue although I should have seen it coming when the parts suppliers stopped making sensor leads. I always thought the companies would at least make sure we have brakes [with or without ABS].

This is an issue that can be overcome.

Already there is talk on this site of using accumulators that are used on other vehicles. So, other then trim products we as Reatta owners are in a pretty good position. We have a car that utilizes a great many parts from the Riviera [and others], and has a drive train that is extremely common.

There has been much discussion that once the "Daily Drivers" are gone then the Reatta will go up in value. This brake issue will hasten that day coming. Who will spend $500-$1000.00 to convert a car over to a regular brake system and what shop [due to liability concerns] would want to do attempt the conversion? So unless one is a "Do it yourselfer" the car will be junked.

So as Kevin and I discussed just yesterday there will be a short term glut of parts [and parts cars] and then once they are gone, then the Reatta will go up in value and so will any parts that will still be left.

We should consider ourselves very fortunate that there are a number of very smart guys on this forum who are also resourceful.

These are very interesting times.

Well...that's one way of putting icing on a week old cake to make it palatable.

On a related note (and not to get far off subject), Reatta values (as in selling price) have ticked higher over the past 4 months. Let's hope it's not a summer tease only to be defeated by a winter freeze.

I am surprised this [accumulators] turned into an issue although I should have seen it coming when the parts suppliers stopped making sensor leads. I always thought the companies would at least make sure we have brakes [with or without ABS].

This is an issue that can be overcome.

Already there is talk on this site of using accumulators that are used on other vehicles. So, other then trim products we as Reatta owners are in a pretty good position. We have a car that utilizes a great many parts from the Riviera [and others], and has a drive train that is extremely common.

There has been much discussion that once the "Daily Drivers" are gone then the Reatta will go up in value. This brake issue will hasten that day coming. Who will spend $500-$1000.00 to convert a car over to a regular brake system and what shop [due to liability concerns] would want to do attempt the conversion? So unless one is a "Do it yourselfer" the car will be junked.

So as Kevin and I discussed just yesterday there will be a short term glut of parts [and parts cars] and then once they are gone, then the Reatta will go up in value and so will any parts that will still be left.

We should consider ourselves very fortunate that there are a number of very smart guys on this forum who are also resourceful.

These are very interesting times.

Vultures are starting to circle. There is a guy in New York selling one on ebay. $450.00 buy it now price...

We have purchased the entire balance of the US stock of the Reatta ABS brake accumulators. We have several in stock.

Vultures are starting to circle.

John F.

I was looking at some of the hydraulic machines at work. While acquiring original stock accumulators may be hard to find, I'm sure we can make due with parts for small automatic rotary transfer machines if we are resourceful. I for one don't plan to let my Reatta die that easily.

On that note, is there a compatibility cross reference anywhere? The Mitsubishi Montero accumulator looks similar, I guess the kicker is pressure rating and thread fittings?

We have purchased the entire balance of the US stock of the Reatta ABS brake accumulators. We have several in stock.

Please contact us directly for pricing.

That is not correct. I just bought one today to see if I could. The place was Car Dealer Parts. I paid $172.19 plus freight.

Places to try are;

Delano Family Motors in Ca. 661-725-3272 $ unknown

1st Chevy Parts Wa. 800-400-4126 $161.01

Buy OEM Parts N.J. $158.47 Fax 908-561-7415

GM Parts Giant Ca. 888-737-9766

Gm Parts Online N.M. 866-807-4471

None of mine are for sale. Please don't ask.

Update Car Dealer Parts called me back and said they didn't have the part after all. I did get one from Delano family Motors in Ca. I paid $175.00 plus freight. He told me it was in inventory for 10 years and was glad to be rid of it.

Deleted my opinion to avoid controversy.

I agree that no one should make a claim they have bought all of something. However I also don't think anyone should berate Marck for buying what he could find and then charging more. I found a number of them at GM dealers and they would not budge off of $256.08 [plus freight], so if that is what he paid, he should be at a minimum of $350.00. Coupled with the fact that if someone makes more parts at a lower price he either sits on what he has or drops his price and takes a loss.

Remember he, like anyone else that stocks and sells parts on the forum has to have profit to stay in business. Otherwise why should he do this?

Deleted my post. I'll keep my thoughts about that matter to myself.

When Amazon has the accumulators in stock and customers buy through the Reatta Store I make 4-6 percent per accumulator at no additional cost to the customer. Evan at that people give me a hard time for recommending the Reatta Store here on the forum. A lot of people take pride in recommending RockAuto or a direct purchase from Amazon over the Reatta store. People seem to resent me making a dollar to help support my website. It seems to be perfectly acceptable for a vendor to push the same accumulator on here and jack the price up ~30% - ~ 100 bucks. I guess I should be a Reatta vendor instead of a Reatta webmaster. Good luck with your sales guys.

Now here I stand defending Marck which is not my intent. This is Marck's only income stream. He buys cars, strips them and sells parts. He also see's an opportunity to get NOS parts and tries to sell them. He has to make a profit to pay his bills. It's his business to determine his profit.

Jim Finn is more competitive with his pricing. Why? Because he is retired from his "real" job. He doesn't need the income to live.

I "dabble" in parts selling my excess inventory at very cheap prices. Why? Because it is mostly a hobby to me. I enjoy the hunt of getting parts and it takes stress out of my real job. I have sold parts to Jim and Marck and watched when they marked those same parts up $50-100.00 and sold them. But I still made a profit so I was happy. I then use the money to help other guys on this forum as a "reward" for being excellent sources of knowledge and having a willingness to help others and also to pay for repairs on my own cars.

The one exception to my way of doing things is sensor leads. If one goes up to the Reatta Buy/Sell you will see that I have leads for sale. Prices may seem high, but what needs to be mentioned is that there is hidden costs in time spent finding/reconditioning/selling leads. Some leads are promoted as excellent and a high price was paid $50-$75.00 each that still need to be redone because they weren't as I was told. Then there are the leads that arrive "dead" and can't be repaired. Or the ones that are sold by me and sent as being "good" but arrive "dead" and need to be replaced.

Ronnie I wish you could make more on parts then what Amazon allows, you offer a great service and are one of the great guys on this forum. We should all strive to do as you have done to promote the Reatta.

I will just add that there are other accumulators still out there if you go looking (as Dave has already pointed out). So, Marck is stretching a bit to state he has them all.

That said, it will not be long before the others I am aware of are scooped up. So, Marck will probably be the sole source at some point; until he runs out also. This is why we all need to be researching and verifying workable alternatives.

What I am getting to is that at some point nobody will have a NOS OEM accumulator left and then we need a substitute that we know works. May as well establish that effort now so we are not caught unprepared, or extorted by less scrupulous parts places that will put huge markups in place just because they can (like a gas station in a hurricane zone).

The unit sold by the outfit in California (discussed here multiple times) seems to fit the bill and the price is decent enough. I've not tried one so can't vouch for it but it looks promising. It has been posted here by others that it is plug and play. If so, the accumulator problem is solved.

KDirk

If there are two things I've learned in the many years of owning a variety of businesses (from food to broadcasting to real estate) they are:

- Never say it can't be done.

- There is always an alternative; whether for an item, service, vendor, etc.

Aside from those most involve in the Reatta as a hobby, hopefully the Reatta Division will take a lead and research other vendors for a variety of Reatta items (including the accumulator, wheel speed sensors, etc). I have doubts that Amazon was the only distributor (or supplier) for accumulators.

Nobody said it can't be done. As a matter of fact there is a supplier in Ca. that says their accumulators will work. Problem is, is that their accumulators are more expensive then the ones we have been getting from Amazon. And they say they work, but no one here has tried one so that is why the run on GM ones.

I know there are a couple of guys who are working on sensor leads, but right now they are still available and at a lesser cost then it would be to fabricate an entirely new unit on an individual basis.

We have had parts vendors try group buys from original manufactuers, or find sources to make parts and there has been little or no interest. I think the reason for this is that the parts vendors we do have are very resourceful in getting very good quality used parts and selling them for a fairly reasonable price.

And the last reason I can think of is that there were only 24,000 Reattas built and I would guess that there are less then 16,000 left and how often does a part break that needs to be replaced? I'm not talking about the wear items like brake pads, rotors, light bulbs, tune up parts and the like.

Good points from Dave. I've a few more thoughts.

Regarding the outfit in CA that is selling a purportedly plug and play accumulator, I think the only way we answer that definitively is for someone here to buy one and install it for a real-world test. If you can get the same or greater number of good pumps of the pedal with their accumulator as with the Delco unit, that would indicate to me it is a suitable replacement. Only long term testing would reveal if the lifespan is on par with the OEM part.

This is completely doable, we just need a volunteer to spearhead it. Maybe I'll do it if no one else is so inclined. Won't happen soon though as I have no need of replacing the accumulator on either of my 88's presently. In also have two new Delco units I purchased upon seeing what was happening with the supply.

As far as the remaining supply of stock accumulators, get 'em while they're hot. Yes, we will see opportunistic rectal cavities scrounge a few up and put them on ebay for $500+. This has happened and is happening with other obsolete parts. The best way to deal with these clowns is not to. Let them sit on the stuff and ignore the shakedown artists.

That is why I am adamant about finding a second source; that puts some flexibility back into the pricing so that the extortion leeches have no leverage to do that crap. Owners of these cars should not find themselves being nicked by the guys who do this. This may well lead to some cars in the possession of uniformed owners being junked for parts rather than pay several hundred dollars for a critical part to fix it. That is just stupid.

I have no problem with profiting from the sale of parts. I do it myself. I do not put obscene markups on anything. 3, 4, 5 or more times the known retail value meets that threshold in my mind. And we will see some sellers trying to do just that. Amazon bumped their price from 99 to 300 in a day. This means less than nothing as they have none to sell; they aren't even accepting orders at that price. Point being: don't tell me a part you bought at under $150 maybe a couple of years ago (or longer) is now worth $500+ just because you say it is.

I mentioned to Dave while I was visiting that there are aftermarket ABS conversion systems for old (pre-ABS era) cars to be fitted with anti-lock capability. I've not looked in detail at any of these. It seems possible a system like this could be adapted to the Reatta negating the need to keep stringing along the Teves hardware.

This is more of a long-term thing to consider, as we may reach the point where it simply isn't practical to keep the Teves system working. Eventually, the pumps will be the issue that sinks us irrespective of leads or accumulators being available in some form. Since there is not a great supply of pumps around and maybe one outfit still rebuilding them (for how long?) that is the next snag we will hit in retaining the stock ABS system.

I guess this is where we seperate the men from the boys, so to speak. Those with ingenuity, resourcefulness and money will keep their Reattae going. Those without will start falling away as these problems mount at an accelerating rate. This is bound to happen anyway since only a small percentage of owners will (or even can) commit that kind of effort and expenditure for an old car. That is why collecting classic cars, while popular, is still a niche hobby.

Cars of the Reatta's era (late 80's) and beyond will be particulary challenging compared the popular models from the 40's to the 70's due to their heavy reliance on electronics and specialty parts for safety related systems like brakes.

KDirk

KDirk,

Well said Sir, well said. Took the words right from my mouth (again) and couldn't agree with you more.

(Forget a new accumulator or sensors. What I need is to find a brain like yours.

Not that mine is completely broken, just the part that takes the thoughts, forms them into words then pushes them out the fingertips.) Anyway...

I agree that someone needs to try one of these other accumulators to see if in fact the do work with our systems. In one of the more recent posts, someone provided an Ebay link to one manufactured for some foreign automobile that was listing for under a hundred bux. From the looks of it, seemed to be "plug and play".

Only one sure way to know.

But, as you mentioned, right now no one wants to part with a hundo only to find it wasn't what they'd expected.

But, lets be realistic. All the accumulator is, is a nitrogen filled metal container with a rubber diaphragm separating the gas from the fluid. As long as the volume of the cavity is close and the cavity is pressurized the same as ours, it's going to work. If the size and or the fitting is different, then adapters can be made and the position/location can be changed. It doesn't matter to the system how the "ball" is oriented. I believe it'll work just as well in any position.

So, lets not get out panties in a bunch just yet. All is not lost. H*ll, It just occurred to me that if one were concerned about looks under the hood, a dummy/plugged accumulator could be placed in the original position and, with a tee, a line inconspicuously run to an accumulator placed anywhere under the hood, out of sight and it would work.

So, possibilities do exist.

I also have an idea on how to use new, currently available and reasonably priced WSSs on our cars. More on this later in a resurected thread.

Gotta run. gonna be late for work if I don't leave right now!

John F.

Is the accumulator for the Regal Grand National an acceptable substitute? Several on eBay. Until I started looking, I didn't realize that so many vehicles used accumulators for brake systems. The least costly appears to fit Mitsubishi vehicles. Or are we at the point where we have resort to salvage yards. Using a jump box to test the pump and accumulator before removing them?

I had posed this same question recently, and apparently it is NOT compatible. That said, the present options are to find a NOS correct part (getting more difficult but not yet impossible) or contact the outfit in Orange, CA also referenced further up-thread and order one one of their accumulators which is purported to be a direct fit - though slightly larger - for about $200.

Do not get nicked by someone wanting $450+ on ebay for a new one as there are still other options that do not require shelling out that much.

KDirk

I heard a while back the GN model was much lower pressure. I think the Mitsubishi model looks promising, nobody has compared the pressure capability or made note of the fitting and necessary adapter yet though.

Although I still think the Amazon accumulators will be back in stock I agree that we need to find an alternative that will work. The first thing we should do is establish a set of perimeters for the ACDelco accumulator that we have been using.

Here is what comes to mind that we need to know about the stock accumulators:

1. Length and diameter of the accumulator
   
2. Maximum working pressure
   
3. Pre-charged pressure of the gas inside
   
4. Specifications of the threads that screw into the master cylinder
   
5. ???
   

Once we know the above we can start looking for a suitable alternative that meets those perimeters.

We may be overlooking an obvious step here. Does Teves (ATE) have a US office? Some effort should be made to contact them and inquire as to the status of the accumulator (in production, in shipment or discontinued) and if it is no longer being made see if operating specs can be supplied so workable substitutes can be determined.

If there is no US office for them, we probably need someone who speaks German to contact their headquarters. We keeep speculating and wondering whether the accumulator will be available again or if we can find another that will work. The only people who can answer those questions are staff at ATE. Of course, being a large corporation, it may be difficult to find someone who can speak with certainty on the subject but is seems worth pursuing.

KDirk

FYI

25528382 accumulator also fits:

(standard on some, optional on others, GM cars only not including Ford, Jag, and SAAB))

6000 1986-1986 All

6000 1987-1990 All

98 Regency (FWD) 1986-1986 All

98 Regency (FWD) 1987-1988 All

98 Regency (FWD) 1989-1990 All

Bonneville 1988-1988 All

Bonneville 1989-1990 All

Delta 88 Royale 1987-1988 All

Delta 88 Royale 1989-1990 All

Deville 1986-1986 All

Deville 1987-1988 All

Deville 1989-1990 All

Electra 1986-1986 All

Electra 1987-1988 All

Electra 1989-1990 All

Fleetwood D'Elegance 1987-1988 All

Fleetwood D'Elegance 1989-1990 All

Fleetwood Limousine 1986-1986 All

Fleetwood Limousine 1987-1988 All

Fleetwood Sixty Special 1987-1988 All

Fleetwood Sixty Special 1989-1990 All

Funeral Coach 1986-1986 All

Funeral Coach 1987-1988 All

Funeral Coach 1989-1990 All

Lesabre 1987-1988 All

Lesabre 1989-1990 All

Reatta 1988-1988 All

Reatta 1989-1990 All

Riviera 1988-1988 All

Riviera 1989-1990 All

Toronado (FWD) 1988-1988 All

Toronado (FWD) 1989-1990 All

ps think it is now part of Continental.

pps GN used a PowerMaster and was under 1,000 psi, Teves is around 2,200

Does anyone know the thread size for our accumulators? The reason I ask is that Hydac manufactures accumulators and they have a spec sheet that lists two accumulators that are the right size and pressure for our cars.

I would be interested in making an adapter to run a different accumulator and looking at results. My car will never be in a 400pt judged competition, so function over form suits me just fine.

I refer now to Ronnie's post above, No. 27 in this series.

A lot of interest has been expressed in this issue but we have to have the specs to make any worthwhile progress in reaching reasonable solutions.

Kingsley

After visiting Hydac's site, I had a thought. What's causing the failure of accumulators? Is it pressure loss from continual compression and gas degradation or bladder failure and leakage? Shouldn't the nitrogen be rechargeable?

PD210,

Here's a link showing one possible cause of Accumulator failure. A ruptured bladder.

John F.

Can anyone answer these questions about the accumulators?

1. Length and diameter of the accumulator
   
2. Maximum working pressure
   
3. Pre-charged pressure of the gas inside
   
4. Specifications of the threads that screw into the master cylinder
   

The precharge spec is very wide: 600 to 1300 psi of nitrogen gas but what I remember is 990 psi. The maximum working pressure is about 2600 psi and a relief vale is supposed to open at 3400 psi.