O/T: brake accumulator compatibility

Somewhat off topic. Anyone here familiar with the optional ABS system offered on the 88-91 W body Regal? I have a line on a NOS accumulator for that application and wondering if anyone knows if it may be a correct physical fit to the Reatta. Big issue is the size and thread pitch of the nipple on the accumulator.

I can't find much out about the system, other than it uses a unique master cylinder/controller setup that is obscenely expensive ($1800 or so reman'd) and is clearly a different unit from the Reatta. Apparently not many were built with this option. I would like to assume it is a Teves Mk II based system, but have not been to verify that so far.

I am aware of the Saab part that fits (big money for these though when found new) and the Jaguar JLM1907 is apparently a direct fit as well based on some things I am reading. Of course, that is even bigger money than the Saab variant.

I've decided to start beating the bushes to find a couple of new ones as I am getting ever more doubtful the Delco one we are all wanting will be available again anytime soon.

This was exacerbated by my helping another local Reatta owner troubleshoot his brakes (on an 89) and he needed an accumulator. He has connections in the auto parts business and got "the last one available in the country" (per the wholesaler he deals with) ordered today. Kind of drove home the point with me that it is yet another item I need to plan ahead for.

KDirk

I have mentioned before that someday the Teves accumulators will disappear. Hydraulic Accumulators are made in many different sizes and shapes and we may need to work out an alternative. I was looking up something for Kingsley the other day and came across this AUDI parts book illustration. Note that they locate the accumulator remote from the pump housing. This could be easily done on a Reatta with the properly designed high pressure hose.

Kevin - I am also working on the same project - trying to find accumulators for the Reatta - and will keep you posted as to what I am finding. Barney has given me a list of TEVES II applications so that is my base point from which I am working.

Kingsley

Good to know. My immediate concern is making sure I can keep my 88's with fully functioning ABS. The accumulator is one of those parts that I am inclined to have on hand for the eventual and inevitable failure. I did just get one Delco NOS unit I tracked down ordered late yesterday. Ran more than I would have liked (the Amazon price, were it in stock, would be a deal by comparison). I am hoping to find a second.

After that the focus will be on figuring out cross references and adapting other readily available accumulators with custom fitting adapters as the solution going forward. Even if another run of a OE Teves accumulators is eventually available, I am very much in the mindset of long term planning. Eventually we will have to either modify or scrap the Teves system for lack of original parts. I think that day is coming sooner than any of us would care to admit based on current availability of critical parts.

KDirk

I have been a long advocate of having extra parts. For those that are planning to keep their cars long term building inventory is the way to go. If you think prices are high now wait 5 years.

I believe it has been discussed before that people will be buying Reatta beaters to get the parts they need to keep their car original.

That's when the value will be going up.

Thought Barney already came up with the solution to this possibility:

http://forums.aaca.org/showthread.php?t=302957&p=879971&highlight=accumulator#post879971

With the tremendous mark up that the European car makers put on their parts distribution network, I don't think Volvo, Saab, Jaguar etc accumulators will be priced low enough to make sense even if you find an one that works.

Mc-

I have found a couple of the Jaguar units at around $325. That's a bite in the butt, however if it keeps the system functional in originally spec'd state, I could be persuaded to pay it. If they last half as long as the originals, it is still a fair deal IMO as it prevents the use of a non-spec'd part and the potential need to make modifications for thread pitch or other differences.

Parker makes some hydraulic accumulators that could likely be made to work with a custom machined inlet thread adapter. There are all manner of similar- but not identical - units used by Land Rover, and even a few from Mitsubishi that appear not to have immediate supply concerns.

I guess got caught with my pants down, as I waited too long to order off Amazon and now suspect there are no more forthcoming. I'll be all too happy to be proven wrong if they do get additional stock. At any rate I am now scrambling to cover my own cars, have one on the way and examining other potential replacements.

For the benefit off all owners (excepting 91's who needn't worry about accumulators) I am hoping we can find a single good solution that will prevent a lot of "creative" one-off that may end up being of questionable value and functionality.

KDirk

"Just checked the Orange CA listing above and they state that they do have them as above and priced at $195.00 plus tax.

Kingsley Baker"

"Today I found the article and called ABS Power Brake Inc.

The fellow I talked with claims they have installed their accumulator on Reattas and while it is slightly "fatter" it has no interferrence and works fine.

They have no part number, apparantly it is the only one they use. Their price is $150 plus shipping

Barney Eaton"

Pull your pants back up Kevin. Why fool around with a $325 one from Jag that may not fit and may have sat in a warehouse for 10 years? These are brand new and will plug and play.

There sure are a lot of stickers on that accumulator for it to not have a part number.

Ok. Now that I've re-cinched my belt, that is reassuring. I either missed (or failed to derive by esp) that this accumulator was in fact tested successfully on a Reatta.

Now I can redirect my anal-retentive tendencies towards some other crisis.

KDirk

There sure are a lot of stickers on that accumulator for it to not have a part number.

Or a date code!

Key is the working pressure. The Teves uses upwards of 2200 psi and the Delco Powermaster (Buick Turbo GN) less than half that.

This is one of those FWIW posts.

Several days ago I made a phone call or two and bought an accumulator for the Reatta that I do not own. As I do not like to jack FLAPS around and wanting to actually put my hands on this one, had it picked up today.

Very nicely packaged with the first outer box marked "Articles, pressurized Pneumatic UN 3164 - Non-Flammable Gas 2" as well as "Made in Federal Republic of Germany and AC Delco trademark. Inner box marked 25528382 1 Piece/Stuck" "Accumuilator Druckspeicher 10.0399-0040.2. "15.10.2010". Many, many numbers on the part itself, non of which would appear to be a date. Perhaps the "15.10.2010" holds the key to this.

Initial reaction on my part was great - no problem until I called the FLAPS and asked what he would sell me 10 of them for. His reply - "I do not think you can do that since this one was the only one in captivity around here in three of the largest parts warehouses"

Just as info, list price was $256.08 with the ususal discount bringing down my pre sales tax cost to $136.23.

I would think Delco themselves would be the only source of finding out their intentions on this part and I do not wish devote the lifetime it would take to make that call.

Incidentally, the "white strip" that appears in the label circle on the accumulator says only "Made in Germany" with the only reference to Delco being on the outer carton.

Kingsley

Reatta Specialty Parts

I would say that I think Kingsley got it right on the numbers being the date. I worked for many years in the aircraft industry. When I had documents / packages that came from europe they always dated with day before month and year last. So... 15.10.2010 to me would mean October 15th 2010.

Should have got this one before it was pulled.

Got to make your car go faster if for nothing else than your wallet will be lighter. :cool:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ferrari-348-ABS-Pump-with-Accumulator-ATE-/281293204246?nma=true&si=wM96VJZbbQE3o37ClGu%252FLhkA02M%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

I am spending some time on this. It appears that G.M. offered a "buy back" on obsolete parts about 4-5 months ago of which a number of dealers sent back their stock of accumulators. However some dealers kept theirs. I have found some [less then 5].

I have one NOS [New Old Stock] and am buying one more. The price is $153.65 plus freight. The rest I have found are selling for $256.08. One place would discount it if I had the local dealer buy it. Then the price is $204.86 plus freight. But then I would have to deal with the mark up from the local dealer, so I still believe the price will still be $256.08.

I found two. I paid $164.08 [with freight]. email me at lemke1044@aol.com if you want one.

Rather then try to buy and then sell an accumulator ball without looking like I am trying to rip anyone off, here is the list I have acquired with dealers who have the part [#25528382];

Car Dealer Parts 318-387-8377 $153.65

Rich's Garage 845-887-5150 $256.08

Sterling 979-846-5555 $256.08

I did find a website by googling the afore mentioned part # and they listed a number of sources with prices starting at $140.00 That website is www.oemcats.com

I bought one accumulator and think I am set as I already had one in inventory [actually 2 as I have a complete Teves assembly in inventory as well] so I wish you well in your search...

Dave

good info there. I now have two NOS on hand and might get a third although two should be enough. My two Teves equipped 88's have 49,650 and 65,200 miles on them and the brake system has been well maintained on both it appears. I believe both accumulators to be original, but have no way of being certain.

That they are 25 years old and still good per the test is both remarkable and somewhat disconcerting. I say that because I wonder if at this age they could fail catastrophically while I am on the road. At what they cost I am not so inclined to replace them preemptively, but neither do I care to chance a sudden failure of a safety critical part at a most inopportune time (say like driving to Wisconsin from St. Louis).

Guess I'll carry a spare on road trips.

KDirk

Dave, I ordered 1 from oemcats, it was cancelled so I called every phone # listed all said sorry no longer available. I think we should all order 1 or 2 from Amazon thru Ronnies site so they can see demand and may be do another run of them. It can not hurt as you only get billed if shipped and you can cancel if they do come up with them.

Did you call Car Dealer Parts in Monroe, La? They had one. She sent me a fax that I had to fill out [which I didn't]. Their phone # 318-387-8377

My accumulator arrived this morning. Cost was $160.00 delivered. Now have two new ones [got the first one on a trade for a '90/91 Instrument Cluster] and one used one on a complete Teves unit.

Should be set for as long as I want to keep a Reatta around...