My '63 project

Hi all, just got this to fix up and cruise eventually.

I've got a lead on a guy that has about a dozen rivieras he's parting out just down the street. I've put together a tentative list depending on what's available. What do you think?

i have a couple questions:

Is there a way to tell what engine is in the car by the chassis numbers or do you have to use the block number specifically? It's in the shop so I have no access to any other info, it hasn't run in 15 years (fingers crossed) Is the interior original color scheme? Tuxedo? Thanks

Oh, and the hood emblem is interesting.

Here's my list of things to replace(?)

Dash

Blinker lever

Tilt wheel lever

Passenger side front light cover

Glove compartment door?

Seat belt hardware

Driver side rear chrome strip

Door wood? (May just cut my own variety)

Driver door rear lever

Brake pedal rubbers

Rear dash cover

Headliner

And the pics from the seller:

That's a cool color combination! The tag is a good place to start. I saw this one on Craigslist, I thought that was the same car for a minute.

http://columbus.craigslist.org/cto/4550202679.html

Good luck with your project!

Tim

Hi all, just got this to fix up and cruise eventually.

I've got a lead on a guy that has about a dozen rivieras he's parting out just down the street. I've put together a tentative list depending on what's available. What do you think?

i have a couple questions:

Is there a way to tell what engine is in the car by the chassis numbers or do you have to use the block number specifically? It's in the shop so I have no access to any other info, it hasn't run in 15 years (fingers crossed) Is the interior original color scheme? Tuxedo? Thanks

Oh, and the hood emblem is interesting.

Here's my list of things to replace(?)

Dash - Depending on the level of restoration you're looking to do, there is an aftermarket ABS cap available to cover the existing cracked dash. I think the car that Kaber's son is redoing has one on it.

Blinker lever

Tilt wheel lever

Passenger side front light cover -If you can't find a good original, there are reproductions available. OPGI shows one so you can see it but it's available for about $20 cheaper. I'll have to find the source for you. Found ithttps://www.gmobsolete.com/details.php?db=lenses&amt=1&special=no&item=ts6364

Glove compartment door? It might not be the door. Check to see that the part of the dash the door hinges on isn't cracked. Pretty common

Seat belt hardware - Check out these guys - http://www.wescoperformance.com/i-3207-retractable-install.htmDriver side rear chrome strip - I've got parts of these from many cars. Post a picture so I know exactly which one

Door wood? (May just cut my own variety) Quarter sawn walnut give you the correct grain

Driver door rear lever I've probably got one or two of these as well

Brake pedal rubbers CARS, Inc.

Rear dash cover Join the ROA, there are vendors for these in the classified section of the magazine. The one from OPGI does not fit.

Headliner Clarks Corvair. www.corvair.com

Could you post a better picture of your data plate? The date appears to be the first week of July, but that seems very early or you could have one of the very first cars built. What is the FB number (upper right on data plate) Early production - smooth dash, 120 mph speedometer, small dent in vacuum storage canister, floor mounted spare.

Originally this car came with black cloth and vinyl - code 787; J2 is the power seat option.

Good luck and keep us informed

Depending on the level of restoration you're looking to do, there is an aftermarket ABS cap available to cover the existing cracked dash. I think the car that Kaber's son is redoing has one on it.

Here is the dash cap installed, I can't remember where we found it but it was far cheaper than a recovered one, around $100. They come in black, the blue was extra cost.

Tim,

That CL link sure makes me feel better about the price I paid for mine and the condition it's in.

Ed,

That great info, thanks so much. The speedo info and etc, is that different than other production 63 standards? Or just different than other first gen.?

I forgot to mention the power antenna is in the trunk too. So the interior is not original.?

Depending on what this guy is asking for his parts I may be interested in picking those up from you, let me know your price.

i just heard from my mechanic, the car runs but needs a carb overhaul and a radiator hose at least. He replaced the points, and flushed the gas tank and swapped some fuel lines so far. Overall, good news to me. I'm still within my negotiated "to get driveable" budget.

The odo reads 83k, would the condition suggest its rolled over?

here are some other shots of the numbers:

it appears to me FB38142

in this photo just behind the fender at the bottom the trim is missing.

doug

Depending on the level of restoration you're looking to do, there is an aftermarket ABS cap available to cover the existing cracked dash. I think the car that Kaber's son is redoing has one on it.

Here is the dash cap installed, I can't remember where we found it but it was far cheaper than a recovered one, around $100. They come in black, the blue was extra cost.

that looks real nice, and I could imagine a nice recovered one would be: a: hard to find b: not cheap.

thanks for that!

That FB number is really strange to go with the smooth dash. FB38142 is 38,142 / 40,000. More like one of the last cars made in July of '63 before they shut down production in August for the new year. The smooth dash and 120 mph speedometers were replaced by the ribbed dash and 140 mph speedometers before mid-way of the 1963 production run. My '63's FB number is 18,733, built the latter part of February 1963. It has the ribbed dash and 140 mph speedometer.

I'm guessing that the vinyl on the seats is original and the cloth inserts have been replaced with a non-original color.

Look at this picture and you'll see where the numbers are. http://www.teambuick.com/reference/ident_engine_where.php

The two letter number should be JT or JW for 1963. J=1963, T-401, W=425. The engine serial code should match your VIN. If it doesn't, then someone has swapped engines - which is not that big of a deal.

You should be able to find direct replacement radiator hoses so don't settle for a universal one.

When you consider S&H, finding those parts locally would probably be the better way to go monetarily.

Contact Jon at www.thecarburetorshop.com and give him the number off of your carburetor. He can supply you with the specific kit for that carb, not some universal zip kit. You'll first need to know if the carb is a Carter AFB or a Rochester 4GC, both came as standard equipment. Find out what kind of carb you have and we'll tell you where to find the number.

Keep us posted.

Did you join the ROA yet? The link is in my signature line. Best, cheapest restoration tool you can buy.

The ABS dash cover is from an outfit called DashPro. I took Kaber's lead on this one. It's the best $100 I've spent restoring my entire Riv. No joke. The cover goes on and the ugly goes away. Mine is black and the fit and finish is great. Highly recommended. PRL

Someone posted this & i saved it.

http://www.dashtop.com/index.php?search%5Bterms%5D=2064

383Roller - for lack of a given name :-)

If you're a newbie and haven't yet learned the nuances between the 1963, 1964, and 1965 years, you need to know that '63 dashes are different than '64/'65 dashes.

Here's the link and part number for the '63 part.

http://www.dashtop.com/products/dash-cover-1963-buick-riviera-dash-cover

It helps everyone if you'd go into the forum actions link at the top of the page and let us know in which area you live - city, community, area, etc. and we're pretty friendly group; let us know your name. Thanks,

Ed

RockinRiv is right. My mistake. It's called Dashtop not Dashpro. PRL

I asked my Son where we got the dash pad for his last night. He said he saw them in the OPGI catalog in Black only. His was a dark navy blue and he wanted the blue one. In the catalog they stated the name of the manufacturer (Dashtop) so he checked with them and found you could order colors. He ordered blue for the 63 Riviera thinking he would get the dark blue cover, but got the really bright blue one instead. We got it on the morning of the homecoming dance and he really wanted the dash to look good. I thought it was too bright but he liked it. After having it in there a while, I have to say I like it now. He said he thought the black ones were a little less expensive. One thing I liked is that even though it comes with a tube of silicone to attach it, there are dimples on the leading edge to accept a flat head screw in 4 places matching the factory attachment points. We drilled holes and screwed it down there. Didn't need any adhesive at all, very nice fit! It really brightens the interior!

Tim

383Roller - for lack of a given name :-)

If you're a newbie and haven't yet learned the nuances between the 1963, 1964, and 1965 years, you need to know that '63 dashes are different than '64/'65 dashes.

It helps everyone if you'd go into the forum actions link at the top of the page and let us know in which area you live - city, community, area, etc. and we're pretty friendly group; let us know your name. Thanks,

Ed

my name is Doug, I'm from Sacramento, California. I like cars, guitars and other cool, vintage stuff.

i tried to add that in my sig?

I got the engine numbers today, K W = 64 425 right?

what does that say about the transmission?

my name is Doug, I'm from Sacramento, California. I like cars, guitars and other cool, vintage stuff.

i tried to add that in my sig?

Hi Doug, Guitars you say? Send me a PM. I'm into vintage Fenders and Gibsons and lately some of the more recent Gretsch hollow bodies. Cars 'n' guitars... I don't know what costs me more these days, but it's a great way to go!

ALL '64 Rivieras came from the factory with 425 engines, most with one four barrel, some with dual four barrels. The transmission is a GM TH400 which Buick, in keeping with tradition, called a Super Turbine, or ST, 400.

Of course in 50 years lots of things can have been switched out or replaced. Look at the tag on the passengers side of the transmission. It will have a B? with the ST400. All the B? letters tell you is a little more about the car in which the transmission came - Floor shift, column shift, rear end ratio, etc.

Ed

I talked to my mechanic the other day, he's the type of guy that grew up working on cars like these and loves doing this kind of work. His shop is now full of modern daily drivers and that's his living, he's very busy doing modern diagnostics and repairs and hardly ever works old stuff anymore.

I would consider him a sort of perfectionist, he's also a fabricator.

The starter went out right as he tried to use it. He couldn't find a replacement so he had it rebuilt. Took a few days.

After that was in order and the points and fuel lines, fuel pump and tank were up to par he got it started but ran like crap. I gave him the go ahead to rebuild the carb( in hind sight it may have been cheaper to replace all together).

Days go by.

He told me it was running better but not good still, then he told me he did a compression test on the cylinders and that didn't turn out good, one cylinder was solely low and failed a leak down test that showed rings were the culprit.

All the while he claims it could just be because it's been sitting so long (20+ yrs)

Then his helper tried driving the car around the lot to get a feel for how it rolls and reported the transmission wasn't grabbing. I was totally disappointed. I'm thinking engine, transmission- there was no way I can afford to get it rolling and make it look nice.

He said he's going to try some other things to see if he can get it to run better- putting gas in the tank was a start. (It ran out)

In the mean time he works on my dad's truck, him and my mom are planning a cross country adventure via roadway in their truck. So, this means new brakes, water pump, tune up, transmission flush and any other maintenance that can be handled before they leave= that leaves no time for the Buick.

I took my dad over to pick up his truck and to see what was up with the Buick, I get there and there's still no gas in the tank to even start it (I hadn't even heard it run yet), I asked if there was gas and he had filled a 5 gallon jug. I poured it in and turned her over.

She's alive! But rough and exhaust leaking out of the muffler area and manifold. Yikes! She warms up a minute. I decide I want to roll her, we get the floor jack and pivot the back wheels towards an open bay door (other was blocked by a motor home with no front wheels-again: busy) and maneuver the 10 point turn to the parking lot, all the while the power steering is screeching bloody hell competing with the squealing wheels on the epoxy floor and the echoing exhaust leaks.

By the time I'm headed for the lot entrance I feel the transmission pulling good and the steering is quieting down. Hmm, okay I'm going to the gas station. I fill up and hit the road. In the days of cel phones and AAA it's not too much of a risk in my mind. The two speed shifts hard like it should, but only manually. The car floats down the road effortlessly with some play in the front end, but the engine is running strong and the transmission feels the same. I'm ecstatic! I keep driving for a while and ultimately decide to bring her home after I report my finding and my man drives it and is floored at how good it rolls.

I thought she was a goner when I got the diagnostic report, quite the contrary. I'm elated and hugely relieved. Now I just need to work out the bugs: electrical(many things here), vacuum, brake booster, suspension work, polishing, paint and cosmetics.

The transmission seems to start in second when in D, it works great when starting out in L. But then once cruising in D if you punch it- it drops to L and shift again to second.

The idle is still a bit rough, the power seat doesn't move- it makes a sound when you push the switch though. There are no tailights, the right blinker doesn't work.

The fuel gauge does nothing, I'm assuming I should see a needle like the speedo (that works). Only the oil light comes in when the ignition is on. The two front windows work great, the back two need major assistance.

These are all the things I had no idea about until we could run it. Regardless, I'm happy. Hey, it is a project

im just happy it's home, and can tinker anytime.

I would love to hear feedback/advice on any the issues.

Will keep you posted...

Doug

Sounds like many other similar adventures you have when working with old cars like that. One thing that I do notice that you'll want to investigate. If you only have two speeds in your transmission, there's definitely something wrong. EVERY '64 Riviera is equipped with a GM Turbo Hydromatic 400 Transmission. The TH400 (Buick calls it the ST400) is a three (3) speed transmission. The gate on the shifter has only a D and an L but there's a three speed automatic transmission lurking under the console. Take the car out and check it again. One thing that's easy to replace, and it's what holds up shifts is the vacuum modulator on the side of the transmission. You can also check to make sure that there's vacuum going to the modulator. You'd be surprised at what else might be just something that age has taken a toll on and can be easily repaired. Good luck and let us know what you find.

Ed

congrats, this will turn out to be a nice ride. BTW, before you tear into those rear windows try something I learned on the forum here years ago. My window were all struggling til I emptied a small can of WD40 into each window compartment (widows up)using the little red tube through whatever cracks & holes I could find, trying to coat every surface & mechanism. After a little soak time & a few ups & downs they worked like new & have ever since. Prior to that revelation I had to warn everyone not to roll down those windows and sat around dreading the day I would have to summon the courage to tackle the problem. Repairing and realigning those window is no fun I've been told. Can't wait to see your Riv all cleaned up! Drew

Sounds like many other similar adventures you have when working with old cars like that. One thing that I do notice that you'll want to investigate. If you only have two speeds in your transmission, there's definitely something wrong. EVERY '64 Riviera is equipped with a GM Turbo Hydromatic 400 Transmission. The TH400 (Buick calls it the ST400) is a three (3) speed transmission. The gate on the shifter has only a D and an L but there's a three speed automatic transmission lurking under the console. Take the car out and check it again. One thing that's easy to replace, and it's what holds up shifts is the vacuum modulator on the side of the transmission. You can also check to make sure that there's vacuum going to the modulator. You'd be surprised at what else might be just something that age has taken a toll on and can be easily repaired. Good luck and let us know what you find.

Ed

Ed, your post has me confused.......it sounds like you are referring to the car as a 64 model, not a 63. The title of the post is my 63 project, which means it would have come from the factory with a two speed automatic.

I got the engine numbers today, K W = 64 425 right?

what does that say about the transmission?

I'm going off this post in my reply. KW is an engine from a '64. That engine would have been backed up with a 3 speed ST400 Transmission. To mate that '64 engine to a '63 transmission, you have to change crankshafts in the engine or machine a '64 flex plate to bolt to it. It also requires a different carb to make the kick down work properly, the '63 is mechanical while the '64 is electric, and would need a '64 shifter to get the neutral safety switch in the correct position.

If in fact the car does have the original '63 Dynaflow transmission, you'll soon realize that it is very much like the new CVT transmission in some of today's era cars. The Dynaflow is not designed to use L except getting out of mud or snow, or other typed of those kinds of situations. The Dynaflow is basically a single speed transmission, not a two speed, that uses a number of torque converters to propel you from zero to over 100 mph without you ever feeling a shift. When you select the kickdown feature by stomping on the accelerator, it does not shift into L, it switches the pitch on the converters to give you a different stall speed which in essence is like downshifting. Don't use L then shift to D, the trans is not designed to work that way. So if you feel that your car may be starting in 2nd gear, remember there is no 2nd gear. That's just the way the Dynaflow feels when it pulls away from a dead stop. As Jim Cannon says "Love that Dynaflow hum." It's effortless, makes for the best cruising transmission on the planet. It's always in the right gear at the right time.

Here's a quick way to tell what transmission is in the car. Where is R in relationship to P? We'll take it from there.

It could be an original 425. I have info that mentions the 425 was available as an option in 1963. Is there a W6 on the data tag?

Are you sure it's KW and not JW?

The data tag only tells you when, where, sequence, paint, trim, and back half options that would have been installed at the Fisher Body plant, it contains no engine data. When the went to final assembly the engine, and other front half options would have been installed but none of the front half options are on the data tag.

The ONLY way to tell what engine is in the car is by the two letter code stamped (not cast) into the horizontal block surface. H for '61, I for '62, J for '63, K for '64, L for '65, and M for '66. The other letter (if it's a four barrel high compression engine from a full sized car*) will be T for 401, or W for 425. For example: JT is a '63 401, JW is a '63 425, KT is a '64 401, and KW is a '64 425, etc. If it's a dual four barrel engine the letter code will have an X along with the year's letter, except for 179 '66 units that came from the factory with dual four barrel carbs which were assigned a Z code.

If the engine is original to the body, then the Engine Serial number will match the VIN on the body. No engine info is contained in the VIN.

Ed

* There are other codes besides the T and the W but they would have been assigned to two barrel engines, low compression engines, or nailheads installed in the intermediate Skylark GS series cars.

OK 383 Roller: I can see a fresh set of points and bypassing a fuel delivery problem but........a carb rebuild before a compression test? I would have changed oil and filter with Marvels and let it idle for a while, then a compression check.....then a leak down test if your guy knows how.

A mechanic I'm not. I am under the impression that one get's it running for a while and then diagnoses it before rebuilding a carburetor. Mitch

congrats, this will turn out to be a nice ride. BTW, before you tear into those rear windows try something I learned on the forum here years ago. My window were all struggling til I emptied a small can of WD40 into each window compartment (widows up)using the little red tube through whatever cracks & holes I could find, trying to coat every surface & mechanism. After a little soak time & a few ups & downs they worked like new & have ever since. Prior to that revelation I had to warn everyone not to roll down those windows and sat around dreading the day I would have to summon the courage to tackle the problem. Repairing and realigning those window is no fun I've been told. Can't wait to see your Riv all cleaned up! Drew

great advice, I did this tonight and realized the driver side is working better and I think it will work real good after it soaks in. The passenger is off the track.

Ed, your post has me confused.......it sounds like you are referring to the car as a 64 model, not a 63. The title of the post is my 63 project, which means it would have come from the factory with a two speed automatic.

I'm going off this post in my reply. KW is an engine from a '64. That engine would have been backed up with a 3 speed ST400 Transmission. To mate that '64 engine to a '63 transmission, you have to change crankshafts in the engine or machine a '64 flex plate to bolt to it. It also requires a different carb to make the kick down work properly, the '63 is mechanical while the '64 is electric, and would need a '64 shifter to get the neutral safety switch in the correct position.

If in fact the car does have the original '63 Dynaflow transmission, you'll soon realize that it is very much like the new CVT transmission in some of today's era cars. The Dynaflow is not designed to use L except getting out of mud or snow, or other typed of those kinds of situations. The Dynaflow is basically a single speed transmission, not a two speed, that uses a number of torque converters to propel you from zero to over 100 mph without you ever feeling a shift. When you select the kickdown feature by stomping on the accelerator, it does not shift into L, it switches the pitch on the converters to give you a different stall speed which in essence is like downshifting. Don't use L then shift to D, the trans is not designed to work that way. So if you feel that your car may be starting in 2nd gear, remember there is no 2nd gear. That's just the way the Dynaflow feels when it pulls away from a dead stop. As Jim Cannon says "Love that Dynaflow hum." It's effortless, makes for the best cruising transmission on the planet. It's always in the right gear at the right time.

Here's a quick way to tell what transmission is in the car. Where is R in relationship to P? We'll take it from there.

the P and R are at far ends from each other, the transmission works in accordance with the shifter marks. From the amount of work involved it must have been done long ago before that knowledge was easily known.(?) That explains why it doesn't start in L! Good stuff!

It could be an original 425. I have info that mentions the 425 was available as an option in 1963. Is there a W6 on the data tag?

Are you sure it's KW and not JW?

its definitely KW

OK 383 Roller: I can see a fresh set of points and bypassing a fuel delivery problem but........a carb rebuild before a compression test? I would have changed oil and filter with Marvels and let it idle for a while, then a compression check.....then a leak down test if your guy knows how.

A mechanic I'm not. I am under the impression that one get's it running for a while and then diagnoses it before rebuilding a carburetor. Mitch

it was running so bad the car wouldn't stay running, let alone drive.

thanks for the feedback guys!

Doug,

If the P and the R are at opposite ends and the trans works according to those marks then someone did swap a '64 425 in with the '63 dynaflow. What you won't know, and may never unless you get that far, is whether the '63 crank was used (same stroke on a 425 as a 401) or whether a '64 flex plate was modified. One other thing you need to check. Look at the stamped aluminum band on the distributor and get the number from it. The '63 and '64 Buicks each had different distributors. The '63 is timed at 12* and the '64 is timed at 2-1/2*. Because the transmission kicks down the way it's supposed to, I'm guessing the carb is the original '63 carb. Could be that just a short block was swapped or it could have been the entire engine. It will take some searching but you can identify all of the parts eventually. Much easier to tune properly is you know what everything is from.

I'm going off this post in my reply. KW is an engine from a '64. That engine would have been backed up with a 3 speed ST400 Transmission. To mate that '64 engine to a '63 transmission, you have to change crankshafts in the engine or machine a '64 flex plate to bolt to it. It also requires a different carb to make the kick down work properly, the '63 is mechanical while the '64 is electric, and would need a '64 shifter to get the neutral safety switch in the correct position.

If in fact the car does have the original '63 Dynaflow transmission, you'll soon realize that it is very much like the new CVT transmission in some of today's era cars. The Dynaflow is not designed to use L except getting out of mud or snow, or other typed of those kinds of situations. The Dynaflow is basically a single speed transmission, not a two speed, that uses a number of torque converters to propel you from zero to over 100 mph without you ever feeling a shift. When you select the kickdown feature by stomping on the accelerator, it does not shift into L, it switches the pitch on the converters to give you a different stall speed which in essence is like downshifting. Don't use L then shift to D, the trans is not designed to work that way. So if you feel that your car may be starting in 2nd gear, remember there is no 2nd gear. That's just the way the Dynaflow feels when it pulls away from a dead stop. As Jim Cannon says "Love that Dynaflow hum." It's effortless, makes for the best cruising transmission on the planet. It's always in the right gear at the right time.

Here's a quick way to tell what transmission is in the car. Where is R in relationship to P? We'll take it from there.

Ed.......thanks for the transmission lesson.....that's what I get for reading Hemmings Motor News ........they stated in their early Riviera article that the 63 had a two speed automatic, not a Dynaflow. they said if you didn't like the two speed automatic you should look for a 64 riviera when purchasing an early Riviera. I agree with you

that the Dynaflow is a fabulous transmission. Is it any problem getting someone to rebuild a Dynaflow nowadays?

Here are my impressions of the transmission:

L has very good low speed torque and drives comfortably without too much revs to about 40 mph.

D takes quite a bit of fuel and time to get going off the line, but once up to about 15-20mph off it goes! I have yet to take it on the freeway, I need to rebuild the brake booster first.

Ed, do these impressions run consistent to what you know on the dynaflow?

sat I spent the day working in the riviera, first the exhaust manifold gasket was addressed with only one broken bolt head to deal with. Then to the fuel gauge; I learned that it was an open circuit when tested which means there was a disconnect somewhere. I pulled the sending unit to find this.

i crimped the connection with a piece of copper and soldered it, presto! Piece by piece it's coming together. Hopefully today I'll get some of the last electrical issues dealt with.

Hello all and welcome newbies. I haven't been in forum for some time because of work & family illnes

My 1963 has a fb5535 and a 10E production code. My only difficulty is my engine. The engine is painted light green and the code is 4Ixxxx. That would make it a full size Buick engine, ie; LeSabre, Wildcat, Electra, etc.

That's capital i!

Spraybob,

Welcome, I see that the above post if your first. You must have been lurking in the viewing mode. I'm sure that there are answers to your questions, but you'll get a much better response if you start a new thread rather than attaching to one that is not germane to your questions. It's easy to do. When you're on the home page for the Riviera Owners, you'll find a Post new thread button. Just click on it, title your thread, and ask your questions.

Best of luck on obtaining the information you're looking for.

Ed

hey riv nut i have a 64 and was wondering other than on the windshield and engine where else can i locate the vin number

Other than the cowl and the engine block, supposedly, there is (are) VIN number(s) stamped into the frame. I've seen them on 2nd generation (66 - 70) Riviera but never first hand on a 63 - 65. Perhaps one of the frame off guys can answer this better for you. Just curious, if the VIN on the block and the cowl match, why are you looking for one someplace else? Here's another curiosity, did you type this out on your smart phone? There's no capitalization or punctuation in your post.

Ed

Update; interior is done for now, prepping for paint

I pulled apart the hubcaps after deciding to hold off on new rims, painted and polished every part. They came out so nice I'll keep them!

here is before and after photo

I had my gas gauge working well, but now it has a mind of its own; coming on here and there.

Im still trying to solidify my color choice for paint. My wife has an 09 enclave with a nice stock color I like, anyone have photos of 1st gen with tinted windows?

Ive got the car sanded and stripped, waiting on getting it to the booth, when I see other classic cars rolling around I really start chomping at the bit to get her done, my projection was for summer this year car shows. I'm on track for that but still antsy regardless